Pride

[aislegi]

again, a regular finals side - a grand final winner, was regularly beating a cellar dweller on their hone ground, and you are surprised by this?

On what grounds should the RFC of 2005-13 be beating the Swans at the SCG? They were more skilled than us, bigger than us, masters at tempo football, masters on the small SCG. What was our reason to win other than "we is due"?

According to the self-appointed experts on this board, we are an improving side, don't you know? Yet we went from losing to the Swans by 10 points at the SCG in 2011 to a 47-point drubbing last year. Improvement my (_|_).

 

[tugga]

Pride would be the whole team donating their match day paycheck to charity because they didn't earn it and want the fans to know they are not happy with their performance!

Disagree with this mate. Would you give back a week's pay to your employer if you felt you'd slacked off a bit too much?

 

[This Is Anfield]

According to the self-appointed experts on this board, we are an improving side, don't you know? Yet we went from losing to the Swans by 10 points at the SCG in 2011 to a 47-point drubbing last year. Improvement my (_|_).

Damn, that's Freo's improvement shot to bits! They went from a 15 point loss to Hawthorn to a 58 point thrashing in only 3 games!

 

[aislegi]

Funny you should say that. I went over to the Fremantle board the other day to see what they thought. I can tell you one thing. They're not exactly doing cartwheels over it. Some of them think they might be able to bounce back and have a good season but there was very much a feeling that they're not as close to the prize as they may have thought and a fair number of their players came in for a bollocking.

 

[aislegi]

ALL Richmond fans can see we are struggling.

Disagree. Plenty are running around pretending that failure is the new success. Failure is not a sign that things are bad but a sign that success is around the corner. If our coach misses the finals a few times, hey, that's just like "Bomber" over at Geelong. It's deluded nonsense.

 

[This Is Anfield]

Funny you should say that. I went over to the Fremantle board the other day to see what they thought. I can tell you one thing. They're not exactly doing cartwheels over it. Some of them think they might be able to bounce back and have a good season but there was very much a feeling that they're not as close to the prize as they may have thought and a fair number of their players came in for a bollocking.

But don't you want a Ross Lyon to coach Richmond?
And what does that also tell you - that AFL is a hard gig, there are no guarantees of success! A quick fix is no substitute for hard work & a clear plan, we have had both for four years now. Yes, we have not played well for the first three weeks but to waste the last four years of constant improvement by a knee jerk removal of DH would be insane!

 

[Ned_Flanders]

According to the self-appointed experts on this board, we are an improving side, don't you know? Yet we went from losing to the Swans by 10 points at the SCG in 2011 to a 47-point drubbing last year. Improvement my (_|_).

Yes, improvement - we started beating more teams, and improving our percentage each year.

You are picking one of the best sides in a generation, on a ground that is their fortress and nearly all clubs struggle at. Once we start winning regularly at the SCG, we know we are a fair dinkum contender. We are not there yet, just as we are not yet a top 4 side. Patience people, it takes time

 

[docko911]

How many times have you donated your pay when your performance at work was less than what you are paid for?

I've never performed, in my job, as bad as the Tigers did on Saturday.

I also don't get paid between 200-650k a year... but I do pay their ****ing wage and expect them to show a bit more bloody pride when wearing our ****ing jumper!!!

 

[Ned_Flanders]

I've never performed, in my job, as bad as the Tigers did on Saturday.

I also don't get paid between 200-650k a year... but I do pay their ******* wage and expect them to show a bit more bloody pride when wearing our ******* jumper!!!

So thats a "no I'm different"?

I love the double standards people have

 

[aislegi]

Yes, improvement - we started beating more teams, and improving our percentage each year.

