PRGuy to be unmasked

[Gethelred]

For fun, I'm going to describe to you how each of these things you list are positions on different spectrums, therefore placing them 'on the fringes' isn't a useful analysis.

• 2nd amendment gun rights as currently interpreted by USA Supreme Court

Right wing position, harking back to the origin of the US as a nation on the basis of the overthrow of tyrants.

Can you not imagine a possibility of needing a left wing revolt against the US government within the next 50 years?

• excessive focus on language in terms of pronouns

Progressive position, or at least a position in favour of allowing people to define themselves. It also kind of borders on a position on freedom, as being able to choose your own name and gender is a position on freedom.

• tax cuts for high income earners in the Australian context

A neo-liberal position, which is to say a modern right wing position from an economic perspective.

• climate change denialism

Being right/correct isn't partisan.

• cancel culture (in that any serious criminal activity or activity judged by todays moral standards invalidates the entirety of that persons work)

This is something I could spend a long time arguing about, because I don't think it's clear cut. There are some artists whose deeds permeate through their works in ways that make it impossible to separate them (you can hardly watch any film about sex with Harvey Weinstein's name attached to it without feeling that dissonance/discomfort, and there are quite a few of those films. Likewise, you cannot separate H.P Lovecraft's racism from his stories, as his horror is built from fear of the unknown and the oriental) but the art produced can absolutely be worth preserving.

• enforcement of vegetarian lifestyle

Position on societal freedom, nature conservation.

• anti vaccination groups

Could legitimately come from any side of the political spectrum.

Do you know what the point of this exercise is? You've listed a series of things you find bonkers, and they mostly don't exist on the same spectrum. They're opinions, isolated.

The centre doesn't exist because in order to be a centrist you need to have a series of opinions that all fall within the dead centre of every spectrum (which while imaginable is highly improbable) or to be utterly ignorant of all things.

'Centrism' is faux objectivity, when objectivity does not exist.

I do not judge someone just for voting Republican because in the context of an election you have to choose for the closest fit to your values and wants and you definitely aren’t going to have 100% overlap, so you vote for close enough. It doesn’t make that voter a whack job. But if they were then to be (for example) an advocate for the current interpretation of 2nd amendment gun rights I would close my mind to them on that issue as to me they are clearly a whack job.

That, just there, is you closing your mind. It's you doing what you said they do. You cannot countenance yourself being sufficiently wrong about things.

You don't think the American government could be seized by a psycho, for the purposes of removing rights from its people? Who would react to democratic vote by trying to overcome the government with a coup?

Oh wait. That happened.

Imagine if he got a second term. Imagine if he stacked military command with his own people, just as they stacked the high court over ******* decades. Imagine if the military co-operated with his attempt at retaking power.

What you have then is a situation in which a left wing revolution of that country is absolutely necessary, and the second amendment's loose interpretation could bite them on the arse.

And I’m sure others will seem things I’ve posted as whack job and I accept that they may choose to ignore what I have to say - an example could be my comfort with current Victoria law on abortion to 24 weeks, some pro choice might still see it as too restrictive other pro life as too permissive.

You disagree with other people?

In all seriousness, disagreement is at the root of societal improvement. Centrism is a genuine impediment to that, because you cannot talk down someone you refuse to interact with because 'they're a wackjob'.

You need the fringes, because they don't agree with you. Centrism is no less an echo chamber than the extremes; it's just a lot more boring.

 

[William Wonka]

Nowhere but Australia was the word acceptable and even here only in the context of describing a brand of cheese. Changing it was a no brainer to me and as I said, probably should have happened a long time before it did.

Thoughts on the 'Maine Coon' breed of cat?

 

[Maddo11]

Thoughts on the 'Maine Coon' breed of cat?

Not in Australia.

 

[William Wonka]

Not in Australia.

Rapscallion Maine Coons and polydactyls kittens for sale

www.mainecoons.com.au

Also consider the below.

