Expansion Proposals for a Truly National AFL

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Tonatopia

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Sep 30, 2018
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AFL Club
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-------------PROPOSAL FOR A TRULY INTER/NATIONAL FOOTY LEAGUE--------------
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This thread is dedicated to the exploration of how the Free Market and Consensus Governance, can be applied to Australian Football to help it grow, become more dynamic and accessible to all Australians and potentially the world.

The AFL's revenue is $793M (pre covid), yet, they only distribute $314M to the clubs???
Where is all the money going?


The Divisional model proposed is inspired by the European Soccer model, rather than the American NFL fixed license system.

In regard to the hypothetical team table below, I have not included SANFL or WAFL teams, as those leagues are operating well, however, if say a Norwood or a Subiaco FC ect., can demonstrate sustainability as a participant, then they are welcome to enter the league from the lowest division, pending 51% consensus from participating clubs. This applies to any international or domestic club.

Details regarding the Constitution, Governance, Player Transfers & Distribution Rights are mentioned below the Divisional Tables;

The 12 side per division model, attempts to blur the line between the DIV1 and DIV2 to maintain audiences and revenue, whilst also appealing to our traditional formula of 12 teams, 22 rounds, where each side plays each other twice. 12 teams per division would also ensure closer contested games, as the gap between 1st and 12th is less than 1st and 18th, and eliminate ‘dead rubbers’.

12 teams per division would also spread spread premiership success with a team winning a premiership on average every 12 years, compared with the current of 1 premiership every 18 years. The battle for relegation, would also be seriously dramatic, enthralling supporters no matter where they sit on the ladder, resulting in increased audiences, sponsorship and revenues.

There is the option of 18 teams and 3 divisions, however, there is something more elegant, pure and intense about 12 teams per division, and keeps Div2 intrinsically connected to Div1.
Div. 3&4 stretches out to a maximum cap of 23 teams per division, allowing for domestic and international growth.

Based on predicted future strength of the clubs (real & hypothetical), the divisional table below could represent what the league table could look like in 2050;

Hypothetic League Table 2050
Div. 1
12 teams, 1 Premier, 5 finalists, 2 relegation

Richmond Tigers
Essendon Bombers
Adelaide Crows
West Coast Eagles
Collingwood Magpies
Sydney Swans
Carlton Blues
Brisbane Lions
Melbourne Demons
Fremantle Dockers
Geelong Cats
* Los Angeles - Privateer


Div. 2
12 teams, 1 Premier, 5 finalists, 2 relegation, 2 promotion

Hobart Pirates
Western Bulldogs
St Kilda Saints
Canberra Federals
GWS Giants
*Las Vegas - Privateer
* London FC - Privateer
Perth Utd
Port Adelaide Power
Hawthorn Hawks
Gold Coast Suns
*Ireland Fighters - AFL Sponsored

Div. 3
12 teams, 1 Premier, 5 finalists, 4 relegation, 2 promotion

Darwin Crocs
* 3rd USA Team - Privateer
North Tasmania Devils - Launceston
Cairns Reefers - Privateer
North Melbourne Kangaroos
Bendigo Pioneers - Essendon Reserves
Fitzroy FC
Ballarat Utd - Collingwood Reserves
* Tokyo - Privateer
* Auckland - Privateer
Sunshine Coast - Brisbane Reserves
* Toronto - Privateer

Div. 4
23 teams, 1 Premier, 8 finalists, 0 relegation, 4 promotion

Southport Sharks
Alice Springs All Stars - NIAA Gov Funded
Albury Wodonga
Gippsland Power - Melbourne Reserves - Traralgon
Northern Rivers - GC Reserves - Lismore
Werribee Tigers - Richmond Reserves
* Cape Town - Privateer
Aspley Hornets
* Port Moresby - Privateer
Shepparton Utd - Carlton Reserves
Wagga Wagga - Canberra Reserves
Port Melbourne Boroughs
Bayside Dolphins - StKilda Reserves - Frankston Oval
Central Coast - Sydney Reserves - Newcastle/Gosford
* Vancouver - Privateer
Wollongong - GWS Reserves
Bunbury - Fremantle Reserves
* Fiji - Suva - FNPF funded
* Wellington NZ - Privateer
Geraldton Dingoes - WCE reserves
Warrnambool - Geelong Reserves
Horsham - Bulldogs Reserves
Mildura Murrays
nb. The teams listed are suggestions ONLY.
nbb. If further expansion continues, then Div3 grows to 23 teams, with the remainder in Div4.

