MRP / Trib. Paul Curtis

[Brian McGee]

I have said it before countless times, but the flaw in the system lies with the mro matrix causing this to either be 0 or 3 weeks. It’s horrible that a footy act gone slightly wrong like this can get such a harsh penalty. If it only got 1 week, people would be more accepting of it as a duty of care issue, even if it’s not a dirty act. 3+ should be reserved for dirty acts.

 

[Makeshift Park]

Going to be hard to over turn, based on the wording of the rule

View attachment 2298436

Pretty clear example of the third point.

I reckon North might try arguing that taking both arms in a tackle from behind is not unreasonable, and find vision of Curtis laying similar tackles where they don't flip forward because of their knees getting stuck in the turf.

Michael Christian has previously said wtte that a forward-motion tackle that pins the arms of the player with the ball will be graded as rough conduct. Therefore its deemed a reportable offence from the outset.

Once you start from that position, add a concussion and the ridiculous grading matrix into the equation, this type of action will almost always lead to a lengthy suspension. Its simple as that.

As far as the AFL is concerned, the actions Sinn took are irrelevant, so too are the intentions of Curtis.

Rather than doing the hard and serious business of keeping the sport entertaining by changing players contracts so a higher degree of risk is tolerated, the current stewards will opt for punishing players, particularly lesser known players at little clubs, every single time.

 

[kaiserchief13]

Why was my post deleted from this thread?

 

[DocSholl]

Going to be hard to over turn, based on the wording of the rule

View attachment 2298436

Pretty clear example of the third point.

I reckon North might try arguing that taking both arms in a tackle from behind is not unreasonable, and find vision of Curtis laying similar tackles where they don't flip forward because of their knees getting stuck in the turf.

I think the argument has to centre around two thing:

1) Curtis made reasonable attempts to avoid going into Sinn's back (if you go frame by frame, you can see he drops his bodyweight and goes slightly to the side of Sinn)

2) Sinn also drops his knees when the tackle hits, and his knee going into the turf helps propel him forward

Not sure how successful either will be though. The AFL will argue that the speed be approached the tackle with meant that this outcome was reasonable foreseeable. Which is dumb because that's exactly how you run someone down but that's also the sport we play now. They will also argue he should have released an arm.

It probably also.doesnt help that Curtis is a freakishly strong human.

 

[JackFlash]

Absolutely insane! He doesn't deserve 3 weeks for that? What are these people trying to do? They are deliberately destroying the game and are out of touch with it completely. The bump has been eradicated and now they are after the pressure tackle, it was perfectly executed. He must get off or at the very least cop a week otherwise this game has just had another nail driven into it.

 

[Sirlemsip]

This reminds me of the Sicily tackle from 2023.
No malice in the action, it just happened to cause a concussion.

Sic got three weeks, and unfortunately Curtis will as well.

I'm sure the majority of people would be happy with one week, maybe even two, but three is definitely excessive.

 

[RCAB]

This reminds me of the Sicily tackle from 2023.
No malice in the action, it just happened to cause a concussion.

Sic got three weeks, and unfortunately Curtis will as well.

I'm sure the majority of people would be happy with one week, maybe even two, but three is definitely excessive.

Sicily did nothing wrong.

He was on the ground and didn't drive McCluggae.

He was attempting a lunging tackle off the ground while being simultaneously pushed by Coleman.

McCluggae has an arm free (you could argue two) where he can brace but either chooses not to or is unable to do it properly due to a secondary Hawthorn player intervening.

McCluggae had been concussed not long before this concussion. Sometimes players are their own worst enemy when it comes to concussion (see Angus Brayshaw).





Ultimately by "real-world" defintions, any tackle with downward force or momentum is considered careless. The fact is, there are 150 tackles a game, and at least 50 would be careless by that defintion. It would be ridiculous if 18 players a week received a suspension, so only the one's that result in concussion are suspended.

 

[shintemaster]

Michael Christian has previously said wtte that a forward-motion tackle that pins the arms of the player with the ball will be graded as rough conduct. Therefore its deemed a reportable offence from the outset.

If that is the case why were other tackles from the weekend not offered suspensions? I've seen a couple in highlight reels without even looking that meet this definition.

 

[powerrrrrrrrrrrr]

If that is the case why were other tackles from the weekend not offered suspensions? I've seen a couple in highlight reels without even looking that meet this definition.

Because the other tackles don’t meet the excessive force criteria and resulted in concussion. Whether we like it or not, that’s the key criteria here.

He doesn’t get concussed and it’s not even looked at.

 

[Makeshift Park]

If that is the case why were other tackles from the weekend not offered suspensions? I've seen a couple in highlight reels without even looking that meet this definition.

Because it’s outcome based.

If Sinn didn’t get concussed this thread wouldn’t exist.

 

[HairyO]

If that is the case why were other tackles from the weekend not offered suspensions? I've seen a couple in highlight reels without even looking that meet this definition.

