Opinion Politics (warning, may contain political views you disagree with)

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poshman

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The question is impossible to answer because there are any number of different lenses to read the article through. Informing the Australian public, and the world, that the US takes allies committing war crimes seriously might improve our relationship as it shows we're not, as a nation, burying that embarrassing interaction. Equally, that communication might have been intended for ADF ears only, in which case it might strain our political relationship with the US.

Either way, this article can't be held responsible for moving the dial because it is essentially Hansard with push notifications. It simply recounts what was said in the Senate Estimates hearing. I don't think that Hansard as a function can be found responsible for impacting political relationships.

What was said in the hearing certainly can, but that is the responsibility of the people asking the questions and those answering them.

Your question also has nothing to do with bias, which you brought up in the first place. Bias means there is some sort of agenda being pushed. I don't think the article is pushing an agenda.

Great so we agree that all articles have bias.

The question is simple to answer - I am only asking for your opinion.
 

poshman

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Can you provide the quotes where you show how this article is biased? You've said multiple times that writing can be biased, which no one is contending. That's not the same as pointing to the ways that this article in particular, in your view, is biased.

Actually I was told numerous time in this thread that the article wasn't biased, do I need to go and get the quotes?

I already pointed to them.

The article is discussing issue or statement A. Then what might happen due to statement A. Do they also say that it is most likely that nothing will happen and that with recent agreements further strengthening our relationship with the US etc etc.

I didn't think it was a terrible article. I do think that the ABC in general has become shockingly biased. Does that mean I have a bias when I look at ABC stuff? Yes it does.
 

poshman

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Yep, articles can contain bias. This article doesn't.

Quoting for posterity. The games being played and I get accused of not arguing in good faith...

I will leave this discussion here as if someone says X isn't biased. Then when shown every article has bias, says it being biased wasn't the argument...

You seem very defensive of the ABC. Which is so very far left these days it is depressing. They are right there with Bernie the ABC. In fact they probably make his socialist self look centre left.
 

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wahooo

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Quoting for posterity. The games being played and I get accused of not arguing in good faith...

I will leave this discussion here as if someone says X isn't biased. Then when shown every article has bias, says it being biased wasn't the argument...

You seem very defensive of the ABC. Which is so very far left these days it is depressing. They are right there with Bernie the ABC. In fact they probably make his socialist self look centre left.
To be clear, I think you've only provided your opinion that the article is biased. You have not proved it. We've been asking you to go beyond stating an opinion and provide some evidence of the bias in this article, which you have not done.

As I said before every paragraph either directly quotes, paraphrases or summarises statements from politicians, reports and correspondence.

You have not shown that the article misrepresented a source in a biased way.

Actually I was told numerous time in this thread that the article wasn't biased, do I need to go and get the quotes?

I already pointed to them.

The article is discussing issue or statement A. Then what might happen due to statement A. Do they also say that it is most likely that nothing will happen and that with recent agreements further strengthening our relationship with the US etc etc.
The article's scope and purpose is clearly confined to the line of questioning put to Angus Campbell at Senate estimates.

An op-ed might explore the relationship in a wider context but this is not an op-ed.

The absence of some opinion (that conforms to your views) about the current state of the Australia/US relationship does not make the article biased.

It's an accurate recount of what happened in Senate estimates.

Quoting for posterity. The games being played and I get accused of not arguing in good faith...
No games are being played. Your views are being challenged, that is all.

No obligation to respond, I respect that you've said you want to leave it.
 
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wahooo

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I will leave this discussion here as if someone says X isn't biased. Then when shown every article has bias, says it being biased wasn't the argument...
Actually, I might clarify because you appear to have misread Superman's comment.

What they were saying is that your question of whether the article is 'positive or negative or neutral toward the US relationship' has nothing to do with bias.

An article that is positive about the Aus/US relationship can be unbiased. In the exact same way that an article that is negative about the relationship can be unbiased.
 