You are picking one of the best sides in a generation, on a ground that is their fortress and nearly all clubs struggle at. Once we start winning regularly at the SCG, we know we are a fair dinkum contender. We are not there yet, just as we are not yet a top 4 side. Patience people, it takes time

The thing is, we won a handful of games up here when we were supposedly crap, back 10 or 15 years ago. But now when we're supposedly good, expecting a win up here is too much. We don't lose up here because it's a "fortress" we lose up here because we make the same mistakes every year. We are lazy and our defence is terrible and the Swans clog our forwardline and hit us on the rebound for goal after goal. These are the sorts of things I would expect a crack coach to be solving. But these problems were evident in spades when we played up here last year.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

The thing is, we won a handful of games up here when we were supposedly crap, back 10 or 15 years ago. But now when we're supposedly good, expecting a win up here is too much. We don't lose up here because it's a "fortress" we lose up here because we make the same mistakes every year. We are lazy and our defence is terrible and the Swans clog our forwardline and hit us on the rebound for goal after goal. These are the sorts of things I would expect a crack coach to be solving. But these problems were evident in spades when we played up here last year.

And look at the types of wins they were flukes.

Also you are ignoring that we play better on the big decks. There is a reason we kept upsetting Freo and WCE at Subi, we like the open spaces. SCG is like a kryptonite for our team, as it doesn't suit our style of play at all.

Thats cool, all teams have grounds they do better and worse on.

 

[aislegi]

But don't you want a Ross Lyon to coach Richmond?

Actually, Leigh Matthews would probably be my first choice

 

[aislegi]

And look at the types of wins they were flukes.

Also you are ignoring that we play better on the big decks. There is a reason we kept upsetting Freo and WCE at Subi, we like the open spaces. SCG is like a kryptonite for our team, as it doesn't suit our style of play at all.

Thats cool, all teams have grounds they do better and worse on.

Doesn't suit our style of play? Bah. Have you seen the sorts of goals the Swans kick on us up here? How long does it take for you to lose count of the number of times their players take uncontested marks? Often in dangerous parts of the ground. On a small ground should, there should be fewer excuses for this than on a large ground. But we play up here under Hardwick exactly like we did under Wallace. As a clueless rabble.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Doesn't suit our style of play? Bah. Have you seen the sorts of goals the Swans kick on us up here? How long does it take for you to lose count of the number of times their players take uncontested marks? Often in dangerous parts of the ground. On a small ground should, there should be fewer excuses for this than on a large ground. But we play up here under Hardwick exactly like we did under Wallace. As a clueless rabble.

We play a game where the aim is to get the ball into key players in SPACE who rapidly move the ball into the forward line

Subiaco has lots of space. MCG, has lots of space. SCG, has less space than a Dato 120Y

A small ground makes it easier for your mids to flood hard up against your HFL, stop you finding space, and thus making it more difficult to generate run. Swans engineered their game around the ground, as the small ground is tailor made for stoppages. We lack the players to suit a stoppage style of game though (which is why we suck against Ross Lyon at Etihad)

 

[aislegi]

We play a game where the aim is to get the ball into key players in SPACE who rapidly move the ball into the forward line

Subiaco has lots of space. MCG, has lots of space. SCG, has less space than a Dato 120Y

A small ground makes it easier for your mids to flood hard up against your HFL, stop you finding space, and thus making it more difficult to generate run. Swans engineered their game around the ground, as the small ground is tailor made for stoppages. We lack the players to suit a stoppage style of game though (which is why we suck against Ross Lyon at Etihad)

What we lack is the capacity to adapt. When we come to Sydney, we should do to them what they do to us. Park 16 players in their forward 50. Triple and quadruple team anyone they kick it to.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

What we lack is the capacity to adapt. When we come to Sydney, we should do to them what they do to us. Park 16 players in their forward 50. Triple and quadruple team anyone they kick it to.

that kind of defensive teamwork takes years to master, when you do it as a plan b it unravels because you create inadvertant gaps, or allow a man to be isolated and pressured for the turnover.

even an experienced side like freo took a year to get their head around it

 

[aislegi]

that kind of defensive teamwork takes years to master, when you do it as a plan b it unravels because you create inadvertant gaps, or allow a man to be isolated and pressured for the turnover.

even an experienced side like freo took a year to get their head around it

We are poor defenders. Really poor. You can beat Sydney. Collingwood like to set up a neat zone defence. Swans players look bamboozled. Works a treat.

