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Ponting's replacement

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Scotland said:
Any left field options for young batsmen?

The selectors showed faith in Starc, Cummins & Pattinson who are all very young. Why not do the same for some 19 year old batsman from somewhere?

Mitch Marsh is only going to get worse playing for WA, give him a shot.:)
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Travis Head? Peter Hanscomb?

I like this thinking, might as well give a shot to a young up and comer like they have with the bowlers (Starc, Cummins, PAttinson).
 
Caesar said:
I think I have made it pretty clear what my position is.

The top of the order is best suited to batsmen with expansive, aggressive styles who like the ball coming onto the bat quickly and the freedom to play their own innings in their own way.

The lower middle order is best suited to batsmen who are adaptable to a range of conditions, like playing spin, can work the ball around and are experts at shepherding less experienced players.

To see the truth of it, you have to look no further than the recent test between England and India. Gambhir is a fine opening bat who played a wonderfully gritty innings under tough conditions, much like du Plessis did in Adelaide. The difference was that unlike du Plessis, he was all at sea when batting with the tail. Completely failed to farm the strike, exposed his partners unnecessarily to the dual spin of Panasar/Swann and let the Englishmen mop up the final few wickets for hardly any runs.
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That's fine, there are so many games that I'm sure you could easily find other examples as well. Just to add further, since I didn't have the time yesterday. I had a look at where Hussey was batting during his debut summer, the batsmen at the time, and how a current Clarke and Hussey would fit in, taking into account you opinon. Due to injuries Hussey did get moved around a little.

So, in those days, if there were no injuries, the top 4 would be Hayden, Langer, Ponting and Martyn. Accounting for the fact that Hussey's background is of an opening bat. In theory, a current Hussey would not improve the order by replacing Hayden. Since Langer was never really an opener, just a surprisingly successful makeshift, you could improve that order by replacing Langer with Hussey, Langer can go at 5 or 6, if we're definitely making a distinct seperation from the top 4. With a current Clarke, there's no reason why he couldn't open (It would be a courageous move. If he did and it paid off, he would elevate his status amongst the Australian/Cricket community, even his detractors), but he's not replacing Hayden and Hussey is more experienced at that position, so it wouldn't be an improvement. If a Ponting (att) wanted to bat at 3, he can bat at 3. Despite his last 12 months, Ponting then is better than Clarke now, so that wouldn't be an improvement. Clarke's last 12 months, is better that any 12 month block of Martyn's career (including the year he should've won the AB medal). So Clarke could replace Martyn, as an improved order, and Martyn could go at 5-6.

However, the intial top 4 performed so well, so often, that your plan of putting a current Clarke and Hussey at 5-6, to take advantage of their relative strengths as you've stated, would be a fair plan and few people would have serious issues with it. The current Australian team does not have this luxury, though. There is a glaring weakness in the batting lineup and the most obvious and necessary tactic is for Clarke and Hussey to move up. The top order is on it's effing knees, but those two clowns are "comfortable" in the middle order. It's a joke. If the team does get hammered by SA in this test, it still wouldn't get close to what they really deserve. If Clarke/Hussey continue to please themselves during the SL series, not only should Clarke and Huseey **** off from the Aust team, but hopefully Karma will help SL to a 3-0 whitewash, and embarrass them/the team even further.

In conclusion, you idea is valid. However, I think it's best suited to a team going through a peak period or a purple patch. The current team is certainly not going through an peak period or purple patch. Therefore, I think your plan, in this case, is rigid and unhelpful. That was too long to make a point. I'm done.
 
Overall strength of the team has nothing to do with it. It's about ensuring each batsman plays in a position where they maximise their value to the side.

For example Warner may not be as good a batsman as Clarke but he's much more suited to opening against a new ball and pace attack, and Clarke is much more suited to farming the strike and protecting tailenders. Swapping them over just for the sake of having the better batsman playing higher up the order reduces the value of both players.
 

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Warner
Hughes
Clarke
Smith
Hussey
Watson
Wade
Lyon
3 quicks

Cowan isnt that good and Hughes more likelt to make a 100. Clarke shits diamonds at the moment. Smith in the middle benefits from batting with Clarke and/or Hussey and Watson bats where he should be. Lyon is the best spin option with Smith as backup.
 
fishman said:
Warner
Hughes
Clarke
Smith
Hussey
Watson
Wade
Lyon
3 quicks

Cowan isnt that good and Hughes more likelt to make a 100. Clarke shits diamonds at the moment. Smith in the middle benefits from batting with Clarke and/or Hussey and Watson bats where he should be. Lyon is the best spin option with Smith as backup.
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I smell trollmeat.
 
Anyone.

I mean he is a champion but gee he has fallen off the pace if this test series is to go off.
 
fishman said:
Warner
Hughes
Clarke
Smith
Hussey
Watson
Wade
Lyon
3 quicks

Cowan isnt that good and Hughes more likelt to make a 100. Clarke shits diamonds at the moment. Smith in the middle benefits from batting with Clarke and/or Hussey and Watson bats where he should be. Lyon is the best spin option with Smith as backup.
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Just Lol. Clarke is making runs are 5, had his best year ever, so let's move his position.

