Potential compensation for Ablett

[Turbocat]

Re: Gary Ablett may be worth 2 draft picks

For sure, but you have to remember that they can only take guys out of contract, which eliminates a number of guys immediately.

You right Vegas but how many players do you think come out of contract over the next two years. Its sort like if GC doesn't get you GWS will.

The other thing Im a bit sus on is the thought that we can only lose 1 player to each club. What do you think will happen if for instance Sydney lost a top paid player to GC? IMO , they would immediately look at their happy hunting ground down at KP with a truck load of cash. I think the next two years will see some massive offers to guys like Bartel ,Ablett, Taylor,Kelly etc I just wonder how far loyalty can take you.

 

[Vegas.]

Re: Gary Ablett may be worth 2 draft picks

Geelong hasn't exactly been a happy hunting ground for Sydney (results wise)! Spriggs, Playfair, Chambers were busts, but you're right, they keep coming back for more. Not a whole let we can do about it to be honest - at least we are making hay while the sun shines.

 

[Turbocat]

Re: Gary Ablett may be worth 2 draft picks

Geelong hasn't exactly been a happy hunting ground for Sydney (results wise)! Spriggs, Playfair, Chambers were busts, but you're right, they keep coming back for more. Not a whole let we can do about it to be honest - at least we are making hay while the sun shines.

Vegas , I go back a bit longer than that. When Hafey left and took Williams, Toohey and Bolton. A different era bit they have had a fair bite at us over the years.
Yes your right Playfair, Chambers were not wins for them and they have always given us some sort of a pick so some might say we did well out of it. Spriggs from memory was already delisted so Im not sure he really counts.

Something , tells me that got it right with Mumford. The only thing that comforts me is the way Duncan has played. One could argue , that the type player he may develop into is more crucial than Mumford. (Glass half full) considering we have Simpson on the list but may not really need him for a year or two.

 

[mark121]

Re: Gary Ablett may be worth 2 draft picks

No formula can possibly decide accurately what a player is worth and can only be done on a case by case situation and nobody wants that because this would be even less fair than what they will be doing now. Because of this its the only viable option .

Ablett is worth much more than one late first round pick but if they dont change the system and Ablett does leave at the very least they should allow Geelong to decide just before draft time if they wish to use the pick this time around not nominate almost a whole year before the draft. this way they could at least target a player with some hope of selecting them.

This should apply to all compensation picks however picks should have a number allocated to them or after a certain round not after the teams first pick otherwise teams will rort the system.

One last thought, would it make more sense if compensation was determined 1 - 4 years later when a players worth can be more accurately determined or wouldnt teams want to wait that long?

 

[TheMightyAchilles]

Re: Gary Ablett may be worth 2 draft picks

if end up losing selwood and gazza, but with 4 first round picks wells would be salivating

 

[AM]

Re: Gary Ablett may be worth 2 draft picks

It's more concerning that the cats are working so hard to have Selwood listed as elite for the compensations !!

I can understand the club protecting its interests, but it's also concerning they feel the need to do it know. All the signs have been that Joel would re-sign in the near future. Not only from his public comments but those of people who know him who indicate there's more substance to him than chasing the biggest bucks or holding the club to ransom. I'm confident he'll stick with us but it is a tad disconcerting though.

 

[noclashjumpers]

The hierarchy seem extremely pre-occupied with this at the moment. Which of course is understandable given the circumstances. But it does make you, rightly or wrongly, reflect on the club's confidence in keeping GAJ and Joel.

 

[SJ]

A development to follow this afternoon:

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...on-system-for-star-players-20100623-yx8e.html

The AFL is poised to announce changes to its compensation system, with a new panel to determine if a club can receive a second first-round draft pick in exchange for losing a superstar player to the Gold Coast or Greater Western Sydney.

This means under the new system, Geelong would be able to get a second first-round draft pick if it lost Gary Ablett to the Gold Coast - but it would have to make its case and seek approval from the new panel.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...on-system-for-star-players-20100623-yx8e.html

 

[SJ]

And here we go:

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/96805/default.aspx

Under the system, clubs will receive two first-round picks in the national draft if they lose an uncontracted player judged by the League to be the ‘top echelon’ of talent.

The first compensation selection will be placed immediately after that club’s selection in round one of that year’s draft, while the second selection will be placed at the midpoint of round one, after the teams that have missed the finals have had their round-one selection.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/96805/default.aspx

 

[hamG]

Still barred from getting the top tier talent.

But to put it this way, if we finish one spot out of the finals in say 2014 we could have something along the lines of pick 8, 9 and 10. Also gives us some power in trade week.

 

[Selective Retention]

It's valid for 5 drafts. I take it that is 2011-2015 and not including this year? How many are compromised after this year. Just two more?

