Autopsy Positives and Negatives vs Hawthorn

[twce13]

Clearances are not the problem.

The team won total clearances 45-30 and outscored Hawthorn 4 goals to zero from centre clearances.

It is everything after the clearance that was a problem tonight.

Sure, but there's little doubt the quality of our clearences are much better when NN is in there. Stats can be misleading like that.

Agree in general tho, our players looked lost today forward of centre. Collectively i thought the fwds didnt work well today. Were clearly moving it to slow on a whole.

 

[CM9000]

Hickey is s**t.

Come one, HickGod has just been down over the past two weeks. Apart from that, he's been great this season. You wouldn't be saying this two weeks ago.

And that is how poor a coach WC has....no doubt he thought we have better players we will win....nekminit...just disgraceful really

Yes, the coach that won us a premiership less than a year ago is poor, definitely.

 

[PerthBoy86]

It certainly is going to be interesting. Should we finish fifth, we need to win four games to win the flag instead of three. The major issue will be the consecutive weeks of travel...
We have a pretty good ace up our sleeve in Nic. I really hope we can use the bye to reset, Simpson and co to analyse and prepare. And maybe for the team to have a bit of a heart to heart so to speak. The opportunity is still there (B2B). It will be hard, but it just comes down to desire and the want. Let’s see what will happen.

We may just still finish fourth too haha ☺

Honestly, maybe this is just what we need. Have been too arrogant and complacent, expecting things to fall into place, drinking our bathwater thinking we're premiership faves. They may not say so, but a lot of the footy we play shows it. Expect to play a few minutes of champagne footy, play in bursts, instead of getting down and dirty, playing hard and accountable, and giving it our all for four quarters. If it's a fitnessed thing that needs to be addressed, but I suspect overwise. Can't always win playing fluid sexy uncontested footy. Maybe we need to be the underdogs, back against the wall, to give us more of a fighting spirit. Whatever the result, I'm just hoping to see effort, hunger, want. If we can bring that I'll be proud. Back to back still a chance, but I mostly just want to see a solid performance in a fortnight and whatever happens happens.

Also, it's evident home advantage doesn't mean as much this year as years past. Maybe that's a sort of advantage. We've lost 7, 3 at home, and we beat Collingwood and Hawthorn in the MCG yet lost to both at home. Maybe it ties into what we're saying. We become extra cocky at home and can't handle a challenge. The way we dropped off second half of the 4th and lay over was woeful.

 

[TheBeardedEagle]

Hawthorn were champions and deserved the win. Behind every coach are his assistants and I think there was a major IP leak from Mitchell and Glass who know West Coast intimately and who in my opinion lead the defenestration.

Mitchell and Glass knew where to squeeze and told Clarko where to drive in hard outside their area, he had the most ex-WC players/assistant coaches out of any non-Perth team to target us and they did their job to tear us apart.

On the good side if you want to bet on the eagles for the premiership it's now $6 from $4-4.5. If Richmond lose that will come back and if they win it will blow out.

What we can take away from this: LOTS and I'm glad that a team that wasn't in the chase for the top 4 did this to us. I'm also really glad we can use this to train and motivate us. Eagles do their best work when they aren't pegged as a favourite. Not to say we've got this but a loss now is better being found out later. Last week was unlucky, this week the coach can stick his boot in really hard and we have two weeks to get it right with Nic Nat back!

I know this is cheeky, but a good thing is we get up to 4 games with Nic Nat and it will be a potentially lighter game for him to come back from at Optus than travelling for a blockbuster at the MCG or the GABBA.

As conspiracy theories go (and I don't really believe this) it's interesting that we went right to the point of where we were now matching Richmond in % and couldn't lose any more or we could risk a 1 point loss of Richmond falling below the 4th spot.

Could it be that there was a gentleman's agreement to this level? I know this opens up a very big can of worms that is quite frankly so absurd that only mates could discuss it like Simmo and Clarko. Something around wanting a tough run into the finals instead of an easy one and Hawks get an awesome win and a chance to play in the finals all while west coast get written off and left alone to do their own thing.

Time will tell but just a thought or two

 

[Priddis Is Done]

Clearances are not the problem.