All this is irrelevant btw as Coon Cheese was named after a cheesemaker.

Does Keith Fagg Building Supplies cause you offence Gough ?

 

[Gralin]

Disagree with centrism not existing. People could hold a mix of moderate left and right opinions on issues or have their own view which doesn’t align with left and right.
Most people think they are in the “centre”. Eg with reference to other posters I think I am in between say Gralin and BruceFromBalnarring

A cranky sandwich

• 2nd amendment gun rights as currently interpreted by USA Supreme Court

Hard to wage a war on democracy without weapons
You might think it's crazy but they have reasons, they aren't nice reasons but they also aren't crazy

• excessive focus on language in terms of pronouns

From who though?
Is it the excessive focus of conservatives and bigots that are crazy or is it the people impacted by this behaviour fighting back that you take issue with?

• 
  
• tax cuts for high income earners in the Australian context

It's neoliberal capitalism

• 
  
• climate change denialism

Again neoliberal capitalism plays a big part

• 
  
• cancel culture (in that any serious criminal activity or activity judged by todays moral standards invalidates the entirety of that persons work)

Again how many people are getting cancelled vs claiming they've been cancelled, and then going on a tour to talk about it
Criticism is now framed as cancel culture
But also boycotts aren't new, people suffering repurcussions for shitty actions isn't new, this is just another attempt to co opt and play the victim
The right has been taking the language of the left and twisting it for ages, woke is another

• enforcement of vegetarian lifestyle

You talking religions or states?

• 
  
• anti vaccination groups

Antivax isn't political, fear of vaccines is generally fear of corporations/government

What is left/right is the pipeline, the people using this fear to move people politically to their camps which happens to be right but its not the antivax itself

Rapscallion Maine Coons and polydactyls kittens for sale

www.mainecoons.com.au

Also consider the below.
View attachment 1454105
All this is irrelevant btw as Coon Cheese was named after a cheesemaker.

Does Keith Fagg Building Supplies cause you offence Gough ?

We get it you really like being able to use racist words

 

[Donakebab]

Disagree with centrism not existing. People could hold a mix of moderate left and right opinions on issues or have their own view which doesn’t align with left and right.
Most people think they are in the “centre”. Eg with reference to other posters I think I am in between say Gralin and BruceFromBalnarring

Both Adam Bandt and Peter Dutton are somewhere between Gralin and Bruce.

 

[Chief]

only derogatory in a narrow set of circumstances on the other side of the world.

Not when I grew up it wasn't.

 

[Gralin]

Both Adam Bandt and Peter Dutton are somewhere between Gralin and Bruce.

I'm definitely left of Brandt but tough call on Voldemort and Bruce

 

[Over The Post]

Most people think they are in the “centre”. Eg with reference to other posters I think I am in between say Gralin and BruceFromBalnarring

Congratulations on describing approximately 103,800 Bigfooty members. Care to narrow it down?

 

[Crankyhawk]

Congratulations on describing approximately 103,800 Bigfooty members. Care to narrow it down?

Would substituting kwality for Bruce make a difference? Nah probably not
Ok try again between William Wonka and Evolved1

 

[Gralin]

Would substituting kwality for Bruce make a difference? Nah probably not
Ok try again between William Wonka and Evolved1

Much smaller gap

 

[William Wonka]

Would substituting kwality for Bruce make a difference? Nah probably not
Ok try again between William Wonka and Evolved1

I think you have found a good example of the 'sensible' or 'realistic' Left and Right here.

 

[Crankyhawk]

A cranky sandwich


Hard to wage a war on democracy without weapons
You might think it's crazy but they have reasons, they aren't nice reasons but they also aren't crazy

From who though?
Is it the excessive focus of conservatives and bigots that are crazy or is it the people impacted by this behaviour fighting back that you take issue with?


