Strategy Positional changes for 2015

[Partridge]

thats what I thought. Then why did he put him in the same category as Rivers?

Wasn't my list. I copied it from an earlier post.

 

[dazbroncos]

thats what I thought. Then why did he put him in the same category as Rivers?

He said broken or unproven. Rivers is certainly proven and only marginally broken but his knees are shot and getting up for each game is a process. That's why he is there.
Hmac is way worse than RIV IMO, this he'd be broken. That's my take

Go Catters

 

[FredLeDeux]

He said broken or unproven. Rivers is certainly proven and only marginally broken but his knees are shot and getting up for each game is a process. That's why he is there.
Hmac is way worse than RIV IMO, this he'd be broken. That's my take

Go Catters

Rivers and McIntosh were lumped together by Scott when he mentioned blokes on modified training programs, and they were also doing laps together on the vision of the open day.
They are both bent, not broken, but also proven.

 

[Partridge]

Rivers and McIntosh were lumped together by Scott when he mentioned blokes on modified training programs, and they were also doing laps together on the vision of the open day.
They are both bent, not broken, but also proven.

I'd say McIntosh is warped slightly more than Rivers.

 

[FredLeDeux]

I'd say McIntosh is warped slightly more than Rivers.

Somebody is, anyway.

 

[Shai]

True, but they were still better than 2013. It was a small improvement, but it was an improvement (at least until the finals).

He wouldn't b the Lone Ranger there.

 

[Shai]

Maybe, maybe not. It all depends upon each ruckman's head to head nett hitouts to advantage, figures not available to the public. Sunday papers publish hitouts to advantage, but not hitouts to disadvantage.
And we don't get any head to head figures at all.

 

[Heckler]

Murdoch : BP : Lacks a defensive side he can learn the craft here
Stanley : FB : His speed means he will be only one step behind all the quick full forwards
Sellwood : BP : Gets injured waay to much in the centre needs to be protected for his own good

Johnson : HB : Can showcase his great skills and ball use without being tagged every week
McIntosh : CHB : His height and marking can negate opposition rucking sneaking forward
Menzel : HB : His elusiveness would be hard for opposition forwards to counter

Lonergan : Wing : Spoiling ability would snuff any quick opposition rebound when coming out from defence under pressure
Cockatoo : Centre : His highlight video shows he can kick quick goals running out from the centre.
Clark : Wing : Allows us to attack wide around the wings not just running it through the centre corridor

Kelly : HF : His quick high around the corner kicks forward are sure to be spoiled just how our crumbing forwards like
Motlop : CHF : Not a stay-at-home CHF can roam all over the ground to get kicks. Opens up space for other leading forwards.
Vardy : HF : Proven big man to compete for the high ball with Taylor.

Gregson : FP : His tumbling backflip somersault would be the best after goal celebration ever
Taylor : FF : Great mark and showed he can kick multiple goals
Enright : FP : We lack forward pressure Enright could play the defensive forward on the attacking BP

Hawkins : Ruck : He's finally fit and healthy he won't be double teamed in the ruck
Caddy : Rover : Hard inside player Will bullock his way through the pack and injure the opposition mids
Smedts : Tagger : This is the best position for silly Billy to get a football education

Blicavs : Utility : A different position every week; Supporters love to see his versatility on display
Stokes : 2nd Ruck : If we concede the ruck we have and extra ball magnet to contest the opposition tap
Guthrie / Duncan / Walker / Kersten / Thurlow : Bench : rotating as necessary

Bartel : Sub : Can use his game smarts to swing the game when brought on late

 

[Stan The Caddy]

See sig.

 

[Teriyakicat]

Murdoch : BP : Lacks a defensive side he can learn the craft here
Stanley : FB : His speed means he will be only one step behind all the quick full forwards
Sellwood : BP : Gets injured waay to much in the centre needs to be protected for his own good

Johnson : HB : Can showcase his great skills and ball use without being tagged every week
McIntosh : CHB : His height and marking can negate opposition rucking sneaking forward
Menzel : HB : His elusiveness would be hard for opposition forwards to counter

Lonergan : Wing : Spoiling ability would snuff any quick opposition rebound when coming out from defence under pressure
Cockatoo : Centre : His highlight video shows he can kick quick goals running out from the centre.
Clark : Wing : Allows us to attack wide around the wings not just running it through the centre corridor

Kelly : HF : His quick high around the corner kicks forward are sure to be spoiled just how our crumbing forwards like
Motlop : CHF : Not a stay-at-home CHF can roam all over the ground to get kicks. Opens up space for other leading forwards.
Vardy : HF : Proven big man to compete for the high ball with Taylor.

