PSD, Rookies, Tom Davidson, Brent Guerra....

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Thread starter #1
My Reckoning leaves the senior list short, with questions still about Barker and Campbell ....

Delisted/Retired/traded

Lekkas
Holland (Veterans List)
Beaumont
Kane
Scott
Nixon
Greene
Hay
Lonie

Drafted/Promoted

Ellis
Dowler
Birchall
Muston
Bailey
Tuck
Young

With Crawf on the veterans list we still have 1 spot left on the list, I reckon we should look at taking a risk on someone like Tom Davidson. To me he is a much better option than Guerra who we are tipped to pick. Personally i would prefer Cam Thurley for a forward flank or pocket role anyway, i reckon Guerra is a bit same old same old and old and we already have two tough nuts who can play his role in Ossie and Brown. Fully fit and with his talent he would add something to the club and bolster key position stocks particularly if JB or RC (Fingers Crossed they don't) break down. Also after the national draft who do you think hawthorn will look to pick up as rookies, can we pluck a rough diamond from somewhere?
 

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Bennycoff

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#2
well Robbie Campbell has proved his knee is ok and has accepted a one yr contract.
I'd be surprised if we didnt pick up Kirkby again on the rookie list.
I'd prefer Cam Thurley or someone like him than Guerra.

How many picks do we have for the next draft?
 
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#4
Back Pocket Rocket said:
Luke McEntee as another developing ruckman. P!$$ Guerra off. For the Rookie Draft we should look at Kirkby again, Rischbieth or someone like an Andrew Lovett (Pick someone from the NT league).

I agree..thats what we need to do..get another young ruckman..guerra should be given a chance...and for kirkby,i new they stuffed up when they delisted him..and were in need for someone like andrew lovett!!that would be perfect!What a way would that be to the end of the year..Fantastic!!
 

mattyc2422

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#5
Re: Guerra, I've said it one and I'll say it again - Clarko knows him better than us.

Wouldn't mind a Kelleher or someone in the rookie draft, bit I think some VFL players are worth looking at.
 

DynamoUltra

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#6
Davidson better than Guerra? Seriously... If I could choose a Collingwood reject or a St. Kilda reject, I'd take a St. Kilda reject - even if it was Nick Stone.

Stone > Davidson
 
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DynamoUltra said:
Davidson better than Guerra? Seriously... If I could choose a Collingwood reject or a St. Kilda reject, I'd take a St. Kilda reject - even if it was Nick Stone.

Stone > Davidson
Read carefully, think carefully. I am trying to say that in the long term it may be a better move for the club. Regardless of where he played in the past i think that it would be better to take a punt on recruiting someone who could be a good key position player rather than a snipping small forward who's head could be used as a bowling ball and would be best advised to play the ball and grow a heart. Sorry i don't think Guerra offers anything in the long or short term no matter what AC's opinion of him is! Having said all this there is little in the PSD on offer.
 

RustyHawk

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#9
FatBoy's Wombats said:
Read carefully, think carefully. I am trying to say that in the long term it may be a better move for the club. Regardless of where he played in the past i think that it would be better to take a punt on recruiting someone who could be a good key position player rather than a snipping small forward who's head could be used as a bowling ball and would be best advised to play the ball and grow a heart. Sorry i don't think Guerra offers anything in the long or short term no matter what AC's opinion of him is! Having said all this there is little in the PSD on offer.
Totally agree FBW!

Also, so far, and thankfully, no one has mentioned a certain Scott C or Shane W as possible players for us in the PSD. At least our club is not that stupid or desperate like a Collingwood or Essendon.
 

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#10
DynamoUltra said:
Davidson better than Guerra? Seriously... If I could choose a Collingwood reject or a St. Kilda reject, I'd take a St. Kilda reject - even if it was Nick Stone.