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Mapping of the Game

*Image below indicates hypothetical team bases by 2050
world.png


*Image below indicates hypothetical domestic team bases by 2025
Australia.png


*Image below represents teams in South East Australia
SE Australia.png


*Image below represents teams on the NSW/QLD border
SE QLD.png

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The Code shall be underpinned by a Football Constitution.
- The laws of the game would be enshrined in a national trust, with rule changes only to be amended by 75% consensus of participating clubs.
- Two Clubs to be promoted and/or relegated from each division.
- No Draft, Players will choose who they wish to play for.
- No Salary Cap.
- Player/Club Transfer Fees are encouraged, and act as a key factor in supporting junior football development, providing joiner and revenue streams for feeder clubs.
- Final 5, series. Offering a distinct advantage to top spot.
- Unlimited Player List Sizes.
- Richer clubs may choose to field a stand alone reserves side and even junior development squads, but there is no rules on reserves players, who they play for or where supplementary players can be sourced from.
- All clubs are responsible for their own revenue and welfare. Financial dispensation is dependent on 51%club consensus.
- Season Fixture and broadcast rights to be negotiated via the clubs, broadcasters and ground representatives, based on 51% consensus of clubs (per division).
- The AFL Administrators to hold the chair of Governance and act as administrators and facilitators of the league.

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Governance via weighted democratic consensus.

Strategic Decision Making concerning the League as a whole, is to be conducted via democratic consensus, with club votes weighted in favor of divisional strength, to prevent unfair financial redistribution.

- The AFL Administration is structured as a corporation, and acts as the Chairman of the board, and is NOT allocated voting rights.
- The Participating Clubs are all allocate voting rights, weighted as per the table below;

Voting Rights for Entire League Decisions
AFL - 0 Votes
DIV 1 Clubs - 64 votes per club (total of 768 votes or 74% of total votes)
DIV 2 Clubs - 16 votes per club (total of 192 votes or 19% of total votes)
DIV 3 Clubs - 4 votes per club (max total of 48 votes or 5% of total votes) or 2 votes per club if Div3 expands to 23 teams
DIV 4 Clubs - 1 vote per club (max total of 23 votes or 2% of total votes)

TOTAL OF 1031 votes

Under this method, it would take only 9 x Div1 clubs to gain a majority vote of the league, and 8 x Div1 clubs + 1 x Div3 club to gain majority.

1626146794694.png



Divisional specific decisions such as scheduling, are conducted with each divisional club entitled one vote per division, with the AFL Chair acting as the deciding vote if required.
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BROADCAST RIGHTS & ATTENDANCE ESTIMATES for the year 2025

In an open free market, Enormous energy would be injected into the game. Elite players would be attracting $15M transfer fees and annual salaries of approx. $5M p/a transforming them into mainstream celebrities. Add the inclusion of privateer clubs and flamboyant billionaire owners and the drama of promotion & relegation, with all major football cities/regions in Australia involved, one would expect broadcast rights to increase in value.

Broadcast Revenue and attendance estimates are based on;
- A pattern of historical revenue growth of about 40% over 5 years
- Increase of games from 207 to 570 (excluding pre-season)
- Exclusive DIV2 Thursday, Sunday & Monday night football
- Exclusive DIV2 Later Friday & Saturday night Football (start at 8:30pm EST), with DIV1 Fri & Sat starting at 7:15pm, creating carry on viewing, albeit, a channel switch.
- Night Grand Final and Finals campaign of Div3/4 would attract a Considerable National Audience
- Div3/4 DIV3/4 broadcast revenue would be underpinned by area specific TV and radio advertising.