Cowan
Warner
Watson
Hughes
Clarke
Hussey (Usman when he retires)
Wade

That's the top seven for me now.
 
I've just been looking at the performances of last season's top scorers, and it's remarkable how many players' averages have dropped 20+ this season - Bailey, Christian, Forrest, Dave Hussey, Klinger, Voges... Either something has gone terribly wrong with the pitches this season, or our top batsmen have lost form quite dramatically.

Hughes, Haddin, Doolan and Khawaja have done the opposite, significantly improving on last season.

Henriques, Neville and Rogers are among the few to have averaged 40+ in both seasons, with Cosgrove and Ferguson consistent performers at a slightly lower level.

Given none of those five are likely contenders, we'll be taking a punt on players who were in terrible form not too long ago.
 
Donners said:
I've just been looking at the performances of last season's top scorers, and it's remarkable how many players' averages have dropped 20+ this season - Bailey, Christian, Forrest, Dave Hussey, Klinger, Voges... Either something has gone terribly wrong with the pitches this season, or our top batsmen have lost form quite dramatically.

Hughes, Haddin, Doolan and Khawaja have done the opposite, significantly improving on last season.

Henriques, Neville and Rogers are among the few to have averaged 40+ in both seasons, with Cosgrove and Ferguson consistent performers at a slightly lower level.

Given none of those five are likely contenders, we'll be taking a punt on players who were in terrible form not too long ago.
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If you're going to worry about previous form, then they might aswell retire.
 
Donners said:
I've just been looking at the performances of last season's top scorers, and it's remarkable how many players' averages have dropped 20+ this season - Bailey, Christian, Forrest, Dave Hussey, Klinger, Voges... Either something has gone terribly wrong with the pitches this season, or our top batsmen have lost form quite dramatically.
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Nothing to do with pitches imo, it's just sheer inconsistency of the batsmen we have. For about 5-6 years now the form batsmen in sheffield shield had changed from season to season. Guys do good for a year, maybe two, then drop right off. It's made selecting new batsmen into the test team a near impossibility.

I can't be bothered doing this but i'm positive if you look at the top ten wicket takers from the last 6 individual seasons, the same names are going to bob up over and over. Compare it to the leading run scorers and it'll just be a big mix of names.
 

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Personally I'd take Khawaja over Hughes however the biggest knock on Khawaja is his fielding... Hughes is a solid fielder and slipper so maybe that gets him across the line
 
tynanshinin said:
Personally I'd take Khawaja over Hughes however the biggest knock on Khawaja is his fielding... Hughes is a solid fielder and slipper so maybe that gets him across the line
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Hughes is also great mates with Clarke, who as skipper and selector, is a useful friend to have.

I actually don't know who I'd select which says something about the dearth of quality young batsmen around the country.
 
Actually iz doolan
dolan.jpg
 
Not sure how anyone could be suggesting Khawaja over Hughes - is it the fact he's older, has worse Sheffield Shield history and failed repeatedly at test level?

If someone like Doolan is the best we can do, with a first class average under 40, we might as well give it away. We tried that approach with Rob Quiney and you saw how it worked out.
 

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peternorth said:
how important are relationships in the XI? clarke and hughes are good mates, how are clarke and kawaja?
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I'd say they'd be considered in some matter. Usman hardly left NSW gracefully* and supposedly didn't leave the greatest impression on the Australian squad/setup/whatever, so that'd come into it. You don't want a destabilising force and whatnot. If Usman was putting up the runs, it wouldn't be enough to keep him out. But he's already behind the 8 ball, so it's hardly helpful.

*(although neither did Hughes. But NSW generally thought they were gonna keep him, and he sorta stunned them in the off-season, whereas with Usman before the season ended it was obvious he was leaving, what with he & the captain/coaching stuff not seeing eye to eye and all. Not to mention his mate Peter Forrest's stunning turn around in prospects after moving.)
 
Doolan seems to have fallen back to the pack. Khawaja still can't play off the front foot.

Smith is showing hints of form, and his technique is MUCH improved (particularly his footwork), but it looks like he's still adjusting to his new approach and has never really hit his straps in any innings. Would not be nearly as bad a selection as he would have been 12 months ago, and may be worth rolling the dice (his potential is much greater than Doolan's), but might not be the best time.

Hughes is the safest option, and ****, playing him down the order might be the best thing for him. I'd actually go:

1. Warner
2. Cowan
3. Watson
4. Hussey
5. Clarke
6. Hughes

Alternatively, swap Hussey and Watson. Hussey might actually be the answer at number 3 for a while, and it might allow Watson to bowl more overs.
 
When the batting lineup keeps collapsing it makes sense to have 6 openers as they'll all be facing the new ball
 
Patronij1 said:
Hughes or khawaja.
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Agree, the selectors will play the safe option and these will be the two realistic choices. Between the two I would pick Hughes. As for the batting order its anyone’s guess but you would assume Clarke and Hussey will stay where they are. I would like to see Watson at 4 just so he can bowl a little bit more and has abit of time in the sheds before he comes out to bat, and thus hughes at 3. Has anyone seen hughes lately and how is he with the short stuff?
 

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