List Mgmt. Player List Management 2019-20
- Thread starter Jacko21061993
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- Oct 8, 2004
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The same as most other teams.
Don’t agree we had a premiership winning list in the Hinkley era. We played well in the Pre-lim year, because we had a game plan of run and gun, that no other clubs had worked out yet. The players also had a belief that they were fitter than other teams.
the next year clubs worked us out. Western Bulldogs copied Our game plan and made it better ultimately winning a flag.
Our leadership has been suspect, our recruiting was average between The Boak and Wingard era. And many players failed like Hartlett who needed to become an elite mid.
we have had many games where if our leadership was good (irrespective of Ken) where we would have won games. We probably would have played finals most years.
many of our older players come from a losing culture and they can’t shake it. We r obviously rebuilding, and I prefer that at least the likes of Rozee, DBJ, Houston, etc know how to win 50% of the time, not like the older players.
Hinkley, I don’t mind, but his selection has been suspect, and I question whether he is inspiring the players as he did in the early years.
I do think Hinkley, KT and the recruiting team are building a team for the future, and although it is a bit painful, I’m ok where their club is heading...
the next year clubs worked us out. Western Bulldogs copied Our game plan and made it better ultimately winning a flag.
Our leadership has been suspect, our recruiting was average between The Boak and Wingard era. And many players failed like Hartlett who needed to become an elite mid.
we have had many games where if our leadership was good (irrespective of Ken) where we would have won games. We probably would have played finals most years.
many of our older players come from a losing culture and they can’t shake it. We r obviously rebuilding, and I prefer that at least the likes of Rozee, DBJ, Houston, etc know how to win 50% of the time, not like the older players.
Hinkley, I don’t mind, but his selection has been suspect, and I question whether he is inspiring the players as he did in the early years.
I do think Hinkley, KT and the recruiting team are building a team for the future, and although it is a bit painful, I’m ok where their club is heading...
Our list has been better than a few of the premiership teams' list in Hinkleys time, certainly the Bulldogs. The reasons we couldn't take the opportunity are as you subsequently describe...
Poor Leadership
Poor coaching
Poor selection policy
Poor game plan
Poor culture
And more
- Jun 7, 2015
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My concern is the lack of prime A graders coming through in the next 5 years.
Lets please not haggle about my rankings, I know they are very subjective.
Sure. And I agree, you need at least 5 elite (A grade) players to be on the mix. Forget our older guys, they will be gone soon. We really need some of our mid group to step up into the elite bracket. Otherwise it all hinges on the young guys and latest draftees to produce them all, which is years away.
So there is heaps of potential, but right now full of holes!
FishingRick04
Brownlow Medallist
Our biggest issue on the playing field has been composure, you could argue composure from our senior players and leaders.
rhats the difference between winning and losing the close games. We need more players steady and confident under pressure. Keep moving on those who ain’t.
rhats the difference between winning and losing the close games. We need more players steady and confident under pressure. Keep moving on those who ain’t.
Tredrea_Wanganeen_Gray
Team Captain
- Apr 4, 2018
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Wines in the showdown last year to ice the game from 20m out but decides to kick around the corner to skew it on a right angle comes to mind.
TeeKray
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The problem is that we've traded out all of our mid tier group who had potential to be A grade players for us - Wingard, Polec, Wines (next year presumably). This means that we're relying on the much younger group including Houston, Rozee, Butters, Duursma to develop into A graders, and that could take some time.
Granny Duurs is Lovely
All Australian
- Jun 11, 2019
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Dont give up on Wines just yet. A lot can change in a year and if he can put together a career best year I'm not sure he'll want to disrupt that by moving clubs
- Oct 8, 2004
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Copied from the main board - our oldies and youngies who could replace them:
Westhoff 33.2, Gray 31.9, Boak 31.5, Rockliff 29.10, Ebert 29.8, Harlett 29.4, Dixon 29.3
Butters 19.3, Duursma 19.5, Rozee 19.11, Farrell 20.9, Marshall 21.2, Drew 21.2, Ladhams 21.11, Powell-Pepper 21.11, Houston 22.6, Bonner 22.9, Burton 22.10
Plus 2019 draft
Mead
Bergman
Williams
Georgiades
Burgoyne
Pasini
Westhoff 33.2, Gray 31.9, Boak 31.5, Rockliff 29.10, Ebert 29.8, Harlett 29.4, Dixon 29.3
Butters 19.3, Duursma 19.5, Rozee 19.11, Farrell 20.9, Marshall 21.2, Drew 21.2, Ladhams 21.11, Powell-Pepper 21.11, Houston 22.6, Bonner 22.9, Burton 22.10
Plus 2019 draft
Mead
Bergman
Williams
Georgiades
Burgoyne
Pasini
RussellEbertHandball
Flick pass expert
Players on the 2020 list that were there on our list in the previous seasons;
2012 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas
2013 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey
2014 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon
2015 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon
2016 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston
2017 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston, SPP,
....... Marshall, Atley, Drew, Ladhams, Lienert
So in 2020 there will only be 19 off 45 players who have been at Port for 3 seasons or more. If that's not a rebuild then I don't know what is. if its not a rebuild then how do Cripps, Parker and the development coaches keep their jobs if our board, CEO and GM of Football think the head coach is doing a wonderful job??