Increased energy in the game due to;
- Open Free Market system
- No-restriction on player movement, where transfer fees could reach $15M per superstar
- Genuine Sports Celebrity Superstars with elite player payments to reach $5M p/a.
- Increase of games and teams from 18 to about 50, with the inclusion of most football cities and regions in Australia
- The probable entry of the Billionaire business class, as buyers of private teams.
- Injection of Promotion/Relegation into the League
- Possible expansion into International Markets and Global Exposure

The Distribution of Broadcast Rights falls under democratic governance, and the following suggestions could be made and agreed to by the National League of Clubs, for example;

DIV1 broadcast rights (approx $446M p/a)
- 75% ($334M) gets distributed to the 12 x Div1 clubs = $28M each. Currently they are getting about $17M each.
- 25% ($111M) gets distributed amongst the remainder 36 Clubs = $3M each

DIV2 Broadcast rights (approx $233M p/a)
- 75% ($175M) gets distributed to 12 x Div2 clubs = $15M ($18M total each). Currently each AFL team gets about $17M each.
- 25% ($58M) gets distributed to 24 x Div3/4 clubs = $2.4M each.

DIV3 Broadcast rights (approx $25M p/a)
- 75% ($18M) gets distributed to 12 x Div2 clubs = $1.5M ($7M total each). Currently each AFL team gets about $17M each.
- 25% ($6M) gets distributed to 12 x Div4 clubs = $500K each.

DIV4 Broadcast rights (approx $5M p/a)
- 100% gets distributed to 12 x Div4 clubs = $400K ($6M total each). Currently each AFL team gets about $17M each.

Example Distribution of broadcast revenue
DIV1 clubs - $28M each - compared to now $17M each
DIV2 clubs - $18M each
DIV3 clubs - $7M each
DIV4 clubs - $6M each

OR

Each game could be auctioned to the open market of broadcasters, with revenue going directly to the participating clubs, pending consensus from the 12 clubs per division in relation to fixture scheduling.

Expected avg. club revenue from Broadcast Rights without League equalization;
DIV1 clubs - $37M each - compared to now $17M each
DIV2 clubs - $19.5M each
DIV3 clubs - $2.1M each
DIV4 clubs - $380k each

By 2050, international privateer teams would be incorporated, and based purely on the quality and entertainment value of our product, there is no reason why Australian Rules Football can’t capture a global audience, global corporate sponsorship and globally revenue.

The laws of capitalism shows us that in an unrestrained free market, it is usually the best product that rise to supremacy. Our game is the most dynamic and all encompassing full contact football code in the world, and it is only the restrictive fixed license structure of the AFL which is holding us back. We must open our league to not only the Australian market, but the global market, for it is only a matter of time, if allowed, that a privateer enters a footy team in London, Japan, NZ or the USA.


The estimated table below is for the year 2025, detailing expected broadcast and gate attendances revenue (which absorbs membership revenue).
1623814890123.png

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GRASS ROOTS DEVELOPMENT & PLAYER TRANSFER FEES

The health, development and growth of junior football would be better served, if player transfer fees were approved by the AFL.
For example, in the absence of a draft, AFL clubs of all Divisions, would have to either;
1. Create their own junior teams and develop players 'inhouse' for recruitment
2. Align with other feeder clubs, which would help foster recruitment, in a mutually beneficial two-way relationship, strengthening the junior development leagues.
3. Buy contracted players from Other clubs, which would involve club transfer fees, thus, Dispersing funds from the AFL to the grassroots clubs.
4. Players not contracted may join an AFL club of their choice, without transfer fee.

As there is no draft, it is in an AFL clubs best interests to help develop the promote football at a junior level, and create pathways for recruitment to their own clubs. This would create joiner between the AFL clubs and the junior leagues, fostering co-operation, collaboration, resilience and growth.

For example;
1. St Kilda FC aligns themselves with Junior Football Clubs along the Bayside corridor, offering their senior players to host junior training and so on. St Kilda FC, subsequently invite the best junior footballers to participate in their U16 & U18 squads, which then play in an elite Melb Metro junior league.
Remember, players have free choice, so even if a player is within the StKilda zone, but he loves MFC, then if good enough, he would most likley ask to join MFC U16/18 squad, however, if the junior football clubs have contracted that junior player (which would become standard), then the MFC would have to offer the Junior Football Club a transfer fee, which is negotiated under free market principles.

