Review Player Review vs GWS

[MagpieJoel]

Great write-up Quicky . A bit generous to Elliott imo.

I would have said the same. But...watch a replay and you will notice who is doing all the kicks to Cloke in the last half. He more than redeemed himself.

 

[partypie]

Sure, but I think finals should still very much be at the forefront.

A quick bit of "crystal ball" work with the ladder predictor (pessimistically assuming we come up short in our next 4 games against FRE, HAW, PORT and WCE, as well as in our annual date with the SYD up there) potentially sees us needing to get W's in two out of the WB, RICH and GEEL games, while also banking wins against CARL, MELB and ESS to pretty much guarantee us managing to sneak into the top 8.

If we only beat one out of those three teams (WB, RICH, GEEL) *or* drop one to CARL / MELB / ESS (although we've been a bit better when it comes to beating teams below us on the ladder this year) then it's pretty much out of our hands and we need other teams to do us a favour at various points, although restricting the damage to our percentage against the five teams I'm pegging us in for an 'L' against will help in that respect. If we can't beat any of those three teams (WB, RICH, GEEL) then we'll more than likely fall short by a game because it will be a minimum of 12 wins and decent percentage to make it into 8th spot this year the way things are shaping up (looks like there might be 4-5 teams minimum around that 12-13 win mark this year, maybe as many as 6 or perhaps even 7).

Having said all of that we are in a surprisingly good position given that our destiny is in our own hands at least, wrt just needing to beat other likely mid-table teams that are also fighting for spots towards the bottom end of the top 8 and banking W's against teams further down the ladder. If we can get the job done against a couple of those other mid-table contenders and beat the teams a bit further down then we deserve to be there, if not then we at least know where we are at as also-rans and the level we need to aim for.

 

[Gone Critical]

A quick bit of "crystal ball" work with the ladder predictor (pessimistically assuming we come up short in our next 4 games against FRE, HAW, PORT and WCE, as well as in our annual date with the SYD up there) potentially sees us needing to get W's in two out of the WB, RICH and GEEL games, while also banking wins against CARL, MELB and ESS to pretty much guarantee us managing to sneak into the top 8.

If we only beat one out of those three teams (WB, RICH, GEEL) *or* drop one to CARL / MELB / ESS (although we've been a bit better when it comes to beating teams below us on the ladder this year) then it's pretty much out of our hands and we need other teams to do us a favour at various points, although restricting the damage to our percentage against the five teams I'm pegging us in for an 'L' against will help in that respect. If we can't beat any of those three teams (WB, RICH, GEEL) then we'll more than likely fall short by a game because it will be a minimum of 12 wins and decent percentage to make it into 8th spot this year the way things are shaping up (looks like there might be 4-5 teams minimum around that 12-13 win mark this year, maybe as many as 6 or perhaps even 7).

Having said all of that we are in a surprisingly good position given that our destiny is in our own hands at least, wrt just needing to beat other likely mid-table teams that are also fighting for spots towards the bottom end of the top 8 and banking W's against teams further down the ladder. If we can get the job done against a couple of those other mid-table contenders and beat the teams a bit further down then we deserve to be there, if not then we at least know where we are at as also-rans and the level we need to aim for.

Perhaps too pessimistic with losses to all of Freo, Hawks, Port, WCE and Syd. Hawks v tough and Freo tougher. The others are hard but we should be favs against WCE in Melb, have a great record against Sydney and Port dont appear to be the team they were threatening to be and are no finals certainty. 1-2 wins in that group is likely.

 

[cleomenes]

It's a bit rich criticizing any of our players after that game. Goldsack has become this year's whipping boy, and it makes no sense at all.
In my estimates and guesses at the start of the year, I thought that we had to scrounge wins early, while the team was weak, but our opponents were too. We have done better than I hoped. The team has become confident in itself, and as we face the big guns, I think the players can use that to handle the extra pressure that will come their way now.
I don't know if they are good enough to really challenge this year, but they have given themselves every chance. Many players are way ahead of schedule in their development. With so many being young, they may fade as the year wears on, and we should forgive them if they do. I am looking forward to a very stressfull second half to the year, because the chance of a big finale is there, even if still unlikely. What more can we ask?

 

[Snoop Dog]

What a win! That was a 50/50 game against a fellow top 4 challenger and we buried them. It was a contrast of game styles. They spread and run at all costs. We pressure, tackle and throw everything at the contest. I was worried after that period in the second when GWS scored 3 on the trot, but they were inaccurate and we managed to settle. The difference was that we caused turnovers and really harried their F50 entries, so our game style and plan stood up. Many may say we were lucky with the injuries that they had, which we were, but we already had that game on our terms and their players were hurt because we hurt them. Our attack on the ball and man was second to none. Top effort.

Taylor Adams - Made a statement against his old club and showed how much we missed him against the Dees. Was relentless at the contest all day. Also thought he presented well to make an option around the ground. His ball use was pretty good too. 36 touches, 7 tackles says plenty.

