Autopsy Post Mortem vs Essendon

[neilk]

Agreed. The next question is: to what?

What did we change in the second half of 2016 to get improved results? Can't we do this again?
Genuine question.

 

[Frank Gallagher]

To be frank, I don't rate the list or the coaches.

Don't bring me into it

 

[jackcass]

We just don't have the skill level required to execute the current game plan. It's not working and needs to be changed.

I think as a general observation, we do have the skill and that it is more about confidence and cohesion. I also think we'll see further evidence of that as players like Aish find form and push into the seniors and players like Daicos are introduced. Time will tell.

 

[pablo disco bar]

I cant keep up.....guess the jist is were tripe

 

[barrackers]

Why are you playing the victim?

You are part of the problem. You are supporting a regime which has failed. It has been proven to fail under all metrics over a number of years.

I consider your blind support of the club based on "teasing" gameplay over 5 years as wrong. Instead of analysing the problem and coming up with a solution, you are abetting the problem.

Pretty simple I'm not the one beating my chest and declaring everyone, but my side is wrong. Also for the record I've provided some options in various other threads including changing our playing style, getting back to basics, restructuring our assistant coaching panel to include a motivator and bringing in a sports psychologist and ruck coach. Further I've stated in this thread and elsewhere that change is needed and probably 1 year too late. You might consider it 3-6 years too late, but the reality of the matter is neither of us have a delorean, so there's little point to your opinion based boasting about others being wrong. Much better to look forward.

 

[Apex36]

Yeah, sorry I'm just not prepared to play an AA CHB as a forward decoy on the chance it might improve another forwards output. If he's going forward I'd want and expect him to be the number 1 forward. After an interrupted pre-season he's only just starting to find form in defense so not sure why we should assume he's ready to be the number 1 forward.

And I'm not omitting anything, I was responding to your suggestion that Reid play forward. If you'd asked, I would have said Reid had a relatively poor 4 quarter game, even by 2017 standards, and had little impact irrespective of playing either forward or back.

Irrespective of the views of them, Blair and Mayne are seasoned senior players, Crocker and Daicos aren't.

He hasn't been an AA CHB for 6 years, and he sure as hell isn't in AA form this year! In fact, he's been relatively average this year in defence, while we have had Dunn in impressive form in the VFL who's also a very vocal leader who can organise defensive structures in addition to playing that key defensive role.

The whole 'can't put an AA defender forward' bit is a massive crock of s**t. Geelong did it with Taylor, but apparently we're too scared to try something different when what we're currently doing is clearly not working, and then wonder why nothing is changing!

 

[Hardas]

Fasolo does bugger all and can't kick a set shot to save his life which has him snapping as quick as he can because he is s**t scared of the pressure to kick straight.

I must say, the sight of him rushing in to kick asap is embarrassing to see.
That's the solution?

 

[jmac70]

I think as a general observation, we do have the skill and that it is more about confidence and cohesion. I also think we'll see further evidence of that as players like Aish find form and push into the seniors and players like Daicos are introduced. Time will tell.

Do you ever wish we were the team that is able to score over the top goals?

 

[Hardas]

Do you ever wish we were the team that is able to score over the top goals?

Or have consistently effective kick-in plans?

 

[30yearpie]

The call from the umpire was touched. They went upstairs because there was doubt. The video wasn't conclusive enough to overturn the umpire's decision.

Bullshit....The video was conclusive...there was no movement as there has been for every other touched review

 

[30yearpie]

We have lost nearly every last quarter this year with or without Reid fwd.

The midfield lost badly in the last, it was a problem up field, not the absence of a player (Reid) who was ran away from the play for the proceeding 3 quarters by Hooker. Hooker basically played as a decoy.

Reid was visibly spent in his whole 25 minutes played as a forward after being ran up and down the ground by Hooker.

In the 3rd (the 5 minutes he was there) he actually did improve our structures and bought smalls into it as well as allowed Moore 1v1s in the 4th. he himself may not of directly scored but his presence added to the f50.

PS I do believe Reid was playing defence in the 1st quarter where we lost badly...You conveniently omit that as it doesn't fit your agenda.

As for Daicos or Crocker I'd just play them for development reasons, while Pendles recovers from a obvious ailment. Seen many players come in of crap VFL form Blair and Mayne say hi.

Reid has had an awful year, confirmed by his inability to block a ball which went through his legs to cost us another goal. The past three weeks he has gifted a goal each game through poor disposal and everyone thinks he's our leader in defence.

 

[30yearpie]

What did we change in the second half of 2016 to get improved results? Can't we do this again?
Genuine question.