2. Shepparton FC is playing DIV4 in the National Comp, and has been developing a local kid called Clayton Oliver. Oliver starts playing seniors as a 16 year old, and quickly stamps himself as a potential future star of the entire National Competition. Offers start to come in for Oliver to join one of the Superclubs, but in the interests of Olivers development, his family and Shepparton FC convince him to hone his craft in Div4, and try to help his home club Shepparton rise up the ladder.
So Shepparton sign him up for $800k/5 year contract until he is 22years old, with the condition that he does promotion work for a the main club sponsor. He is a local star and hero and help Shepparton win a DIV4 premiership and rise to Div3. Broadcasters are now bidding for the rights to televise his games. Just like Rowan (GC), the audience are tuning in just to watch a young local star. The auctioning of these broadcast rights go directly into the coffers of the participating clubs which further enhances the importance of the junior development pathway, which led to this windfall.
At the end of the 5yr contract, he is arguably ready to become one of the best players in the entire country, so clubs start laying down massive offers. West Coast offer $20M/5 year contract with a $15M transfer fee to Shepparton. All parties are happy, and he leaves.
Shepparton then uses $15M to better resource their club, junior development and entertainment complex to further build their business, in an attempt to sustain Div3 and potentially rise to Div2, where the big TV broadcast rights start to happen.
This is how I see the free market working in football.

In contrast to our current system.
1. Elite junior player is told that he is good enough to be drafted, but the only way in Vic, is to leave his junior club and join a stale and cultureless TAC U18 club competition.
2. Player enters draft and is told which club he is to play for, without his say, and on the terms of the AFL.
3. Junior clubs get raped, and the AFL creates a wall of division between AFL clubs and Vic junior clubs.

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International Opportunity

The snip below shows significant attendances at international exhibition games of Footy.
1625204203982.png

1625184989355.png


Based on the quality of our game, with a highlights reel second to none, our game has the opportunity to spread around the world as the greatest full-contact football code on earth. However, we must have a structure which allows overseas privateer teams to enter our league, in a manner which allows potential teams to grow and compete in a sustainable manner, and only an open divisional structure can make this vision possible.

Example 1.
The Irish have played a big part in our game and the synergy with Gaelic Football is highlighted by the traditional international rules series.

Again, let's say via club consensus, that the AFL earmark $10M p/a for 5 years to fund a Div4 entry from Ireland, called, Ireland Fighters, playing out of Dublin.

The local Irish Gaelic competition would unwillingly provide a bulk of the players for the new team, supplemented with some established AFL players.
As the Gaelic League is amateur, many of the premium talent would switch codes to the new lucrative offering, strengthening the team, and attracting considerable local attention, both positive and negative. As a result, audience and attendances are strong from the outset, even from their inception at Div4 level.

The Ireland Fighters quickly excel, and win the Div4 Premiership in their second season, get promoted and quickly progress to Div3 finals, where support and interest accelerates. They win the Div3 premiership and launch into the bigtime in Div2, hosting home games against say club's like Stkilda, Collingwood & Carlton (as it stands) and playing away games in Aus. coinciding with primetime viewing in the pubs in Ireland.

The fighting Irish are called the Ireland Fighters for a reason, and within 10 years in the AFL competition, they win a Div2 premiership, and backed by hundreds of thousands of local Irish aswell as tens of thousands of international expats, the Ireland Fighters make their entry to Div1 as a potential superclub.

all while, the folk in London who are well familiar with Footy, look on with admiration and interest, and plans are drawn up to fund a new London entry to join the competition.

Example 2;
Let's say extraordinarily, that Melbourne born Chris Hemsworth, decides to float a footy club in LA called the Los Angeles Stars, with a long-term strategic plan to get them playing AFL Div1 in 20 years. Obviously, a Div1 team from LA would add an extra dimension to our revenue stream and potentially create enormous international exposure, and really kickstart the game in the USA.

The LA Stars do a home ground deal with LA Colleseum and allocates an annual $15M budget to the enterprise.
$750k p.a travel budget (4week trips to Aus) and $8M annual player payments and local player development. 50% expenditure is covered by commercial/ DFAT sponsorship and broadcast rights, with a longterm vision toward Div1/2 broadcast revenue and 10 year plan toward profitability.

Twilight games are scheduled in LA, giving us live viewing in Vic at 10:30am Sunday morning. Of course we tune in, because of the huge ramifications of a successful US based team.

Many older champions like say Dustin Martin, Buddy Franklin, Eddie Betts, Nathan Jones, Kade Simpson, Heath Shaw ect, are drawn to LA, along with a very well paid 28 man squad, and a sprinkling of local US talent which grows in quality and size as the team moves forward.

Hyperthetically, based on the player payment budget, the LA Stars win the Div4 Premiership in their third season, still with little interest in LA, but plenty of interest and industry support in Australia.