Dane Swan - Contributed all game and I thought was important through the middle. You might question his disposal but he always gets the ball moving our way.

Scott Pendlebury - He gives us what he always gives, poise and class. Lovely goal from the boundary on the left late in the game was the highlight.

Jack Crisp - I thought he started a little slowly and was given a hard time by Shiel who was really good for the Giants. But he always worked hard, got into the game late and surprised to see ended up with 28 disposals. The two goals are the ones that have me excited. A big bodied, hard running, contested possession winning run with player that kicks goals regularly. He really has helped the balance of our midfield group. Beams who?

Marley Williams - I wasn't sure where Williams fit in the team 6 weeks ago. Since then he has been nothing short of astonishing. He was tough as nails today and is really good at the contest. One of our best contested players. He found plenty of the footy too and used his pace and evasiveness really well from half back (or our defensive wall which sets up a kick behind the play on any account). The big question mark on Marley was his footskills and on balance he has been clean and creative with the odd poor one from time to time. Real good.

Tim Broomhead - Stood up big time. For a player that is still developing his strength he does pretty well in the contest through his sheer wiliness. I thought he was important early with creative ball use and presented well up the wing as a target for our half backs. Needed a big game and delivered. I'm really excited about what Broomy can give us on the outside with development. I think we need to be patient.

Adam Oxley - Not as prominent today but still got plenty of the footy. I thought his kicking was off and delivered a few half volleys which he would be disappointed about. Took some good intercept marks. Not bad. Not great.

Travis Varcoe - In the absence of any real dominant outside players Trav has been great for us. He is a really street smart player, harangues, closes space quickly and I think is super important for our defensive game plan. Plus he adds some run and carry. It's a shame he doesn't get bigger possession numbers because then he would be real good, but what he offers us is really important.

Steele Sidebottom - He had a quiet-ish game by his standards but still had some clever moments with his ball use. Due for a big game and we will need it against Freo after the bye.

Tom Langdon - I thought he was good and far more committed to the contest than last week which was pleasing. I like his ball use off half back, it's typically assured and unflustered. And he is pretty consistent at cracking 20 possie games too.

Paul Seedsman - He is in poor form and I believe if we had better outside options would be having a spell in the 2's. That moment in the second half when he had an open forward and hit the pass straight to the GWS defender summarised his issues today. He had some great lead up work only to burn the final pass. He was played largely off half back today. I think I would like to see Scharenberg given a crack at the role given his solid form in the twos.

Nathan Brown - Back to his best. Gave up very little against Cameron. On the few occasions he looked like being beaten our defense was there to help out. Real pleasing from Brown after a poor few weeks.

Tyson Goldsack - I'm torn about Goldsack. I think he was horrible on Stewart early and gives up too much space to his forwards. Of late he is a liability one vs one. His kick ins are good and important but his field kicking is garbage. He will always tackle and chase and did that again today. If Reid is ready to go I would consider bringing him in at Goldsacks expense.

Alex Fasolo - I thought he was great again today. That strong lead and mark in the first half to beat three GWS defenders was quality and at a time the team needed someone to stand tall. Seemed to do his best when we were under the pump and the heat well and truly in the game. Most importantly he has given 3 solid weeks of committed defensive forward. The forward line looks far more dangerous with an in-form, hungry Fasolo.

Travis Cloke - I thought GWS were real good at limiting his space and triple teaming him early. I thought our forward 50 entries in the first all to Cloke were a bit dumb. He worked his way into the game later and kicked a couple of important goals. Laid a vicious tackle that ended Davis day. Competed hard to the wing later in the game with a GWS player backing back, who ended up taking out Patfull which ended his day. And then he let loose. Most impressively his goal kicking was good again today. Has he turned a corner?

Jamie Elliott - What a gun. Seriously. This kid does not lose a contest and was playing on Shaw who is no mug. Has an innate ability to keep his feet which means you can't switch off on him. Had some great leads and marks. Had a brilliant crumb and dribble goal. Won some quality transition contests in the middle to set up goals. His forward 50 entries were clinical. He tackled. I just wish he could start averaging a few more possies a game.

Alan Toovey - He is our back line captain for mine. Didn't get beaten all day. Initiated some important run at times from defense. His field kicking was hit and miss. Good game overall and important to our defense. We are more settled with him out there.

Jesse White - I thought he was our best tall forward target early. Kicked two early goals. He will be disappointed that he missed that third when we really needed a leveler. How good was the snap and goal from the set shot on the boundary? Top 100th game big fella!

Jordan De Goey - Surprised he didn't get more disposals. I thought his commitment at the contest was a real highlight. Played forward a bit I think and helped us maintain that pressure in Blairs absence. Went off with a crook finger so hope he is alright there. Needs to start winning a bit more ball.

Jack Frost - Got well beaten by a very clever McCarthy. That kid is scary good. Gave up too much space I think.