It's neoliberal capitalism

Again neoliberal capitalism plays a big part

Again how many people are getting cancelled vs claiming they've been cancelled, and then going on a tour to talk about it
Criticism is now framed as cancel culture
But also boycotts aren't new, people suffering repurcussions for shitty actions isn't new, this is just another attempt to co opt and play the victim
The right has been taking the language of the left and twisting it for ages, woke is another



You talking religions or states?


Antivax isn't political, fear of vaccines is generally fear of corporations/government

What is left/right is the pipeline, the people using this fear to move people politically to their camps which happens to be right but its not the antivax itself


We get it you really like being able to use racist words

To respond to your responses (and sorry that I am not as skilled as you are in breaking up your response)

I will never understand the reason for the second amendment nor will I accept any interpretation that does not actually use the component of well regulated. This is what I mean by bat s**t crazy. And when one recognises something as batshit crazy, theres no point engaging with it in a open minded fashion. Its like arguing with someone who is psychotic - there is no common reference point.

People who get riled up about perceived impact due to language which is deemed not inclusive (and also those who crack the shits because such language is being used) It is a nothing burger to me. But to be honest I'm probably just better off skipping posts that discuss such issues.

is there something wrong with identifying aspects of neoliberal capitalism as batshit crazy?

I could be misinterpreting cancel culture - I thought it was things like not being able to watch a movie because one of the actors later was found to have sexually assaulted a co star. I'm for sanctioning the behaviour but it doesn't invalidate the enjoyment one gets from the movie.

with the vegetarain one that was a bit more hypothetical were in the name of sustainability its suddenly no longer ok to eat meat. It wasn't a shot at religious beliefs about not eating meat.

antivax is political - its the refusal to do something to help the collective good (it may not be a left right thing though as you say). But I have hated the antivax liars before covid made it fashionable to whale on them. ******* scum wakefield.

but in a way the antivax is getting back to the original point about being "centrist" it was a rejection of Gethelred's assertion that centrists cannot/ do not hold political beliefs. Not all political beliefs map to a left/ right axis and I don't think trying to classify everyones belief on every issue as left vs right is helpful. It would seem to me that it fuels division and partisan approaches.

 

[Gralin]

To respond to your responses (and sorry that I am not as skilled as you are in breaking up your response)

I will never understand the reason for the second amendment nor will I accept any interpretation that does not actually use the component of well regulated. This is what I mean by bat s**t crazy. And when one recognises something as batshit crazy, theres no point engaging with it in a open minded fashion. Its like arguing with someone who is psychotic - there is no common reference point.

You don't need a common reference point but if you lived in America you'd have to deal with it and if you want to change it, it's batshit ain't going to do it

People who get riled up about perceived impact due to language which is deemed not inclusive (and also those who crack the shits because such language is being used) It is a nothing burger to me. But to be honest I'm probably just better off skipping posts that discuss such issues.

This is the motto of the "centrist" it doesn't impact me so why bother, you want social contract and traction on your issues though

is there something wrong with identifying aspects of neoliberal capitalism as batshit crazy?

Again it's not batshit crazy, that dismisses the rather deliberate nature of it

I could be misinterpreting cancel culture - I thought it was things like not being able to watch a movie because one of the actors later was found to have sexually assaulted a co star. I'm for sanctioning the behaviour but it doesn't invalidate the enjoyment one gets from the movie.

Again boycott isn't new and people choosing not to consume art from a rapist or pedophile isn't a bad thing, except for the people who profit off it.

We've seen over and over that profitable and powerful abusers are enabled within the arts.

Everyone knew about Harvey, you want to watch Pulp Fiction that's your choice, if someone else doesn't that's their choice.

The other thing is if he started producing movies again would you buy a ticket?

with the vegetarain one that was a bit more hypothetical were in the name of sustainability its suddenly no longer ok to eat meat. It wasn't a shot at religious beliefs about not eating meat.

There is no doubt our current diet in western countries isn't sustainable.