Of the players we trade in or use free agency to add to the list this decade, they haven't lasted more than 5 seasons, apart from Ebert, who came home after only 4 seasons.
Players traded or drafted in after 2017 season ended and add 26 more to the current list
2017 Hayes, Patmore, Farrell, Garner, Rockliff, Motlop, Watts, McKenzie
2018 Rozee, Butters, Duursma, Grundy, Woodcock, Cox, Lycett, Burton, Mayes, Fredrick, Sutcliffe
2019 Bergman, Georgiadies, Williams, Mead, Pasini, Burgoyne, Buzza
Given our past history only 8-10 of the above 26 names added since October 2017 will still be on the 2025 list. If the players are better than average we might get to 13-14 still being on the list by then.
Of those 19 who have been at Alberton since before October 2017, maybe 6-7 will still be on the list come 2025.
I've said 2025 is probably our next window to win a flag. Might actually be peaking before 2025 with the 45 players we currently have, but that doesn't mean a flag. Probably still need to add another 4 or 5 top line players to win in 2025.
2012 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas
2013 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey
2014 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon
2015 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon
2016 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston
2017 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston, SPP,
....... Marshall, Atley, Drew, Ladhams, Lienert
So in 2020 there will only be 19 off 45 players who have been at Port for 3 seasons or more. If that's not a rebuild then I don't know what is. if its not a rebuild then how do Cripps, Parker and the development coaches keep their jobs if our board, CEO and GM of Football think the head coach is doing a wonderful job??
Of the players we trade in or use free agency to add to the list this decade, they haven't lasted more than 5 seasons, apart from Ebert, who came home after only 4 seasons.
Players traded or drafted in after 2017 season ended and add 26 more to the current list
2017 Hayes, Patmore, Farrell, Garner, Rockliff, Motlop, Watts, McKenzie
2018 Rozee, Butters, Duursma, Grundy, Woodcock, Cox, Lycett, Burton, Mayes, Fredrick, Sutcliffe
2019 Bergman, Georgiadies, Williams, Mead, Pasini, Burgoyne, Buzza
Given our past history only 8-10 of the above 26 names added since October 2017 will still be on the 2025 list. If the players are better than average we might get to 13-14 still being on the list by then.
Of those 19 who have been at Alberton since before October 2017, maybe 6-7 will still be on the list come 2025.
I've said 2025 is probably our next window to win a flag. Might actually be peaking before 2025 with the 45 players we currently have, but that doesn't mean a flag. Probably still need to add another 4 or 5 top line players to win in 2025.
It has been a full rebuild in the last few years without publicly saying so. Hence why there is literally no pressure internally towards Ken because they are giving him leeway to be garbage for a few more seasons until he burns the next lot of draftees leaving us in an inescapable hole.
The only reason why they haven't said so publicly because it would likely financially cripple the club more than it is by saying "hey remember how we looked close to a premiership? lol jk we're starting from scratch with the same potato."
RussellEbertHandball
Flick pass expert
Just further to my post a couple up the page, in December, in 2020 there will only be 19 off 45 players who have been at Port for 3 full seasons or more. Here are the other 26 added at end of 2017,2019,2020.
Players left on our list from the 2016 season onward. Bold equals players from other clubs.
2016 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston =13
2017 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston,
....... SPP, Marshall, Atley, Drew, Ladhams, Lienert = 19
2018 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston,
....... SPP, Marshall, Atley, Drew, Ladhams, Lienert
....... Motlop, Mckenzie, Rockliff, Watts, Hayes, Farrell, Garner, Patmore = 27
2019 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston,
....... SPP, Marshall, Atley, Drew, Ladhams, Lienert
....... Motlop, Mckenzie, Rockliff, Watts, Hayes, Farrell, Garner, Patmore
....... Burton, Lycett, Mayes, Suttcliffe, Rozee, Butters, Duursma, Grundy, Woodcox, Cox, Fredrick = 38
2020 we add Buzza, Bergman, Georgiades, Williams, Mead, Pisani, Burgoyne = 45
Players left on our list from the 2016 season onward. Bold equals players from other clubs.