Jarrod Witts - He had a really big game on Mumford. I have been critical of his ruck work in the past but beat Mumford in the hitouts and had some real important ones there. Good clean hitouts to advantage helped our midfield get on top and ultimately win the clearances against a quality clearance team. Needs to be cleaner over head and would expect him to win more possies for a guy that is as good as him on the deck. But he was real good despite a low possession count.

Ben Kennedy - Found it hard to get into the game as the sub. I think the club doesn't have faith in his ability to run out full games. Needs to work on his fitness to feature in the 21 because I think he can offer a lot.

Nice one Quicky.

Witts was huge. Not easy to go toe to toe with Mummy and he did. Got first hand to it a lot and match him physically. His agility is an issue though. Couple of times he was like the Titanic.

Adams - exceptional. We missed him vs Melbourne and was incredible around the stoppage. GWS are good in this area and we smacked them in the 'chops'. Greenwood back will make this the real strength of our side. Witts giving us first use and these two blokes going at it like 2 fat kids and a donut between them.

Crisp - got beaten badly early but worked way into game.

Brown & White- best games of the year.

Williams - running more aggresively week by week. He is becoming very dangerous through the middle.

Broomhead - thought he was terrific. Not sure a true mid yet as think gets knocked around a bit but he is very polished and will make it.

Agree on the Kennedy comment but suspect more to do with fact hasnt had a super preparation. His time will come. Did a couple of very good things in close.

 

[4#Didak#4]

Some great positives emerging from the game. But the highlight for me was Witts vs Mumford. Witts is a real competitor and it showed today, he went with the man mountain and held his own. He would do well to model his game on Mummy and I am really excited to see how he goes against Sandilands.

Marley Williams was the other stand out. He has shaken the shackles and started backing himself in. He is a little ball of destruction.

Sidebottom is starting to attract some heavy tags. I think sides have worked out that tagging Pendles is pointless and with no Beams, Sidebottom is our most damaging player. Scully is a good tagger (the most expensive tagger in history!) and limited his usual output. Will be a big test for him for the rest of the year to break these, because I can't see this strategy changing otherwise.

 

[Maggie5]

What a win! That was a 50/50 game against a fellow top 4 challenger and we buried them. It was a contrast of game styles. They spread and run at all costs. We pressure, tackle and throw everything at the contest. I was worried after that period in the second when GWS scored 3 on the trot, but they were inaccurate and we managed to settle. The difference was that we caused turnovers and really harried their F50 entries, so our game style and plan stood up. Many may say we were lucky with the injuries that they had, which we were, but we already had that game on our terms and their players were hurt because we hurt them. Our attack on the ball and man was second to none. Top effort.

Taylor Adams - Made a statement against his old club and showed how much we missed him against the Dees. Was relentless at the contest all day. Also thought he presented well to make an option around the ground. His ball use was pretty good too. 36 touches, 7 tackles says plenty.

Dane Swan - Contributed all game and I thought was important through the middle. You might question his disposal but he always gets the ball moving our way.

Scott Pendlebury - He gives us what he always gives, poise and class. Lovely goal from the boundary on the left late in the game was the highlight.

Jack Crisp - I thought he started a little slowly and was given a hard time by Shiel who was really good for the Giants. But he always worked hard, got into the game late and surprised to see ended up with 28 disposals. The two goals are the ones that have me excited. A big bodied, hard running, contested possession winning run with player that kicks goals regularly. He really has helped the balance of our midfield group. Beams who?

Marley Williams - I wasn't sure where Williams fit in the team 6 weeks ago. Since then he has been nothing short of astonishing. He was tough as nails today and is really good at the contest. One of our best contested players. He found plenty of the footy too and used his pace and evasiveness really well from half back (or our defensive wall which sets up a kick behind the play on any account). The big question mark on Marley was his footskills and on balance he has been clean and creative with the odd poor one from time to time. Real good.

Tim Broomhead - Stood up big time. For a player that is still developing his strength he does pretty well in the contest through his sheer wiliness. I thought he was important early with creative ball use and presented well up the wing as a target for our half backs. Needed a big game and delivered. I'm really excited about what Broomy can give us on the outside with development. I think we need to be patient.

Adam Oxley - Not as prominent today but still got plenty of the footy. I thought his kicking was off and delivered a few half volleys which he would be disappointed about. Took some good intercept marks. Not bad. Not great.

Travis Varcoe - In the absence of any real dominant outside players Trav has been great for us. He is a really street smart player, harangues, closes space quickly and I think is super important for our defensive game plan. Plus he adds some run and carry. It's a shame he doesn't get bigger possession numbers because then he would be real good, but what he offers us is really important.

Steele Sidebottom - He had a quiet-ish game by his standards but still had some clever moments with his ball use. Due for a big game and we will need it against Freo after the bye.

Tom Langdon - I thought he was good and far more committed to the contest than last week which was pleasing. I like his ball use off half back, it's typically assured and unflustered. And he is pretty consistent at cracking 20 possie games too.

