Strategy Play Frampton

[PAFC_1870]

Doesn't change that Frampton "has done it at AFL level"

One dead rubber vs a s**t team as opposed to 126 games taking multiple defenders.

We overrate people no end.

If he was any good he'd be playing.

He's just another White, Salter etc etc.

 

[PAFC_1870]

Butcher was at least played. I remember being at Adelaide Oval against Melbourne before they re-developed, it was like seeing the Jesus storming out of the forward 50. Crowd loved it.

I think Frampton adds a bit of go to the footy to see him about him too - which can only be a good thing right, seeing the same thing repeated each week is pretty expected these days, with similar outcomes.

Butcher was a deserved first round selection, highly rated with one obvious flaw.

There was far far more upside with him than any other we've had outside Tredrea imo.

I don't buy the blame the coaches for their inability to develop these talls, some blame has to be on the individuals too.

 

[Forzaport]

One dead rubber vs a **** team as opposed to 126 games taking multiple defenders.

We overrate people no end.

If he was any good he'd be playing.

He's just another White, Salter etc etc.

White played 55 games, Salter 21. Frampton is sitting on 1 game. How about giving him some AFL opportunity before writing him off?

 

[PAFC_1870]

White played 55 games, Salter 21. Frampton is sitting on 1 game. How about giving him some AFL opportunity before writing him off?

Which of our failed bigs (Ruck or fwd) went somewhere else and proved us wrong?

None.

We recruit ready made fwds as they all turned out average. I don't feel the need to gift games.

 

[ahneadearut]

Butcher was a deserved first round selection, highly rated with one obvious flaw.

There was far far more upside with him than any other we've had outside Tredrea imo.

I don't buy the blame the coaches for their inability to develop these talls, some blame has to be on the individuals too.

Hallelujah! Responsibility for working at improving ones skills cannot be totally put on a coach. What are they ...Mummy boys? If you cant kick straight work on it then work on it more!! Being 'Hinkleyed ' is just a cop out .

 

[PAFC_1870]

Hallelujah! Responsibility for working at improving ones skills cannot be totally put on a coach. What are they ...Mummy boys? If you cant kick straight work on it then work on it more!! Being 'Hinkleyed ' is just a cop out .

It's easy to just keep blaming the coach. But Choco was well regarded as an excellent teacher. Did he manage to develop any other than having a role with Tredrea? Nope.

Did he win a flag with a very average 2nd fwd. Yep.

But yeah blame Hinkley.... It's been an issue for over 20 years... Maybe the players are just average? No one else picks up our scraps...

2 goal a game key fwd isn't demanding to be picked. That's nothing worth mentioning.

 

[ahneadearut]

It's easy to just keep blaming the coach. But Choco was well regarded as an excellent teacher. Did he manage to develop any other than having a role with Tredrea? Nope.

Did he win a flag with a very average 2nd fwd. Yep.

But yeah blame Hinkley.... It's been an issue for over 20 years... Maybe the players are just average? No one else picks up our scraps...

2 goal a game key fwd isn't demanding to be picked. That's nothing worth mentioning.

Yea well Tredders was a freak. Players like him are pretty rare. Midfielders drop out of trees while good KPF are like hens teeth.
I'm all for giving Frampton a go and seeing what he can give us. But Ive lost count how many games we have lost due to missed shots on goal. Does my head in.
And I think too much faith is being put on a guy who has played a few good SANFL games. Lets see in the big league .

 

[PAFC_1870]

few good SANFL games.

4 games for 10 goals this season, that's hardly knock the door down stuff.

We are all looking for that obvious easy fix, maybe it's not there....

 

[PowerBaz]

4 games for 10 goals this season, that's hardly knock the door down stuff.

We are all looking for that obvious easy fix, maybe it's not there....

Howard looked pretty good when he got placed forward didn't he? I think that's the point around here, Hinkley just tinkers whilst he waits for Dixon to come back, what if we started with Howard up forward last week, we need to be more proactive and actually set the tone a bit more.

You mentioned this - '2 goal a game key fwd isn't demanding to be picked. That's nothing worth mentioning.'

Why is a 9 disposal SANFL for AJ better then deserving of being picked?

People just want to see some logic that's all.

 

[ahneadearut]

Howard looked pretty good when he got placed forward didn't he? I think that's the point around here, Hinkley just tinkers whilst he waits for Dixon to come back, what if we started with Howard up forward last week, we need to be more proactive and actually set the tone a bit more.

You mentioned this - '2 goal a game key fwd isn't demanding to be picked. That's nothing worth mentioning.'

Why is a 9 disposal SANFL for AJ better then deserving of being picked?

People just want to see some logic that's all.

I absolutely agree . AJ should not have been picked. Didn't deserve it . And he played accordingly.

 

[Janus]

4 games for 10 goals this season, that's hardly knock the door down stuff.

We are all looking for that obvious easy fix, maybe it's not there....

You’re not playing this game right.

