Restricted Free Agent Patrick Cripps [RFA 2021]

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RonnieRaven

Mature age recruit
Jun 12, 2018
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Brownlows and Premierships aside, Cripps is a top 5 players in the league, and possibly even top 3 when taking away the fact he was playing injured throughout the entirety of last year.

According to reports he has put on 5kg of muscle, is back to full training, and lighting the house on fire during match sims. I am very confident he will return to his amazing 2016-19 form.

Even as a 27 year old in 2 years time, he will be worth two top-5 picks. If you think otherwise, what would you value a Neale, Dangerfield, Martin or Fyfe at? (who by the way are all several years older than Cripps)
Dangerfield was a 25yr old club champion with 3 AA nods when he was traded for pick 9 pick 28 and dean gore(p55)(they had Selwood)and was on course to be arguably the best player in the comp (he won Brownlow MVP AA in 2016)
No doubt for the blues that his worth what ever you think because his the heart of the team.
But to the Dockers his not worth the same because we have a heart and we have a future heart.
Logan McDonald could get homesick in two years we would love him more.
Cripps is a gun and if he wanted to go to Essendon last year you could have got 6,7,8 because they are desperate for a bull.
Can you understand the logic
 
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Ash24

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Dangerfield was a 25yr old club champion with 3 AA nods when he was traded for pick 9 pick 28 and dean gore(p55)(they had Selwood)and was on course to be arguably the best player in the comp (he won Brownlow MVP AA in 2016)
No doubt for the blues that his worth what ever you think because his the heart of the team.
But to the Dockers his not worth the same because we have a heart and we have a future heart.
Logan McDonald could get homesick in two years we would love him more.
Cripps is a gun and if he wanted to go to Essendon last year you could have got 6,7,8 because they are desperate for a bull.
Can you understand the logic
I get what you mean, but I think it's just unfair on the club trading a star player away.

GWS got pick 10 as compensation for Zilliams, whereas Dangerfield went to Geelong for only pick 9 and 28. A big jump in the quality of the player, but a much smaller jump in terms of picks involved.

While two top 5 picks for Cripps is overs (I will agree), I do still believe he is worth multiple first rounders similar to the T.Kelly trade.
 

eastfreo75

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Brownlows and Premierships aside, Cripps is a top 5 players in the league, and possibly even top 3 when taking away the fact he was playing injured throughout the entirety of last year.

According to reports he has put on 5kg of muscle, is back to full training, and lighting the house on fire during match sims. I am very confident he will return to his amazing 2016-19 form.

Even as a 27 year old in 2 years time, he will be worth two top-5 picks. If you think otherwise, what would you value a Neale, Dangerfield, Martin or Fyfe at? (who by the way are all several years older than Cripps)
2 years time Cripps will 27 and 11 months.

Who got two 5 top picks in a trade in the last 5 years?
 

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eastfreo75

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Can’t agree that it wouldn’t be worth it. Fyfe for one will be 30 by the end of this season. If Fremantle are planning for this young group to rise up and be potential contenders over the next 5-8 years then you’ll have to ask how much influence will Fyfe have getting older. Getting in a star like Cripps will certainly Fremantle contend over longer than what Fyfe will.

I didn’t watch too many Fremantle games last season so correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t Fyfe play a lot more in the forward line. If so Fyfe and Cripps don’t always have to be in the same midfield all the time. They would be a nightmare in the midfield together for any opponent but both players have great marking ability that can go forward and expose opposition defences while always leaving an elite midfielder in the midfield.

Attracting elite talent is hard, yes getting an elite key forward for example might me better for Fremantle than an elite inside mid but if only an elite inside mid is available then you don’t knock that chance back
Fyfe played only forward in a few games and especially when coming back from injury.
 

Ash24

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2 years time Cripps will 27 and 11 months.

Who got two 5 top picks in a trade in the last 5 years?
As I replied later...
I get what you mean, but I think it's just unfair on the club trading a star player away.

GWS got pick 10 as compensation for Zilliams, whereas Dangerfield went to Geelong for only pick 9 and 28. A big jump in the quality of the player, but a much smaller jump in terms of picks involved.

While two top 5 picks for Cripps is overs (I will agree), I do still believe he is worth multiple first rounders similar to the T.Kelly trade.
 

Ash24

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Those first-rounders were nowhere near the top five. Those first-rounders ended up in the late teens.
Tim Kelly was traded for picks 14, 24, 37 and a future first. Although the draft value index isn't the most accurate, those picks combined are worth roughly 3500 points. That equates to just over pick 1, or 3 mid-late first rounders.
 

Sweet Jesus

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Tim Kelly was traded for picks 14, 24, 37 and a future first. Although the draft value index isn't the most accurate, those picks combined are worth roughly 3500 points. That equates to just over pick 1, or 3 mid-late first rounders.
Right, but WC didn't actually trade out any top 5 picks. If you're using the Kelly trade as a basis for a Cripps trade, that's worth noting.
 

La Dispute

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7 players - half of which are over 25 and how many AA's to their names collectively?
In what world is this group anywhere close to the groups that have been part of dynasties.
Not to mention you've got 2 midfielders, 3 half back flankers (1 trying to play midfield), 1 key forward and 1 key back. Not sure that Carlton will be winning premierships if that's your mix of your best players. Plus the only one who has ever had a top 10 in comp calibre season is Cripps and he just came off a relatively ordinary season.

Its not a bad list of players but its not exactly putting fear into the hearts of opposition.
Frankly you could list out all the Bulldogs midfielders and it would look more intimidating on paper.
Well that's 3 AA's collectively - not a bad start.

No AA key position players have come from a draft from 2015 onwards, however Moore and Andrews (2014 draft) made the AA team last year so there's no reason Weitering or McKay shouldn't be pushing in the coming years. Weitering did make the 40-man squad last year, and is about to enter his prime.