SupermanCapes

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Actually, I might clarify because you appear to have misread Superman's comment.

What they were saying is that your question of whether the article is 'positive or negative or neutral toward the US relationship' has nothing to do with bias.

An article that is positive about the Aus/US relationship can be unbiased. In the exact same way that an article that is negative about the relationship can be unbiased.
Yeh this is what I said, except that I don't think the article is positive or negative about the relationship. Instead, the article can have a positive of negative impact on the relationship.

The article itself does not form a view, or push a view, about the comments. It simply states that the comments were made, when they were made and by whom. Factual reporting can have an impact on the real world, but that is not evidence of bias. The impact is caused by the comments that were made, when they were made and by whom.

Great so we agree that all articles have bias.

The question is simple to answer - I am only asking for your opinion.
No, I don't agree that all articles have bias. You said that words can be used to create bias, which is true. As I've consistently said, this article does not do that.

Actually I was told numerous time in this thread that the article wasn't biased, do I need to go and get the quotes?

I already pointed to them.

The article is discussing issue or statement A. Then what might happen due to statement A. Do they also say that it is most likely that nothing will happen and that with recent agreements further strengthening our relationship with the US etc etc.

Where does it do that? It is the simplest of requests, point me to the part of the article where it talks about what might happen.
 

poshman

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.25% increase today.

Payments way up and borrowing power >half what is was.

I hope people were refinancing 8 months ago and now are on a strong budget with space to cover what I think will be future increases.
 

wahooo

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The group of them come across as very superior feeling scumbags. Not to mention racist.
The comments are disgusting and I agree, racist. I may not agree with many of Price's views but it's incredibly harmful to diminish her achievments.

I find it interesting, that only a few pages ago on this thread, Taylor and Dogs R Us were making similar remarks about Thorpe and Kamala Harris. Admittedly, Taylor was critiquing such bebaviour but the very suggestion of the occurrence of such bias in pre-selection shows an assumption has been made that Thorpe/Harris did not get there on merit (which I would dispute).

The comments didn't sit well with me at the time but I didn't see a need to raise them.

Thoughts?
 

wahooo

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I think it shows even the people who cheer the idea of hiring people on race or gender merits don't actually believe that stuff and ultimately it's just another means by which a political group is seeking to cause division and disrupt existing structures.
You were advancing the idea that Thorpe/Harris were not chosen on merit. Do you genuinely believe that?
 
You were advancing the idea that Thorpe/Harris were not chosen on merit. Do you genuinely believe that?

If we look at just Harris, Biden made the words with his mouth that he would be choosing from a pool of women of colour for his running mate.

To deny that she was picked because she ticked two boxes entirely outside her control for the purposes of appealing to two groups is being naive at best.

So yes, I am suggesting that the political machine assigned value to both those women on the basis of their gender and race and that it is both racist and sexist to have done so.

But like I said above, I think the people pushing things like that don't believe in it, they just know there are enough disengaged people who cheer it on without a second thought.
 

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poshman

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The comments are disgusting and I agree, racist. I may not agree with many of Price's views but it's incredibly harmful to diminish her achievments.

I find it interesting, that only a few pages ago on this thread, Taylor and Dogs R Us were making similar remarks about Thorpe and Kamala Harris. Admittedly, Taylor was critiquing such bebaviour but the very suggestion of the occurrence of such bias in pre-selection shows an assumption has been made that Thorpe/Harris did not get there on merit (which I would dispute).

The comments didn't sit well with me at the time but I didn't see a need to raise them.

Thoughts?

I am glad we agree on Price.

I didn't see anything said about Thorpe, so cannot comment.

Harris was most definitely hired because she was a black woman. We know this because Joe Biden said that was what he wanted. He made a promise to the effect:

"I am not committed to naming any but the people I've named, and among them are four Black women," Biden said.

"Black women have supported me my whole career," Biden said. "I have been loyal, and they have been loyal to me — and so it's important that my administration, I promise you, will look like America."