Paul Seedsman - He is in poor form and I believe if we had better outside options would be having a spell in the 2's. That moment in the second half when he had an open forward and hit the pass straight to the GWS defender summarised his issues today. He had some great lead up work only to burn the final pass. He was played largely off half back today. I think I would like to see Scharenberg given a crack at the role given his solid form in the twos.

Nathan Brown - Back to his best. Gave up very little against Cameron. On the few occasions he looked like being beaten our defense was there to help out. Real pleasing from Brown after a poor few weeks.

Tyson Goldsack - I'm torn about Goldsack. I think he was horrible on Stewart early and gives up too much space to his forwards. Of late he is a liability one vs one. His kick ins are good and important but his field kicking is garbage. He will always tackle and chase and did that again today. If Reid is ready to go I would consider bringing him in at Goldsacks expense.

Alex Fasolo - I thought he was great again today. That strong lead and mark in the first half to beat three GWS defenders was quality and at a time the team needed someone to stand tall. Seemed to do his best when we were under the pump and the heat well and truly in the game. Most importantly he has given 3 solid weeks of committed defensive forward. The forward line looks far more dangerous with an in-form, hungry Fasolo.

Travis Cloke - I thought GWS were real good at limiting his space and triple teaming him early. I thought our forward 50 entries in the first all to Cloke were a bit dumb. He worked his way into the game later and kicked a couple of important goals. Laid a vicious tackle that ended Davis day. Competed hard to the wing later in the game with a GWS player backing back, who ended up taking out Patfull which ended his day. And then he let loose. Most impressively his goal kicking was good again today. Has he turned a corner?

Jamie Elliott - What a gun. Seriously. This kid does not lose a contest and was playing on Shaw who is no mug. Has an innate ability to keep his feet which means you can't switch off on him. Had some great leads and marks. Had a brilliant crumb and dribble goal. Won some quality transition contests in the middle to set up goals. His forward 50 entries were clinical. He tackled. I just wish he could start averaging a few more possies a game.

Alan Toovey - He is our back line captain for mine. Didn't get beaten all day. Initiated some important run at times from defense. His field kicking was hit and miss. Good game overall and important to our defense. We are more settled with him out there.

Jesse White - I thought he was our best tall forward target early. Kicked two early goals. He will be disappointed that he missed that third when we really needed a leveler. How good was the snap and goal from the set shot on the boundary? Top 100th game big fella!

Jordan De Goey - Surprised he didn't get more disposals. I thought his commitment at the contest was a real highlight. Played forward a bit I think and helped us maintain that pressure in Blairs absence. Went off with a crook finger so hope he is alright there. Needs to start winning a bit more ball.

Jack Frost - Got well beaten by a very clever McCarthy. That kid is scary good. Gave up too much space I think.

Jarrod Witts - He had a really big game on Mumford. I have been critical of his ruck work in the past but beat Mumford in the hitouts and had some real important ones there. Good clean hitouts to advantage helped our midfield get on top and ultimately win the clearances against a quality clearance team. Needs to be cleaner over head and would expect him to win more possies for a guy that is as good as him on the deck. But he was real good despite a low possession count.

Ben Kennedy - Found it hard to get into the game as the sub. I think the club doesn't have faith in his ability to run out full games. Needs to work on his fitness to feature in the 21 because I think he can offer a lot.

Good summary.
Re Goldsack, heard on the radio that he had scans on a sore knee/leg, didn't catch it all but thought it was worth mentioning.

 

[partypie]

Perhaps too pessimistic with losses to all of Freo, Hawks, Port, WCE and Syd. Hawks v tough and Freo tougher. The others are hard but we should be favs against WCE in Melb, have a great record against Sydney and Port dont appear to be the team they were threatening to be and are no finals certainty. 1-2 wins in that group is likely.

I think you took that the wrong way there - I was putting forward a "worst case" scenario where we don't manage to beat the teams entrenched at the top end of the eight (and I'm not writing off Port yet especially at AO).

Even if that worst case scenario does come to pass and it's probably more realistic than a prediction of us winning 1-2 out of those 5 harder games imo (being optimistic is fine but the reality is that none of our wins to this point really stack up as indicators of whether we will be competitive with the teams at the pointy end, never mind pencilling in a win against any of them), there is still a realistic chance for us to play finals - if we can win the games we probably should and beat a couple of the other middle-of-the-road teams that would be vying to sneak into the bottom end of the top 8 as well.

 

[Collingwoodity]

Seedsman is not a full-time back flanker and he should be played on the wing.

For an outside wingman he is actually not soft so that is not an issue. Our side has its limitation penetration and speed on the outside. Seedsman has that and I would like it if he was played on the wing.

 

[Gone Critical]

I think you took that the wrong way there - I was putting forward a "worst case" scenario where we don't manage to beat the teams entrenched at the top end of the eight (and I'm not writing off Port yet especially at AO).

