Preserving the Past

[Roaming Lou]

Sorry I worded it wrong, by established I meant in the eyes of the public. Most people would consider them new because people are stupid.

Would you mind listing the original 12 teams you want in the league? I'm interested in what those teams are in your eyes.

Regardless whether they are new teams, old teams, linked with current clubs or what, all my points still stand. There just sadly isn't a market for it within the public and much, much less so in the business world.

Yeah, hey lets brainstorm ideas, even if the entire BigFooty community got behind this the AFL could not care less about what BigFooty has to say, so lets have some fun anyway.
anyway those 12 clubs are
Richmond
Essendon
Collingwood
Carlton
Melbourne
Geelong
St. Kilda
Western Bulldogs (it would be called Footscray in this league)
Hawthorn
North Melbourne
and I'm pretty sure you know me enough to know what the other 2 teams are, they live on in my heart.

 

[Roaming Lou]

& thats the best you can do?

Dude I'm not even having a go at you.
I was just talking about you before and you show up.
Its happened twice this week actually, first with Roylion and now with you.

 

[Roaming Lou]

Dude I go to vfl and local footy games, it's not about dumb footy

It's about people have finite time, and when choosing to watch something they usually want to watch the best. It's why EPL is more popular here than the HAL, and why vfl will only ever be a weak second tier comp

I play local footy, its not dumb, its just the term many people use when they talk about the older style of game, and I agree with you that the VFL will always be second, its stupid if they become first. Although the VFL can vary in success, the VFL can become big and still be second, and it would be good to see.

 

[Kwality]

Dude I'm not even having a go at you.
I was just talking about you before and you show up.
Its happened twice this week actually, first with Roylion and now with you.

Now you are taking the P155 ... did it ever occur to you that Vic clubs should/could pay?

 

[Roaming Lou]

Now you are taking the P155 ... did it ever occur to you that Vic clubs should/could pay?

 

[AuntyBlindEye]

Yeah, hey lets brainstorm ideas, even if the entire BigFooty community got behind this the AFL could not care less about what BigFooty has to say, so lets have some fun anyway.
anyway those 12 clubs are
Richmond
Essendon
Collingwood
Carlton
Melbourne
Geelong
St. Kilda
Western Bulldogs (it would be called Footscray in this league)
Hawthorn
North Melbourne
and I'm pretty sure you know me enough to know what the other 2 teams are, they live on in my heart.

Haha yep.

See in my head for some reason I had the teams as

Brighton
Hotham
Northcote
Port Melbourne
Ballarat
Preston
West Melbourne
University
Prahran
Brunswick
Albert Park
Williamstown

Which would A) fail to draw in fans of established brands and B) cut into the VFL a bit.


I would like to see your idea happen. I'm never against more footy, and it could be a whole heap of fun to watch. I just don't think it would ever catch on and would eventually get the AFLX treatment of being taken out behind the shed.

I think if it were to happen it would have to be entirely independent and not on channel 7.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

I play local footy, its not dumb, its just the term many people use when they talk about the older style of game, and I agree with you that the VFL will always be second, its stupid if they become first. Although the VFL can vary in success, the VFL can become big and still be second, and it would be good to see.

you still cant answer the key question, who is watching this over AFL? sponsors go where the eyeballs go. tv goes where the eyeballs go. you talk of sentiment and nostalga for a simpler game, but the crowds at WAFL/SANFL/VFL level show the market is way too small to build it into anything substantial

 

[Roaming Lou]

Haha yep.

See in my head for some reason I had the teams as

Brighton
Hotham
Northcote
Port Melbourne
Ballarat
Preston
West Melbourne
University
Prahran
Brunswick
Albert Park
Williamstown

Which would A) fail to draw in fans of established brands and B) cut into the VFL a bit.


I would like to see your idea happen. I'm never against more footy, and it could be a whole heap of fun to watch. I just don't think it would ever catch on and would eventually get the AFLX treatment of being taken out behind the shed.

I think if it were to happen it would have to be entirely independent and not on channel 7.

For the TV fox could do it.
As for free to air I reckon Win/Sky/Ten could have a go, it would be interesting to see how they would go.

