Discussion Prison Bars debate

Should Port be allowed to wear the PBs as their home jumper?


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caloschwaby

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Why don't Collingwood have to honour that agreement?
Should we really hold what would have been essentially banter probably intended to poke fun at Port Adelaide to the same standard as a legally-binding contract that outlines the conditions of said teams' entry in to the AFL?
 

El_Scorcho

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Should we really hold what would have been essentially banter probably intended to poke fun at Port Adelaide to the same standard as a legally-binding contract that outlines the conditions of said teams' entry in to the AFL?
Should Collingwood have a say in this matter at all?

It's nothing to do with them and everything to do with Port.
 

caloschwaby

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This whole PB debate takes a left hand turn from constructive debate when we begin to forget what either side is asserting.

Like Bomberclifford said, many Port fans aren't arguing for full-time PB's and to wear it for their 150th year is fair enough to me personally (obviously a clash vs Collingwood but everyone knows that).
That being said, many other Port fans are indeed arguing for full-time PB's and those of this group get amalgamated with those of the other group and then we don't even know what we're debating.

Do I think Port have the right to celebrate their history with the PB's for their 150th anniversary? Certainly.
A move to full-time PB's? Probably something the AFL would reject based on the overall aesthetic and branding of the league.
 

caloschwaby

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Should Collingwood have a say in this matter at all?

It's nothing to do with them and everything to do with Port.
I'm not talking about Port's anniversary celebration, I'm talking about the reference to the Collingwood CEO's proposal as being more legitimate/enforceable than a legally-binding contract.
 

El_Scorcho

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Soccer is a different case altogether. 95% of the world would know these teams and their colours, compared to 0.002% of the world who might know an AFL club. Soccer couldn't care less if the other 5 percent was confused by two teams with the same colours, but for the AFL, every knew fan counts and matters.
Have you heard of global brands like the Chicago Bulls/Miami Heat/Portland Trailblazers/Toronto Raptors, or Buffalo Bills/New York Giants or Detroit Pistons/LA Clippers or Toronto Maple Leafs/Tampa Bay Lightning

People will manage. The guernseys are quite distinct from front and back.
 

TY24

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I know it's a bit of a ****-take, but they're literally different coloured guernseys.
Same base colour, different accent with the exact same design vs same coloured guernseys with a completely different design

Both might create a little confusion but nothing significant.

The argument that the guernseys look too similar is a cop out IMO.


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El_Scorcho

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This whole PB debate takes a left hand turn from constructive debate when we begin to forget what either side is asserting.

Like Bomberclifford said, many Port fans aren't arguing for full-time PB's and to wear it for their 150th year is fair enough to me personally (obviously a clash vs Collingwood but everyone knows that).
That being said, many other Port fans are indeed arguing for full-time PB's and those of this group get amalgamated with those of the other group and then we don't even know what we're debating.

Do I think Port have the right to celebrate their history with the PB's for their 150th anniversary? Certainly.
A move to full-time PB's? Probably something the AFL would reject based on the overall aesthetic and branding of the league.
Port Adelaide supporters simply want the right to wear the home guernsey of their choice. A design that is unique and special to the club and not used by any other club in the league. No more no less.

Can you name another major professional sporting club that is banned from wearing it's preferred home uniform?
 

caloschwaby

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Can you name another major professional sporting club that is banned from wearing it's preferred home uniform?
The AFL has adopted far too much from other leagues at this point, so why not.

I've had a think about this over the afternoon and realised we're really just arguing over the right for teams to wear a particular arrangement of colours on pieces of cloth and that perspective has me wondering why myself and any of us bother with this stuff at all.
 

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El_Scorcho

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The AFL has adopted far too much from other leagues at this point, so why not.

I've had a think about this over the afternoon and realised we're really just arguing over the right for teams to wear a particular arrangement of colours on pieces of cloth and that perspective has me wondering why myself and any of us bother with this stuff at all.
I'm an admirer of Collingwood and there is certainly no intention to ruin anything for them, and I don't believe for a second we'd be doing that.

We just want to wear our guernsey.
 

Zer0

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There's a pretty simple solution staring everyone in the face.

Compromise, and have a PB guernsey, but instead of white, use teal.

Then change the teal back to white to commemorate 45 years since black & white television in Australia.

Loopholed
 

El_Scorcho

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I'm not talking about Port's anniversary celebration, I'm talking about the reference to the Collingwood CEO's proposal as being more legitimate/enforceable than a legally-binding contract.
Can anyone show me the wording of that legally binding contract?

We were required to change our name and colours to join the league, but i'd love to see what the licence agreement actually states. Does it state that we must abandon the prison bars, never to be worn again? Does it mandate teal? Because our current away kit has no teal in the guernsey. Does it mandate that we not wear black and white without another colour?

Or, far more likely, does it simply state that our uniform design will be subject to league approval, as it is with every club?