Even if that worst case scenario does come to pass and it's probably more realistic than a prediction of us winning 1-2 out of those 5 harder games imo (being optimistic is fine but the reality is that none of our wins to this point really stack up as indicators of whether we will be competitive with the teams at the pointy end, never mind pencilling in a win against any of them), there is still a realistic chance for us to play finals - if we can win the games we probably should and beat a couple of the other middle-of-the-road teams that would be vying to sneak into the bottom end of the top 8 as well.

No worries, fair call

 

[Pedro]

I would have said the same. But...watch a replay and you will notice who is doing all the kicks to Cloke in the last half. He more than redeemed himself.

Agreed, and thats exactly thats what I was alluding to?? Very quiet 1st half, very good second half. Wish he would play 4 quarters

 

[TradeDraft]

Nice one Quicky.Witts was huge. Not easy to go toe to toe with Mummy and he did. Got first hand to it a lot and match him physically. His agility is an issue though. Couple of times he was like the Titanic.

Agree with that. Great in the Ruck but moves like the Titanic around the Ground

Adams - exceptional. We missed him vs Melbourne and was incredible around the stoppage. GWS are good in this area and we smacked them in the 'chops'. Greenwood back will make this the real strength of our side. Witts giving us first use and these two blokes going at it like 2 fat kids and a donut between them.

Yesterday did show how Important Adams is too the Team

 

[Vankri]

This shaped to be a game between truly contrasting playing styles, with us being statistically the top contested possession team in the league and them one of the best uncontested. And this is how the game went down with us trying to bring the pressure on them particularly in our forward line (15 tackles inside 50 vs 6) whereas they tried to play on, take bounces, and use their run and carry to get to our defence as quickly as possible. We worked as a well structured unit overall and didn't rely on our top few players only to get the win. Think our spread of 11 goal kickers says it all.

But the surprise for mine was our midfield dominance. Honestly think Pendles was a massive reason we didn't get smashed by their mids (superior in skills and pace) and his hand in the win is being severely understated in the post game discussions. Him doing so much work on the inside interestingly allowed Adams to produce more than usual on the outside to end up with career high numbers. Also Witts was another huge reason for our midfield dominance with his ruck work making us much better than usual at stoppages.

The infamous run of goals against us sort of happened at the start of the 2nd quarter (3 goals and 2 behinds to them in 5min), but the great thing is that we saw us starting to understand how to counter this by better controlling the rhythm of the game, slowing the play, being smarter with the ball evidently in that passage of play where Goldsack went to Langdon to Pendles to Crisp to Adams all percentage kicks on the boundary line. Good to see we're doing something about this issue.

--- The match winners:

Pendlebury - As I stated above, not enough made of his game as he was a massive reason we didn't get beaten by the super powerful GWS mids. Huge work on the inside and threw his body in there with a game high 17 CPs, a team high 10 clearances which is twice as many as our second best in Swan, and a team high 7 I50s and all of this while going at 82% DE (these things don't usually go together). Beyond his numbers, his skills and smarts set up our best plays and were a big reason we steadied the ship after the GWS comeback and he scored the goal that killed the game.

Adams - Ended up with career high numbers which shows he's got that extra gear in him. His ferocious tackles just crunched his old teammates and saved us a few times. He is still untidy with his disposal and prone to the costly mistake unfortunately (went at 50% DE), but then again if we had a 36d, 8 marks, 7 tackles, 7 I50s player that was also very clean with his disposal we would have the next superstar of the comp in our hands... Which we don't, but what we have is a really important and really good player in the Luke Ball mould that should play 200 games for us.

--- The great contributors:

Cloke - Topping the contested mark ranking in the comp now, and while he of course benefitted from the GWS injuries, he is also the one that 'caused' them by being so strong (in his tackle, and in a marking contest where he was double teamed). Very interesting to see him kick 10.2 in the past couple of weeks, you never know with his mental issues but if he maintains his confidence throughout the year he could actually go back to being one of the best forwards in the comp.

Elliott - There's a trend with him of having little impact in the first half and dominating the second. While he didn't kick multiple goals in the second himself as per the past weeks (5 and 3 in his last two games), he delivered 3 perfect assists to Cloke and ended up with 4 score involvements all in the second half. His goal showed unbelievable skills and timing and a crumbing ability we haven't had on the park since Krakouer. Also very strong and hard at it.

Williams - So fast, so tough. But also so smart. I just can't believe how much his decision making has improved, it must be a psychological thing because he also doesn't look like he's into fights/arguments on the field anymore. His smart short kick to set up Cloke's first goal summarised this new found ability with a real smart play to set up a goal. Also a real leader in the way he chases and does the grunt work for the team.

Brown - Good to see him win his battle comprehensively. He never let Cameron off the hook and that's a real win because Cameron is so mobile and agile. And he did well to keep our defence together, taking 7 marks and hitting all his targets.

Broomhead - Very happy to see him bounce back so well. Last week he tried hard but got crunched in the forward line and never got a proper go at it. This week he got much more involved in the middle against a team that likes it uncontested and that benefitted his game greatly. Loved his quick hands and his goal from a tight angle. Not a perfect game however by any means as he had a couple of uncharacteristic mistakes by foot but at least shows he can play his top game at AFL level.