Into their fourth season (now in Div3), they are starting to build a quality field of local US athletes, and there is no shortage of quality Aussie players willing to give life a go in LA, rubbing shoulders with Hemsworth and A list Hollywood celebrities which have been attracted to our ancient indigenous football spectacle.

After their 7th season, the LA Stars win the Div3 premiership, and are promoted to Div2 where they are now on the big stage. The local player development program is working, with US players sized like LeBron James providing a freakish highlights reel. The local audience starts tuning in and attending games. It's Game On!!!!!!

The hypothetical success of LA Stars would invite interest for other US and Canadian private teams.

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Possible Rules Changes
1. In order to speed up the game and make it more dynamic, maybe (just like the VFA did in 1938), we could allow players to throw the ball, which would attract Rugby and Gridiron participants.
2. Reduce the length of the field by 10m and on field players to 16, with international grass roots player development encompassing 9 players per side on soccer/rugby sized pitches.
3. Create player substitution rule (similar to soccer). Once subbed off, the player can not re-enter the game. 5 players on the bench. This rule would stimulate the requirement for Power Based athletes, more so than the 5 minute endurance runner.

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Summary

History shows us that the free market is the most resilient and effective method of sustained growth, contingent to the quality of the product.
And arguably, Aussie rules is the most dynamic, interesting and most stimulating football code in the world. Our highlight reel is second to none. Our product is that good, that the free market alone, will drive it to become globally successful. All we need is a model which allows organic growth into not only all regions of Australia, but eventually the world.

An open divisional structure offers the organic scope for growth and regional representation that an engineered system can not deliver as effectively.

Is it time to look for a new model, based on Western Cultural Principles, so 'Footy' can truly reach its potential?
 

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Messenger

No, I’m just disappointed
Jun 16, 2007
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Yeah, nah.

There isn’t enough money in the football economy to support the top half dozen clubs accumulating the lion share of the financial wealth and the majority of the player talent.

Your lower end of the top tier and lower divisions aren’t going to end up being the Southern Hemisphere version of West Brom, Norwich or Rochdale. They’ll go broke and right quick. What is the revenue source for the lower tiers?

This will make the professional league smaller and the rest a glorified suburban competition. There’s no casual fans and overseas market for that. The fans of the teams you lose are lost.
 

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Tonatopia

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Your lower end of the top tier and lower divisions aren’t going to end up being the Southern Hemisphere version of West Brom, Norwich or Rochdale. What is the revenue source for the lower tiers?
Firstly, each team will enter via their own capacity. The team's listed are just an example. I'd suggest that a few teams may be driven to success by private/ corporate ownership, but at the end of the day, the free market will dictate proceedings, not AFL engineering.

Obviously broadcast rights, sponsorship and gate takings will be the major revenue sources. But the main concept was to breed loyalty back into the game by allowing kids to support and play for their 'local' club.

Also, it is arrogant to think we can just introduce a Tasmanian team, as Hobart has 250k people and could support a strong team on their own.

Imagine a Wayne Carey strutting around at Wagga or Johnathan Brown at Warrnambool. Those types of players are capable of bringing a side to Div2, and packing in home crowds.

If you look at Port Lincoln, it is the richest place per capita in Oz.
Werribee will be nestled in a hub of $300k people and is uniquely local.
Indigenous players will stay at Alice Springs, and I'm sure those broadcast rights would be worth a bit.
Mildura has a massive agri community, as does the other regional club's.
Regional WA has massive mining companies that would get onboard.

Port Melbourne and Williamstown just keep on keeping on and may be used as reserves affiliates.

I'll layout my proposition for 'freemarket equalisation' as we go forward with this thread.
 
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NoobPie

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Yeah, nah.

There isn’t enough money in the football economy to support the top half dozen clubs accumulating the lion share of the financial wealth and the majority of the player talent.

Your lower end of the top tier and lower divisions aren’t going to end up being the Southern Hemisphere version of West Brom, Norwich or Rochdale. They’ll go broke and right quick. What is the revenue source for the lower tiers?

This will make the professional league smaller and the rest a glorified suburban competition. There’s no casual fans and overseas market for that. The fans of the teams you lose are lost.

