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Autopsy Positives & Negatives of JLT1
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How many of our best 18 will be better next year than this year?
If I'm picking my batting order with our best player on top and working down it's something like -
Fyfe
Walters
Neale
Hill
Hill
Sandilands
Ryan
Blakely
Hamling
A Pearce
Wilson
Mundy
Bennell
Logue
McCarthy
Matera
Tucker
Hughes
Looking at that list there's not a lot of upside in our best 18, particularly our best 10 players. Sure another pre-season for the kids gives us more depth in 2019, but replacing senior players with kids who have played 10 games won't propel us up the ladder.
What's the average age/games of Sandilands/Fyfe/Neale/Mundy/Hill/Hill/Walters/Blakely? If that group stay relatively fit and don't win 10 games we're in strife. If we have a good run with injuries this year and don't push for the 8 we're in for a few more years of mediocrity IMO.
Which clubs best 10 players offers significant improvement?
Not sure we won't get significant improvement from the likes of Logue, Cox and Darcy. Ryan will hopefully keep getting better. Brayshaw has the potential to become elite very quickly and we currently lack ball winners (we only really have Fyfe and Neale who consistently with the hard ball in the middle). Cerra probably has similar potential to Brayshaw. Crowden/Banfield etc may surprise. There's also the enigma that is Bennell. Think you are underselling our youth.
Also football is a team game. We might get zero improvement from individuals but play far better as a team.
The teams that are genuinely in the middle of a rebuild like Gold Coast and Brisbane. Our rebuild is complete and we should be pushing for the 8 this year.
Logue, Cox and Darcy are already good players but will be better in 2020. In 2020 Sandilands, Johnson, Mundy will be gone so unless 1, 2 or 3 of the afore mentioned players is AA in 2020 it doesn't really make us a better team.
Not at all. Just think we've got a really good blend of experience and youth this year and the people that are suggesting we'll win 8 or 9 games this year are either selling the group short or will be right for 2 or 3 years.
That's a fair point, especially considering Hamling/Ryan/Wilson/Logue/Pearce have played zero games together as a defensive unit. But there's plenty of fringe 22 players in Darcy, Langdon, Cox, Tucker, Hughes who have had multiple pre-seasons and should be ready to establish themsleves this year when they get an opportunity.
DudleyDocker
Cancelled
We are two (maybe 2 1/2 depending on who you ask) years into a four year rebuild. Not saying we won't make finals this year, but the rebuild is far from complete.
I managed to watch the replay and thought there were more than a few good signs the second time around. Especially in the last 4 and a half minutes of the 3rd. That transition started by Luke Ryan intercepting at CHF, kicking to Neale in the centre square, handballs to Ballas who launches a bomb to Fyfe inside 50 was one of the best I've seen from any team in recent memory. Then you just need to ignore the MJ and Sherro comedy show and move on to the next centre clearance where Sandi taps to Fyfe who launches it to the goal square where Banfield runs on to it for the goal. Bailey trying a bit to hide his smile afterward was perhaps the highlight of the day. And then in the next passage he chased after three Crows defenders to put enough pressure on to eventually get the ball back. Then he intercepted just outside 50 (in amongst 3 Crows) and gave Mundy an uncontested mark inside 50 that he'd normally nail. And then followed that all up by some really strong work in the middle to almost get the clearance - if Danyle's brain would work just a bit faster. If Langdon is on the right forward flank with ball in hand he should have a licence to have a ping - he seems to nail them from there regularly. Thought he and Ballantyne stepped up really well after a pretty poor first half.
A lot of our guys were rusty but after 4 quarters I'd say there was only a handful at most who hadn't shown at least a couple of good glimpses. And that's all you need for JLT1. If they are that rusty again in JLT2 I'd be a bit concerned but add in some extra tall defenders and the class of SHill, hopefully Bennell and maybe even Cerra and Crowden and I don't see why our lead in to round 1 won't be a lot better than the past two years. Think the extra run on Sunday is a very smart move.
