The Law Police

[WA ROO]

And how often is it on our streets?

https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/wa-p...ponse-to-active-shooter-attacks-ng-b88665653z

In the article

WA Police will arm 100 more Perth officers with semiautomatic assault rifles to boost the frontline response to so-called “active shooter” attacks.

Mr Dawson said the officers would patrol with the weapons in their vehicles but there were no plans to have them on “foot patrol” or “static guard” with the rifles.

Not for walking beat cops,but in patrol cars
Remember these are not the highly trained TRG police but patrol officers

 

[Procrastinator35]

And how often is it on our streets?

Don't know ShanDog.

It was only implemented as a policy just prior to the Christmas holiday period. No numbers were mentioned, or total of patrol hours.....Just the fact that an 'increased security measure' in the form of police cruising the streets in this get-up.....The bulletin & the sight of the para-military gear completely shocked me & took me by surprise....No coincidence that it was a mere 2 weeks post the Bibi/Turdbull meeting either I'd venture.

From memory, the new-bulletin on the ABC cited a trial-run over the summer period in the Melbourne & Sydney C.B.D's.....No mention of other states, so the news from the lads over in W.A is quite surprising.

 

[Power Raid]

https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/wa-p...ponse-to-active-shooter-attacks-ng-b88665653z

In the article

WA Police will arm 100 more Perth officers with semiautomatic assault rifles to boost the frontline response to so-called “active shooter” attacks.

Mr Dawson said the officers would patrol with the weapons in their vehicles but there were no plans to have them on “foot patrol” or “static guard” with the rifles.

Not for walking beat cops,but in patrol cars
Remember these are not the highly trained TRG police but patrol officers

~120 guys on HMAS Moresby were given a automatic weapon with 20 rounds. From a distance of 50m, on full auto, not one bullet out of 2,400 bullets hit the target.

hmmmm

 

[ShanDog]

~120 guys on HMAS Moresby were given a automatic weapon with 20 rounds. From a distance of 50m, on full auto, not one bullet out of 2,400 bullets hit the target.

hmmmm

Who did what now?

 

[Power Raid]

Who did what now?

it just demonstrates how inappropriate it is to give semi-trained professionals such high powered weaponry

 

[ShanDog]

it just demonstrates how inappropriate it is to give semi-trained professionals such high powered weaponry

I'm wondering what you are referring to though. Strange sounding LF EX. Also worth noting the article states they are receiving semi-auto rifles. A child could hit a target at 50m with a semi auto.

 

[Procrastinator35]

I'm wondering what you are referring to though. Strange sounding LF EX. Also worth noting the article states they are receiving semi-auto rifles. A child could hit a target at 50m with a semi auto.

Here you go ShanDog....Finally found it....Damn paywalls.

Melbourne Critical Incident Response Team: Elite Victoria Police unit ...
www.heraldsun.com.au/news/...police...melbourne-cbd.../news.../c874c482f39be26f385...
Dec 16, 2017 - AN elite Victoria Police strike squad armed with sub-machine guns will roam Melbournes CBD to instantly respond to any terror attacks. ... The rapid response officers will begin official duties on Monday and operate daily, cruising the city center and inner suburbs in marked and unmarked four-wheel-drives.

 

[Power Raid]

I'm wondering what you are referring to though. Strange sounding LF EX. Also worth noting the article states they are receiving semi-auto rifles. A child could hit a target at 50m with a semi auto.

And what happens to the bullet once it leaves the body?

 

[ShanDog]

And what happens to the bullet once it leaves the body?

A standard 5.56? Normally leaves the body via the medical examiner during the autopsy.

 

[ShanDog]

Here you go ShanDog....Finally found it....Damn paywalls.

Melbourne Critical Incident Response Team: Elite Victoria Police unit ...
www.heraldsun.com.au/news/...police...melbourne-cbd.../news.../c874c482f39be26f385...
Dec 16, 2017 - AN elite Victoria Police strike squad armed with sub-machine guns will roam Melbournes CBD to instantly respond to any terror attacks. ... The rapid response officers will begin official duties on Monday and operate daily, cruising the city center and inner suburbs in marked and unmarked four-wheel-drives.

I like it.

 

[Power Raid]

A standard 5.56? Normally leaves the body via the medical examiner during the autopsy.

Perhaps at 200m or more on a short barrel weapon.

However, even a lighter bullet within the 5.56mm series would pass through most people at 50-100m.

30cm to 60cm of penetration would see exit wounds on most.