 

[AuntyBlindEye]

you still cant answer the key question, who is watching this over AFL? sponsors go where the eyeballs go. tv goes where the eyeballs go. you talk of sentiment and nostalga for a simpler game, but the crowds at WAFL/SANFL/VFL level show the market is way too small to build it into anything substantial

It would have to be not for profit. Aired on ABC or more likely channel 31.

 

[jatz14]

Ah but both of these issues are taken care of in my own thread post.
In the post I talk about this league getting TV time, much like the VFL does.

Television time is what most sponsors are looking for. Notice the Toyota sign in the AFL is shaped towards the TV camera's.
If this league can get TV time sponsors will be happy to put in an offer.

Secondly

These original 12 teams are the same clubs as the Victorian ones e.g. Richmond, Essendon, Western Bulldogs ( it would most likely called Footscray in this league) and Hawthorn they are just different wings of the club but the same club no doubt.

I see your logic, but think about how it could be of great benefit to the AFL. There are many supporters who have gotten horribly board of the AFL (I being one of them), having a league with a different play style resembling the older game would almost surely bring many fans back to the game. It could also help in another way being that having sponsors with TV time creates a big profit, having this as a semi-professional league means that you aren't blowing millions of dollars on player contracts, this should help create a budget surplus in these wings of the clubs, this can be used in many different ways such as updating and upgrading the grounds themselves, taking money up to the AFL wings of the clubs to help decrease reliance on the AFL for funding and buying stocks in other companies to increase the income to spend on more other things.
This league is property of the AFL, if there is competitiveness between it and the AFL (league) the AFL (company) will still win out.

1. It will not get airtime
2. If it did, it's eyeballs sponsors want, not airtime. Eyeballs and a connection. Ripcurl sponsor surfing, not football, Goodyear sponsors motor racing. Banks sponsor football because of footballs broad appeal.
The sponsorship income of WAFL is a minute fraction of the AFL.
4. It will lose money. The only way for the AFL to even attempt for it to not lose money is to use its influence to drum up sponsorship, pay for exposure and news stories. All of which eats into its capacity to do those things for the AFL and AFLW. It's taking resources, supporters and sponsors that generate huge profit for the established league, and funnel them to a loss making venture.

The AFL has started a new league. It is getting airtime. It is only paying semi pro wages. Unlike your league, it has a real point of difference for sponsors and broadcasters, meaning it has a chance to add new sponsors. By your logic, it should be making money, but it isn't.

There is a reason for the AFLW. See the boost in female player numbers, and interest from people who didn't follow footy before.

Your league is entirely aimed at people already into footy. It's aimed at the old, that don't play.

It has far less chance of being anything other than a drain on the league than AFLW does, and with far less upside, or point to it.

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[Roaming Lou]

you still cant answer the key question, who is watching this over AFL? sponsors go where the eyeballs go. tv goes where the eyeballs go. you talk of sentiment and nostalga for a simpler game, but the crowds at WAFL/SANFL/VFL level show the market is way too small to build it into anything substantial

The AFL oversees this league, it is marketed as nostalgia because thats what many people would be interested in watching. Think about it, the main idea I had for this is because many people missed the old style of play. If this was marketed like this I could see many of them sitting down and watching it.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

It would have to be not for profit. Aired on ABC or more likely channel 31.

agree

personally i think the VFL and the AFL reserves need to split, but that leaves the VFL/VFA gutted. who you bring in to make it a genuinely relevant and sustainable competition I dont know (or do we just shove Willy/Port/Franga/etc down to the local leagues and do a best of the best at seasons end, dont know...)

 

[Ned_Flanders]

The AFL oversees this league, it is marketed as nostalgia because thats what many people would be interested in watching. Think about it, the main idea I had for this is because many people missed the old style of play. If this was marketed like this I could see many of them sitting down and watching it.

who are these people you keep referring to? for all the talk of people wanting the old ways, people arent watching it when its available to them

they say one thing, but do the other

 

[Roaming Lou]

1. It will not get airtime
2. If it did, it's eyeballs sponsors want, not airtime. Eyeballs and a connection. Ripcurl sponsor surfing, not football, Goodyear sponsors motor racing. Banks sponsor football because of footballs broad appeal.
The sponsorship income of WAFL is a minute fraction of the AFL.
4. It will lose money. The only way for the AFL to even attempt for it to not lose money is to use its influence to drum up sponsorship, pay for exposure and news stories. All of which eats into its capacity to do those things for the AFL and AFLW. It's taking resources, supporters and sponsors that generate huge profit for the established league, and funnel them to a loss making venture.

