Analysis Player Grading - What are the Benchmarks?

On my own board a spirited discussion is happening.

Luke Shuey and his legacy within West Coast’s best ever lists.
As a Norm Smith medalist, premiership player and now captain, he’s obviously a club legend, but there is no one consensus of where he sits compared to previous contemporaries, the only consensus mainly being Matera/Cousins and Judd are unanimously ahead, from there it gets murkier.

This got me thinking onto the bigger picture of actually defining what is an elite player, what is an A grade player etc.

My questions for you, the main board brains trust.

1. What is an Elite player today
2. From there, what is the destination between an A grade, a B grade , a C grade player etc?
3. How do you compare players from previous eras where stats aren’t necessarily reflective on a changed game?

My own opinion is that Judd, Matera and peak Cousins were elite. For me though, Shuey is a B+ player due to having periods of inconsistency and injury affected games.

For perspective, I consider fellow era players such as Fyfe, Ablett, Bartel, Hodge as elites, and say players like David Mundy as being A grade , a step down for not being super damaging but having longer consistent careers.

A B grade player is a best 22 player who has good qualities but is a step below the top, such as Jamie Cripps or maybe someone like Andrew Walker from Carlton

A C grade player being a fringe player with decent quality, such as Tom Hickey during his time with West Coast

That’s kinda my loose definition - feel free to pick it apart or debate it, but I’m curious as to how the greater footy community thinks
 
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I could think of a heap of better West Coast midfield players than Shuey

Cousins, Judd, Matera, Kerr, Embley, Kemp, Mainwairing off top of my head
 
I a
I could think of a heap of better West Coast midfield players than Shuey

Cousins, Judd, Matera, Kerr, Embley, Kemp, Mainwairing off top of my head
I agree, but i'm more interested in say, your list.

Could you give me an example of an elite player, an A, B, and C grader?

Off the top of my head..

Gawn and Grundy are elite rucks, but it remains to be seen how they go together - could be very exciting, I'm keen to see how the Dees get on this season. Proper club.


Anyway. Mids. Oliver and Petracca elite, Jack Viney an A grader, Langdon a B grader and pick any fringe player of your choice as a solid C grader.
 
I a

I agree, but i'm more interested in say, your list.

Could you give me an example of an elite player, an A, B, and C grader?

Off the top of my head..

Gawn and Grundy are elite rucks, but it remains to be seen how they go together - could be very exciting, I'm keen to see how the Dees get on this season. Proper club.


Anyway. Mids. Oliver and Petracca elite, Jack Viney an A grader, Langdon a B grader and pick any fringe player of your choice as a solid C grader.

In my opinion it would be something like this

26​
Adams, Jed NA
17​
Bowey, Jake C+
10​
Brayshaw, Angus A-
50​
Brown, Ben C
37​
Chandler, Kade NA
27​
Dunstan, Luke C-
43​
Farris-White, Kyah NA
31​
Fritsch, Bayley B (hard player to judge. Elite goalkicker but doesn't offer much else)
11​
Gawn, Max A
6​
Grundy, Brodie B
4​
Harmes, James C
14​
Hibberd, Michael C+
22​
Howes, Blake NA
12​
Hunter, Lachlan B (hard to judge on how he goes this year)
21​
Jefferson, Matthew NA
23​
Jordon, James C
15​
Langdon, Ed B
16​
Laurie, Bailey NA
8​
Lever, Jake B
1​
May, Steven A
25​
McDonald, Tom C
41​
McVee, Judd NA
18​
Melksham, Jake C-
45​
Moniz-Wakefield, Andy NA
30​
Neal-Bullen, Alex C
13​
Oliver, Clayton A
5​
Petracca, Christian A
35​
Petty, Harrison B
36​
Pickett, Kysaiah B+
24​
Rivers, Trent C
3​
Salem, Christian B-
19​
Schache, Josh C
38​
Sestan, Oliver NA
34​
Smith, Deakyn NA
29​
Smith, Joel D
9​
Spargo, Charlie D+
32​
Sparrow, Tom C+
20​
Tomlinson, Adam C-
42​
Turner, Daniel NA
33​
Turner, Kye \NA
2​
Van Rooyen, Jacob NA
28​
Verrall, Will NA
7​
Viney, Jack B+
40​
Woewodin, Taj NA
 