He added, "Both from vice president to Supreme Court to Cabinet positions to every major position in the White House. It's critically important that be the case."


Is she or was she qualified? She was one of the worst candidates he had to choose from and has proven that with her performance. She is Californian and could barely muster any type of support in California. She is poorly prepared and a 1/10 when it comes to communication. I think I am being generous there.

This is why some of the intersectional virtue signalling is more harmful than good. We know the criteria was a black woman. We also know that they didn't consider Tulsi to count as a woman of colour so that left only Kamala out of the field. Although there was mention of 4 black women being considered.

The most recent supreme court justice has similarly been undermined. Biden said they were going to choose based on race.


So it makes it exponentially harder to claim she was qualified. Now, giving her a chance I listened to some of her comments in front if the senate and not being able to define a woman, in my opinion makes someone's qualifications immediately questionable. Having said that she did have some other very good answers. However, if someone was to say she was hired because of her race it wouldn't be racist as we know that was the qualification that Biden announced he was looking for. Which again, is sad.

I haven't heard many people seeking for wilkinson to lose her job or sponsors or anything like that - has it been happening I haven't seen it?
 
I haven't heard many people seeking for wilkinson to lose her job or sponsors or anything like that - has it been happening I haven't seen it?
Has she currently got a job? She left the Project because of the speech she made at the Logies about Brittany Higgins, resulting in delay of the rape trial, then went overseas. I guess she's back... Is she still under contract to 10?
 

poshman

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Has she currently got a job? She left the Project because of the speech she made at the Logies about Brittany Higgins, resulting in delay of the rape trial, then went overseas. I guess she's back... Is she still under contract to 10?

I have no idea - don't follow her or aussie personalities much tbh. I would have expected to see more of it on social media though.

She has built a career of playing identity politics so it will be interesting to see what happens from here.
 

poshman

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Anyone coming in to rage about how much those ALP leaders lie?

Not only did she lie but she went all holier than thou on another woman when she dared mention there was prior knowledge. Not surprised that the bully in chief (Wong) was a part of that charade.

Looking forward to hearing them condemned by our fair minded friends on the left.
 

poshman

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Also now we have Thorpe and Price against the Yes vote. That is two prominent indigenous representatives.

Does this mean that you are racist if you support it now? Given that the vibe was the other way before leading indigenous voices came out against it....

Oh the perils of intersectional gamesmanship.
 

poshman

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Serious Question Now:

I have just hired an international worker from the Phillipines - $8 per hour. University grad. A week in and the attitude, standard of work of fit is better than anything I have found in up to $80-$100k positions ($40-$50 ph) here. She was on less than half that with a local company.

I am sure there are some with strong opinions on this and I genuinely want to hear them.

She has been able to move her family from a rough area to a good area and enrolled her children in better schools. They are now in a 3x2 rather than a derelict hut/home. She has asked if she can recommend uni friends/grads.

Timezone is not an issue and aside from a slight american/canadian accent they are often as clear or more so than Aussies.

Talk to me - please engage seriously.

I meant to test this and if it works well I will take as many on as possible through the 10+ businesses I own or have involvement in.
 

poshman

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Australia is a paradise and the whole world would love to live the life that many here take for granted, if not complain about.

We are bloody lucky that is certain. I just hope the push for some of the far left ideology doesn't ruin it.

I think there is definitely less pride in the nation and who we are than there should be.
 

poshman

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What complete stupidity. Just absolute stupidity. The problem when there is no opposition. Why was it rushed through as an urgent bill?

If it goes through there will be some new businesses opening with a token shareholder to make millions. What a pisstake.
Queensland is rushing through lots of bills. Treaty with 150 indigenous groups, “nothing is off the table”, approved by both sides. Gender self-ID , able to change your birth certificate by turning up and saying yep, I’m a lady, approved by both sides, no submissions allowed from women’s groups.

Edit: correction, Labor and the Greens 50 for, LNP and minor parties 34 against.
 
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