A lot of our guys were rusty but after 4 quarters I'd say there was only a handful at most who hadn't shown at least a couple of good glimpses. And that's all you need for JLT1. If they are that rusty again in JLT2 I'd be a bit concerned but add in some extra tall defenders and the class of SHill, hopefully Bennell and maybe even Cerra and Crowden and I don't see why our lead in to round 1 won't be a lot better than the past two years. Think the extra run on Sunday is a very smart move.
Port may be thinking the same, they are risking the 10k of softcap to get Robbie back in for round 1
I am surprised at some of the negativity in this thread, I thought there were heaps of positives and very little negatives:
+
Fyfe confirmed he is back to his best.
Neale and Mundy were very good as well.
Tabs looked good. Yeah he fluffed a couple but he provided a contest almost every time and kicked straight.
Bailey Banfield was exceptional I thought, way above expectations.
Alex Peace also way above expectations for first game back. Think he will play from round 1.
Matera, whilst he didn't get a heap of it, looked to provide a lot of pressure. As long as he does that he will get goal opportunities, and he seems like he is someone that will make the most of those opportunities.
Wilson - thought he wasn't as good as I hoped, but will only get better.
Tucker - would like to know his time on ground as I thought he did OK but wasn't on that much - had 8 disposals I think.
Luke Ryan - generally looked good and kicking was excellent.
Brayshaw - lived up to lofty expectations.
Also think it is a good thing we got overran in that last couple of minutes, reckon winning those games gives you a false sense of optimism. Better they learn from it. Remember Richmond lost a few close ones (including to us) and they seemed to learn from it.
+
Fyfe confirmed he is back to his best.
Neale and Mundy were very good as well.
Tabs looked good. Yeah he fluffed a couple but he provided a contest almost every time and kicked straight.
Bailey Banfield was exceptional I thought, way above expectations.
Alex Peace also way above expectations for first game back. Think he will play from round 1.
Matera, whilst he didn't get a heap of it, looked to provide a lot of pressure. As long as he does that he will get goal opportunities, and he seems like he is someone that will make the most of those opportunities.
Wilson - thought he wasn't as good as I hoped, but will only get better.
Tucker - would like to know his time on ground as I thought he did OK but wasn't on that much - had 8 disposals I think.
Luke Ryan - generally looked good and kicking was excellent.
Brayshaw - lived up to lofty expectations.
Also think it is a good thing we got overran in that last couple of minutes, reckon winning those games gives you a false sense of optimism. Better they learn from it. Remember Richmond lost a few close ones (including to us) and they seemed to learn from it.
Fanfooty says 72% for Tucker. Rookies ... Brayshaw 66%, Banfield and Giro 39%, Meek 36%.
Not a lot of upside?
Players who are nowhere near peaking IMO:
Blakely
Ryan
Pearce
Logue
McCarthy
Tucker
Hughes
Pretty sure Cam or Blakely is the most experienced of that lot a at around 35 games. To say 7 best 22 who have all played less than 50 games can't give significant improvement is baffling. Of course your best players don't improve significantly because if they were good enough to keep us competitive and still improved significantly, we'd win the league in a canter when they did.
Also, just because we will be better in 2019+ doesn't mean we can't be competitive this year. We are just more sensitive to injuries because so much of our depth is sub 10 gamers. They are 40-50 gamers in 2 years.
Sandi is 35 and is not as dominant as he once was. Still a good ruckman though. Mundy is still good, but not the 2015 AA version. Agree they will be missed. The rest will be at around the same level IMO. The improvement comes from the rest of the team as well as the "gelling" that naturally occurs when players stay together for a few seasons.
I am sure Ross and the boys would love to play finals and will bust their guts trying to get there. Might even get there if we don't get significant injuries.
I'd argue that Pearce is probably not far off Johnson, if at all at the this point. Darcy showed as much as any first year ruck ever has last year and Sandi is not what he once was (still good though). Midfielders develop the fastest so I'll back someone to improve enough to cover Mundy and then some.
