Autopsy Positives and Negatives vs Bulldogs - Rd 2, 2021

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El_ahrairah

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The fact that he's been used as an Inside mid tells me that he isn't considered as a KPP atm.
It's a slow burn of a development;

- defensive winger: teach him how to find space and rebound
- inside mid: teach home how gather a contested ground ball
Then...
- Full back: learn good leading patterns
- Waterboy: learn how to drink fluids
Finally...
- Play full forward, be absolutely terrible at it after having your development screwed with for years, culminating in your eventual delisting


For the record I'm heartened in his recent performances in the midfield.
 

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flamingEMBERS

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5 touches (but the game sealing goal in the dying seconds) after Nelson went to the middle early in Q3.

For part of that Bont was playing as a lead up forward, to be fair.
I don't really hold that last goal against him. Had Cole made the correct call and gone short, it's a non issue.

There was also a second player with Bont so who's player was that?
 

shooshka

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5 touches (but the game sealing goal in the dying seconds) after Nelson went to the middle early in Q3.

For part of that Bont was playing as a lead up forward, to be fair.
Yep exactly this.

Nelson was excellent. Had a goal kicked on him at the start of the 3rd also from memory, but really stopped Bont's influence until early in the 4th.

Dogs moved him forward to break the tag (and Nelson didn't follow him).

It was a shame we didn't make the move earlier.

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shooshka

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I don't really hold that last goal against him. Had Cole made the correct call and gone short, it's a non issue.

There was also a second player with Bont so who's player was that?
Or had cole kicked it out in front of Ryan. Popped it up and was basically the worst possible result (albeit it does take some luck to spoil and have the ball come back to you when it is 1 v 3 at ground level).

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EagleEgo

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Yep exactly this.

Nelson was excellent. Had a goal kicked on him at the start of the 3rd also from memory, but really stopped Bont's influence until early in the 4th.

Dogs moved him forward to break the tag (and Nelson didn't follow him).

It was a shame we didn't make the move earlier.

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Bontempelli had 30 disposal + 3 goals. Whatever reasons to give him such a influential performance is history. Something better definitely need to be done by the WCE at R14.
 

Coasters7

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I don't really hold that last goal against him. Had Cole made the correct call and gone short, it's a non issue.

There was also a second player with Bont so who's player was that?
I don’t mind that there were open players down their end. We were behind in the final 2 minutes, needed to score (and definitely had more than enough chances). Would be more of an issue if we were up and that had happened but no issue with throwing the hail mary
 

ukurrie

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I thought Nelson was very good on Bont. It had the Dogs worried too. Yes, eventually they moved him forward but, before that, Liberatore spent every spare moment blocking Nelson’s path to Bont and generally being a shithouse to create some space for Bontempelli. You probably didn’t see that on TV as it was always away from the ball.
 

eaglespremiers

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2 Marks????????? Dominates ..Yeah ..I was at the game as a neutral observer and watched him closely. He wouldnt have been in my top 3 for WC..
1. Barrass 2. Kelly 3. Sheed ( In saying that his opponent was BOG by far ) but Sheed on his own was part of reason WC still in it in 3rd Qtr .

Anyway dont care what NIc Nat does, for me who has played many many season in the Ruck and Forward at high levels he needs to go forward and be dominant there as well. Its good to have a million htouts a game but for me you need to be taking marks around the ground.
Naitanui makes both Kelly and Sheed look far better. Sheed would've had a couple of clearances tops without Naitanui.

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THE A5

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Naitanui makes both Kelly and Sheed look far better. Sheed would've had a couple of clearances tops without Naitanui.

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It's no secret our midfield aren't great contested ball side and he is one of our better contested mids. Basically majority of his possessions come in the clinches for us. I mean it would niced for him to have a tad more touched but thats just being greedy I'd say
 

Avalor

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i can never understand the morons who think NN is no good because he doesn't link up around the ground.

Or that he should be resting forward when we have Kennedy, Darling and Allen there.

It astounds me that people can watch the game yet remain so clueless.
As you said, clueless. Totally clueless!
 

Dylan82

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The Passenger

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Just got around to watching the game in full.

Biggest + for mine is that is the game played by two teams who have got a real crack at the whole thing. Poor teams rarely play in game of that high quality. Reminds me of R1, 2015 when we played a similar ball tearer of a game against the Dogs. Neither team was rated as they are now having missed finals in 14, but as it turned out it proved to be quite a prescient match. We made the GF, Dogs won the next year and we won in 18.

Rotham and Barrass down back is looking like a very likely duo in defence. TB has been improving and right up there a while, but Rotham is really coming into his own (I was surprised it took him 15ish rounds to get back into the team in 2019). With Hurn on the home straight and even Gov no spring chicken at 28 (not to mention his weekly career ending injury) with these two coming on in leaps and bounds our defence is not going to be much of an issue for a while to come.

JK and Hurn were our two biggest concerns age wise for 2021 and potentially falling off the end of career cliff, but if the first two rounds are anything to go by, they are not only holding strong but having a mini-resurgence. That being said, I thought they were better in 2020 than many made them out to be. JK was unusually up and down from one week to the next but still equal second on the goal table is nothing to sneeze, whilst Hurn did start poorly before finishing strongly.

Last week we looked like absolute sh*te when GC had the run of play, which they did from halfway through the first to early in the fourth. This has been a recurring theme since 2018. This time around we actually hung in there when the Dogs were on the front foot. We wrestled back control plenty of times and if we couldn't we didn't just let the dogs score at will.

