List Mgmt. Player List Management 2019-20

Enviable Tradition

Professional Procrastinator
Oct 12, 2007
17,467
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"Powerball", lol. What would that involve? Kicking the ball inside 50 as many times as you can without scoring? Trying to lose as many games by single digit margins as possible? Seeing how many consecutive seasons you can finish either 9th or 10th?
Finishing low enough to miss finals yet high enough to back in your coach for another year.

Or finding the balance between remaining somewhat competitive whilst minimizing player payments in order to pay off debt.

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raptalia

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Mar 1, 2014
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On page 85 of this morning's press Rucci has got around to writing an article telling everyone what most of us had already worked out. Port has altered it's list building strategy over the past 12 months. We have changed list strategy from Moneyball to Astroball.

We are no longer trying to buy a Premiership but build a Premiership list via the Draft.

Of course neither Rucci or Keith Thomas who says, “We made a decision at the end of 2018 that the squad needed to change” , can tell anyone how long this will take or what happens if we make the wrong choices at the Draft. We still have nine players who will turn 29 or older next season so any influx of youth has to blossom pretty quickly. Last year's Draft bought about some promising results but it has to happen again in 2019 with a repeat in 2020 if we are to benefit. The other aspect is of course that it is one thing Draft talent but yet another to have the system that develops it to it's full potential.

The change in direction, while welcome in some respects, is an admission that what we tried between 2014 and 2017 did not work. Names like DIxon, Motlop, Rockliff, Watts and Polec have not got us to where we want to be so we try something different. I am OK with that, I just hope it works.

 

theDuckFarmer

Stun Guitar
Jul 7, 2007
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On page 85 of this morning's press Rucci has got around to writing an article telling everyone what most of us had already worked out. Port has altered it's list building strategy over the past 12 months. We have changed list strategy from Moneyball to Astroball.

We are no longer trying to buy a Premiership but build a Premiership list via the Draft.

Of course neither Rucci or Keith Thomas who says, “We made a decision at the end of 2018 that the squad needed to change” , can tell anyone how long this will take or what happens if we make the wrong choices at the Draft. We still have nine players who will turn 29 or older next season so any influx of youth has to blossom pretty quickly. Last year's Draft bought about some promising results but it has to happen again in 2019 with a repeat in 2020 if we are to benefit. The other aspect is of course that it is one thing Draft talent but yet another to have the system that develops it to it's full potential.

The change in direction, while welcome in some respects, is an admission that what we tried between 2014 and 2017 did not work. Names like DIxon, Motlop, Rockliff, Watts and Polec have not got us to where we want to be so we try something different. I am OK with that, I just hope it works.

Yep, the playing list is definitely the problem.
 

Magus

Brownlow Medallist
Dec 31, 2013
14,969
37,430
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On page 85 of this morning's press Rucci has got around to writing an article telling everyone what most of us had already worked out. Port has altered it's list building strategy over the past 12 months. We have changed list strategy from Moneyball to Astroball.

We are no longer trying to buy a Premiership but build a Premiership list via the Draft.

Of course neither Rucci or Keith Thomas who says, “We made a decision at the end of 2018 that the squad needed to change” , can tell anyone how long this will take or what happens if we make the wrong choices at the Draft. We still have nine players who will turn 29 or older next season so any influx of youth has to blossom pretty quickly. Last year's Draft bought about some promising results but it has to happen again in 2019 with a repeat in 2020 if we are to benefit. The other aspect is of course that it is one thing Draft talent but yet another to have the system that develops it to it's full potential.

The change in direction, while welcome in some respects, is an admission that what we tried between 2014 and 2017 did not work. Names like DIxon, Motlop, Rockliff, Watts and Polec have not got us to where we want to be so we try something different. I am OK with that, I just hope it works.

Let's not forget that losing Dougal is no big deal because we have Westhoff and Watts in defence.
 

Us against the rest

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Sep 26, 2012
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On page 85 of this morning's press Rucci has got around to writing an article telling everyone what most of us had already worked out. Port has altered it's list building strategy over the past 12 months. We have changed list strategy from Moneyball to Astroball.