Gregson : FP : His tumbling backflip somersault would be the best after goal celebration ever
Taylor : FF : Great mark and showed he can kick multiple goals
Enright : FP : We lack forward pressure Enright could play the defensive forward on the attacking BP

Hawkins : Ruck : He's finally fit and healthy he won't be double teamed in the ruck
Caddy : Rover : Hard inside player Will bullock his way through the pack and injure the opposition mids
Smedts : Tagger : This is the best position for silly Billy to get a football education

Blicavs : Utility : A different position every week; Supporters love to see his versatility on display
Stokes : 2nd Ruck : If we concede the ruck we have and extra ball magnet to contest the opposition tap
Guthrie / Duncan / Walker / Kersten / Thurlow : Bench : rotating as necessary

Bartel : Sub : Can use his game smarts to swing the game when brought on late

I like your reasoning behind putting some of those players in certain spots. If you're playing Gregson as a FP purely for his goal celebrations, then Taylor will complement him perfectly, with his own little fist pump

 

[Daniel McL]

Murdoch : BP : Lacks a defensive side he can learn the craft here
Stanley : FB : His speed means he will be only one step behind all the quick full forwards
Sellwood : BP : Gets injured waay to much in the centre needs to be protected for his own good

Johnson : HB : Can showcase his great skills and ball use without being tagged every week
McIntosh : CHB : His height and marking can negate opposition rucking sneaking forward
Menzel : HB : His elusiveness would be hard for opposition forwards to counter

Lonergan : Wing : Spoiling ability would snuff any quick opposition rebound when coming out from defence under pressure
Cockatoo : Centre : His highlight video shows he can kick quick goals running out from the centre.
Clark : Wing : Allows us to attack wide around the wings not just running it through the centre corridor

Kelly : HF : His quick high around the corner kicks forward are sure to be spoiled just how our crumbing forwards like
Motlop : CHF : Not a stay-at-home CHF can roam all over the ground to get kicks. Opens up space for other leading forwards.
Vardy : HF : Proven big man to compete for the high ball with Taylor.

Gregson : FP : His tumbling backflip somersault would be the best after goal celebration ever
Taylor : FF : Great mark and showed he can kick multiple goals
Enright : FP : We lack forward pressure Enright could play the defensive forward on the attacking BP

Hawkins : Ruck : He's finally fit and healthy he won't be double teamed in the ruck
Caddy : Rover : Hard inside player Will bullock his way through the pack and injure the opposition mids
Smedts : Tagger : This is the best position for silly Billy to get a football education

Blicavs : Utility : A different position every week; Supporters love to see his versatility on display
Stokes : 2nd Ruck : If we concede the ruck we have and extra ball magnet to contest the opposition tap
Guthrie / Duncan / Walker / Kersten / Thurlow : Bench : rotating as necessary

Bartel : Sub : Can use his game smarts to swing the game when brought on late

Kudos to your post layout at least it looks very nice

 

[Daniel McL]

Really want Lang to play that FP role with increasing midfield time throughout the year, mostly because I think he could cement a spot in our side next year with his intensity & skill level (and get some points for my Supercoach team )

 

[cynical]

Murdoch shouldn't play forward he just doesn't have the agility, much prefer Smedts/Cowan/Lang/McCarthy/Cockatoo. He needs to be in the middle, wing is probably the best spot for him.

Kelly can play midfield in the VFL.

Blicavs can play defender in the VFL also.

Don't see many other changes.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

Murdoch shouldn't play forward he just doesn't have the agility, much prefer Smedts/Cowan/Lang/McCarthy/Cockatoo. He needs to be in the middle, wing is probably the best spot for him.

Kelly can play midfield in the VFL.

Blicavs can play defender in the VFL also.

Don't see many other changes.

I think Murdoch is ok in the forward line; his main issue is too often not taking advantage of his opportunities to convert goals. The forwardline is still quite one-dimensional though and Murdoch is not a crumbing forward, nor should he be asked to be. If Motlop plays in the forward line, alongside one of the above or Blease, they could play complementary roles with Murdoch and Bartel, who are more undersized lead-up targets.

 

[Partridge]

I think Murdoch is ok in the forward line; his main issue is too often not taking advantage of his opportunities to convert goals. The forwardline is still quite one-dimensional though and Murdoch is not a crumbing forward, nor should he be asked to be. If Motlop plays in the forward line, alongside one of the above or Blease, they could play complementary roles with Murdoch and Bartel, who are more undersized lead-up targets.