Then you include the improvements from the other 20 blokes under 22 in that time and tell me they can't make the difference over 3 blokes past their prime. If this was 2013 (those 3 were gun) it would be different story, but its not.
Also don't think it is at all unreasonable to think that Andy or Cez could be genuinely gun by 2020.
Some of those players might improve and that will definitely help. Not so much Cox or Darcy because they are KPP and young. The blokes that could elevate us are Tucker, Hughes, Langdon (even dare I say it Sherro and Sutty) types who as you say have had enough time. I am not super confident on any of them but it is certainly possible. Not sure it is quite enough to send us too high, but certainly can make a difference.
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You have a point. Yes, we only have one pick in the 1st 4 rounds. Fortunately, its the 1st rounder. Worst case scenario is that pick Is pick 3 and GWS or Gold coast will pay over the odds for it trading their 1st and 2nd picks and a player at the very minimum for it. As far as the old contributors.... Darcy will eventually take Sandis spot as the main ruckman. Mundy will be phased out. Danyle Pearce looks like he will be turfed out. Ballantyne has been a club servant but I see Matera or a Fully fit bennell taking his spot. Spurr is 31 and might go one more season, but he is replaceable too.
I don't think we are in a bad situation. We have a lot of youth coming through. Also Just remember. We had an aging list in 2008. So bad that we only had 7 players aged 23 or under. We made finals in 2010.
If you look back to last season, take away rounds 1 and 2, Our best 22 in 2017 had a good blend of youth and experience. Again, I have been a freo supporter since 2001. Back in 2008, freos had an aging list that was so bad, we only had 6-7 guys aged 23 or under. As a reminder, None of them ended up as A graders: Rhys Palmer, Chris Mayne, Clayton Hinkley, Rob Warnock, Marcus Drum, Garrick Ibbotson and Brock "Lesnar" O Brien. As you listed, We have 24 under 24 years (and 11 under 21 years).
We need that gun 50-60 goal a season KPF to complete our squad or settle with few talls kicking 30-35 a year.
Saying that and I am realistic on this. If we are going to average 10 goals a game for the 3rd season in a row, they say you need to bridge the gap between your best and worst game... I hope its not the case. I don't mind during a rebuilding year, Freo kick 5-8 goals vs a top 8 team one week and get belted then kick 12-15 goals the next week vs a bottom 10 team and grind out a 20-30 point win.
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I watched it last night as it was on youtube courtesy of a Crows supporter - but I think it might be gone now.
The ground was too small for big switches of play and most of the kicks went down the line. We picked a running side on a ground with not much space to run into. Players like Hill, Pearce, Walters, Tucker you see them overlapping on the flanks and cutting in with their kicks on a bigger ground - but on that small ground the ball would just get kicked over their heads if the got out on the wings.
On a bigger ground I can see Wilson and Ryan switching it to each other and then going direct.
Best 3 for me were Fyfe, A Pearce and Taberner.
Mundy in the 2nd half, more so the early part of the last quarter with Meek rucking had a good run of centre clearances - maybe with the attention being more on Fyfe.
Langdon. First kick from a pocket he didn't centre it or take a shot and the ball slid out of bounds when Ballantyne was in a good position with space in front of him. 2nd time inside 50m he tried to square up when he was in kicking distance. Third time he pinged a goal. I think that's probably the message getting through but over correcting and then getting it right the 3rd time. What pre-season is for.
Liked Banfield. In tight he had good hands and kept the ball alive under pressure in the first half and hit the scoreboard and a goal assist in the latter part of the game.
We gave up some easy goals. Blakely and Ryan botched a mark between them, Langdon and Grey left it for each other. Johnson, then Sheridan failed to clear the ball. Walters gave one up to Gibbs and could have come across and pressured Atkins when he sold the dummy to Grey, but another Crow shadowed across him and probably indicitive that it was a pre season game he didn't bust a gut to push through his path and block the space.
Didn't see anything that said to me that such and such a player should never play for Fremantle again.
