Traded Pick swap: Sydney trade #31 to Carlton for #48 and a 2021 R3 (Carl)

Jeremias · Nov 24, 2020

slashin_velvet said:
I reckon we would have been better served just doing the future 3rd for pick 37 and seeing what happens on draft night - but wouldnt be shocked if Gold Coast werent keen on trading with us.

Why wouldn’t they want to trade with us?

slashin_velvet · Nov 24, 2020

Jeremias said:
Why wouldn’t they want to trade with us?

Bad blood from the Jack Martin deal falling through. Different when its a player nomination vs pick swaps.

Kreuuuzeurns · Nov 24, 2020

slashin_velvet said:
Bad blood from the Jack Martin

21

Jack Martin

Age
25

Ht

186cm

Wt
83kg

Pos.
M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D
16.2

4

K
10.0

4

HB
6.3

4

M
4.9

5

T
3.7

5

CL
1.7

4

D
14.9

4

K
7.9

3

HB
7.0

4

M
4.3

4

T
3.6

4

CL
1.5

4

D
8.2

2

K
4.6

2

HB
3.6

3

M
1.8

2

T
2.0

4

CL
0.8

3

deal falling through. Different when its a player nomination vs pick swaps.

We did a live trade with GC last year weeks after the trade period. Flanders > Kemp and Philp.

Jeremias · Nov 24, 2020

slashin_velvet said:
Bad blood from the Jack Martin

21

Jack Martin

Age
25

Ht

186cm

Wt
83kg

Pos.
M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D
16.2

4

K
10.0

4

HB
6.3

4

M
4.9

5

T
3.7

5

CL
1.7

4

D
14.9

4

K
7.9

3

HB
7.0

4

M
4.3

4

T
3.6

4

CL
1.5

4

D
8.2

2

K
4.6

2

HB
3.6

3

M
1.8

2

T
2.0

4

CL
0.8

3

deal falling through. Different when its a player nomination vs pick swaps.

Don’t think so, the two teams traded on draft night just a few weeks later.

Reckon the “bad blood” is a fan beat up.

slashin_velvet · Nov 24, 2020

Jeremias said:
Don’t think so, the two teams traded on draft night just a few weeks later.

Reckon the “bad blood” is a fan beat up.

You might be right. Just don't really understand why Gold Coast wouldn't come directly to us with that offer.

Stamos · Nov 24, 2020

slashin_velvet said:
You might be right. Just don't really understand why Gold Coast wouldn't come directly to us with that offer.

Maybe we preferred #31 to #37 + #48

slashin_velvet · Nov 25, 2020

Stamos said:
Maybe we preferred #31 to #37 + #48

Even so, we could have traded with gold coast and then if we decided Sydney's 31 looked right, then we could deal 37 & 48 with them directly.

Tippett2Goal · Nov 25, 2020

Seems unlikely we go into deficit now unless a Gulden bid comes super high

Peel67skin · Nov 25, 2020

RUNVS said:
That is possible. We would not want to go into deficit next year as we are likely going to have a good pick in next years draft.

If no bid coming for gulden and the player you want fall at pick 26/27 you get your player and gulden , if a bid come in early you use up your point and still can trade a future 2nd for a player you want in this year draft if he is available at 26/27.
Have both end cover .

WilloTree · Nov 25, 2020

Jeremias said:
Don’t think so, the two teams traded on draft night just a few weeks later.

Reckon the “bad blood” is a fan beat up.

Yes, and the Jack Martin fiasco was under Silvagni, who's gone.

GCS were trading a pick they won't use anyway, and I'd hazard a guess they went to Sydney and asked for their F3, then settled on the Carlton F3 after a bit of haggling.

Peel67skin · Nov 25, 2020

WilloTree said:
Yes, and the Jack Martin

21

Jack Martin

Age
25

Ht

186cm

Wt
83kg

Pos.
M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D
16.2

4

K
10.0

4

HB
6.3

4

M
4.9

5

T
3.7

5

CL
1.7

4

D
14.9

4

K
7.9

3

HB
7.0

4

M
4.3

4

T
3.6

4

CL
1.5

4

D
8.2

2

K
4.6

2

HB
3.6

3

M
1.8

2

T
2.0

4

CL
0.8

3

fiasco was under Silvagni, who's gone.

GCS were trading a pick they won't use anyway, and I'd hazard a guess they went to Sydney and asked for their F3, then settled on the Carlton F3 after a bit of haggling.

Yup , correct , also there might be some negotiation In the background if Sydney plan to pick 4 players in this year draft . No point trading future pick for pick 27 now when nobody knew where the bid come for gulden ..
Pick 27 become very handy for club like Sydney , Hawthorn , Fremantle if no bid for their academy come around pick 27 and non academy players they want still Around at pick 27.