Given that our forward line will definitely have Hawkins (who isn't quick), almost certainly Clark, and definitely Bartel, that's three players who you can't really expect 10 tackles a match from. We're going to need some pace there to help lock the ball in. I can see why Murdoch would be moved up to a wing; but I can also see why he'd stay in a forward pocket (which has been expounded on before). For me it's a question of who fills those remaining two spots, and one of them must be a small forward. Whether it's Blease or McCarthy or Smedts or whoever.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

Given that our forward line will definitely have Hawkins (who isn't quick), almost certainly Clark, and definitely Bartel, that's three players who you can't really expect 10 tackles a match from. We're going to need some pace there to help lock the ball in. I can see why Murdoch would be moved up to a wing; but I can also see why he'd stay in a forward pocket (which has been expounded on before). For me it's a question of who fills those remaining two spots, and one of them must be a small forward. Whether it's Blease or McCarthy or Smedts or whoever.

Agreed. And I wouldn't be against making those small/medium forward spots fairly interchangeable, where occasionally we'll have Bartel alongside Murdoch and a traditional crumber at times, then Bartel (or Murdoch for that matter) with two genuine crumbers, as Murdoch (or Bartel) plays further up the ground. If one of that group can genuinely produce 30-35 goals per season, I'm happy for him to be a permanent forward, but if not, we may be better served by continually mixing up the bowling and giving the opposition different looks throughout the game. It makes sense to me that if Murdoch is in the forward line and chases down an opponent bringing the ball out in the first half, the implied pressure will be there for that defender for the rest of the game, whether it's Murdoch, Bartel, Kersten, or Smedts giving chase.

 

[Jon Douglas]

Given that our forward line will definitely have Hawkins (who isn't quick), almost certainly Clark, and definitely Bartel, that's three players who you can't really expect 10 tackles a match from. We're going to need some pace there to help lock the ball in. I can see why Murdoch would be moved up to a wing; but I can also see why he'd stay in a forward pocket (which has been expounded on before). For me it's a question of who fills those remaining two spots, and one of them must be a small forward. Whether it's Blease or McCarthy or Smedts or whoever.

I have been harping a bit on about what you refer to P.

If GFC wants to be more competitive there are a number of positions that need be filled with better players. Or players we think will soon do a good job if given senior exposure.

I think many people on the his Board noted we can get carved up by opposition small forwards and have been putting players names forward to get this role filled. Most think Bews is the go at the present. Young, eager, strong, has dash, tackles and can lock down on a player. More time may see him playing an important role for us in the future.

But the one that has had less attention (than the midfield, the ruck combination, the small defender) is we need another small, fast dangerous forward. Especially if you play Hawk and Bartel in the same forward line. That makes us slow and we have to counter any easy rebounding out of our 50 into their forward 50.

Motlop plays a lot outside our forward 50 - so his leg speed is not always there to crumb a goal, or tackle or harass an opposition player inside our forward 50. So candidates for the job are probably McCarthy (now injured), Lang (quick and looks to have some nice balance about him), Blease (because he has pace and quite a bit of senior exposure already) and Hartman (I think he will be a tackling machine - and has pace a bit of X factor maybe about him). Some say Murdoch - as he is tall, quick and has been given quite a bit of exposure in the seniors already. We are invested in him I would think at this point in time (mind you the same policy did not work for Smedts - yet).

If we can get a small forward down there doing what a good small forward does these days - we would have a better forward line. A better forward line means greater scores and a greater score is harder to beat. Yes the midfield is the greatest issue then our rucks. They are simply not good enough on the last 2 season's performances to get us to a Flag. They are not problems we can solve overnight - but we have quite a few choices in all the positions we need to fill (except KPBs) now - so let's pick the most likely and bring them in.

I think that Clark, Stanley and Blease are all likely to get a go in the seniors this season. If they are good enough they will stay in. And one of Blease, Lang, Hartman and maybe Smedts will get a real chance at being our next small forward.

If one works we can tick the box maybe on the small forward role - and if Bews improves we can probably tick off another box - small defender. These positions might not be the most exciting, or even the most important for us, but they do get the jigsaw puzzle just that more complete. Handle these two positions well this year and the side would probably be 2 goal better performer (opposition small forwards kick 1 less goal per game and our small forward adds 1 more goal to our score line). And that is a fair bit of improvement.