Also that we eat too much meat, there are many reasons to eat less meat and I don't think its a batshit crazy thing, and I love steak and bacon

antivax is political - its the refusal to do something to help the collective good (it may not be a left right thing though as you say). But I have hated the antivax liars before covid made it fashionable to whale on them. ******* scum wakefield.

Yes but its a fear/distrust response that is used to manipulate people. You've had historical hippy/lefty nature types that are antivax and now we're seeing a real embracing in sections of the right of it, usually linked to religion and libertarianism
But this doesn't equal the left and right are the same which is an argument often made

but in a way the antivax is getting back to the original point about being "centrist" it was a rejection of Gethelred's assertion that centrists cannot/ do not hold political beliefs. Not all political beliefs map to a left/ right axis and I don't think trying to classify everyones belief on every issue as left vs right is helpful. It would seem to me that it fuels division and partisan approaches.

Yeah but Gethelred is right centrism is bullshit
Division will always exist, people will uave different opinions on pretty much any topic or idea.
Left and right, progressive and conservative, authoriatarian and libertarian, colonial and decolonial, nationalist and globalist.

There are many different axis that your political views exist on

 

[Crankyhawk]

<snip>
Yeah but @Gethelred is right centrism is bullshit
Division will always exist, people will uave different opinions on pretty much any topic or idea.
Left and right, progressive and conservative, authoriatarian and libertarian, colonial and decolonial, nationalist and globalist
There are many different axis that your political views exist on

What I am seeing though is that debate is driven by the extreme views (on all the axes - and I will put my hand up and say I am likely at what a lot of people would see as the batshit end of authoritarian vs libertarian) and it becomes really shouty, unrealistic, "validate my point of view" type s**t and not actually attempts to make solutions.
I posit that where centrists are is where constructive conversation happens. The extremes become irrelevant and get ignored

As to the question about Harvey, it would depend on what he was making. Eg something documenting what he did (in terms of the abuse) and his motivation could be of interest

 

[Gough]

I tend to think that an electorate that rewarded Tony Abbott for running around describing himself as being from the sensible centre has probably lost sight of what the centre of politics even looks like.

 

[Crankyhawk]

I tend to think that an electorate that rewarded Tony Abbott for running around describing himself as being from the sensible centre has probably lost sight of what the centre of politics even looks like.

i wouldn't be calling Abbott the "center"
for me the center is somewhere around Albo/ ALP

 

[Gralin]

What I am seeing though is that debate is driven by the extreme views (on all the axes - and I will put my hand up and say I am likely at what a lot of people would see as the batshit end of authoritarian vs libertarian) and it becomes really shouty, unrealistic, "validate my point of view" type s**t and not actually attempts to make solutions.

This is a perfect example of how the status quo is maintained.
Change is extremism
Who benefits from lack of change?
Conservatives.

I posit that where centrists are is where constructive conversation happens. The extremes become irrelevant and get ignored

Yes this is the argument, the middle is where the smart people are those people that aren't me are stupid and know nothing, only my choices are smart and not ideological.
Again that supports conservatism as Gethelred said

As to the question about Harvey, it would depend on what he was making. Eg something documenting what he did (in terms of the abuse) and his motivation could be of interest

Meaning your entertainment is more important than holding abusers to account or supporting their Victims
The right would call that cancel culture, but they'd also want people on the left punished and see nothing wrong with that contradiction.

 

[Crankyhawk]

This is a perfect example of how the status quo is maintained.
Change is extremism
Who benefits from lack of change?
Conservatives.

Yes this is the argument, the middle is where the smart people are those people that aren't me are stupid and know nothing, only my choices are smart and not ideological.
Again that supports conservatism as Gethelred said


Meaning your entertainment is more important than holding abusers to account or supporting their Victims
The right would call that cancel culture, but they'd also want people on the left punished and see nothing wrong with that contradiction.