We are no longer trying to buy a Premiership but build a Premiership list via the Draft.

Of course neither Rucci or Keith Thomas who says, “We made a decision at the end of 2018 that the squad needed to change” , can tell anyone how long this will take or what happens if we make the wrong choices at the Draft. We still have nine players who will turn 29 or older next season so any influx of youth has to blossom pretty quickly. Last year's Draft bought about some promising results but it has to happen again in 2019 with a repeat in 2020 if we are to benefit. The other aspect is of course that it is one thing Draft talent but yet another to have the system that develops it to it's full potential.

The change in direction, while welcome in some respects, is an admission that what we tried between 2014 and 2017 did not work. Names like DIxon, Motlop, Rockliff, Watts and Polec have not got us to where we want to be so we try something different. I am OK with that, I just hope it works.

If we remember we were told this way back when Ken arrived.
Hinkley said he wanted to build a squad that can not only go deep in September but maintain that level of consistency like Geelong.

What happen Ports. 7 years down the track and we are going to build a premiership team. Spin and Bullshit, a car salesman he is.
 

Janus

Dominus Ex Machina
Sep 9, 2007
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An absolute rubbish article from Rucci where he just makes up his own narrative without actually having any insight from the people in charge except a throwaway line from Keith Thomas about how they knew they needed to change the list at the end of 2018 - something that Thomas was adamant didn't need to happen in 2013 when Ken took over because the list was good enough according to Cripps, when it clearly wasn't. That's what I would have asked if I was talking to KT - 'So you're saying you got it wrong when you believed it was a top four list?'

It didn't start in 2018, it started in 2016 after we got a glimpse as to how shit our depth really was with the massive amount of injuries we had. That was when we decided to trade out of the 2017 first round and into 2016 where we picked up Marshall, Powell-Pepper, Atley and Drew. That's why we selected Rockliff and Motlop as free agents - it had nothing to do with 'moneyball' and had everything to do with the fact that we didn't have a first round pick in that draft.

Jason Cripps said that our strategy is to target certain draft crops and skip others. It's why we traded out of 2017 and into 2016. It's why we targeted 2018. It's why we traded out our 2019 third round pick last year, and why we weren't going to allow Ladhams and Amon to go to other clubs because the draft picks wouldn't have been worth the talent that we lost.

Keith Thomas says, “It is a solid group aged under 25. And we go to the draft again in a good position to inject more high-end talent.” And Rucci takes this to mean we are building around our group under 21? That discounts guys like Amon, Byrne-Jones and Houston, because he implies they won't be part of our next flag...just because we traded out a 24 year old Howard who wasn't that good anyway? Ridiculous.

Next year we target Lukosius and Hately with multiple first and second round picks while bringing in Schofield and Jones through a stockpile of third and fourth round draft picks.

Let's put it this way - we still offered contracts to Frampton, Ryder and Sam Gray. So it wasn't a deliberate ploy to get rid of those players by Cripps, just an accurate assessment of where they were at. Getting two picks in the first round in this draft + Mead is sound draft strategy.
 

EternalOptimist

Draftee
Oct 27, 2016
10
149
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Janus we are absolutely building around our 2016 draft onwards. The likes of Houston and Byrne-Jones will be the old men of the team if/when we see success
At the meeting with KT and Matthew Richardson a few weeks ago, in response to our challenge about the " playing the youf " narrative, KT clearly was including all our under 23s and Houston and Byrne-Jones specifically as some of the successes. I did not accept this and challenged, as I did not immediately think of a developmental youth strategy as something different for players that are already top 10 best and fairest. Even more so while drafting Sutcliffe and playing Sam and Paddy.

Accepting KTs comments at face value from his perspective, I think the difference is in how quickly he thinks we will bounce with the upper end youngsters like DBJ an Houston leading the charge. While agreeing with you, I can see a sharper improvement than perhaps you can at the moment. Of course it brings us back again to the criticality of getting a good coach in 2021 and stopping the "dumb stuff" so we don't set ourselves back any further in the meantime.

Jury is out for me, I think it is possible to rebound quickly, and I am encouraged by the couple of better announcements in the past few days. I don't think there is any room for more errors though.
 