The ground was too small for big switches of play and most of the kicks went down the line. We picked a running side on a ground with not much space to run into. Players like Hill, Pearce, Walters, Tucker you see them overlapping on the flanks and cutting in with their kicks on a bigger ground - but on that small ground the ball would just get kicked over their heads if the got out on the wings.
On a bigger ground I can see Wilson and Ryan switching it to each other and then going direct.
Best 3 for me were Fyfe, A Pearce and Taberner.
Mundy in the 2nd half, more so the early part of the last quarter with Meek rucking had a good run of centre clearances - maybe with the attention being more on Fyfe.
Langdon. First kick from a pocket he didn't centre it or take a shot and the ball slid out of bounds when Ballantyne was in a good position with space in front of him. 2nd time inside 50m he tried to square up when he was in kicking distance. Third time he pinged a goal. I think that's probably the message getting through but over correcting and then getting it right the 3rd time. What pre-season is for.
Liked Banfield. In tight he had good hands and kept the ball alive under pressure in the first half and hit the scoreboard and a goal assist in the latter part of the game.
We gave up some easy goals. Blakely and Ryan botched a mark between them, Langdon and Grey left it for each other. Johnson, then Sheridan failed to clear the ball. Walters gave one up to Gibbs and could have come across and pressured Atkins when he sold the dummy to Grey, but another Crow shadowed across him and probably indicitive that it was a pre season game he didn't bust a gut to push through his path and block the space.
Didn't see anything that said to me that such and such a player should never play for Fremantle again.
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A really key thing we are seeing is that some of the recruits is very close to ready to play. Bradshaw and Banfield could slot in from round 1and I am expecting others to show the same capacity. By midway through the season we may have changed another chunk of our team.
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Why so?
DudleyDocker
Cancelled
Just rewatched the second half over lunch and agree with most of what you say there.
The one big disappointment that I hadn't really noticed watching "live" was Brennan Cox. Not disappointed that he was a bit quiet, because he has been playing forward and has been switched back. More concerned that there were at least three passages I saw where he either squibbed a contest (went in with hands and avoided body contact) or got knocked over way too easily. He needs to learn very quickly that he is a big boy and has to go harder at the ball or he will struggle to get games, particularly as I think Ross wants us to play with a harder edge this year.
Love the guy and see huge potential, but I suspect he will come into focus on their post-match review for a couple of efforts.
Likewise. He and Tucker are better than what they showed. They are both going to be good footballers so a reality check in the next couple of weeks won't be the worst thing for either of them. Both will struggle to be in b22 for round 1 if they don't step up in the next two games. They are in my handful of players that didn't show glimpses.
Still need to qualify them for Peel B2B2B. Gotta play 3 in the last month and half or whatever. Really hope Peel can do it again, just to see what ridiculous rule changes to finals qualifications the WAFL come up with next
Like the commentators said the players have spent the last 4 or 5 months playing against their team mates where you wouldn't hit the contest at 100%. We really lifted in the second half and there was a lot to like other than the final 2 minutes.
Best part will be when those new rules apply to East Perth one day and everyone melts because all the eagles youngsters can't play.
Lost_Deputy
Premiership Player
Maybe the thing I’m most optimistic about is that we are clearly back on the pressure model of 2012-15. While not a fan of everything RTB does I do prefer our coach to play to his strengths.
We need our kids to have clear and strong direction. Trying to replicate other teams sends a convoluted message.
If RTB is our coach he might as well do what he does best. It’s only JLT1 but you could see it clear as day
We need our kids to have clear and strong direction. Trying to replicate other teams sends a convoluted message.
If RTB is our coach he might as well do what he does best. It’s only JLT1 but you could see it clear as day
BigKep
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Very true, we had 10 players aged 22 or under (including four teenagers) in our semi final loss to Geelong in 2010. I do think it'll take time to make it back to the top but there's no reason we can't compete hard this year. I'd be surprised if we were bottom 4 this year. We could finish anywhere from 7-14.
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