I think it is actually reasonable in general, just not for the best player in the comp.

 

[CF]

2 first round picks isn't bad

 

[DanA]

The way I see it a precendent for Ablett's value was set when Carlton traded for Judd. Judd was out of contract and made it clear he wanted to go to Carlton. They paid pick 3 + 20 + Kennedy (former pick 3).

Equivalent would seem to be two No.3 picks and pick 20. IMO we are still well and truely getting screwed with just two first round picks and restrictions on when we can take them. It'd be one thing if we were Richmond but where not going to finish outside the 8 before 2015.

 

[Claude Balls]

How generous of them.

Still a complete and utter shafting, given Ablett's worth.

 

[bulletproof]

Well done to Cook, that's a real win and some great lobbying. This would have never been changed, if not for us. It is still not fair but if used correctly and given Ablett has played a lot of football, we could still 'win' the trade. Just might take a while!

Still let's just sign him up eh?

 

[Pure_Ownage]

It's still not as good as I'd like-i.e. picks 2 and 7 would be reasonable.

As far as what I read, the second pick is a midpoint pick i.e. about if you finished 8th, so it would be about pick 10, and the other pick is directly after your first pick, so if we still do well in that year, it might not even be a top 10 pick either.

So it's better than piddly old pick 26 but it's still not as good as it ought to be.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Still barred from getting the top tier talent.

But to put it this way, if we finish one spot out of the finals in say 2014 we could have something along the lines of pick 8, 9 and 10. Also gives us some power in trade week.

Well yes and no...the earliest we can take the selections is the end of next year (2011) so we can't really use those picks to do deal(s) in trade week this year. But yes, from next year onwards it would certainly give us bargaining power.

 

[Premiers2007]

As far as what I read, the second pick is a midpoint pick i.e. about if you finished 8th, so it would be about pick 10, and the other pick is directly after your first pick, so if we still do well in that year, it might not even be a top 10 pick either.

Yeah if it Ablett does go it would be wise for us to wait until we have a bad year. We have the option to wait until the next 5 drafts. It would seem like a bonus if we wait 5 years.

 

[donbooger]

The tricky part is you will need to guess the year you will be poor in before the season starts to get good value.

 

[Selective Retention]

The thing that you have to take into consideration with it too is other teams also getting compensation for the loss of their players as well. So there might be two or three clubs that lose 'top echelon' talent and have these double first rounders up their sleeve. Now you would expect no one is stupid enough to use them when the compromised drafts are on, so most will rush in at once towards the end of the 5 year window. That would push a team that finishes highest on the ladder out of these clubs back a further two picks for every club that decides to use them in the same year as yourself. This certainly has to be taken into account also.

 

[wencat]

Good point!

 

[DanA]

My understanding is they will be immediately tradable. I think we might be better off doing that

 

[TommyJay]

I feel sorry for you guys, you're getting shafted if this goes ahead. I'm glad they've recognised Ablett is worth more than one pick, but two still isn't much.

I know how I'd feel if we lost Riewoldt and got stuff all like is being offered, and I can see how it would be easy for me to sit back and laugh at the Cats seeing as I know our superstar is safe. But if they're screwing you over now, it's just a matter of time before the other clubs get screwed over too.

Just out of curiosity who are the other players at the Cats who are out of contract at the end of the year?

 

[year of the cat]

The way I see it a precendent for Ablett's value was set when Carlton traded for Judd. Judd was out of contract and made it clear he wanted to go to Carlton. They paid pick 3 + 20 + Kennedy (former pick 3).

Equivalent would seem to be two No.3 picks and pick 20. IMO we are still well and truely getting screwed with just two first round picks and restrictions on when we can take them. It'd be one thing if we were Richmond but where not going to finish outside the 8 before 2015.

Judd was I think 3 years younger when he moved to Carlton than what Ablett will be if he decides to move to GC.

I reckon that sort of compensation is fair. If it is indeed valid for 5 more years it gives you the ability to pick up a couple of very handy players.

I wonder when we would take the option up? Would you do it straight away while your premiership window was still open or delay it for a couple of years in order to rebuild and take advantage of the non-compromised drafts?

I would wait. I reckon even without Ablett we have enough talent coming through to remain a power for a little while.

 

[catters078]

the structure for compensation should purely be based on price Gold coast is prepared to offer..If the AFL are prepared to give GC all this cap room, there should be some advantage for other clubs being exploited with reduced cap space when it comes to bidding wars with GC..

eg-

If GC offer 1 million plus to a player the compensation should be GC's first pick.

if its between 750-1 mill then the compensation should be a straight after that teams 1st round pick but pick no lower than pick 10

if its between 500k and 750k then it should be a pick at the end of the 1st round.

or something to that affect, you get my drift..