You see, if Frampton doesn’t play and the problems still persist, we can blame Ken for not playing a contested marking forward.

If Frampton does play but the problems still persist, we can blame Ken for not developing a contested marking forward.

If Frampton doesn’t play and the problems disappear, we can blame Ken for not using the opportunity to use an easy game to develop a contested marking forward.

If Frampton does play and the problems disappear, we can pat ourselves on the back for knowing more about football than Ken and still say he should be sacked.

There is no possible outcome that results in this board saying that they got it wrong, because they all believe that playing a 1 game ruck cum forward is the panacea to fixing crap decision making and execution when it comes to delivery into the forward line.

Frampton will fix Marshall’s horrible delivery to Westhoff and Broadbent.

Frampton will fix Sam Gray kicking to a 3 on 3 in the goal square.

Frampton will fix Powell-Pepper constantly being caught behind his man.

Frampton will fix Johnson kicking the ball on top of Westhoff’s head.

Frampton will fix Farrell not targeting a Westhoff v Brad Crouch one on one.

Frampton will fix Westhoff not blocking for Johnson and instead peeling off for the loopy handball when it was a 2 on 2 anyway.

Frampton will fix everything.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

4 games for 10 goals this season, that's hardly knock the door down stuff.

We are all looking for that obvious easy fix, maybe it's not there....

1 goal from 2 games where he was 50% in the ruck.

Then a 2 game suspension.

Then 9 goals from 2 games when he played 20% in the ruck whilst Ladhams was dominating.

Frampton playing AFL isn't about him kicking a bag each week. Buddy is the only player this decade who averages 3 goals a game year in year out and you have about 6 guys at the moment who have averaged between 2.0 and 2.9 over their career. The rest are less than 2.

Frampton is about structuring up our forward line whilst Marshall, Westhoff and the resting rucks don't have an impact. On form Marshall and Hoff should be dropped.

 

[PAFC_1870]

Frampton will fix everything.

Lol Port fans are in a world of disappointment if we are gonna pin our hopes on another young fwd.

But hey we nicknamed someone the future....

 

[PAFC_1870]

On form Marshall and Hoff should be dropped.

Marshall couldn't do squat against an undermanned Adelaide defence coming from a shorter break.

The fact a fwd turned defender absolutely put him to shame suggests to me he's never gonna make it.

If this is the same bloke who's keeping Frampton outta the team I'd be inclined to think maybe he won't either.

Ken isn't scared to play kids, the 4 against Melbourne warranted selection.

 

[Magus]

You’re not playing this game right.

You see, if Frampton doesn’t play and the problems still persist, we can blame Ken for not playing a contested marking forward.

If Frampton does play but the problems still persist, we can blame Ken for not developing a contested marking forward.

If Frampton doesn’t play and the problems disappear, we can blame Ken for not using the opportunity to use an easy game to develop a contested marking forward.

If Frampton does play and the problems disappear, we can pat ourselves on the back for knowing more about football than Ken and still say he should be sacked.

There is no possible outcome that results in this board saying that they got it wrong, because they all believe that playing a 1 game ruck cum forward is the panacea to fixing crap decision making and execution when it comes to delivery into the forward line.

Frampton will fix Marshall’s horrible delivery to Westhoff and Broadbent.

Frampton will fix Sam Gray kicking to a 3 on 3 in the goal square.

Frampton will fix Powell-Pepper constantly being caught behind his man.

Frampton will fix Johnson kicking the ball on top of Westhoff’s head.

Frampton will fix Farrell not targeting a Westhoff v Brad Crouch one on one.

Frampton will fix Westhoff not blocking for Johnson and instead peeling off for the loopy handball when it was a 2 on 2 anyway.

Frampton will fix everything.

Broadbent will fix....

Oh wait.

 

[PAFC_1870]

Howard looked pretty good when he got placed forward didn't he?

Thats because Howard is AFL standard and genuine quality.

Which is far better than the dozen or so failed bigs we've had.

 

[Janus]

Broadbent will fix....

Oh wait.

Broadbent was perfectly fine for his first game at AFL level in 2 years and with Burton leaving the ground after 5 minutes.

Had a far better game than all the other inclusions.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Marshall couldn't do squat against an undermanned Adelaide defence coming from a shorter break.

The fact a fwd turned defender absolutely put him to shame suggests to me he's never gonna make it.

If this is the same bloke who's keeping Frampton outta the team I'd be inclined to think maybe he won't either.

Ken isn't scared to play kids, the 4 against Melbourne warranted selection.

How was the crows defence undermanned?

Talia, Keath and Hartigan are their 3 best tall defenders. Smith and Laird are All Australian defenders and Kelly played. Yes Millera was missing.

I agree we should have used that 2 day extra rest to our advantage but didn't.

 

[Butters Made Me Do It]

4 games for 10 goals this season, that's hardly knock the door down stuff.

We are all looking for that obvious easy fix, maybe it's not there....