The thing is, there is no real casual fans and overseas market for much outside of the top 6 in the premier league. The reason you have pro rel in english soccer in the first place is because it evolved into that overtime as more teams joined the Football league than could play in one division and eventually (not until the 20th century) it developed into a purely merit based pro rel. A lot of this had to do with 1) the much smaller distances in the UK 2) private ownership of clubs 3) soccer's low scoring which allows for greater disparity between teams.

There is no such culture in Australian football. The game evolved in to "closed" city leagues and regional leagues and was destined not to have pro/rel pretty much back in 1897 when the original VFL split happened.

People in Warrnambool don't want to watch some made up Warrnambool team in some contrived division 3 playing fcking Geraldton 5000K and probably 3 flights away and the absurd costs involved. People in Warnambool want to watch whoever they follow in the Hampden League and/or whichever AFL club they follow.
 

Tonatopia

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The thing is, there is no real casual fans and overseas market for much outside of the top 6 in the premier league. The reason you have pro rel in english soccer in the first place is because it evolved into that overtime as more teams joined the Football league than could play in one division and eventually (not until the 20th century) it developed into a purely merit based pro rel. A lot of this had to do with 1) the much smaller distances in the UK 2) private ownership of clubs 3) soccer's low scoring which allows for greater disparity between teams.

There is no such culture in Australian football. The game evolved in to "closed" city leagues and regional leagues and was destined not to have pro/rel pretty much back in 1897 when the original VFL split happened.

People in Warrnambool don't want to watch some made up Warrnambool team in some contrived division 3 playing fcking Geraldton 5000K and probably 3 flights away and the absurd costs involved. People in Warnambool want to watch whoever they follow in the Hampden League and/or whichever AFL club they follow.
The VAFA divisional league is the most stable and Powerful in Victoria. Pro/Rel is deeply rooted in our game, and the fixed licenses are the contrived versions.

Plus, AFL players are playing at a fraction of the price of top tier soccer players.

Geraldton and Warrnambool are rich areas, with a base population pool of around 50kand growing and could make good Div4 club's.
 
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NoobPie

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Sorry mate, you've got it wrong.
The VAFA divisional league is the most stable and Powerful in Victoria. Pro/Rel is deeply rooted in our game, and the fixed licenses are the contrived versions.
Pro rel pretty much only exists in amateur competitions and semi pro suburban comps. It is not "deeply rooted in out game" at all.



Plus, AFL players are playing at a fraction of the price of top tier soccer players.

What? What point are you trying to make????

The AFL is far richer than any domestic competition in any country that is not more than twice our size on the planet. Thankfully only 28% of revenues go to players salaries.

This is a good thing.

Geraldton and Warrnambool are rich areas, with a base population pool of around 50kand growing.
Again, what point are you trying to make? You have some vague concepts in your head that are just not an argument for anything
 

Tonatopia

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Again, what point are you trying to make? You have some vague concepts in your head that are just not an argument for anything
You sound like a TV supporter. Probably never played.

In reality, suburban footy stems from divisional competitions, and is where we draw a bulk of our players from. It's in our footy DNA. Country footy is usually well attended, and is the main drawcard in regional cities. Imagine if big regional cities could unite behind 1 team, and potentially ride it to Div1. It's is the hope and opportunity that is the main driver.
 
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Engimal v3

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Sep 21, 2017
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While I'm enthusiastic about my home state of Tasmania, I have doubts that both a Launceston and Hobart team would be stronger off-field than North Melbourne.

Even more unbelievable is that Devonport would be at roughly a similar strength to an already established AFL club. I mean, North Melbourne's current membership figure is almost double the population of Devonport lol

People argue enough around the viability of 1 professional Tasmanian club, and you want to split the state into 3.
 

Tonatopia

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While I'm enthusiastic about my home state of Tasmania, I have doubts that both a Launceston and Hobart team would be stronger off-field than North Melbourne.

Even more unbelievable is that Devonport would be at roughly a similar strength to an already established AFL club. I mean, North Melbourne's current membership figure is almost double the population of Devonport lol

People argue enough around the viability of 1 professional Tasmanian club, and you want to split the state into 3.
Hobart is bigger than Geelong in population with a deep football pedigree.

Launceston region has approximately 150,000 people and is over 2 hours drive from Hobart with its own AFL stadium. It ticks the boxes.

Devonport has an beautiful AFL ground with 15,000 capacity, and would pull from Burnie and nth west Tasmania to have a supporter base of around 80k. It is also 1 hour drive from Launceston.