Enviable Tradition

Professional Procrastinator
Oct 12, 2007
17,467
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If we remember we were told this way back when Ken arrived.
Hinkley said he wanted to build a squad that can not only go deep in September but maintain that level of consistency like Geelong.

What happen Ports. 7 years down the track and we are going to build a premiership team. Spin and Bullshit, a car salesman he is.
He was right about the consistency bit...



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Enviable Tradition

Professional Procrastinator
Oct 12, 2007
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An absolute rubbish article from Rucci where he just makes up his own narrative without actually having any insight from the people in charge except a throwaway line from Keith Thomas about how they knew they needed to change the list at the end of 2018 - something that Thomas was adamant didn't need to happen in 2013 when Ken took over because the list was good enough according to Cripps, when it clearly wasn't. That's what I would have asked if I was talking to KT - 'So you're saying you got it wrong when you believed it was a top four list?'

It didn't start in 2018, it started in 2016 after we got a glimpse as to how shit our depth really was with the massive amount of injuries we had. That was when we decided to trade out of the 2017 first round and into 2016 where we picked up Marshall, Powell-Pepper, Atley and Drew. That's why we selected Rockliff and Motlop as free agents - it had nothing to do with 'moneyball' and had everything to do with the fact that we didn't have a first round pick in that draft.

Jason Cripps said that our strategy is to target certain draft crops and skip others. It's why we traded out of 2017 and into 2016. It's why we targeted 2018. It's why we traded out our 2019 third round pick last year, and why we weren't going to allow Ladhams and Amon to go to other clubs because the draft picks wouldn't have been worth the talent that we lost.

Keith Thomas says, “It is a solid group aged under 25. And we go to the draft again in a good position to inject more high-end talent.” And Rucci takes this to mean we are building around our group under 21? That discounts guys like Amon, Byrne-Jones and Houston, because he implies they won't be part of our next flag...just because we traded out a 24 year old Howard who wasn't that good anyway? Ridiculous.

Next year we target Lukosius and Hately with multiple first and second round picks while bringing in Schofield and Jones through a stockpile of third and fourth round draft picks.

Let's put it this way - we still offered contracts to Frampton, Ryder and Sam Gray. So it wasn't a deliberate ploy to get rid of those players by Cripps, just an accurate assessment of where they were at. Getting two picks in the first round in this draft + Mead is sound draft strategy.
I was with you on the strategy of trading out of weak drafts and into strong drafts and focusing on improving the list using cheap pick ups and free agents when we dont have picks...

Until we traded out Howard for pick 18 and a pick downgrade in a weak draft.

It totally flies in the face of any supposed strategy that was there.

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PatientMental

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Jul 17, 2010
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Portia, if we were really going down that path, we don’t re-sign McKenzie and we don’t rookie Sutcliffe.

That’s why the article is just Rucci’s own opinion.
We re-signed McKenzie and Sutcliffe because we just lose a huge chunk of our SANFL depth and we always choose to have extra players on our list on minimum wage to circumvent the SANFL rules. Trengove was specifically traded for to be a well paid SANFL player. It's the same reason why the Crows have a development coach as their SANFL captain.
 

Janus

Dominus Ex Machina
Sep 9, 2007
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I was with you on the strategy of trading out of weak drafts and into strong drafts and focusing on improving the list using cheap pick ups and free agents when we dont have picks...

Until we traded out Howard for pick 18 and a pick downgrade in a weak draft.

It totally flies in the face of any supposed strategy that was there.

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It’s weak depth wise but the first round is still good enough.

Melbourne trading out of next year’s first and into this one tells you all you need to know.
 

shewho

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Oct 7, 2005
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You change strategy every year. That’s what reviews are for- is the strategy working?

Clearly the Watts Motlop Rockliff strategy didn’t bring the immediate rewards we hoped. New strategy, build around the 2017 draft.

The key to the astroball strategy is getting Lukosius. He is a player you can build a team around. Likewise the key to getting Lukosius is the astroball strategy. Save your salary cap for 2-3 years then when you have the funds to buy, buy the right guy.
 

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