2016 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston =13
2017 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston,
....... SPP, Marshall, Atley, Drew, Ladhams, Lienert = 19
2018 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston,
....... SPP, Marshall, Atley, Drew, Ladhams, Lienert
....... Motlop, Mckenzie, Rockliff, Watts, Hayes, Farrell, Garner, Patmore = 27
2019 Boak, Westhoff, Gray, Hartlett, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Clurey, DBJ, Amon, Dixon, Bonner, Houston,
....... SPP, Marshall, Atley, Drew, Ladhams, Lienert
....... Motlop, Mckenzie, Rockliff, Watts, Hayes, Farrell, Garner, Patmore
....... Burton, Lycett, Mayes, Suttcliffe, Rozee, Butters, Duursma, Grundy, Woodcox, Cox, Fredrick = 38
2020 we add Buzza, Bergman, Georgiades, Williams, Mead, Pisani, Burgoyne = 45
Agree, although it sounds like Bergman could develop into this role over time.
Bergman has a few characteristics that remind me of James Sicily.
Our next-gen prospect Jones also seems to play as a medium-tall defender and looks pretty good to me, a bit in the mould of Will Gould.
25 and under side:
Forward line:
F: Hayes.....Georgiades.....Williams
HF: Butters......Marshall......Mead
C: Amon.......Rozee.......Duursma
HB: Bergman........Clurey.......Burton
FB: DBJ.......Pasini......Bonner
R: Ladhams.....Wines.....Houston
Int: Powell-Pepper.......Drew......Farrell......Garner.....Patmore......Burgoyne......(Schofield, Jones)
- Sep 11, 2014
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When you look at lists like this you see exactly how well our list management team has been doing over the last 3-4 years. ~75% of a side built for the next 5 years.
It’s a nice list. We need a full back and a back pocket. Maybe Schofield will become a defender?
- Oct 8, 2004
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Port have 16 players on top of Dixon who are out of contract after this season:
Port Adelaide
Charlie Dixon
Sam Powell-Pepper
Brad Ebert (restricted free agent)
Joe Atley
Wylie Buzza
Tobin Cox (rookie)
Willem Drew
Martin Frederick (rookie)
Riley Grundy (rookie)
Jarrod Lienert
Trent McKenzie
Jake Patmore
Jake Pasini
Cam Sutcliffe (rookie)
Jack Watts
Justin Westhoff
Boyd Woodcock (rookie)
Port Adelaide
Charlie Dixon
Sam Powell-Pepper
Brad Ebert (restricted free agent)
Joe Atley
Wylie Buzza
Tobin Cox (rookie)
Willem Drew
Martin Frederick (rookie)
Riley Grundy (rookie)
Jarrod Lienert
Trent McKenzie
Jake Patmore
Jake Pasini
Cam Sutcliffe (rookie)
Jack Watts
Justin Westhoff
Boyd Woodcock (rookie)
RossFC
Moderator
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I'm going to feel sorry for some of the guys that get delisted this season. Good performances in a few scratch matches and training sessions are the difference between staying or leaving for them.Port have 16 players on top of Dixon who are out of contract after this season:
Port Adelaide
Charlie Dixon
Sam Powell-Pepper
Brad Ebert (restricted free agent)
Joe Atley
Wylie Buzza
Tobin Cox (rookie)
Willem Drew
Martin Frederick (rookie)
Riley Grundy (rookie)
Jarrod Lienert
Trent McKenzie
Jake Patmore
Jake Pasini
Cam Sutcliffe (rookie)
Jack Watts
Justin Westhoff
Boyd Woodcock (rookie)
Port have 16 players on top of Dixon who are out of contract after this season:
Port Adelaide
Charlie Dixon - he will obviously sign
Sam Powell-Pepper - like to sign him. Could be courted by other clubs. Necessary to keep for his point of difference.
Brad Ebert (restricted free agent) - 1 year contract. Could retire due to concerns about concussions.
Joe Atley - likely gone. I would like to keep him especially if wines leaves and see if his body gets right but I predict he’s gone.