Despite the last point, we could still do a lot better at making our tackles stick. We've all accepted we aren't a high tackling team, but we can still look to make quality tackles that don't let the opposition get the ball. So many times we'd have a Dog wrapped up only for him to get his arm out and get a handpass away.

OK the dogs kicked poorly on goal, especially in the second but gee what had some chance to put some serious distance on the scoreboard at the start of the fourth. Cripps was the FMD moment, but even after that Allen, JK and Kelly all had chances to move the margin from 13-14 to 19-20. The last foray forward was a serious lack of composure too. Can't remember the exact numbers but Cole had 4 or 5 handball outlets with only 3 or 4 opponents in the vicinity (it was a two man overlap including Cole). Further up field he had Allen and Cripps free about 50-60 metres from goal. Long bomb to Ryan 1-on-1 on the lead (so he can't even use his jumping ability) was basically the worst of his options. And then going back to the previous point when it hit the deck that was a pretty half hearted tackle from Cripps that allowed the ball to get back into the Dogs half of the ground. He really had to wrap him up and get the ball up.

All in all, fantastic game. Frustrating to lose from where we were, but the Dogs are a good team and we stuck it right to them without Shuey and Yeo, whilst Bont and Macrae had absolutely sensational games. I think Bont is well on track to be adding some pretty big individual awards to his trophy cabinet this year (although Martin himself has had a huge start to the year).
 
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Brolga

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I thought Nelson was very good on Bont. It had the Dogs worried too. Yes, eventually they moved him forward but, before that, Liberatore spent every spare moment blocking Nelson’s path to Bont and generally being a shithouse to create some space for Bontempelli. You probably didn’t see that on TV as it was always away from the ball.
On The Couch highlighted Liberatore's clearances, however of the 5 they showed, 2 were very clear throws.
"quick hands" indeed
 

The wily weagle

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I really want to know what, if anything, has been done to address our ground ball deficiency

Time after time we are beaten when we have superior numbers around the contest.....because everyone is waiting for someone else to go and get the ball whilst they wait on the outside for a cheap possession

And our tackling. We are useless at it. The concerning thing is (and it's nothing new) that we can have kids in the system that 3-4 years later don't look any bigger and stronger then when they were drafted, and still can't stick or break a tackle. I am hardly a Brander fan, but I have always kind of hoped our strength and conditioning guys (if we are serious about making Brander an inside midfielder) would be bulking him up and making him a beast around stoppages like Nat Fyfe or Patrick Cripps. But after years in the system, physically, he looks almost the same as he did on draft day


Frustrating
 

RookiePick

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And our tackling. We are useless at it. The concerning thing is (and it's nothing new) that we can have kids in the system that 3-4 years later don't look any bigger and stronger then when they were drafted, and still can't stick or break a tackle. I am hardly a Brander fan, but I have always kind of hoped our strength and conditioning guys (if we are serious about making Brander an inside midfielder) would be bulking him up and making him a beast around stoppages like Nat Fyfe or Patrick Cripps. But after years in the system, physically, he looks almost the same as he did on draft day
Our S&C guys are hopelessly out of date. We've been developing players for this mythical "endurance is king" nirvana since the tail end of Woosha's reign. Time and again we see that it's ability to win or positively influence contested situations that is the difference in close games. Power athletes are the ones that fit this bill - a burst of speed and the strength to break a tackle to open up play. Strength to lay a positive tackle and not let the ball be moved on. Speed and strength to make position and effectively block and shepherd for your ball carrier.

Loping along at a fast cruise for 2 hours is well and good when the game is mutually bruise free ala our Gold Coast match but it doesn't but it doesn't cut it when the other side turns up looking for a stoush.
 

SloppyJoe

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I haven't rewatched the game, but I thought Nelson had a poor first half. He then redeemed himself in the second half with a vary good job on Bontempelli. You can't really blame Nelson for Bont's goal at the death - it was our last roll of the dice and we needed everyone pushing forward. Nelson's ability to lay a tag gives him good flexibility, and I think it is something we will need while we await Shuey and Yeo's return.

Tom Cole had a poor game by his standards, but it would be a bit harsh to drop him off one bad performance. I thought he was great against the Suns.
 

Agent93

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2 were very clear throws.
There was a throw that got pulled up, I think in the second. It was in the tackle and the Bulldog had his hand pinned so he couldn't get the graze on the ball as he chucked it on to his teammate. It's muscle memory for them, they don't even look to handball correctly.
 

Rowan18

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There was a throw that got pulled up, I think in the second. It was in the tackle and the Bulldog had his hand pinned so he couldn't get the graze on the ball as he chucked it on to his teammate. It's muscle memory for them, they don't even look to handball correctly.
I used to be so ropeable with Bulldog and then Richmond throws. Now I'm wondering why we aren't in on the act.

Dropping is the other thing both teams do well. They let go as soon as tackled and use their body to propel the ball forward so the next player can keep paddling it on.
 

DanWCE

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I used to be so ropeable with Bulldog and then Richmond throws. Now I'm wondering why we aren't in on the act.

Dropping is the other thing both teams do well. They let go as soon as tackled and use their body to propel the ball forward so the next player can keep paddling it on.
Is it because us doing so plays into our deficiency of ground ball gets? We could be coughing up the ball to a scenario we perform poorly in, as opposed to forcing a stoppage where we back in our structure.
 

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