Roast Player development

[Saintly Viewed]

Considering our success in 2010 and 2011, I find it hard to believe that in 2012 when the Bucks era began, we were a long way behind the competition, physically.

Agree.
Hence we got to a prelim.
Wheels got shaky but we were still thereabouts but unlikely to reach the summit again without new wheels so to speak

 

[jackcass]

Considering our success in 2010 and 2011, I find it hard to believe that in 2012 when the Bucks era began, we were a long way behind the competition, physically.

Was how it was expressed by the club at the time.

How'd we go against the Cats in 2011? Seems teams evolved and we didn't. It's what happens to the premiers, teams work out how to beat them, Geelong nailed the formula in 2011.

 

[LynchToPies]

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/player-claim-for-2018-brayden-sier.1181813/


FWIW don’t get me started on the shit quality of the journalism. If they were even halfway decent these days they’d have asked those questions themselves to create an actual debate.

I think this story re: Sier originated from AFL.com, didn't it? From Q&A with Bucks?? AFL.com is pretty much your one-stop shop for vanilla journalism & unfortunately a big part of why sports journalism in this country is so

Which is why I prefer to shop at Big Footy

 

[sr36]

Was how it was expressed by the club at the time.

How'd we go against the Cats in 2011? Seems teams evolved and we didn't. It's what happens to the premiers, teams work out how to beat them, Geelong nailed the formula in 2011.

No doubt that we changed our training philosophy.

I'm just suggesting that the change was botched, resulting in too many injuries. Thus it's an example of poor player development during the time frame.

 

[left at home]

No doubt that we changed our training philosophy.

I'm just suggesting that the change was botched, resulting in too many injuries. Thus it's an example of poor player development during the time frame.

Yes very hard to develop when your in the rehab room, that’s for sure
Build your strength yes, but very little skill work

 

[Schraderbrau]

even more surprising that it took 18 months to have a 'chat' given that Sier's lack of exposure to professional systems was obvious to all when he was drafted

 

[Jasper84]

even more surprising that it took 18 months to have a 'chat' given that Sier's lack of exposure to professional systems was obvious to all when he was drafted

My guess is that there were several chats taking place over the 18 months, though the one Buckley is talking about probably involved an ultimatum.

 

[Bard]

I guess Freeman's hammy could be rooted (pardon the pun) in his physical preparedness but not sure Schaz's (or the other players likewise afflicted) knee can be lumped into that basket. Neither can the large number of in-game contact injuries we've endured. No amount of development will counter bad luck.

As I understand this discussion it is focused on the development in the Buckley era and your point on Davoren and increased training loads in my mind highlights that it has been a longer rooted issue. The reason they suggested the need to drastically increase training loads was because we were so far behind other clubs in terms of aerobic fitness.

Some of that is rooted in the transition of playing styles from MM's big-arsed contested boundary hugging to what Bucks wanted to implement, but some also needs to be put down to poor development, particularly in light of the vastly different age-experience list profiles of the respective coaches. Some of it also needs to be attributed to the list management and transition of new players into the squad in preparation for the departure of seasoned veterans. Some of it is just a failure to anticipate changes in playing styles or be at the forefront of those changes.

I think it's just a little more complex than pointing a bone at the development. As I've previously stated, I don't dispute that there have been developmental issues at the club. I just don't have enough information to draw the conclusions some suggest. I certainly find it ridiculous to blithely point to ladder regression and surmise that that is due to poor development in isolation.

Have you seen the recent picture of Freeman on the AFL website? Kirby’s physique puts him to shame, think there’s a lot in the bad recovery rumours.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Considering our success in 2010 and 2011, I find it hard to believe that in 2012 when the Bucks era began, we were a long way behind the competition, physically.

We made the prelim in 2012. Weren’t behind at all. Three knee recos and other injuries and an unprecentended PF week funeral for a former teammate cost us a gf position.

By the end of 2012 as stated ad Infinitum a large majority of our premiership side was either cooked, injured, petulant whingers, or right place right time youngsters who turned out to be not as good as we thought they were.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Davoren's changed training loads was a Buckley era issue. I don't blame Bucks, it's not his job to be an expert on physically developing players - we've got a coaching department of experts whose job that is. I don't think it was that we were so far behind in the pre-Buckley, but rather that during the Buckley era there was a cap on interchanges that was introduced and we'd been training for high intensity/high rotations, so we had to change our training focus. This occurred during the Buckley era and if you believe the whispers, Davoren stuffed stuffed it up. Thus, it has been a factor in poor player development during Bucks's reign - but by no means a criticism Buckley's coaching.