 

[Power Raid]

Oh and FTR I believe we need well trained response groups who can handle assault rifles and even 50 cal.

But these should be response teams and not on the beat.

 

[ShanDog]

Perhaps at 200m or more on a short barrel weapon.

However, even a lighter bullet within the 5.56mm series would pass through most people at 50-100m.

30cm to 60cm of penetration would see exit wounds on most.

I'll double check that with some papers tonight, but that wasn't the impression I was under.

 

[ShanDog]

Oh and FTR I believe we need well trained response groups who can handle assault rifles and even 50 cal.

But these should be response teams and not on the beat.

Article talked about these personnel being selected, trained, and also recieving professional development training every six weeks. Sounds like a good system to me.

 

[Taylor]

The police have to look like they have been beefed up so the massive cross section of older racist people can feel safe when they go down to their local IGA. The pistols are familiar, capable and adequate but the scared group who write letters and vote hard are expecting to see more, so the police carry something bigger that they will also probably never use.

I remember being in New York when there was a mass shooting, a gunman had drawn their weapon on a known target to them and a police officer had seen it. The gunman fired on the target, the policeman fired. Six people were shot... all by the policeman. Nobody was killed thankfully.

 

[Snake_Baker]

The overt militarisation of the state is not there for outsiders, it's there for us. It's existence is primarily psychological.

 

[Power Raid]

I'll double check that with some papers tonight, but that wasn't the impression I was under.

I've had limited experience with weapons training in the military generally utilises longer barrels and heavier bullets. My numbers are from recalling the lightest bullets and the shortest barrels used 20 years ago.

oh and training every 6 weeks is appropriate to retain familiarisation.


I will add though that the navy had a massive issue with unauthorised discharges during pirate watch, including one where a bosun "accidentally" opening fire at a P&O cruiser. The decision to reduce this risk was to only arm those who were not gunnery rates. Essentially it was deemed safer to give weapons to semi-experienced guys vs gun ho guys who couldn't wait to shoot s**t.

The gunnery rates and the SAS would form a second and third response where blowing s**t up and shooting s**t was the objective and their enthusiasm appreciated. That's why I suggest police should have similar controls and only have these weapons issued to response teams rather than those on the "ordinary" front line.

 

[Power Raid]

oh and here's the weaponry issued in the Philippines to protect oneself from kidnap



RPGs are standard and simply provided to civilians for use

 

[Snake_Baker]

No doubt a hangover from U.S. naval occupation

 

[ShanDog]

oh and here's the weaponry issued in the Philippines to protect oneself from kidnap

View attachment 450497

RPGs are standard and simply provided to civilians for use

Is not RPG but that's some pretty serious hardware for someone to just get a hold of.

 

[ShanDog]

I've had limited experience with weapons training in the military generally utilises longer barrels and heavier bullets. My numbers are from recalling the lightest bullets and the shortest barrels used 20 years ago.

oh and training every 6 weeks is appropriate to retain familiarisation.


I will add though that the navy had a massive issue with unauthorised discharges during pirate watch, including one where a bosun "accidentally" opening fire at a P&O cruiser. The decision to reduce this risk was to only arm those who were not gunnery rates. Essentially it was deemed safer to give weapons to semi-experienced guys vs gun ho guys who couldn't wait to shoot s**t.

The gunnery rates and the SAS would form a second and third response where blowing s**t up and shooting s**t was the objective and their enthusiasm appreciated. That's why I suggest police should have similar controls and only have these weapons issued to response teams rather than those on the "ordinary" front line.

I haven't managed to find time to look for some of the studies and articles I've read before, but from memory, lower round velocities actually increase the chance of the round passing through flesh and exiting the body. The reason is the higher speeds make the round oscillate and then break up in the body for max damage. Not fast enough = no oscillation. There's also different issues with different round types. There's a lot to it.

 

[Procrastinator35]

The overt militarisation of the state is not there for outsiders, it's there for us. It's existence is primarily psychological.

It's a perfect encapsulation of a fascist police state; Is what it is.....And a boon to arms manufacturers....It's also an assault upon our civil freedoms & liberties.

Cops cruising our Melbourne CBD with Sub-machine guns, is my definition of insanity run amok.

 

[Snake_Baker]

"This and no other is the root from which a tyrant springs; when he first appears he is a protector." - Plato

 

[Procrastinator35]

"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent."
—Thomas Jefferson

 

[ShanDog]

"A few cops with scary looking guns in the boot of their car isn't tyranny."
--ShanDog