The team won total clearances 45-30 and outscored Hawthorn 4 goals to zero from centre clearances.

It is everything after the clearance that was a problem tonight.

It's also the quality of those clearances that are an issue. On the back foot and a hacked kick to no one.

 

[W.C. Fry]

Positive - only have to waste money on one final to watch them dish up that crap.

 

[Priddis Is Done]

It's shits me to no end that at a loose ball, our natural instinct is to back off from the contest, let the opposition take the ball, then tackle them. Seen it so many times last night and throughout the year.

Lazy

 

[chunkylover]

Just a fyi. We have not lost at the gabby in a decade,even when we were s**t and lions strong. It's like a little mcg for us.

Good luck for the finals

Can you please never ever call it the "gabby" again!

 

[greatwhiteshark]

It's also the quality of those clearances that are an issue. On the back foot and a hacked kick to no one.

Those hack kicks are quite common in all clearances from all teams, just get it forward is most clubs way.
Our problem is our small forwards stand 10m behind their opponent waiting fir the easy one instead of being the first bloke into the centre square to either mark that hack kick or at least make the play from that kick, go watch some of our games and you will see how often the only players on the end of that hack kick are our opponents. I think really gives me the shits our small forwards wait back for the easy one over the top.

 

[Coasters7]

No positives at all. We aren’t winning a flag from 5th so all those saying that are deluded. Interstate sides needs top 4 minimum.. usually top 2. Hawks game wasn’t the issue.. we should’ve had it wrapped up a long time before then. Richmond and Pies games was where our season reallt fell apart.

 

[West World]

Your dreaming if you think NN playing changes things much, we have had him at his best and yes we get a bit more use of the ball out of the middle but we still were no better. Unaccountable is unaccountable and no player changes that.

We were smashed in the ruck. Nic makes a huge difference there.

We really need to trade in another decent ruck this off season somehow.

Why Brooksby hasnt been tried is a bit of a ???

We looked cooked. Long season, sore bodies, lots of travel and playing on slippery concrete at home every 2nd week.

Maybe we are tanking for draft picks? Need pick 10 for Kelly.

 

[Coasters7]

Honestly, maybe this is just what we need. Have been too arrogant and complacent, expecting things to fall into place, drinking our bathwater thinking we're premiership faves. They may not say so, but a lot of the footy we play shows it. Expect to play a few minutes of champagne footy, play in bursts, instead of getting down and dirty, playing hard and accountable, and giving it our all for four quarters. If it's a fitnessed thing that needs to be addressed, but I suspect overwise. Can't always win playing fluid sexy uncontested footy. Maybe we need to be the underdogs, back against the wall, to give us more of a fighting spirit. Whatever the result, I'm just hoping to see effort, hunger, want. If we can bring that I'll be proud. Back to back still a chance, but I mostly just want to see a solid performance in a fortnight and whatever happens happens.

Also, it's evident home advantage doesn't mean as much this year as years past. Maybe that's a sort of advantage. We've lost 7, 3 at home, and we beat Collingwood and Hawthorn in the MCG yet lost to both at home. Maybe it ties into what we're saying. We become extra cocky at home and can't handle a challenge. The way we dropped off second half of the 4th and lay over was woeful.

It’s not what we need. That was last week. Finishing 5th is season over. If we were 3rd or 4th then I agree with the home advantage stuff as we’d only need to win week one to get a home prelim. But 5th is a bridge too far having to travel every week.

 

[Gaffy Duck]

Can you please never ever call it the "gabby" again!

 

[StateOE]

Whatever change we've made to Gaff's role, it's putting our midfield out of balance.
He's always slamming it on the boot the moment he gets the ball.
Our midfield is adding more pressure to our backline.
At his best last year, he was a damaging player and would regularly hit the scoreboard.

I hope this is a reality check for anyone that believes we've got one of the best midfields in the comp with Gaff back in the team.
We won the flag last year because we tagged oppositions best midfielders giving ours a chance.
Why the F don't we hard tag every game? I mean we hardly used Hutch as a tagger when he was in the team!