I don't see that I need to be actively involved in supporting victims. Happy for reparations to come from the criminal though. So I'm not sure how that is not holding abusers to account - via the process of the law
And yes I accept that the law needs to have less barriers to have complaints of abuse investigated.

if you mean conservatism as lack of change, or lack of dramatic change - ok sure that's conservative. But a lot of what I am hearing is that "conservative" in politics also is being used for "dragging people towards a batshit right wing future" which I don't see as conservative in the sense that Gethelred was using, but a form of right wing progressivism (in terms of progressive - change - vs conservative lack of change).

SO this leads to linguistic confusion. Because I don't see myself as conservative in the sense of the right wing changes, but am someone who wants change to be incremental rather than dramatic. Eg a view that the stage 3 tax cuts should not go through, that is "conservative" (because it means don't change s**t right now) but it is also not a right wing "conservative" stance (because that is "give the talented/ privileged all the resources, * government and * the poor)

 

[Gethelred]

To respond to your responses (and sorry that I am not as skilled as you are in breaking up your response)

I will never understand the reason for the second amendment nor will I accept any interpretation that does not actually use the component of well regulated. This is what I mean by bat s**t crazy. And when one recognises something as batshit crazy, theres no point engaging with it in a open minded fashion. Its like arguing with someone who is psychotic - there is no common reference point.

People who get riled up about perceived impact due to language which is deemed not inclusive (and also those who crack the shits because such language is being used) It is a nothing burger to me. But to be honest I'm probably just better off skipping posts that discuss such issues.

is there something wrong with identifying aspects of neoliberal capitalism as batshit crazy?

I could be misinterpreting cancel culture - I thought it was things like not being able to watch a movie because one of the actors later was found to have sexually assaulted a co star. I'm for sanctioning the behaviour but it doesn't invalidate the enjoyment one gets from the movie.

with the vegetarain one that was a bit more hypothetical were in the name of sustainability its suddenly no longer ok to eat meat. It wasn't a shot at religious beliefs about not eating meat.

antivax is political - its the refusal to do something to help the collective good (it may not be a left right thing though as you say). But I have hated the antivax liars before covid made it fashionable to whale on them. ******* scum wakefield.

but in a way the antivax is getting back to the original point about being "centrist" it was a rejection of Gethelred's assertion that centrists cannot/ do not hold political beliefs. Not all political beliefs map to a left/ right axis and I don't think trying to classify everyones belief on every issue as left vs right is helpful. It would seem to me that it fuels division and partisan approaches.

The point of saying there is no centre is to eliminate it as an option: you have to pick a side on any given issue. You don't need to be ideologically wedded to any side of the spectrum, just pick good ideas and theories that match your current situation.

Centrism is ideological paralysis.

That is the real problem with centrism. You become so wedded to soft responses and soft conservativism, you become unable to react to real problems for fear of leaving the centre or changing the status quo when it needs to change, or is struggling from too much change in too short a timespan.

 

[Todman]

I just want to remind people what the OP is for this thread.

High-profile Twitter user PRGuy17 has revealed his true identity to be Jeremy Maluta.

PRGuy unmasked in YouTube video

The identity of a high-profile Twitter user known as PRGuy17 has finally been revealed in a video posted to YouTube.

www.perthnow.com.au

 

[CM86]

I just want to remind people what the OP is for this thread.

High-profile Twitter user PRGuy17 has revealed his true identity to be Jeremy Maluta.

PRGuy unmasked in YouTube video

The identity of a high-profile Twitter user known as PRGuy17 has finally been revealed in a video posted to YouTube.

www.perthnow.com.au

This guy?

 

[Todman]

This guy?

That guy!

 

[Chief]

Yes CM86, this guy:

 

[sataris]

The point of saying there is no centre is to eliminate it as an option: you have to pick a side on any given issue. You don't need to be ideologically wedded to any side of the spectrum, just pick good ideas and theories that match your current situation..

There are some issues that I genuinely don't care about and there are some issues I'm not qualified to have an opinion on.

Also the bolded is incredibly dangerous if you're asking people to make a decision on things they don't care/know about.