Watson on Reid was very similar but no concussion so its okay.

Points out how truly ******ed the system is.

If WCE announced today that Reid has delayed onset concussion does the AFL go back and suspend Watson ?

 

[Duckimus Prime]

I reckon North might try arguing that taking both arms in a tackle from behind is not unreasonable, and find vision of Curtis laying similar tackles where they don't flip forward because of their knees getting stuck in the turf.

And the response from the AFL's representative being... thank you for showing us cases of Paul Curtis showing the required duty of care. However, on this occasion he didn't.

 

[Duckimus Prime]

Although we live in the real world good luck with a split second moment to act. I didn't see that as a reportable/MRO incident based on player intent, but yes as stated these days it's outcome based.

Why do people keep bringing up "based on player intent"?

He didn't intend to do that, is basically the stupidest defence anyone could bring up for an offence that is graded as "careless" not intentional.

 

[Duckimus Prime]

The AFL should really just ban pinning both arms as a tackling technique and be done with it.

Otherwise you just get a farcial situation where one player is fronting the tribunal tomorrow night, while the AFL's own twitter account is promoting another tackle where the arms were pinned and the player driven forward, but Reid was strong enough to prevent his head smacking the ground.

More to do with Reid simply getting lucky. Than any strength by the player.

And I'd argue the Watson's tackle technique is actually worse. Curtis bringing down Sinn is just careless through his technique, Watson is trying to bury Reid.

Because it’s outcome based.

If Sinn didn’t get concussed this thread wouldn’t exist.

If Curtis doesn't pinn both of Sinn's arms and take him to the ground then Sinn doesn't get concussed.

 

[Ambrosia]

Other than concussion how is the tackle any different to the Wizards tackle on Butters?

MATCH REVIEW: Dockers to appeal as forward cops big ban

The Match Review findings for Sunday's round five games are in

www.afl.com.au

 

[Ambrosia]

The AFL should really just ban pinning both arms as a tackling technique and be done with it.

Otherwise you just get a farcial situation where one player is fronting the tribunal tomorrow night, while the AFL's own twitter account is promoting another tackle where the arms were pinned and the player driven forward, but Reid was strong enough to prevent his head smacking the ground.

How does someone execute a lunging chase down tackle without pinning the arms? I very much doubt Curtis even considered Sinn's arms he just grabbed him as quick as possible

 

[DocSholl]

How does someone execute a lunging chase down tackle without pinning the arms? I very much doubt Curtis even considered Sinn's arms he just grabbed him as quick as possible

I mean I get it. If you pin the arms in a tackle, you have a duty of care to reasonably avoid pushing the player forward into the ground, because if you fail that duty you're responsible for the consequences.

I just found it funny the AFL also promoted a dangerous tackle which would have gotten three weeks if Reid hit his head. So they want the drama of run down tackles but they will also suspend for it.

 

[flyinghi64]

Wow decided to finally see the vision of this one and I want to know how many weeks the turf is getting.
Curtis EXtremely unlucky, as of course was Sinn who wouldn't have been concussed if the turf didn't do him in.

 

[fusion]

Watson on Reid was very similar but no concussion so its okay.

Points out how truly ******ed the system is.

If WCE announced today that Reid has delayed onset concussion does the AFL go back and suspend Watson ?

That's a really good point, sometimes concussions can be a delayed thing, and symptoms be more apparent a few days later, eg chronic headaches, balance issues, nausea etc. So the tackle is ok by the MRP, but 2 days later it is not.

 

[Ambrosia]

I mean I get it. If you pin the arms in a tackle, you have a duty of care to reasonably avoid pushing the player forward into the ground, because if you fail that duty you're responsible for the consequences.

I just found it funny the AFL also promoted a dangerous tackle which would have gotten three weeks if Reid hit his head. So they want the drama of run down tackles but they will also suspend for it.

The stupid thing is they are happy to suspend guys for home and away games but as soon as its a key player missing a final or late in the season Brownlow favourite all of a sudden intent matters and the knees digging in would be taken into account.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Of course rub out the player not from a big club. Honestly this is farcical that this was even reportable

 

[TheKanga]

We never win at MRP they absolutely hate us.

Panel is made up of an old boys club and we aren't part of it.

 

[tropicaltiger]

AFL was shit, now its diarrhoea.... Rough stuff is dead, maybe have a look at Dangerfield running thru Saad like a runaway freight train and knocking him senseless, probably rougher play than the Curtis tackle.

 

[DocSholl]

Of course rub out the player not from a big club. Honestly this is farcical that this was even reportable

Well something like concussion isn't going to get in the way of money-making. Of course a big star isn't going to be suspended for something like this come the business end of the season.

This is just a nice soft kill that the AFL can point to when the next class action hits.

 

[Vindicater]

The AFL have jumped the shark.