Expansion Propose A Name

[Sebastian Balboa]

Western Sydney Whatevers
Gold Coast Flashies

* had a go but shrugs *

 

[genghiskhan]

True it wouldn't make sense. But i think there would be issues with the name Blacktown.

Yeah. Its a bit of a nothing place. (Population is about 300,000 people though.)

 

[Paddy_Mac]

Yeah. Its a bit of a nothing place. (Population is about 300,000 people though.)

I agree.
I guess the name will have to be West Sydney (Insert Name Here) or Wests (Insert Name Here) or Western (Insert Name Here) if it's not in Parramatta.

 

[Sebastian Balboa]

You need to consider the obstacles that you are working with. Rugby league exists in city and certain prejudices are associated with certain areas due to people's affinity with their rugby league teams. You would need to do some market research in order to ascertain how significant these prejudices are.

Of course, if you see the conversion of rugby league fans as a lost cause, the logical thing to do would be to call it Parramatta (something). Parramatta is near the geographic heart of Sydney and the region has lots of environmental and historical features that could be used to build the clubs image.

Too much risk of a backlash; paranoid/trigger-happy RL Sydney media types would crucify the new club if it were to take the Parramatta name. Parramatta are and will always be assocaited with the Eels.

HOWEVER, having said that, the Western/then Perth Reds didn't seem to upset the footy community in WA, re Perth Football Club, perhaps the Demons being a second-tier club, ie: WAFL, had something to do with that. But that's because we are perhaps less paranoid, less hysterical and more welcoming of others with their foreign, imported English game than what Sydney is of the indigenous game.

 

[Paddy_Mac]

Too much risk of a backlash; paranoid/trigger-happy RL Sydney media types would crucify the new club if it were to take the Parramatta name. Parramatta are and will always be assocaited with the Eels.

HOWEVER, having said that, the Western/then Perth Reds didn't seem to upset the footy community in WA, re Perth Football Club, perhaps the Demons being a second-tier club, ie: WAFL, had something to do with that. But that's because we are perhaps less paranoid, less hysterical and more welcoming of others with their foreign, imported English game than what Sydney is of the indigenous game.

Can't they just live with it. How many teams does Melbourne have. Melbourne Demons, Storm, Victory, Tigers, Vixens. We don't care.

 

[Sebastian Balboa]

Can't they just live with it. How many teams does Melbourne have. Melbourne Demons, Storm, Victory, Tigers, Vixens. We don't care.

Not sure if you've been keeping up with current event, pal, but in Sydney, footy's fair game from insecure, Roy Masters-Phil Rothfield types. Anything, and I mean ANYTHING they and their underlings can leverage against the new club, and the perception of it, they will.

 

[jpdixon]

I agree.
I guess the name will have to be West Sydney (Insert Name Here) or Wests (Insert Name Here) or Western (Insert Name Here) if it's not in Parramatta.

Western is taken, West Sydney is boring, as well as not really appealing to the Hills area. What's wrong with Cumberland? A name with a bit of history, but still mainly a blank sheet ready for the club to stamp its own image.

 

[Musrum]

Or the Wombats.

Wombats would work if they could secure the rights to Fatso as the mascot. Fatso has the runs on the board as far as sport in Sydney is concerned. Would also setup the new team with a very distinct style from the start...

 

[genghiskhan]

Western is taken, West Sydney is boring, as well as not really appealing to the Hills area. What's wrong with Cumberland? A name with a bit of history, but still mainly a blank sheet ready for the club to stamp its own image.

Logically it makes sense, but for some reason it just isn't grabbing me. Cumberland does cover all the regions, but that gives me a bit of a generic feel.

If we liken it to West Coast and Fremantle, West Coast is the more generic and more broad. Fremantle is narrow. For me; however, I prefer Fremantle as it seems to have more of a distinct image. The associations with one area allow an image to be formed. I personally like that much more.

I like Parramatta the most, but I agree that there is the problems with the rugby league associations and it is a bit illogical basing a team in Blacktown and calling it Parramatta.

 

[Professor Knowall]

Out of all the many proposed names I've in these threads here, I like CUmberland the most. However, I'm an outsider to Sydney, so I'm prepared to go with whatever the locals think is best.

 

[jpdixon]

Logically it makes sense, but for some reason it just isn't grabbing me. Cumberland does cover all the regions, but that gives me a bit of a generic feel.

If we liken it to West Coast and Fremantle, West Coast is the more generic and more broad. Fremantle is narrow. For me; however, I prefer Fremantle as it seems to have more of a distinct image. The associations with one area allow an image to be formed. I personally like that much more.

You're right, but I don't think any existing images, based on an area or not, are actually going to work. This club is only going to succeed if it starts from scratch and builds its own image. There is no short-term solution.

 

[gytre]

West Sydney BROWNS. That would be fitting with the changing ethnic mix in the area.

It's more relevant than Pioneers, anyway.

 

[Paddy_Mac]

What's wrong with Cumberland?

I don't know where it is and the name is not appealing to me.

 

[Professor Knowall]

I don't know where it is and the name is not appealing to me.

It doesn't matter that you don't know where it is or that it doesn't appeal to you in Altona. The same applies to me.

What matters is if it's likely to appeal to the potential supporters of West Sydney. Will they identify with that name? If so - I'll support it. If not - look for something else. I'm really more interested in what the Sydney locals think.

 

[genghiskhan]

You're right, but I don't think any existing images, based on an area or not, are actually going to work. This club is only going to succeed if it starts from scratch and builds its own image. There is no short-term solution.