Varcoe - I would love to get his GPS data for the year compared to others because he just runs and runs and gets involved in the back and forward without a break. I think he's playing a very important role for us, because his combination of quick decision making, clean kicking and pace regularly gets us out of trouble and sets our counter attacks. He did lay a poor attempt at a tackle just before McCarthy's third goal, similar to last week so that's one area that needs improvement.

White - Good return for his 100th game, 3 goals, 1 assist, 3 I50s. Best play for him was his snap on the run because it showed him finally using his pace to his advantage.

--- The solid performers:

Oxley - This year he's either been very good or very bad. This was his first middle of the ground performance. Few missed kicks but a few important kicks as well. His intercept mark/read of the ball is top class, I think he can add another dimension to his game if he utilises that offensively and not just defensively.

Swan - Good numbers and a solid game again, some smart plays and was tidier than last week.

Crisp - Got a few down periods in the fist half, allowing Shiel to hurt us without hurting GWS himself in return. But in the end he slowly took over and was really involved and lifted in the last with again his goal kicking a feature, which is amazing for a player who gets given run with roles a the start of games.

De Goey - Spent more time in the forward line than previous weeks and did OK. Watching the game at the ground it was obvious he was leading in the wrong places at times. He did create his own opportunity though with that tackle on Ward and kicked beautifully after. I actually think people will be surprised by his skills once he gets used to the pace of the AFL. He actually started as an outside mid as a junior and his kicking technique is really sound so once he uses that as a weapon at AFL level, he'll star.

Witts - His ruck work was very important for us yesterday and a big reason we didn't get smashed in the middle. Just beat Mumford in the hit outs which is no easy task. He was poor around the ground, not marking, not being involved enough (funny how he's the exact opposite of Grundy, combine these two players in one and we'd have the best ruck in the league). However it has to be noted that Mumford did not dominate around the ground either, only took 2 marks himself and has 1 kick 11 handballs which is not great. Hard to tell if this is due to Witts holding him well or Mumford underperforming/being injured, but can't argue with the results.

Fasolo - Quiet game for him with a few mistakes. He did kick a good goal and had one assist so in the end fulfilled his role, hope he gets back to his previous form and intensity after the bye.

Langdon - He looked a little fresher and was nowhere near as slow as last week as a result. Solid game but not our most prominent in the back in defence or on the rebound. I would expect him to feel even better after the bye and start dominating in the back again.

Toovey - Good game overall, good defensively as usual and started some good transition plays. Didn't like the incident in the third where he played on with 2min left on the clock and the boundary line saved him from being caught HTB. An experienced player like him should know better.

-- The disappointments:

Sidebottom - I've got to put him down to this section for the second week in a row. I just think he had way too little impact and even costly at times, when he is meant to step up and be our second best mid and replace Beams. He also gave GWS an easy entry to our defensive 50 which ended up with a goal by kicking the ball towards defence. After two down weeks, you'd think he's due to repeat one of the top class performances he had vs the QLD clubs. I don't know if Freo's game style will allow him enough space as he's still more comfortable on the outside, but watch out for him against the Hawks.

Frost - Beaten all day unfortunately. Didn't protect the goals enough against McCarthy and has too many tackles that didn't stick.

Goldsack - He kicked better than last week which is a good sign but his defensive work was lacking. Better second half than first though. wHe takes the vast majority of kick ins for us and is both experienced and has leadership qualities so it's hard to see him dropped.

Seedsman - Should it come as a surprise that the player who had poor games four weeks in a row had another poor one here? He did actually get dropped from the team but Grundy's injury got him back in. And I do understand the decision to get him in the starting 21 because he has pace and we don't have a replacement for him yet (Freeman should have been the guy if injuries hadn't stalled his development). He can play a role, but he's pretty one dimensional and I think the people waiting for him to consistently put in performances like his Anzac Day game will be left waiting for a while.

-- The Sub

Kennedy - Didn't do much but only had 15min of play when the game was done and we dropped our intensity. I would still like him to get a full game but not sure Freo at home with their intense game style and big bodied midfield is the best place to do so. Perhaps he stays as a sub if De Goey has to go out because of his hand injury, but being the sub 3 weeks in a row is not good for development.

 

[Quicky]

Really good write up Vankri. It's a great point you make about Pendles and Adams. I was surprised to see how much outside ball Adams got. Something like 24 out of his 36 possessions were uncontested. Pendles was simply fantastic you are right.

Not sure I agree on your thoughts on Fasolo. It was not his best and certainly had low numbers, but I thought his effort was there all game and still helped put score board pressure on.

Where do we go with Seedsman? We need more from him but have no great alternatives. It's been mentioned but I think if we play him he needs to be on the wing not half back.

 

[Vankri]

Really good write up Vankri. It's a great point you make about Pendles and Adams. I was surprised to see how much outside ball Adams got. Something like 24 out of his 36 possessions were uncontested. Pendles was simply fantastic you are right.