Stone > Davidson
funny that guerra has been rejected from two clubs, port & the aints

davo hasn't been rejected by collingwood, he was cruelled by knee injuries, all the talent in the world but u just cant keep blokes on the list who cant get themselves up & running these days, hopefully muston recovers for the hawks!

hope the pies rookie davo, then if his knees do hold up we can promote him
 

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mattyc2422

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#13
Haha, not related I assure you. But Guerra was definitely not 'rejected' from Port and I'd think it might be a bit of a salary cap issue with St. Kilda given they are not going to participate in the PSD even with Penny walking.

I'm comfortable in trusting Clarko on a guy he would have seen every day for a couple of years though.
 

Malibu#27

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#14
mattyc2422 said:
Haha, not related I assure you. But Guerra was definitely not 'rejected' from Port and I'd think it might be a bit of a salary cap issue with St. Kilda given they are not going to participate in the PSD even with Penny walking.

I'm comfortable in trusting Clarko on a guy he would have seen every day for a couple of years though.
Depends what you define as 'rejected' ...... Port were not willing to offer him a new contract so he elected to go home .... sounds pretty 'rejected' to me. For the record it wasn't so much his footy that cost him, but his preference for "not doing the hard work" which led to him having a lower fitness base and the club not being prepared to play him. He also liked to "get on the cups" a bit too uch for the clubs liking.
 

cs61

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#16
Guerra has shown enough that he could be a good player if he gets down and has a crack at it. Hopefully after being cut twice he'll realise this is his last chance.

Wouldn't hurt to have a few bigger bodies around our young blokes next year for confidence purposes. He got delisted from port when they were very stong, and from st kilda who has arguably the best list, and was keeping the older guys rather than looking towards youth, ... not the same as being delisted from say richmond then carlton is it?

If AC thinks he's worth it, then I'm happy.
 

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#17
cschreuder61 said:
Guerra has shown enough that he could be a good player if he gets down and has a crack at it. Hopefully after being cut twice he'll realise this is his last chance.
CS, love your posts but gotta say thats pretty much Picioane said when after he was drafted by North in PSD last year..... only to be cut at the end of this year.

There seems to be 2 schools of thought re Guerra's history at Port & Saints. 1 says he was unlucky. The 2nd believes there were reasons, other than the official line (wanting to come home/ cant afford him) why he was cut/left etc [let there be know doubt im in the later]

The facts are as the stand, Port are not interested in taking him back and St Kilda who now have a vacancy, $700,000 over 3-4 years to spend with the likelihood of another $200,000 from the AFL from the Ch7 pay tv fight to come, their reasons of cutting him have disappeared, yet, strangly, they don't want him back.

Further, another player cut due to salary cap (Hefferman) looks certain to be going back to the club that cut him.

If we do take Guerra this could be AC's first real mistake. There are very very few AFL coaches who can take wayward footballers with talent and turn them into consistant match contributors. IMHO Denis Pagen is one; when he was at north, so far no displayed at the blues; with Abrahams, Pike, Sinclair etc. If AC fails, they'll start nailing the first ones into his coffin as they close Guerra's.
 

cs61

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#18
I agree that it could turn out like that Rusty for sure. No doubt he may be a fringe player his whole contract. That's a negative, and a pretty big one too.

But, with so many young guys, it would be suicidle to have too many out there at the same time, and if that happens, say a few injuries next year (please not again!), we may need to call on a bigger bodied guy who can handle himself out there, and provide some support and grunt.

If there was a better option out there from an ex-afl player, I'd take it, but it looks pretty thin this year.

The only spot he's going to take is someone's like Steven Greene, Doug Scott, etc... guys who didn't play anyway at all, we didn't even see Doug Scott. I don't reckon it'll hurt us too bad if he doesn't work, but could be handy if he does.

I do see what you are saying, that it may fail etc. but I don't think it will kill us if it did. Its more lets get someone who's been around, who has a bit of grunt about him to get him among the younger guys.
 

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#20
You guys are forgetting one very important factor in comparing Guerra at Port or St Kilda to Guerra at Hawthorn.