In my opinion it would be something like this

26​
Adams, Jed NA
17​
Bowey, Jake C+
10​
Brayshaw, Angus A-
50​
Brown, Ben C
37​
Chandler, Kade NA
27​
Dunstan, Luke C-
43​
Farris-White, Kyah NA
31​
Fritsch, Bayley B (hard player to judge. Elite goalkicker but doesn't offer much else)
11​
Gawn, Max A
6​
Grundy, Brodie B
4​
Harmes, James C
14​
Hibberd, Michael C+
22​
Howes, Blake NA
12​
Hunter, Lachlan B (hard to judge on how he goes this year)
21​
Jefferson, Matthew NA
23​
Jordon, James C
15​
Langdon, Ed B
16​
Laurie, Bailey NA
8​
Lever, Jake B
1​
May, Steven A
25​
McDonald, Tom C
41​
McVee, Judd NA
18​
Melksham, Jake C-
45​
Moniz-Wakefield, Andy NA
30​
Neal-Bullen, Alex C
13​
Oliver, Clayton A
5​
Petracca, Christian A
35​
Petty, Harrison B
36​
Pickett, Kysaiah B+
24​
Rivers, Trent C
3​
Salem, Christian B-
19​
Schache, Josh C
38​
Sestan, Oliver NA
34​
Smith, Deakyn NA
29​
Smith, Joel D
9​
Spargo, Charlie D+
32​
Sparrow, Tom C+
20​
Tomlinson, Adam C-
42​
Turner, Daniel NA
33​
Turner, Kye \NA
2​
Van Rooyen, Jacob NA
28​
Verrall, Will NA
7​
Viney, Jack B+
40​
Woewodin, Taj NA
I rate your list similarly, if maybe a bit higher, though I'm not super duper familiar with some of your outer fringe players. Petracca Oliver and Gawn A+ / elite. For me A grade is a slight step below. Grundy is probably an A grader if he isn't elite.

Viney a B+ is interesting. I also had Lever as a B+ type. Harmes also a borderline B.

Good summary, cheers.
 
I rate your list similarly, if maybe a bit higher, though I'm not super duper familiar with some of your outer fringe players. Petracca Oliver and Gawn A+ / elite. For me A grade is a slight step below. Grundy is probably an A grader if he isn't elite.

Viney a B+ is interesting. I also had Lever as a B+ type. Harmes also a borderline B.

Good summary, cheers.
yeah I originally had Gawn, Petracca, Oliver & May at A, but pulled it back

If you od that I could see Viney potentially getting up to A grade status, but there are alot of great midfielders

Grundy could get back to A grade but he has dipped a bit over the last 18 months (injury played a part).
 

Osho

We haven't changed our position.
Jul 9, 2021
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In my opinion it would be something like this