Not sure I agree on your thoughts on Fasolo. It was not his best and certainly had low numbers, but I thought his effort was there all game and still helped put score board pressure on.

Where do we go with Seedsman? We need more from him but have no great alternatives. It's been mentioned but I think if we play him he needs to be on the wing not half back.

Yeah, didn't realise I sounded so harsh when typing my review on Fas. His efforts were definitely there, he came really close to getting a couple of pack marks which would have made his game more damaging, think he had a solid game but not a great one and not as great as his past two weeks.

I've always had my doubts on Seedsman. He's a one dimensional player at this stage that really only plays well on a wing and against teams that mostly play an uncontested game, but he doesn't have the football smarts of great pacey wingmen such as the Hawks' have and rarely switches the play. If Freeman wasn't injured he would have probably taken his spot. With the return of Greenwood and Blair we'll have to add a midfielder and a forward/mid to our mix and I think to keep Broomhead we'll need him to take Seedsman's spot. Whether that exposes us against the fastest teams I don't know but even then Seedsman rarely chases down the opposition anyway and outside of the Anzac Day game I've seen more damaging running this year from Varcoe, Elliott and Williams than Seedsman.

 

[ClaytonM]

I worry about our run if you drop Seedsman and replace him with someone like Greenwood for example. We seem to have a wealth of hard working, inside contested midfielders, but less so on the outside. Of those outside the 22 the only outside guy with any form is Scharenberg, although I don't have the benefit like you of watching the games live. Young is the other player (who's form is horrible in the VFL from reports) but honestly I would prefer persisting with Seedsman if that were the selection decision.

I would think Broomy could take a more outside role and potentially do it better. Is quick and uses the ball really well. Seedsman's is in poor form and think he needs to go back to the 2s for a spell.

 

[Alexander323bc]

Thought everyone was really good.

Surprise packets was the standout performance by Adams. Shows how important he is to our side, and his kicking has really turned a corner.

Clokey's kicking is actually good. Wow.

White will have good and bad games, but at least there are good games. I honestly think he's the best key forward to partner Cloke since 2010.

The negatives were Goldsack, Seedsman and Witts for me.

Goldsack... he's just a defensive liability. Gives off way too much space, and it's not like we actually see him intercept marking a lot of the time, so what the **** is he doing? That's the main thing. Also, there was a goal that led to his inability to get up fast enough to take on the GWS player that played on. FFS Goldy. He's had a shocker month, only problem is, who do we bring in? Can Marsh cut it in a defensive line that has been very patchy this whole season?

Seedsman has had a horrid last few weeks. Not sure what the problem is for me, but he really needs a spell. Can't see him changing the minds of the selection committee who omitted him on Friday with that game.

And Witts. He is clearly behind Grundy it's not even funny. Mumford is a great ruck, one of the best in the comp, and Witts did well to compete against him in the hitouts BUT thats what we should already expect. It's his efforts around the ground that hurt, particularly his marking. He's the tallest player in the competition, yet can barely influence any ******* marking contest. It's SO infuriating. I think he's just weak, or lacks confidence, or the aggressiveness to assert himself, because in packs, he just gets pushed towards the back.

Even marking contests against smaller players, like Heath Shaw in the 4th, you still didn't see him clunking marks confidently.

It's a massive worry.

Really? you think that a 22yo should keep running for four quarters as a mid and still beat a 30yo in the ruck after 120 min? R u kidding me! Need to get out of your mums basement son and experience the real world where super human effort is reserved for the few not for the many! It shits me to no end when players get measured against this imaginary scale where a bloke 210cm should have the same endurance as a Kenyan marathon runner kick like pendles and mark like Lockett! FMD!

 

[sr36]

Agreed, and thats exactly thats what I was alluding to?? Very quiet 1st half, very good second half. Wish he would play 4 quarters

He's playing up forward. Noone plays '4 quarters' up forward. Not even Plugger or Gary Ablett senior did this. good forwards take theri opportunities when they came - sometimes they come 2 quarters apart.

 

[sr36]

I've always had my doubts on Seedsman. He's a one dimensional player at this stage that really only plays well on a wing and against teams that mostly play an uncontested game, but he doesn't have the football smarts of great pacey wingmen such as the Hawks' have and rarely switches the play. If Freeman wasn't injured he would have probably taken his spot. With the return of Greenwood and Blair we'll have to add a midfielder and a forward/mid to our mix and I think to keep Broomhead we'll need him to take Seedsman's spot. Whether that exposes us against the fastest teams I don't know but even then Seedsman rarely chases down the opposition anyway and outside of the Anzac Day game I've seen more damaging running this year from Varcoe, Elliott and Williams than Seedsman.

The thing with Seedsman is that if you are going to play as purely outside as he plays you've got to have some serious endurance to get the footy consistently enough. He doesn't have that endurance. So what you've got is a guy with some seriously elite attributes who goes missing most of the time. I see him at the crossroads. He needs to make some serious changes in order to survive and prosper. He needs to become a gut running beast, or alternatively, he needs to learn to win contests.