Williams doesn't play as a half back anymore - no point referring to him as one. He has dominated finals as a midfielder, and is going to slot in seamlessly to our midfield group.

Definitely a bit ambitious calling it a premiership squad, but it's a decent starting point.
 

Sweet Jesus

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Well that's 3 AA's collectively - not a bad start.

No AA key position players have come from a draft from 2015 onwards, however Moore and Andrews (2014 draft) made the AA team last year so there's no reason Weitering or McKay shouldn't be pushing in the coming years. Weitering did make the 40-man squad last year, and is about to enter his prime.

Williams doesn't play as a half back anymore - no point referring to him as one. He has dominated finals as a midfielder, and is going to slot in seamlessly to our midfield group.

Definitely a bit ambitious calling it a premiership squad, but it's a decent starting point.
McKay is the one who has to click.
 

Ash24

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Right, but WC didn't actually trade out any top 5 picks. If you're using the Kelly trade as a basis for a Cripps trade, that's worth noting.
Yes they didn't trade out any top 5 picks, but that's not the point. The draft value index tells us that all the picks put together for the Kelly trade were equivalent in points to around pick 5 + 6. If Cripps was to leave, I'd assume the trade to be similar to this.
 

Yoda_

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Well that's 3 AA's collectively - not a bad start.

No AA key position players have come from a draft from 2015 onwards, however Moore and Andrews (2014 draft) made the AA team last year so there's no reason Weitering or McKay shouldn't be pushing in the coming years. Weitering did make the 40-man squad last year, and is about to enter his prime.

Williams doesn't play as a half back anymore - no point referring to him as one. He has dominated finals as a midfielder, and is going to slot in seamlessly to our midfield group.

Definitely a bit ambitious calling it a premiership squad, but it's a decent starting point.
A final. One. Singular.

Let’s not get carried away like Zac is going to transform Carlton now.


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Ash24

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Let’s not get carried away like Zac is going to transform Carlton now.
He will though, both him and Saad.


Take a look at what Carlton were lacking in 2020 compared to the premiers Richmond: goals (although our inside 50s were just as frequent), disposal efficiency and metres gained.

Saad and Williams tick all of those boxes, good ball use/delivery i50, and some run and carry off half back. This good recruiting WILL transform Carlton.
 

Sweet Jesus

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Yes they didn't trade out any top 5 picks, but that's not the point. The draft value index tells us that all the picks put together for the Kelly trade were equivalent in points to around pick 5 + 6. If Cripps was to leave, I'd assume the trade to be similar to this.
So as long as the trade value index lines up, it could be a couple of late first-rounders and some loose change?
 

Ash24

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Where do you get three first-rounders from?
I'm simply going off the Kelly trade and it's worth in draft points, 3 mid-late first rounders, or 3500 points. Cripps would be worth pretty much the same. Where a Freo or WC gets the picks from is not up to me, but that is simply what I think Cripps is worth.
 

Sweet Jesus

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I'm simply going off the Kelly trade and it's worth in draft points, 3 mid-late first rounders, or 3500 points. Cripps would be worth pretty much the same. Where a Freo or WC gets the picks from is not up to me, but that is simply what I think Cripps is worth.
Yeah, you're going off the Kelly trade, which involved two late first-rounders plus a pick in the 20s and a pick in the 30s.

No need for a third first-rounder.
 

Ash24

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Yeah, you're going off the Kelly trade, which involved two late first-rounders plus a pick in the 20s and a pick in the 30s.

No need for a third first-rounder.
You aren't getting my point mate. It doesn't matter if it's 200 4th round picks, if the draft value adds up to two 10 picks or whatever the desired outcome, then it's a fair trade.

The combination of the 4 picks in the Kelly trade, add up to 3 late first rounders using the draft value index. That is also roughly the value of Cripps.
 

Sweet Jesus

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You aren't getting my point mate. It doesn't matter if it's 200 4th round picks, if the draft value adds up to two 10 picks or whatever the desired outcome, then it's a fair trade.

The combination of the 4 picks in the Kelly trade, add up to 3 late first rounders using the draft value index. That is also roughly the value of Cripps.
So if there were five second-rounders bundled together adding up to 3500 draft index points, you'd be cool with that?

Picks 23, 26, 27, 29 and 31. That's 3506 points.

No first-rounders. But five second-rounders. It's all about the draft index value.

Or picks 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 and 68. That's 3505 points.

You'd be cool with that for Cripps? I wonder how other Carlton supporters feel about those options.
 
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Ash24

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So if there were five second-rounders bundled together adding up to 3500 draft index points, you'd be cool with that?

Picks 23, 26, 27, 29 and 31. That's 3506 points.

No first-rounders. But five second-rounders. It's all about the draft index value.

Or picks 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 and 68. That's 3505 points.

You'd be cool with that for Cripps? I wonder how other Carlton supporters feel about those options.
Yes, but no.

The Kelly trade already involved two first rounders, plus pick 24 and 37. The latter two picks are easily added up to give a late first rounder.

Although in your case it is quite far fetched, it could work. Personally if we were to get 5 early second-rounders, it would be far from the worst.
 

Sweet Jesus

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Yes, but no.

The Kelly trade already involved two first rounders, plus pick 24 and 37. The latter two picks are easily added up to give a late first rounder.

Although in your case it is quite far fetched, it could work. Personally if we were to get 5 early second-rounders, it would be far from the worst.
As long as the points add up, what difference does it make?

You said: "It doesn't matter if it's 200 4th round picks, if the draft value adds up to two 10 picks or whatever the desired outcome, then it's a fair trade."

Picks 23, 26, 27, 29 and 31. That's 3506 points.
 

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