26​
Adams, Jed NA
17​
Bowey, Jake C+
10​
Brayshaw, Angus A-
50​
Brown, Ben C
37​
Chandler, Kade NA
27​
Dunstan, Luke C-
43​
Farris-White, Kyah NA
31​
Fritsch, Bayley B (hard player to judge. Elite goalkicker but doesn't offer much else)
11​
Gawn, Max A
6​
Grundy, Brodie B
4​
Harmes, James C
14​
Hibberd, Michael C+
22​
Howes, Blake NA
12​
Hunter, Lachlan B (hard to judge on how he goes this year)
21​
Jefferson, Matthew NA
23​
Jordon, James C
15​
Langdon, Ed B
16​
Laurie, Bailey NA
8​
Lever, Jake B
1​
May, Steven A
25​
McDonald, Tom C
41​
McVee, Judd NA
18​
Melksham, Jake C-
45​
Moniz-Wakefield, Andy NA
30​
Neal-Bullen, Alex C
13​
Oliver, Clayton A
5​
Petracca, Christian A
35​
Petty, Harrison B
36​
Pickett, Kysaiah B+
24​
Rivers, Trent C
3​
Salem, Christian B-
19​
Schache, Josh C
38​
Sestan, Oliver NA
34​
Smith, Deakyn NA
29​
Smith, Joel D
9​
Spargo, Charlie D+
32​
Sparrow, Tom C+
20​
Tomlinson, Adam C-
42​
Turner, Daniel NA
33​
Turner, Kye \NA
2​
Van Rooyen, Jacob NA
28​
Verrall, Will NA
7​
Viney, Jack B+
40​
Woewodin, Taj NA
Does this mean zero elite players?
 
Does this mean zero elite players?
I have A as elite

Gawn, Petracca, Oliver & May

Brayshaw, Viney, Grundy, Pickett, Lever, Hunter & Fritsch in the level just below elite with the potential to jump in

Tbf I don't throw the term elite around easily. Would have elite marked for the top 20-25 players. And players like Grundy & Lever I have gone a bit hard on as they were below elite last year. Then someone like Brayshaw needs to do it again to be considered elite imo
 

Hoops

Brownlow Medallist
Jul 30, 2004
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The AFL gradings are a pyramid.
Of the 720 or so players in the AFL as a quick estimate I would say,
D grade ~ 400
C grade ~ 200
B grade ~ 100
A grade ~ 20
I believe Geelong presently only have two A graders in Stewart and Cameron.
 
Nov 8, 2007
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On my own board a spirited discussion is happening.

Luke Shuey and his legacy within West Coast’s best ever lists.
As a Norm Smith medalist, premiership player and now captain, he’s obviously a club legend, but there is no one consensus of where he sits compared to previous contemporaries, the only consensus mainly being Matera/Cousins and Judd are unanimously ahead, from there it gets murkier.

This got me thinking onto the bigger picture of actually defining what is an elite player, what is an A grade player etc.

My questions for you, the main board brains trust.

1. What is an Elite player today
2. From there, what is the destination between an A grade, a B grade , a C grade player etc?
3. How do you compare players from previous eras where stats aren’t necessarily reflective on a changed game?

My own opinion is that Judd, Matera and peak Cousins were elite. For me though, Shuey is a B+ player due to having periods of inconsistency and injury affected games.

For perspective, I consider fellow era players such as Fyfe, Ablett, Bartel, Hodge as elites, and say players like David Mundy as being A grade , a step down for not being super damaging but having longer consistent careers.

A B grade player is a best 22 player who has good qualities but is a step below the top, such as Jamie Cripps or maybe someone like Andrew Walker from Carlton

A C grade player being a fringe player with decent quality, such as Tom Hickey during his time with West Coast

That’s kinda my loose definition - feel free to pick it apart or debate it, but I’m curious as to how the greater footy community thinks
1. Elite I think would be a top 50 player in the comp. So on average, your best 2-3 players. Most of the good players are mids, so there should be a lot more elite players that are mids. Similarly in a position with shallow depth like small forwards, there shouldn't be many 'elites'.

A-Grade is the same as elite I think.

Superstars are those that play at an elite level for a long time, or those who are in the top say 5-10 of the comp for 1-2 years at least.

2. B-grade are players that are sort of in the next 5-10 players on your list. They'd be in the top 16 of most other lists if they changed clubs.

3. C-grade are your fringe 22 and the next handful after that. They're not going to win you the game, but they won't be an absolute liability either.

4. D-grade are when you get desperate due to injuries or lack of depth in a position.

***being injury-prone automatically moves you down a rung from how you'd be if you played 20+ games a season, and maybe more if you're super-prone. Eg McGovern for us should be a B-grade but his output is C-grade.
 
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