Rumour dressed up as fact.

 

[sr36]

Rumour dressed up as fact.

You could be right, but at the time the club did regularly talk about the injuries being a necessary byproduct of the need to significantly up the training loads.

 

[MagpieJoel]

Have you seen the recent picture of Freeman on the AFL website? Kirby’s physique puts him to shame, think there’s a lot in the bad recovery rumours.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

You could be right, but at the time the club did regularly talk about the injuries being a necessary byproduct of the need to significantly up the training loads.

I'd be interested to see a link to these club confessions.

Until then I'll stick with the rumour dressed up as fact line.

 

[sr36]

Looks like he's given up and just collecting his final year of AFL payments

 

[CFC2010]

Wow what a difference.....

 

[jmac70]

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/player-claim-for-2018-brayden-sier.1181813/

I read the article posted in the above thread bump and it got me thinking about where our club sits in terms of development. I’ve been a critic for the better part of three years, but I’ve only been looking at the symptoms, guys just not coming on. Now though I believe I’ve found a trigger point and it has to be discussed, IMO.

Only 2 and a bit years ago we took Sier as our first selection in the draft and it was only towards the end of his second season that he was put under the microscope for his professionalism. What exactly were the development coaches doing to allow a guy to have a “less than professional attitude” after 18 months in the system? Why were they not working on that with him sooner? If they were working on it with him what on earth were they doing if all it took was a chat with the senior coach for him to turn the corner? That’s not the coaches role and if this is happening on a regular basis (a chat with Aish has apparently had a similar impact) no wonder he’s failed with such poor support. The first question I’d also be asking of the development coaches as senior coach is why it took so long for this to be rectified? As fans should we be accepting that time frame? Where’s the process management?

I’m trying not to make this about Sier because everyone matures at a different rate. This is more about what the club is doing to cater for those different rates of maturity. If it’s happening with Sier who’s to say it isn’t happening with others on the fringe like Kirby or Broomhead? It also doesn’t absolve Buckley totally of blame because he should be identifying these issues with his coaching group and working with Walsh to clear out the dead wood within that group if they don’t have the skills to handle them. It’s poor leadership from top down, IMO.

When I, and others, have banged on about our terrible development this is the reason. We almost lost a guy to the system simply because the development coaching group couldn’t make any inroads with a sub par attitude. Yes I realise there will be plenty on here ready and willing to find an excuse for the ineptitude of that coaching performance (I expect it to be based around my interpretation of the article/ circumstances/ “it’s a long bow to draw” type comments), but does that excuse really benefit the discussion or the club? Winners find solutions and losers find excuses! We’ve been losers for too long

FWIW don’t get me started on the shit quality of the journalism. If they were even halfway decent these days they’d have asked those questions themselves to create an actual debate.

You have raised some great questions that really shine a light on our poor performance.

Whilst not a coaching appointment, I believe the role of Maxwell will go a long way towards fixing problem of players not being invested in a professional program.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

The proof of the pudding will be the eating...

Win more, development has improved.

Lose more, development gone backwards.

Same same, development same same, but different

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Wow what a difference.....

View attachment 458179

Bicep awareness...

 

[Schraderbrau]

Bicep awareness...

camera awareness imo

 

[Saintly Viewed]

camera awareness imo

And you reckon he’d love the mirror awareness too.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

The proof of the pudding will be the eating...

If youre referring to post 137 above youre on the wrong thread.

Or the right thread as the thread I'm thinking about shouldnt refer to the actual subject matter.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

If youre referring to post 137 above youre on the wrong thread.

Or the right thread as the thread I'm thinking about shouldnt refer to the actual subject matter.

I was thinking of our development.
I’m a free man to post on this thread as free as any man can be

 

[Bad Horse]

I was thinking of our development.
I’m a free man horse to post on this thread as free as any man horse can be

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I was thinking of our development.
I’m a free man to post on this thread as free as any man can be

Pudding....Freeman

Must me just me then.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Perfect!