In the second half of last year, we conceded that the year was finished and the pressure was off. We played young kids and they shined...Crocker played and kicked goals. Will played well and I was rapt that we had a strong body in midfield rotations. If both can get some fitness back they should be played instead of others who have reached their peak

 

[30yearpie]

Just want

We need to get players in defence that don't panic under pressure.

Dunn coming in, Adams and Varcoe to play half back and use Maynard up the ground to deliver the ball inside 50.

You can't have players that fumble and don't take first options when the heat is on, will just continually leak goals.

Ramsay and Maynard cost us on several occasions yesterday, as they have all year.

to remind everyone that Brown was one of the best and Marley Williams was also 2nd best on the ground over the weekend. Witts was 2nd best on the ground the week before

 

[Sunbot]

What did we change in the second half of 2016 to get improved results? Can't we do this again?
Genuine question.

Yes agree here. We looked good when Wills and Crocker played late last year. They are a must as they have height. JDG will help here as well. I'm all for going big as we don't have the pace to play small.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

The term Buckley hater has nothing to do with Buckley as a person or player rather it's in regards to his coaching, which given that was the topic of discussion shouldn't need explanation. The term is not intended to be degrading either; there's a clear divide between those who like Buckley the coach and those who don't and generally speaking many of those who don't have been very strong in this regard. The number of threads on Buckley's coaching is testament to the strong position adopted by many. Hate is defined as "an intense dislike", which given the strong position of many against Buckley's coaching is therefore an apt term. It's a very sad indictment where a position of supporting the club and having faith and hope in the potential of our pathway is seen as wrong and it's a statement I strongly disagree with.

You thought Buckley should be supported because it was the clubman thing to do. Support the administration, the status quo, the club because it's the club. At any stage did you feel that using your brain to evaluate Buckley's performance was in any way appropriate? Or do you continue to support Buckley because he is the appointed one! You didn't see the flaws in the game plan, the endless thirst for inside mids in our drafting, the players leaving because footy wasn't fun any more or that our ladder position fell a rung or two each year?

As for this s**t about Buckley hating ... why would any of us hate Buckley? Who among us didn't and doesn't hope that the golden boy would succeed? It was doubt not hate that sparked the threads of which you speak. There was a sense that Buckley was not genuine coaching material - that the self-motivating, tackle-centered, forward-flooding game plan was a crock of s**t that simply opened up the opposition's forward line for easy goals. It's not a sad indictment of your support of the club that your Buckley faith is questioned. You believed in Buckley and the club when others chose to independently question Buckley's coaching ability. You were wrong and the doubters were correct. The rest will become history.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Just want

to remind everyone that Brown was one of the best and Marley Williams was also 2nd best on the ground over the weekend. Witts was 2nd best on the ground the week before

Our trading and list management has been appalling. Heads must roll. An ISIS approach to pruning our admin and sporting staff would have me demanding front row seating to witness the spectacle and call for more heads.

 

[jackcass]

He hasn't been an AA CHB for 6 years, and he sure as hell isn't in AA form this year! In fact, he's been relatively average this year in defence, while we have had Dunn in impressive form in the VFL who's also a very vocal leader who can organise defensive structures in addition to playing that key defensive role.

The whole 'can't put an AA defender forward' bit is a massive crock of s**t. Geelong did it with Taylor, but apparently we're too scared to try something different when what we're currently doing is clearly not working, and then wonder why nothing is changing!

Addressed each of your points in other posts.

 

[jackcass]

Do you ever wish we were the team that is able to score over the top goals?

I do, and I actually think we've improved that this year.

 

[barrackers]

You thought Buckley should be supported because it was the clubman thing to do.

Start with an outrageous lie, always a great sign of a massive unsubstantiated rant coming up. As I posted within this thread I supported Buckley because there were signs there to give hope that we were on the right track. Great wins against great sides and some great footy fixed amongst the bad.

Support the administration, the status quo, the club because it's the club.

Another outrageous lie, you're off to a fantastic start. While I generally try to remain positive if a clip is deserving a clip will be given.

At any stage did you feel that using your brain to evaluate Buckley's performance was in any way appropriate?

Ahh, a thinly disguised personal attack - inferring someone is stupid; another great alert to a forthcoming massive unsubstantiated vent.

Or do you continue to support Buckley because he is the appointed one!

I assume from your use of an explanation mark instead of a question mark that this is a statement by you, again it's not something I've stated.

You didn't see the flaws in the game plan

Even premiership winning sides have flaws in their game plans, as I've said there were enough signs within our good performances to give hope that we were on the right track.

the endless thirst for inside mids in our drafting

I've openly questioned our drafting choices and stated I felt our list became imbalanced.

the players leaving because footy wasn't fun any more

Players leave clubs and players vent about their departing club. Aside from Heath Shaw and Dane Beams this season how many are playing great footy elsewhere?