 

[Dark Sharks]

Was Hickey really that bad?

Beaten yes, but people are acting like he was completely useless and worst on ground.


Hickey - 15 touches at 47%, 10 contested, 1 tackle, 20 hitouts, 5 clearances, 4 turnovers.

Ceglar - 16 touches at 63%, 11 contested, 3 tackles, 39 hitouts, 4 clearances, 6 turnovers.

Only major important stat was Ceglar dominated overhead and pulled in 6 marks, 2 contested.

Hickey on the other hand had one of those Callum Sinclair "almost" nights where he dropped everything.

Dylan already pointed out we smashed them in the clearances, so Ceglars hitouts were hardly world beating.


Considering spuddy Vardy was running at about 5 touches, no marks a game and in career worst form I'll still take a bad game from Hickey.





Neither of them can hold a candle against Matthew Kreuzer and Paddy Ryder though.

 

[VicBased]

No positives out of that.

Negatives : unaccountable, soft at contests, all our small forwards even the flashy ones simply put little pressure on and play behind their opponents waiting for the easy one instead of putting themselves in the heat. Our players hate a contest, unless it’s on our terms playing uncontested footy we are pretty weak.
Been like it all year and to many get excited about little flashy things some of our players do instead of hard work and grit which does not exist in our club.

Couldn't agree more. It is the little things experienced teams do to unsettle us. Small stuff like pulling us down in contests, Taking us down so we can not follow up a contest, pushouts etc. We are way to nice and the Friends, Family, Flags title needs a fourth tag of "and some mongrel" on it. They were much harder than us and we pouted.

 

[Tiger71]

Can you please never ever call it the "gabby" again!

Sorry, that was my mobile's auto correct lol.

 

[VicBased]

+ if the Bulldogs win tomorrow, we can take solace that our 1 goal win against Hawthorn at the MCG ended their season

Yeah but that is just grasping at straws. I want a little more than that.

 

[ziad]

I think we last it lastv week. The lasr three qtrs were just the same - running attacking play with man on man defence V slow precise ball movement allowing for the full flood.
Our strenrths are known and well countered, Kennedy is working hard but on the decline. The bluepring is set for all well coached teams to follow.

In reality we are a solid team that plays great team footy when winning - isolated man on man we get beaten by bigger and better players with footy smarts.
Attitude etc hasn't got much to do with it.
We have to evolve the game plan and bring in players that can add run and aggression

 

[DirtySandman]

Too many passengers last night. And established quality players underperforming.

Waterman had a few chances early to impact the game. Blew it. Did little else.

That Rioli knock was fantastic, we had four or five players around the ball, and swarmed forward in what should have been a match turning moment, but Redden slipped, fumbled, and messed it up terribly. It summed up our night.

Petrucelle, while I like his potential, that’s just not acceptable, Cameron must play instead of him.

I withhold much Masten rage on these forums, and only vent rarely about him, so bare with me. but he does not belong out there, and people giving him votes in the votes thread, do so, because of the very low bar he has set for himself, being not as s**t as usual doesn’t mean he is worthy of votes. Out now!

No second chances now, if he is ready, unleash the beast, NN now!

I didn’t think Nelson was too bad either. Want him to stay in the team.

 

[FKASC]

Yeah Petch really doesn’t belong at this level yet, not when the footy’s as hot as it will be in finals.

I’m concerned that we’ve given him too many opportunities and now it’s too late to swap him out for someone.

Playing him in finals is like bringing in Mooen Ali to bat against Nathan Lyon.

 

[W.C. Fry]

Another positive is I can cheer on a side I actually like today rather than be forced to make myself physically ill cheering on scum.

 

[KERRPOW]

What does POS mean? That's twice I've seen it & have no idea what it stands for.

Piece of s**t

 

[Biggie]

That Rioli knock was fantastic, we had four or five players around the ball, and swarmed forward in what should have been a match turning moment, but Redden slipped, fumbled, and messed it up terribly. It summed up our night

Redden has been poor for a few weeks now. That slip and fumble enraged me

 

[KERRPOW]

Still bloody pissed off at how we played after sleeping on it.

We're really blown a chance here to to b2b.