Wylie Buzza - delist
Tobin Cox (rookie) - potential delist depending on roster space. I personally don’t see a need for him
Willem Drew - sign urgently. Injuries are a huge problem right now but he’s the next inside mid in line after wines and rocky and that’s an issue
Martin Frederick (rookie) - delist if need the roster space
Riley Grundy (rookie) - sign urgently. Only developing defender with height and made very good strides earlier than I thought he would.
Jarrod Lienert - sign. Great depth
Trent McKenzie - sign. Earned a moderate pay rise.
Jake Patmore - sign. Times running out for him to show what he has though.
Jake Pasini - sign. I thought he was a rookie listed player?
Cam Sutcliffe (rookie) - my opinion. Delist. That he got picked over quite a few others this year tells me we won’t delist him.
Jack Watts - sign
Justin Westhoff - ? Hard to say. Depends on how the rest of the year plays out. Could retire or might go around 1 more year.
Boyd Woodcock (rookie) - preferably sign but wouldn’t be a priority if we needed list space.
Possible trade - Wines
Port Adelaide
Charlie Dixon - he will obviously sign
Sam Powell-Pepper - like to sign him. Could be courted by other clubs. Necessary to keep for his point of difference.
Brad Ebert (restricted free agent) - 1 year contract. Could retire due to concerns about concussions.
Joe Atley - likely gone. I would like to keep him especially if wines leaves and see if his body gets right but I predict he’s gone.
Wylie Buzza - delist
Tobin Cox (rookie) - potential delist depending on roster space. I personally don’t see a need for him
Willem Drew - sign urgently. Injuries are a huge problem right now but he’s the next inside mid in line after wines and rocky and that’s an issue
Martin Frederick (rookie) - delist if need the roster space
Riley Grundy (rookie) - sign urgently. Only developing defender with height and made very good strides earlier than I thought he would.
Jarrod Lienert - sign. Great depth
Trent McKenzie - sign. Earned a moderate pay rise.
Jake Patmore - sign. Times running out for him to show what he has though.
Jake Pasini - sign. I thought he was a rookie listed player?
Cam Sutcliffe (rookie) - my opinion. Delist. That he got picked over quite a few others this year tells me we won’t delist him.
Jack Watts - sign
Justin Westhoff - ? Hard to say. Depends on how the rest of the year plays out. Could retire or might go around 1 more year.
Boyd Woodcock (rookie) - preferably sign but wouldn’t be a priority if we needed list space.
Possible trade - Wines
I hope we aren't keeping Sutcliffe around for another year, but with Ken still here most likely, then he probably will.Port have 16 players on top of Dixon who are out of contract after this season:
Port Adelaide
Charlie Dixon
Sam Powell-Pepper
Brad Ebert (restricted free agent)
Joe Atley
Wylie Buzza
Tobin Cox (rookie)
Willem Drew
Martin Frederick (rookie)
Riley Grundy (rookie)
Jarrod Lienert
Trent McKenzie
Jake Patmore
Jake Pasini
Cam Sutcliffe (rookie)
Jack Watts
Justin Westhoff
Boyd Woodcock (rookie)
My cuts off the main list (or getting games as a rookie) would be Sutcliffe, Buzza, Drew (can't stay on the park for an extended run unfortunately), Westhoff and Ebert. The last two controversial, but if we don't want all our senior players going at once then hard choices need to be made.
- Oct 8, 2004
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- Other Teams
- Liverpool
If list are cut to 40 (from 44) and we want to draft 4 new players then 8 will have to be cut.
Hong-Kong Phooey
Cancelled
If we need to remove 8 from list then id do the below
Re-sign
Charlie Dixon
Sam Powell-Pepper
Willem Drew
Jarrod Lienert
Trent McKenzie
Jack Watts
Riley Grundy
Jake Pasini
Boyd Woodcock
Retire/Delist/ seek trade
Joe Atley
Wylie Buzza
Cam Sutcliffe
Justin Westhoff
Martin Frederick
Tobin Cox
Jake Patmore
Brad Ebert (forced retirement due to head knocks)
Re-sign
Charlie Dixon
Sam Powell-Pepper
Willem Drew
Jarrod Lienert
Trent McKenzie
Jack Watts
Riley Grundy
Jake Pasini
Boyd Woodcock
Retire/Delist/ seek trade
Joe Atley
Wylie Buzza
Cam Sutcliffe
Justin Westhoff
Martin Frederick
Tobin Cox
Jake Patmore
Brad Ebert (forced retirement due to head knocks)
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