And then we pray that GHS, Caddy and Guthrie improve by around 15 % and our ruck set up is better than the last 2 seasons. We will finish in the Top 6 - maybe Top 4 if that happens. Its a lot to ask because you are praying for a lot of players improve a fair bit in one season.

 

[cynical]

I think Murdoch is ok in the forward line; his main issue is too often not taking advantage of his opportunities to convert goals. The forwardline is still quite one-dimensional though and Murdoch is not a crumbing forward, nor should he be asked to be. If Motlop plays in the forward line, alongside one of the above or Blease, they could play complementary roles with Murdoch and Bartel, who are more undersized lead-up targets.

For me Murdoch and Bartel together doesn't work especially with the other talls.

Murdoch's best attribute is his pace and he has been able to run through players cos of his size also, he is wasted up forward. He needs to improve his game and become the gun player he physically should be in the midfield. He should be picking the ball up on the wing running forward and bombing long goals or hitting up one of the big guys with a 55m kick.

I'd much prefer 2 big talls a 3rd tall and 3 smalls. With 2 beasts in Hawkins and Clark we don't need more marking power we need small quick agile guys who are quick to the drop of the ball.

Hawkins,Clark
Bartel or Kersten as a 3rd tall
Motlop as a hf/mid
2 of McCarthy, Lang, Cowan, Cockatoo, Smedts as crumbing types

guys like Duncan, Caddy, GHS and Selwood have been shown to be able to float forward and out mark their opponents also

 

[Teriyakicat]

I have been harping a bit on about what you refer to P.



If we can get a small forward down there doing what a good small forward does these days - we would have a better forward line. A better forward line means greater scores and a greater score is harder to beat. Yes the midfield is the greatest issue then our rucks. They are simply not good enough on the last 2 season's performances to get us to a Flag. They are not problems we can solve overnight - but we have quite a few choices in all the positions we need to fill (except KPBs) now - so let's pick the most likely and bring them in.


If one works we can tick the box maybe on the small forward role - and if Bews improves we can probably tick off another box - small defender. These positions might not be the most exciting, or even the most important for us, but they do get the jigsaw puzzle just that more complete. Handle these two positions well this year and the side would probably be 2 goal better performer (opposition small forwards kick 1 less goal per game and our small forward adds 1 more goal to our score line). And that is a fair bit of improvement.

I think you've pretty much nailed a solution there, Jon. For a team that had huge holes in the midfield and ruck, the Cats have done extremely well to be thereabouts in September for the past two years. IF we can get support for Hawkins sorted out and IF we can get a crumber or two in the forward line sorted out, that will go a hell of a long way to alleviate the pressure of needing to have an immediate big improvement in the ruck and midfield. Hopefully our back line will hold up for another year, with bit parts played by the young players we have, giving the midfield time to get their act together this season with whoever eventually plays as our number 1 ruckman and his support crew.

The main objective is to get all our parts working in synchronisation by September and, if that happens, the boys will have a fair crack at the finals- hopefully progressing further into September than they have done in the past two years.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Id say Balme knew exactly what was going on. He just didn't tell you. Because of course you can prove Balme had no idea what was going on at the club.

GO Catters

Knew there was a good reason to keep reading. Was about to reply with the same sentiments. The don't have to tell us everything.

Given it's is P maybe he should 'prove' Balme was incompetent??

 

[Partridge]

For me Murdoch and Bartel together doesn't work especially with the other talls.

Murdoch's best attribute is his pace and he has been able to run through players cos of his size also, he is wasted up forward. He needs to improve his game and become the gun player he physically should be in the midfield. He should be picking the ball up on the wing running forward and bombing long goals or hitting up one of the big guys with a 55m kick.

I'd much prefer 2 big talls a 3rd tall and 3 smalls. With 2 beasts in Hawkins and Clark we don't need more marking power we need small quick agile guys who are quick to the drop of the ball.

The only problem is though, thus far in his career, it's only been up forward that he's really shown anything. Even if he has been selected as part of a plan to move into the midfield or wing (which may or may not be the case), he's outperformed all of the other small forward candidates pretty clearly. Right now you'd pick him as a goalkicker easily ahead of McCarthy, or Blease, or Smedts. Smedts is the only one who (in 2013) came close to providing a similar output of 1 goal a game that Murdoch has actually done in the last 2 seasons. And I'm far from Murdoch's biggest fan either. Given the amount of games he's had he really needs to take a big step in 2015.