When he was at the Port, I believe he would've been ranked the 25th to 30th player on the list - they were a top 2 side. When he was on the Saints list he would also have been rated 25-30th and they were a top four side, whom everyone thinks has underachieved.

If he comes to Hawthorn, frankly our list is significantly weaker and he should be a regular in the senior side, albeit a bottom four, maybe bottom six side. Being part of the senior unit week in, week out, with more on-field responsibility will do wonders for his confidence and I've little doubt he'll knuckle down and show greater maturity within the Hawks playing group than when he was in/out/bench at Port or St Kilda.
 

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#21
If we don't get Guerra we will never know what he could achieve at Hawthorn. If all goes wrong then delist him at next seasons end.
 

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#22
Scribe said:
You guys are forgetting one very important factor in comparing Guerra at Port or St Kilda to Guerra at Hawthorn.

I believe you are missing the point about Guerra and why he left Port and why the Saint's don't want him. It is his offield activities and behaviours, may I say professionalism that saw him cut.

I've little doubt he'll knuckle down and show greater maturity within the Hawks playing group than when he was in/out/bench at Port or St Kilda.
Scribe

In his dreams and for the media and for the coach he will say these things, and yes he will play some good games for us, but like a great majority of all the other 2 rejects he will end up a 3 time reject a la Picioane another 3 time reject.

What makes me filthy on wasting a spot on Guerra is we could have picked up Luke McEntee a 197cm ruckman or picked up another good quality youngster.

McEntee would have made 5 in our ruck division. (Everitt, Taylor, Campbell, Bailey) Overkill, yep, but with Everitt gone at the end of 2006 or 2008 we need to have someone to takeover his position so let the competition begin.

Secondly, IFS comes into play during the season. (IFS = injury, form, suspension). During 2006 it is likely at least 2 ruckmen will be injured at some time during the season. Having a pool to choose from helps keep us competative and not looking for short term answers.

Finally, if they all turn out to be any good and we cannot keep them on the list, we could trade 1 for a high round draft pick in 2-3 years.

Thats why im filthy on a Guerra, we wasted an oppurtunity on a spare parts player.
 

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#24
RustyHawk said:
Scribe

In his dreams and for the media and for the coach he will say these things, and yes he will play some good games for us, but like a great majority of all the other 2 rejects he will end up a 3 time reject a la Picioane another 3 time reject.

What makes me filthy on wasting a spot on Guerra is we could have picked up Luke McEntee a 197cm ruckman or picked up another good quality youngster.

McEntee would have made 5 in our ruck division. (Everitt, Taylor, Campbell, Bailey) Overkill, yep, but with Everitt gone at the end of 2006 or 2008 we need to have someone to takeover his position so let the competition begin.

Secondly, IFS comes into play during the season. (IFS = injury, form, suspension). During 2006 it is likely at least 2 ruckmen will be injured at some time during the season. Having a pool to choose from helps keep us competative and not looking for short term answers.

Finally, if they all turn out to be any good and we cannot keep them on the list, we could trade 1 for a high round draft pick in 2-3 years.

Thats why im filthy on a Guerra, we wasted an oppurtunity on a spare parts player.

Mate how many youngsters do you want playing??????? We need some experienced players, what happens if we get some serious injuries to our senior players? replace them with more youngsters!!!! we need balance more than anything ATM, too many youngsters without protection means burn out and a high risk for injury for those kids.

Obviously for no club to pick up McEntee something must give!!!! the same with Kirkby of last years draft,

Guerra can fill our needs and get a regular spot whilst protecting the kids giving us some senior player depth and by also helping us to be competative, where as kid in the 50's and beyond is preety much a hit and miss, more than likely they will turn out to be a dud.
 

mattyc2422

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#25
RustyHawk said:
I wonder. I wonder if Colliwobbles sack Brodie Holland over the alleged assault Sunday morning would we consider picking BH up in the PSD, over Guerra?
Wouldn't think so. We have defensive taggers that do the job such as Clarke and even Sewell. Guerra fills our need as a finisher with skills across the forward line.
 
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