Guardian Hawk · Nov 25, 2020

I know GC won't use the pick this year but surely they could have got more for Pick 37. Carlton's future 3rd will be about pick 50 and a lot of clubs need points this year. They still. seem to be so charitable with draft picks - probably because they get given them so easily by the AFL.

Suma Magic · Nov 25, 2020

Guardian Hawk said:
I know GC won't use the pick this year but surely they could have got more for Pick 37. Carlton's future 3rd will be about pick 50 and a lot of clubs need points this year. They still. seem to be so charitable with draft picks - probably because they get given them so easily by the AFL.

I think it's more likely to be mid 40s.

Maybe it's just showing the difference in value between 2020 and 2021 picks.

You'd hope that GC would have asked all clubs if they could offer better than a carlton future third for 37. Meaning (if they did), all clubs said no.

Peel67skin · Nov 25, 2020

Guardian Hawk said:
I know GC won't use the pick this year but surely they could have got more for Pick 37. Carlton's future 3rd will be about pick 50 and a lot of clubs need points this year. They still. seem to be so charitable with draft picks - probably because they get given them so easily by the AFL.

I heard they going to use it on u19 academy players next year. Next year GCS no longer can pre list academy players .So next year pick 50 and two fourth round pick point is purely drafting local .

Mitchell54 · Nov 25, 2020

Bender571 said:
It's an interesting move from Carlton to trade from 48 to 31 when it looks like a lot of the pick between those pick will get eaten up by bids.
Dogs - 33, 41, 42
Sydney - 34, 37, 43
Port - 35, 47
Freo - 32
Hawks - 45, 46

If all those picks get used on bids pick 48 could become pick 37.

Pick 37 and a future 3rd for pick 31. It'll look worse after academy selection as well.

Not quite because the the whole draft will be moved back 7 picks.

Pick 31 will end up being 38 while 48 will be 44.

So you're right. They'll be much closer when the draft comes around but still not the same.

TENACIOUS · Nov 25, 2020

Guardian Hawk said:
I know GC won't use the pick this year but surely they could have got more for Pick 37. Carlton's future 3rd will be about pick 50 and a lot of clubs need points this year. They still. seem to be so charitable with draft picks - probably because they get given them so easily by the AFL.

Yes, Grand Final for the Blues next year

Guardian Hawk · Nov 25, 2020

TENACIOUS said:
Yes, Grand Final for the Blues next year

Ha ha...not what I meant.

Most rounds are 20+ picks these days - of course there is the standard 18 for each round but free agency compo adds picks to the first three rounds every year - usually in the vicinity of 5-10 additional selections. Academies usually cost more picks than they absorb in the early rounds too as most clubs are smart enough to trade with other clubs and use mostly late picks for points. Even conservatively (predicting only a couple of free agents and NGA's league wide) will see Gold Coast end up with pick 50 if Carlton finish 10th (as an example).

Tippett2Goal · Nov 25, 2020

Guardian Hawk said:
Ha ha...not what I meant.

Most rounds are 20+ picks these days - of course there is the standard 18 for each round but free agency compo adds picks to the first three rounds every year - usually in the vicinity of 5-10 additional selections. Academies usually cost more picks than they absorb in the early rounds too as most clubs are smart enough to trade with other clubs and use mostly late picks for points. Even conservatively (predicting only a couple of free agents and NGA's league wide) will see Gold Coast end up with pick 50 if Carlton finish 10th (as an example).

You have to remember that often these FA's/NGA's actually move up later picks as they eat multiple 2nd/3rd round picks
So Carltons 3rd rounder is likely to be either largely unaffected, or move up rather than drift back.

Guardian Hawk · Nov 26, 2020

Tippett2Goal said:
You have to remember that often these FA's/NGA's actually move up later picks as they eat multiple 2nd/3rd round picks
So Carltons 3rd rounder is likely to be either largely unaffected, or move up rather than drift back.

Yeah, thanks. I did actually mention that. My memory is that often it's the 3rd and 4th round picks that get eaten up en masse but usually the 1st 2 rounds that are in tact and usually pushed back by NGA's. Clubs are smart enough not to 'waste' first and second rounders on NGA bidding and trade out of these positions with other clubs for more points from later picks. I think this draft is the exception really as there are so many NGA's at the very pointy end so second rounders will have to be used on NGA's as the points required are so high. Ergo, an early 3rd round pick is typically pushed back further than it comes in (it's more the late 3rd rounders and 4th rounders that usually end up coming in again).

Even this year, Hawthorn's 3rd round pick has been pushed from 40 to 45 already. Interesting to see where it ends up.