The good thing is his numbers did increase in 2014, and he again showed he does possess terrific goal sense. Of course he still has weaknesses; he still has so little peripheral vision you'd swear horse blinkers were on him, and hopefully kicking on the opposite foot is included in his training regime. Plus he again crashed horribly in September (he's played 4 finals and only reached 10 possessions in one of them, the 2013 Prelim). But, if he can start involving himself more, and getting more regularly into the 15-20 disposal area, I can see him moving up to a wing at times. Failing that, I can't see how he won't be in the forward pocket in Round 1. Right now he's close to our only effective 'small' forward under 30.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

I like apples with apples - each player playing the number 1 role against the same opposition player. Remove the noise from the equation (time spent in other positions, against different opposition etc).

That for me is what clouds the Blicavs as a ruckmen debate. He hasn't spent all his time as a ruckmen, even within games. Makes it hard to truly judge his worth in that role.

I still think he could be suited to defence but I'll hold that thought until pre-season games start and we get a clearer picture as to where players look like playing.

OT: This is taking me so long to type. Getting keyboard dyslexia badly atm.....

 

[Art Vandelay_]

I think only the inner sanctum knows. We can only guess. It certainly was a quick fall from grace.

Which ended in him leaving at the end of that season. Did he walk or was he pushed? Hmm maybe something was afoot.

Sidenote: Apologies for dragging up older posts. I'm going into SquishyKitty mode

 

[Farmer2Goggin]

I have been harping a bit on about what you refer to P.

If GFC wants to be more competitive there are a number of positions that need be filled with better players. Or players we think will soon do a good job if given senior exposure.

I think many people on the his Board noted we can get carved up by opposition small forwards and have been putting players names forward to get this role filled. Most think Bews is the go at the present. Young, eager, strong, has dash, tackles and can lock down on a player. More time may see him playing an important role for us in the future.

But the one that has had less attention (than the midfield, the ruck combination, the small defender) is we need another small, fast dangerous forward. Especially if you play Hawk and Bartel in the same forward line. That makes us slow and we have to counter any easy rebounding out of our 50 into their forward 50.

Motlop plays a lot outside our forward 50 - so his leg speed is not always there to crumb a goal, or tackle or harass an opposition player inside our forward 50. So candidates for the job are probably McCarthy (now injured), Lang (quick and looks to have some nice balance about him), Blease (because he has pace and quite a bit of senior exposure already) and Hartman (I think he will be a tackling machine - and has pace a bit of X factor maybe about him). Some say Murdoch - as he is tall, quick and has been given quite a bit of exposure in the seniors already. We are invested in him I would think at this point in time (mind you the same policy did not work for Smedts - yet).

If we can get a small forward down there doing what a good small forward does these days - we would have a better forward line. A better forward line means greater scores and a greater score is harder to beat. Yes the midfield is the greatest issue then our rucks. They are simply not good enough on the last 2 season's performances to get us to a Flag. They are not problems we can solve overnight - but we have quite a few choices in all the positions we need to fill (except KPBs) now - so let's pick the most likely and bring them in.

I think that Clark, Stanley and Blease are all likely to get a go in the seniors this season. If they are good enough they will stay in. And one of Blease, Lang, Hartman and maybe Smedts will get a real chance at being our next small forward.

If one works we can tick the box maybe on the small forward role - and if Bews improves we can probably tick off another box - small defender. These positions might not be the most exciting, or even the most important for us, but they do get the jigsaw puzzle just that more complete. Handle these two positions well this year and the side would probably be 2 goal better performer (opposition small forwards kick 1 less goal per game and our small forward adds 1 more goal to our score line). And that is a fair bit of improvement.

And then we pray that GHS, Caddy and Guthrie improve by around 15 % and our ruck set up is better than the last 2 seasons. We will finish in the Top 6 - maybe Top 4 if that happens. Its a lot to ask because you are praying for a lot of players improve a fair bit in one season.

Tend to agree Jon Douglas
We now have a lot of options to put together a revamped Forward Line to support Tommy.
Whilst we have the personnel we also must have a Forward Strategy that will enable us to kick winning scores - especially in Finals.
If we continue with our version of insanity - bomb it to Tommy and hope for a different result - I will fe***ng scream.
Time for a change of tactics Coaches !!

 

[Teriyakicat]

Which ended in him leaving at the end of that season. Did he walk or was he pushed? Hmm maybe something was afoot.

Sidenote: Apologies for dragging up older posts. I'm going into SquishyKitty mode

NSFB- you need to add a little subtext to these old posts so people like me who have bad memories, can follow who we're talking about.