I think existing images do work well. Redfern helps form the image of Souths. Bondi helps form the image of the Roosters. Manly helps form the image of Manly. The Blue Mountains help form the image of Penrith. Belmore helps form the image of the Bulldogs.

Personally, I used to like the Balmain Tigers because I liked the Balmain area. It has a lot of character. I could never get enthused about Wests Tigers. I like the Rabbitohs now because I like Redfern. It has a lot of character.

On the other hand, when Manly merged with Nths and became the Northern Eagles, few people seemed to be happy with the name. Manly fans didn't like it, Norths didn't like it, and opporsition supporters didn't like it either. They hate Manly residents and wanted to transfer their hatred of that region onto the club.

I'm just not sure what the image of Cumberland is. I know you can build an image, but what image would you build?

 

[cos789]

After much thought.


West Sydney Wildcats .

 

[gytre]

I originally said Browns as a bit of a joke, but now I'm starting to think it might be ok. Brown is an under-utilised colour in the AFL and you could combine light brown shades with dark brown and get some nice uniforms.

And here's the Browns mascot. The highly venomous Eastern brown snake.

Which brings me to another proposal I like - the West Sydney Copperheads.

 

[jpdixon]

I think existing images do work well. Redfern helps form the image of Souths. Bondi helps form the image of the Roosters. Manly helps form the image of Manly. The Blue Mountains help form the image of Penrith. Belmore helps form the image of the Bulldogs.

These are all examples of an area being part of a team's identity because the code was well established, the team was based there and grew there. It wasn't there when the team was first formed, and isn't simply about the name. As you say the Dogs are identified more with Belmore than Canterbury or Bankstown. The Swans have become identified to some extent more with Randwick and Bondi than Sydney in general.

On the other hand, when Manly merged with Nths and became the Northern Eagles, few people seemed to be happy with the name. Manly fans didn't like it, Norths didn't like it, and opporsition supporters didn't like it either. They hate Manly residents and wanted to transfer their hatred of that region onto the club.

I'm just not sure what the image of Cumberland is. I know you can build an image, but what image would you build?

With Manly and Norths, we're not simply talking about a team called "Northern Eagles", we're talking about the supression of already existing rivalries and traditions. This is an entirely different situation. A new AFL team is not going to get away with imposing itself on existing images - its own image will have to grow naturally, being formed by the supporters themselves.

Eventually, there probably will be an association with an area with its own identity, but that needs physical presence rather than a name, and at least to start with, no one local identity is going to draw on enough supporters of a new code to get the ball rolling. Even if it is good to have a local link develop organically, using the name to force one is just an easy way to make the wrong choice.

 

[genghiskhan]

These are all examples of an area being part of a team's identity because the code was well established, the team was based there and grew there. It wasn't there when the team was first formed, and isn't simply about the name. As you say the Dogs are identified more with Belmore than Canterbury or Bankstown. The Swans have become identified to some extent more with Randwick and Bondi than Sydney in general.



With Manly and Norths, we're not simply talking about a team called "Northern Eagles", we're talking about the supression of already existing rivalries and traditions. This is an entirely different situation. A new AFL team is not going to get away with imposing itself on existing images - its own image will have to grow naturally, being formed by the supporters themselves.

Eventually, there probably will be an association with an area with its own identity, but that needs physical presence rather than a name, and at least to start with, no one local identity is going to draw on enough supporters of a new code to get the ball rolling. Even if it is good to have a local link develop organically, using the name to force one is just an easy way to make the wrong choice.

I understand what you are saying. You should let the identity develop itself, rather than cultivate it. But let us say you associate the club with Cumberland. What are Cumberland people like? It is easy to say Eastern suburb people are w***ers (usually they are) and northern suburb people are insular and boring (probably true as well) but Cumberland is so broad that it is difficult to find a label to insult them with. You can't call them bogans, or toffs etc. At least with West Sydney you can trade off the westie image. That way, even the people who aren't westies but like westies, can support the club.

Also, the word Cumberland reminds me of Cumbersome.

 

[jpdixon]

Cumberland is so broad that it is difficult to find a label to insult them with. You can't call them bogans, or toffs etc. At least with West Sydney you can trade off the westie image. That way, even the people who aren't westies but like westies, can support the club.

People who aren't westies but like westies? You know anyone like this?

I'd happily label a Cumberland team bogans, but the club would do better without pushing that label itself.

Also, the word Cumberland reminds me of Cumbersome.

Ever since it was suggested to me, it's grown on me, but I did live near Cumberland High School for a few years as a kid, so perhaps I'm more used to the name than some.

 

[genghiskhan]

People who aren't westies but like westies? You know anyone like this?

The late Kerry Packer was one. Most of Australia really. Look on your television and see what kind of people are used in advertisements trying to get you to buy a car, beer, paint or go to McDonalds. It is quite different from other countries where actors and artists are commonly used in commercials. (We had actors and artists during the republican referendum but that failed.)

Westies are like Homer Simpson or the ladies from Kath and Kim. People will laugh at them, or insult them, but deep down only a few people really look down on them. Look at Collingwood as well. It has a bogan image, and a bogan following, but most of Collingwood's fans are not bogans.

As for Cumberland, I guess it makes sense. With time some kind of interesting culture should emerge.

 

[jpdixon]

Westies are like Homer Simpson or the ladies from Kath and Kim. People will laugh at them, or insult them, but deep down only a few people really look down on them. Look at Collingwood as well. It has a bogan image, and a bogan following, but most of Collingwood's fans are not bogans.

Fair call. Not sure it works when you actually promote the label, though. It's a more subconscious thing.