The AFL have the power to let us wear the Prison Bars every home game from next week if they want. That would be my preference. I know BomberClifford said earlier that not all Port supporters are pushing for the Prison Bars as a full time home guernsey, but what we are all pushing for is the right to wear our most famous and important guernsey at our leisure and without having to beg for it.

Are people aware that we were denied the right to wear the Prison Bars as a once off in 2014, the 100th anniversary of our undefeated, Champions of Australia 1914 season? The AFL then allowed us last minute to wear the guernsey for the Elimination Final because Richmond didn't have an adequate clash kit. Would that sort of bulls*** happen to any other club? Would that sort of bulls*** happen in any other major professional sports league?
 

TY24

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Can anyone show me the wording of that legally binding contract?

We were required to change our name and colours to join the league, but i'd love to see what the licence agreement actually states. Does it state that we must abandon the prison bars, never to be worn again? Does it mandate teal? Because our current away kit has no teal in the guernsey. Does it mandate that we not wear black and white without another colour?

Or, far more likely, does it simply state that our uniform design will be subject to league approval, as it is with every club?

The AFL have the power to let us wear the Prison Bars every home game from next week if they want. That would be my preference. I know BomberClifford said earlier that not all Port supporters are pushing for the Prison Bars as a full time home guernsey, but what we are all pushing for is the right to wear our most famous and important guernsey at our leisure and without having to beg for it.

Are people aware that we were denied the right to wear the Prison Bars as a once off in 2014, the 100th anniversary of our undefeated, Champions of Australia 1914 season? The AFL then allowed us last minute to wear the guernsey for the Elimination Final because Richmond didn't have an adequate clash kit. Would that sort of bulls*** happen to any other club? Would that sort of bulls*** happen in any other major professional sports league?
Reminds me of all the times we were forced to wear our away strip at home against Carlton because there’s a different set of rules for big 4 clubs.


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Spanna_

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This thread is fantastic. Collingwood supporters don't understand the concept that football clubs with history and culture do exist outside of Victoria, it's not some kind of myth. Port should be able to wear the PBs without a doubt- when I think of the Port Adelaide Football Club who dominated the SANFL for decades the prison bar jumper is the ultimate symbol of that period of extensive success.
 

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Should we really hold what would have been essentially banter probably intended to poke fun at Port Adelaide to the same standard as a legally-binding contract that outlines the conditions of said teams' entry in to the AFL?
I’ve seen more evidence of an agreement from the Collingwood CEO to allow Port to wear their traditional attire (regardless of if it was a rib, that’d be like betting someone $20 they cant do 20 push-ups, they do 20 push-ups and you’re like... oh nah I don’t have $20 sorry) than Port signing a contract that they must not wear the bars in the AFL ever.

What’s more likely is the AFL (rightfully) told Port they couldn’t be the Magpies so Port were like “oh okay yeah cool” and built a rebrand around that during a period where certain clubs forgot the value of their traditional guernsey because gotta make money off the kiddies, hence teal and lightning bolts.
 

FPPF

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Could argue that the PB may infringe on Collingwood's black/white stripe brand and may suffer financial loss as a result?
How so, are you Collingwood supporters going to get confused and buy Port Adelaide merchandise instead?
Are your sponsors going to get confused and send their sponsorship cheques to Alberton instead?
 

RossFC

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How so, are you Collingwood supporters going to get confused and buy Port Adelaide merchandise instead?
Are your sponsors going to get confused and send their sponsorship cheques to Alberton instead?
I'm gonna go buy a flight to Melbourne, buy a ticket to Collingwood vs Carlton at the MCG, show up, and say "wtf, Where is Port Adelaide?"
 

hansie

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I support port wearing the bars at home. Naturally they may need to concede against Collingwood.

As a swans supporter I have no problem with port rolling out in the bars at the scg.

I know Collingwood supporters that agree on this

What is preventing others from being so reasonable? Eddie can EAD


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Bwillow11

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Have you heard of global brands like the Chicago Bulls/Miami Heat/Portland Trailblazers/Toronto Raptors
Where the hell is the similarity??

Buffalo Bills/New York Giants
If you say so.

Detroit Pistons/LA Clippers
Ok then, kind of similar. But it literally says the name of the team on the shirt. How can people get that confused??

Toronto Maple Leafs/Tampa Bay Lightning
Their logos are on the front of the shirt. You've got to be kidding me if you find these too similar to each other. What a joke.
 

El_Scorcho

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Where the hell is the similarity??


If you say so.


Ok then, kind of similar. But it literally says the name of the team on the shirt. How can people get that confused??


Their logos are on the front of the shirt. You've got to be kidding me if you find these too similar to each other. What a joke.
The Port prison bars and Collingwood stripes designs, front and back, are significantly more different than the Clippers and Pistons, or Maple Leafs and Lightning.

It's quite a significantly different design. Even the vertical stripes element they share are very different widths and looks
 
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