 

[4tone]

A quick bit of "crystal ball" work with the ladder predictor (pessimistically assuming we come up short in our next 4 games against FRE, HAW, PORT and WCE, as well as in our annual date with the SYD up there) potentially sees us needing to get W's in two out of the WB, RICH and GEEL games, while also banking wins against CARL, MELB and ESS to pretty much guarantee us managing to sneak into the top 8.

If we only beat one out of those three teams (WB, RICH, GEEL) *or* drop one to CARL / MELB / ESS (although we've been a bit better when it comes to beating teams below us on the ladder this year) then it's pretty much out of our hands and we need other teams to do us a favour at various points, although restricting the damage to our percentage against the five teams I'm pegging us in for an 'L' against will help in that respect. If we can't beat any of those three teams (WB, RICH, GEEL) then we'll more than likely fall short by a game because it will be a minimum of 12 wins and decent percentage to make it into 8th spot this year the way things are shaping up (looks like there might be 4-5 teams minimum around that 12-13 win mark this year, maybe as many as 6 or perhaps even 7).

Having said all of that we are in a surprisingly good position given that our destiny is in our own hands at least, wrt just needing to beat other likely mid-table teams that are also fighting for spots towards the bottom end of the top 8 and banking W's against teams further down the ladder. If we can get the job done against a couple of those other mid-table contenders and beat the teams a bit further down then we deserve to be there, if not then we at least know where we are at as also-rans and the level we need to aim for.

It will be more like the first half of the year, 8/3 to finish 16/6 winning against weak teams will translate into beating good teams.

Not sure if its keeping it under the radar or a genuine non belief, but its getting a bit tired, that people cant see where this year is headed. Anyway their will be plenty of room on the bandwagon when the pies slay one or both of the dockers or the hawks.

 

[partypie]

It will be more like the first half of the year, 8/3 to finish 16/6 winning against weak teams will translate into beating good teams.

Not sure if its keeping it under the radar or a genuine non belief, but its getting a bit tired, that people cant see where this year is headed. Anyway their will be plenty of room on the bandwagon when the pies slay one or both of the dockers or the hawks.

How is it getting a bit tired? Who exactly have we beaten of note? Our two best wins have been against a wildly inconsistent North Melbourne and a GWS team that doesn't travel well at the moment and ended up folding after being beset by multiple injuries (there is still some merit in those wins though). The fact of the matter is that against three middle-of-the-road sides we've come up against so far (Crows, Cats, Tigers) we've come up noticeably short, so our season thus far has us firmly pegged as being what I guess you could call "flat track bullies".

Having a bit firmer a grasp on the reality of the situation and exercising a rather more cautious level of optimism does not in any way equate to a lack of belief - being a bit more optimistic is fine, but saying that beating weak teams (at times with somewhat of a struggle) somehow equates to beating good teams (or that we'll beat one or both of Freo and Hawthorn based on exposed form) is questionable at best.

The acid tests are coming though and if we put up respectable efforts in the next couple of games then I'll reassess the situation - we don't necessarily have to win them, but we'd have to push them to the end for me personally to reconsider our current position.

 

[Quicky]

The thing with Seedsman is that if you are going to play as purely outside as he plays you've got to have some serious endurance to get the footy consistently enough. He doesn't have that endurance. So what you've got is a guy with some seriously elite attributes who goes missing most of the time. I see him at the crossroads. He needs to make some serious changes in order to survive and prosper. He needs to become a gut running beast, or alternatively, he needs to learn to win contests.

That's a good observation. I think he needs to add gut running to his game. A bit like Stanton. I wonder how much the interrupted preseasons are impacting this? I also agree with Vankri that he needs to look for lateral options instead of only down the ground.

 

[Gone Critical]

That's a good observation. I think he needs to add gut running to his game. A bit like Stanton. I wonder how much the interrupted preseasons are impacting this? I also agree with Vankri that he needs to look for lateral options instead of only down the ground.

I was thinking the same in that his development has been stunted by the last 2 missed preseasons. He doesn't have a good base to build on. I agree he needs one of the 2 options described and think becoming a better gut runner would be the most easily achieved if he does get a good run over the next season or two. However he doesn't have a huge amount of time to make those changes

 

[manicmagpie]

The AFLCA votes are very interesting this week:

8: Williams
7: Adams
6: Brown
5: Pendles
2: Shaw
1: Shiel
1: Cloke

Normally it's easy to work out the breakdown of votes but this time it is impossible to tell. It either goes:

5: Pendles & Williams
4: Adams & Brown
3: Williams & Adams
2: Brown & Shaw
1: Cloke & Shiel

or

5: Pendles & Adams
4: Williams & Williams
3: Brown & Brown
2: Adams & Shaw
1: Cloke & Shiel

So either way the only possible combination of votes that fits in sees Pendles getting 5 votes from one coach and 0 from the other. I wonder which way round it was?

 

[TradeDraft]

Great Write Up Vankri