 

[sregit]

I have said for quite some time that Dimmas game plan is rubbish. When Richmond get to the front late in games such as GCS and Bulldogs games, we are unable to hold on as we over commit to holding the ball in our forward line. Geelong, Hawks and Pies play a similar plan but do it way better. They may push numbers forward in games but when there is little time left and they hold a small lead, then they defend and drop players behind the contest. Time and time again Richmond refuse to do this and painfully we end up paying for it.

I am not advocating getting rid of Dimma now. However should this continue and a proven coach such as Bomber Thompson be available at years end, then we should consider the change. No use getting another coach unless we have a plan to snag the best.

Way to early in the season. Let's judge this after about 14 - 16 games. I think our list is ordinary, however, not terrible. Sadly we talked about having the money to recruit top players via free agency and instead of picking up players like Goddard, we picked up players who are very ordinary. They play a role but will not win us a flag. Grigg, Chaplin, Houli etc are just average. Chaplin and Grigg do not hit targets. Houli not great one on one when under pressure. Our list will most likely require a quality boost but not a total rebuild.

I have called for coaches heads for 30 years and will call for Hardwicks also if this does not improve. Why when a coach gets some success they go away from drafting youth and bring in players not good enough to get games at their prior club is beyond me. We have drafted too many recycled players. Richmond should not recruit any more recycled players to the club unless they are top liners. Put faith in the youth.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

We are poor defenders. Really poor. You can beat Sydney. Collingwood like to set up a neat zone defence. Swans players look bamboozled. Works a treat.

Again, it was the Pies normal game plan - they were not reinventing the wheel

If winning at the SCG is a pass mark for you, most clubs get an F

 

[This Is Anfield]

Third best defence in the league, i believe, last year. Just throwing it out there! Better that Hawks & Cats even, just throwing that out there as well!
Some will see that as evidence of improvement since 2010 when we had the 15th (out of 16) best defence or some will see that as evidence that Dimma must go!

 

[aislegi]

Again, it was the Pies normal game plan - they were not reinventing the wheel

If winning at the SCG is a pass mark for you, most clubs get an F

Misleading because a lot of the top clubs, such as Geelong, Hawthorn, and Collingwood, don't play their matches there anymore; they play at Homebush. But it's also not so much about whether we win at the SCG but why we don't win at the SCG. The post above yours is as good an explanation as any of why we are still losing we games we might otherwise win. The problems I see, year-in, year-out, at the SCG are replicated in plenty of other games throughout the season. That's the worry. Every fan should be infuriated when they see the opposition taking uncontested marks, for instance, in dangerous parts of the ground. But no. We have this ludicrous, sanguine, 'oh, well, we were worse a few years ago' sort of attitude. We expect to be crap.

 

[aislegi]

Third best defence in the league, i believe, last year. Just throwing it out there! Better that Hawks & Cats even, just throwing that out there as well!
Some will see that as evidence of improvement since 2010 when we had the 15th (out of 16) best defence or some will see that as evidence that Dimma must go!

This is a dodgy way to measure improvement. This is a bit like showing up to work at midday one day and turning up at 8.30 the next and claiming to have doubled your productivity!

 

[This Is Anfield]

This is a dodgy way to measure improvement. This is a bit like showing up to work at midday one day and turning up at 8.30 the next and claiming to have doubled your productivity!

I know I said I'm not going to reply to you but, WTF!
In fact, hahahahaha! The single most inane, ridiculous, no relevance whatsoever, nonsensical reply EVER!
Extraordinary!

 

[aislegi]

Concentrate. You are comparing Hardwick's results in 2010 (six wins) with his results in 2013 (15 wins) and claiming great improvement. You are not doing something that would be more valid, which would be comparing what someone else (ie. Terry Wallace) did with what Hardwick did. That's what they would do in any other sphere.

 

[This Is Anfield]

Comparing Hardwick's results in 2010 (six wins) with his results in 2013 (15 wins) and claiming great improvement.
What else could it be? Going backwards, no, treading water, no,
And guess what, 2009 15th out of 16 defensively! Even 2008 when we finished 9th we were 11th out of 16!