The AFL has started a new league. It is getting airtime. It is only paying semi pro wages. Unlike your league, it has a real point of difference for sponsors and broadcasters, meaning it has a chance to add new sponsors. By your logic, it should be making money, but it isn't.

There is a reason for the AFLW. See the boost in female player numbers, and interest from people who didn't follow footy before.

Your league is entirely aimed at people already into footy. It's aimed at the old, that don't play.

It has far less chance of being anything other than a drain on the league than AFLW does, and with far less upside, or point to it.

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In terms of sponsorship I'm not talking about these big multinational corporations, that would be silly. Think about more Australian companies, not saying they would but companies like Greenfield mowers, Haymes paint, with a smaller league you don' t have a huge profit but you shouldn't have to pay the huge expenses as well. The problem with AFLX was that many saw it as the AFL's bid to break into the European market, or some poxy piece of trash the corporate AFL created. If this can be marketed well I could see people getting into this.

 

[Roaming Lou]

who are these people you keep referring to? for all the talk of people wanting the old ways, people arent watching it when its available to them

they say one thing, but do the other

When it available?, when.
Plus these people are who I've mentioned before, they were on my other thread how the game has evolved.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

When it available?, when.
Plus these people are who I've mentioned before, they were on my other thread how the game has evolved.

in the sub afl leagues. the crowds are small because despite people saying "we want simplier footy and just having a tinnie enjoying a contest and the old days" 95% of punters want to see the best of the best on the best grounds in the biggest spectacles

you are trying to sell something to a market than doesnt exist anymore outside an isolated few

 

[Kwality]

The problem with AFLX was

The problem with AFLX was ..... AFLX

 

[Roaming Lou]

The problem with AFLX was ..... AFLX

So very true

 

[Roaming Lou]

in the sub afl leagues. the crowds are small because despite people saying "we want simplier footy and just having a tinnie enjoying a contest and the old days" 95% of punters want to see the best of the best on the best grounds in the biggest spectacles

you are trying to sell something to a market than doesnt exist anymore outside an isolated few

May I ask how would you know, many where I went to high school with enjoyed old footy more, my own family enjoys it more.

 

[Kwality]

May I ask how would you know, many where I went to high school with enjoyed old footy more, my own family enjoys it more.

How often do your group go to the footy & at what level?

 

[Roaming Lou]

How often do your group go to the footy & at what level?

I play local footy so every weekend, and I often go AFL games with some mates.

 

[jatz14]

May I ask how would you know, many where I went to high school with enjoyed old footy more, my own family enjoys it more.

It will not be old footy, it will be new footy with old rules. Most of the changes to footy haven't been rules, it's been game plans and styles. The new styles were adopted because the teams that use them generally beat teams that didn't.

For your.comp to play old style footy, they have to be playing to play old style footy, not to win.

If they are playing seriously, it will end up looking like modern footy regardless, because that's how the modern style evolved.

State leagues and local leagues are not playing old style footy, they are playing new style footy, badly.

A league playing to achieve a particular style of footy, badly.

That's a hard pass from me, and I think if it ever happened, it would eventually be a pass from your family as well.

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[Ned_Flanders]

May I ask how would you know, many where I went to high school with enjoyed old footy more, my own family enjoys it more.

because Ive seen the size of crowds at VFL and local footy, and ive heard how many people want to return to the good old days on SEN and here.

if people supported old style footy with actions and not words, Punt Road would be a lock out for every single VFL game. Yet it only holds 6k and never has.

how many VFL games in the past 3 years have been lock outs?

 

[Roaming Lou]

because Ive seen the size of crowds at VFL and local footy, and ive heard how many people want to return to the good old days on SEN and here.

if people supported old style footy with actions and not words, Punt Road would be a lock out for every single VFL game. Yet it only holds 6k and never has.

how many VFL games in the past 3 years have been lock outs?

But this league I'm proposing is not the VFL

 

[Ned_Flanders]

But this league I'm proposing is not the VFL

it is

its old vfl clubs with players who arent good enough for the afl.

thats the vfl