Which of our current `key forwards' is averaging even a goal a game at AFL level?

The threshold to justify Frampton's inclusion is not high.

 

[Forzaport]

Which of our failed bigs (Ruck or fwd) went somewhere else and proved us wrong?

None.

We recruit ready made fwds as they all turned out average. I don't feel the need to gift games.

Technically Howard. He was viewed as a forward, then moved to defence because he failed as a forward and now there's talk that he'll be moved forward again. IIRC Howard kicked 8 goals as a forward at SANFL level but Ken refused to play him. There's also Giles who managed to extend his career at other clubs and would have been handy backup for when we had no available ruck a few years ago.

I don't agree that it's gifting games to Billy when his SANFL form clearly warrants AFL selection as a key forward. The club has seen enough in Billy to extend his contract to the end of 2019, making him a 5 year player at the club. He's on the list and showing form, give him the opportunity.

 

[PAFC_1870]

How was the crows defence undermanned?

Talia, Keath and Hartigan are their 3 best tall defenders. Smith and Laird are All Australian defenders and Kelly played. Yes Millera was missing.

I agree we should have used that 2 day extra rest to our advantage but didn't.

You are forgetting the guy who is out a season? Their real 2nd best defender? Keath and Hartigan were made to look good because we were terrible.

Others were missing too....

and you also mentioned goal averages not being as high, well you did compare AFL averages to what someone is doing in the SANFL, that's not comparable.

Regardless, when all is said and done, the giant sea gull Josh Jenkins is daylight ahead of every fwd we've drafted outside Tredrea, that says a whole lot about the quality or lack there of.

None of these failures went elsewhere and turned it around...

 

[PAFC_1870]

Which of our current `key forwards' is averaging even a goal a game at AFL level?

The threshold to justify Frampton's inclusion is not high.

We are pinning waaaaay to much hope on another kid.

 

[PAFC_1870]

Technically Howard. He was viewed as a forward, then moved to defence because he failed as a forward and now there's talk that he'll be moved forward again. IIRC Howard kicked 8 goals as a forward at SANFL level but Ken refused to play him. There's also Giles who managed to extend his career at other clubs and would have been handy backup for when we had no available ruck a few years ago.

I don't agree that it's gifting games to Billy when his SANFL form clearly warrants AFL selection as a key forward. The club has seen enough in Billy to extend his contract to the end of 2019, making him a 5 year player at the club. He's on the list and showing form, give him the opportunity.

I was always of the belief Howard was a fwd, he kicked goals at AFL level, I felt no reason to switch him, especially when we had so much depth down back.

Giles was never gonna push our best rucks out.

 

[Janus]

How was the crows defence undermanned?

Talia, Keath and Hartigan are their 3 best tall defenders. Smith and Laird are All Australian defenders and Kelly played. Yes Millera was missing.

I agree we should have used that 2 day extra rest to our advantage but didn't.

Adelaide played +2 in defence at all times.

Our issue was the inability of our forward line and midfield to identify this and draw the two extra players out of forward 50 with quick ball movement around the arc to change the angle of entry, coupled with the forwards working as a unit to draw the defence to one side of the field and leave space for one forward or midfielder to lead into.

When a team is 'parking the bus' and looking to hit on the counter, it requires the most astute tactics and skill from the team to score. Repeat entries aren't the answer so much as different looks on every entry - sometimes short, sometimes long, sometimes on the angle, sometimes a shot on goal.

I'd be looking to fix that up before playing another tall forward. There's no point getting it in fast when there is an outnumber. Work the ball around and draw the defenders out of position first. Even if it means going all the way back to our defensive half.

 

[Butters Made Me Do It]

You’re not playing this game right.

You see, if Frampton doesn’t play and the problems still persist, we can blame Ken for not playing a contested marking forward.

If Frampton does play but the problems still persist, we can blame Ken for not developing a contested marking forward.

If Frampton doesn’t play and the problems disappear, we can blame Ken for not using the opportunity to use an easy game to develop a contested marking forward.

If Frampton does play and the problems disappear, we can pat ourselves on the back for knowing more about football than Ken and still say he should be sacked.

You're so close to getting it.

1. We can blame Ken for not playing a contested key forward when we've been crying out for one, as Frampton was waiting for ******* ever last year too
2. Because he wasn't played last year, guess what, Frampton hasn't had AFL development. He could be further ahead now than he is.
3. You were only just last week talking about how we shouldn't be bringing in raw players against the Crows because Gold Coast is an easier game. Is that magically wrong now?
4. Yep, because the duration of his *up shows he isn't up to managing his list to build towards a premiership, and keeps making stupid and short sighted selections.

Isn't it weird how *ups thats someone keeps ******* up just build and build until there are multiple aspects to the sheer enormity of their conglomerate *up?

I guess if you understood that, you'd be aware of how your regular self-contradictions when talking about football/justifying the status quo are affecting your perception in the eyes of others.