I suppose the entire nth Tasmania could be united into 1 team, but having a div3 league, allows regional cities with urban populations of 30k+ to enter, if it can be financed locally. If not, then all aboard Launceston and maybe a few games in Devenport.

NB. Your comments are noted.
 

Dirty Bird

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Wont work.

If you keep the salary caps to the size of the teams in each division, the gap between 2nd and 1st tier would be too large that the teams would just go 1 and done
And if you try and manipulate the salary caps so there isn't that much of a gap. The teams in the 2nd division wouldnt have the income to even fulfil the cap. Causing the same issue.

Dont get me wrong
Promotion/relegationw orks very well in the right situation.
But the top flight of AFL? It'll never work.
 

Tonatopia

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Wont work.

If you keep the salary caps to the size of the teams in each division, the gap between 2nd and 1st tier would be too large that the teams would just go 1 and done
And if you try and manipulate the salary caps so there isn't that much of a gap. The teams in the 2nd division wouldnt have the income to even fulfil the cap. Causing the same issue.

Dont get me wrong
Promotion/relegationw orks very well in the right situation.
But the top flight of AFL? It'll never work.
Ever heard of the moneyball theory?
It does work, and has worked.

In saying that, because list sizes are not fixed, you may have club's with 60+ players on their lists and small club's with as low as 25 contracted players.

Money helps win games, but is not always the case.
Player loyalty to geographic regions is key, along with regional player development and sponsorships.

I'm sure the city council would also see the great opportunity's presented, and earmark some funds towards stadium development.
 
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NoobPie

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Looking forward to an away game to 'checks notes' Albany.
The Western outpost derby between Albany and Geraldton would be massive......You could just imagine the thousands of Albanese folks making the 9 hour trip to Geraldton to fill out the away stands of Geraldton's new council paid for 20K stadium
 

Tonatopia

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Melbourne
The Western outpost derby between Albany and Geraldton would be massive......You could just imagine the thousands of Albanese folks making the 9 hour trip to Geraldton to fill out the away stands of Geraldton's new council paid for 20K stadium
Funny, Cripps would have been groomed by Geraldton and Fyfe by Albany. I'm sure the big bucks would be found to match competing offers. But it comes back to loyalty to a region Vs personal opportunity.

Geraldton would attract support from big mining companies all the way up to Broome and beyond.

Albany has a big agricultural community, and of they can afford to field a team, then why stop them. That goes for any district and team. It's not for the AFL to say it can't be done, it's up to the free market.
 

Tonatopia

Team Captain
Sep 30, 2018
482
135
AFL Club
Melbourne
I
Kids still talk about the local derby between Mt Gambier and Warnambool in 199never
In saying that, local kids would be itching to get a game for their local team, such as Warrnambool, and probably be paid about $2-3k for the privelidge. Not to mention the chance to potentially make Div2 and as it stands, play against Club's like Hawthorn or North Melbourne, or even Coolingwood if relegated.

The divisional system provides opportunity for any club who can sustain themselves.

NB. I'm not saying Mt Gambier or Warrnambool ect, are a lock in. Just an option. It's up to the local league to create the opportunity and weigh up whether it is feasible.
 

NoobPie

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 21, 2016
7,320
5,207
AFL Club
Collingwood
Then you just have the same 4 or 5 teams in contention every year and the same teams yo yoing between divisions.

Do not want.

And enormously reckless spending and wastage.

And people increasingly just following one of the dominant clubs rather than "breeding loyalty back into their local team"
 

Tonatopia

Team Captain
Sep 30, 2018
482
135
AFL Club
Melbourne
Then you just have the same 4 or 5 teams in contention every year and the same teams yo yoing between divisions.

Do not want.
Yes, it would be organic. Not contrived.
But there are examples where radical changes will happen. Look at Manchester City.

Look at Collingwood.
Look at Carlton.
Look at Hawthorn.
Look at the Doggies.
 

NoobPie

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 21, 2016
7,320
5,207
AFL Club
Collingwood
Yes, it would be organic. Not contrived.
But there are examples where radical changes will happen. Look at Manchester City.

Look at Collingwood.
Look at Carlton.
Look at Hawthorn.
Look at the Doggies.

What are you on (about)? Look at them for what reason?
 

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