Also a change of coach will inevitably lead to list changes. In Malthouse's first 2 years King, Monkhorst, Schauble, Michael, Rocca, Williams, Brown and Crosisca were some of the notable departures. Many more left before he won his first flag after 11 seasons at the helm.

or that our ladder position fell a rung or two each year?

A win/ladder position or so less each year in isolation while not great isn't necessarily cause for greater concern. The difference between getting the points versus not can be minuscule. With some great footy amongst those poor seasons it's easy to get caught up on what ifs and injuries especially with Buckley being such a great speaker. Also there was always going to be some drop off once we started turning the list over and I reckon it's unrealistic to think otherwise.

As for this s**t about Buckley hating ... why would any of us hate Buckley? Who among us didn't and doesn't hope that the golden boy would succeed?

It very much seems your talking about Buckley the person or Buckley the player, which I've already stated very clearly wasn't what I was referencing.

It was doubt not hate that sparked the threads of which you speak.

There is a huge amount of passion from both sides of the argument within those threads and in my opinion way too much passion to simply be cast as doubt.

There was a sense that Buckley was not genuine coaching material

I've stated my comments about people disliking Buckley were in regards to his coaching ability; thanks for pointing out what I already know - it's a nice reminder I didn't need.

- that the self-motivating

I've acknowledged previously that Buckley lacked this skill and suggested that we look to find such a quality within our assistant panel via change if need be to address this shortcoming.

tackle-centered, forward-flooding game plan was a crock of s**t that simply opened up the opposition's forward line for easy goals.

I've acknowledged that our game plan needed tinkering and changing; thanks again for pointing out what I already know - again it's a nice reminder I didn't need. It's also a change that can occur without a change in coach. In saying that I'm doubtful that Buckley will take such steps hence in part why I now believe a change in coach is necessary.

It's not a sad indictment of your support of the club that your Buckley faith is questioned. You believed in Buckley and the club when others chose to independently question Buckley's coaching ability. You were wrong and the doubters were correct.

I've already addressed this and I'm not going to waste my time doing so again. I will however reiterate that it's not a premise I agree with and no amount of repetition will change my stance. We each choose to support the club in our own way - I certainly haven't criticised anyone on of their thoughts (labelling the anti-Buckley group haters doesn't count for reasons I've given previously) and it's unfair for you or anyone else to do likewise to those outside the club who had faith in Buckley and the club's pathway.

Supporting the club and Buckley or conversely wanting change are not a right or wrong positions.

The rest will become history.

Are you and the others proud? Some certainly seem to be.



As for your rant:

 

[Somebody]

So opposition forwards only run in straight line and are soft?

No

 

[Somebody]

Yep, not disputing that we get a fair share of re-entry but I'd happily trade a few of those for a few goals. We're lacking Cloke contested F50 marking now so we just need to work out how we offset his absence. I think when the forward line gains greater cohesion we'll see quicker ball movement and better blocking of defenders that'll give the forwards a clearer run at the footy. Hopefully that emerges sooner than later.

Yep but I thought we were too dependent on bombing it to Cloke anyway which "enabled" relatively poor forward structure for a while until his form dropped away, so maybe it's a necessary evil at this stage.

 

[Somebody]

I'm not concerned about his "fragile body", rather his lack of form. I think they've worked through his injury issues and he's easily our best KPF. Just think he's struggling to find his best form and he'll do that quicker playing KPD.

I hope you are right because he seems the best KPF option. IF he isn't used much for that I'd suggest it is because of his fragility. Might even be time to start rotating Grundy through the forward line to at least bring the ball to ground and he is good at ground level follow up too. I could see him becoming a dangerous forward option.
They should also persevere with Pendles forward, he'll be really hyped up for this game.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

As for your rant:

Apologies. I needed to familiarise myself with your recent posts and focus on them rather than vent my own frustrations. It may be time for me to hibernate while the club struggles to find form and direction. Your post deserved a more measured response than my self-indulgent rant.

 

[barrackers]

Apologies. I needed to familiarise myself with your recent posts and focus on them rather than vent my own frustrations. It may be time for me to hibernate while the club struggles to find form and direction. Your post deserved a more measured response than my self-indulgent rant.

Cheers mate, understandably it's been a pretty tense time around here recently for most including myself with my reply to your post being a fair old rant itself, so apologies to you too. I think we're both better than that and I did actually think at the time your post was out of character. Hopefully the club moves forward and can put together some good seasons in the next couple of years, so we can all get back to discussing the footy.

 

[legendstatus]

If only we could fast track McLarty


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk