Review QF: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly vs. Collingwood

[CrowMania1990]

That bloke's analysis really got me thinking. He's right.

Collingwood defend very smart, all over the ground.
ONE of their blokes takes on the oppo player with the ball. Others attend to potential receivers.

So our bloke with-the-ball is under pressure
AND
our blokes without-the-ball are going to be under pressure if they receive it.
That enables them to execute pressure act after pressure act in close, causing fumble after fumble until the last resort is a panicked hack-kick out of the trouble our blokes are in.
Their other players say THANKS VERY MUCH , because they've set up to intercept that hack-kick forced by their mates.

I gotta say, that's brilliant Coaching by McRae and well-drilled execution by the not-so-Mug-pies.

By contrast, our blokes (drilled in second-to-the-ball defence defence defence) take on the ball-holder two or three at a time, allowing fumbles or released ball to be mopped up by free/open Collingwood players around the contest
AND
off they go!
We pay too much attention to the ball-holder and not enough attention to potential outside receivers.

Has anybody got close ties with anyone-who-has-influence at the Club?
moogerfooger , do you?
Please, send that video analysis to Nicks/Davis. Please.

We certainly do pay too much attention to the ball holders and not to the potential outside receivers. How many times do we see 2, 3, or even 4 of our players run at the 1 player carrying the ball. If we don't stop them effectively releasing it, we quickly fall apart. Collingwood, Hawthorn, West Coast and North Melbourne all did this well against us at the backend of the season.

 

[CrowBloke]

Ugly: booing Quaynor.

I have no idea why Quaynor was booed.
But crowds of all kinds have booed players for years, notably Collingwood crowds too, eg aimed at Goodes and Franklin.

Booing is a cowardly act.

I guess you, as a Collingwood fan, would know all about that.

Anyone who defends that behaviour shows the bigotry that got Rankine suspended.

Rankine was suspended for using a homophobic slur about which all players have been educated (not to do) and for which others have been suspended, before him.
It was a mistake and he's doing his punishment but that's not enough for you, is it? ...

You have to come in here and lecture us.

Rubbing our noses in it is laughable and staggeringly hypocritical of you.
Take your outrage back to your own Board and protest about your Club's well-known and well-documented racial bigotry towards your own and other Clubs' Indigenous players, described as "systemic racism", here:

Collingwood Football Club is guilty of systemic racism, review finds

A review commissioned by the Collingwood Football Club describes an organisation more likely to react to media coverage about a racist incident than to complaints made within the club.

www.abc.net.au

That act is not passion, it's prejudice. That's not footy, that's being part of the problem.

Like I said, laughable hypocrisy.
You've never heard a Collingwood crowd boo players?

Get off your moral outrage high horse and do some work on cleaning your own house.

 

[WeeBlake]

It's ridiculous in our structure, because we're not set up to utilise damaging outside players.

But it's very sensible in a better structure. Whitfield, Pendlebury, Hodge, Mitchell, Daicos, McLeod... all spend/spent time at half back with their teams getting the ball into their hands at every opportunity

We don't do this.

In fact, when Dawson did play in defence for us we allowed him to be dragged back to the goal square and become completely ineffective.

Maybe I’m misremembering but I thought we did do this earlier in the year when we were scoring big?

 

[Crow_Magnon]

The other thing I noted was our kick to handball ratio was way out of whack. Nearly a 2 to 1 ratio kick to handball. 198 kicks and 105 handballs, whereas Collingwood were 217 & 152. It probably works when it's wet and slippery - as our numbers were similar in the previous match. In fact, reviewing our stats recently we're definitely hitting that 2 to 1 ratio quite often now. Wonder if we need to change it up a bit and flick it around more, before loading up with the kick?

 

[Rory Walkerfield]

Ugly: booing Quaynor. Booing is a cowardly act. Anyone who defends that behaviour shows the bigotry that got Rankine suspended. That act is not passion, it's prejudice. That's not footy, that's being part of the problem.

Good: You've finished on top for a reason, get a massive win against the Hawks and then make the GF.

Bad: Nick's was terribly outcoached.

Good luck for the rest of the finals.

I look forward to seeing the same passion from you on the Collingwood board when your supporters boo Rankine next time we play you guys.

 

[SugarShane]

Only one team can win it every year. So 17 other teams are disappointed too. My son pointed out Geelong has made 10 prelims under Scott but only 3 GFs and winning 2. GFS are HARD to get in. Fagan took a long while of finals appearances before he made the GF. And they are limping in to their elimination final next week.

When you put it like that I really do have sympathy for Geelong fans only having 2 flags in 14 years and having to wait almost 5 years for Grand Final appearances.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Maybe I’m misremembering but I thought we did do this earlier in the year when we were scoring big?

Yep we seem to have become more stagnant with our ball movement over the season. Less release handballs from marks/free kicks, hack kicking from stoppages rather than releasing outside. Plus going down the line from any stop ball situation. Feels like fewer switches

 

[The Karma Bus]

Yep we seem to have become more stagnant with our ball movement over the season. Less release handballs from marks/free kicks, hack kicking from stoppages rather than releasing outside. Plus going down the line from any stop ball situation. Feels like fewer switches

It's been so obvious (especially live) that they've been instructed not to run off as much and support, link up etc. Stay back, stay safe, stay in position and structure, protect everything defensively.

Leading to far more down the line, hack kicks, not releasing outside, opposition defense not being unsure where we're going, when we're going to release it so they're loving it also.

 

[Thrillthorpe7]

I understand the emotion people have after a finals loss, it sucks losing big games. However, after having more time to think about the game a few days on, did we really play that poorly?

Collingwood had their 5 goal, 10 minute burst at the start of the 3rd, not ideal obviously. However, they kicked 5 goals outside of that in 110 minutes (excluding the goal with 15sec left when game is dead). The game didn’t play out that differently to the previous win against them, it was a defensive struggle because both teams are so elite at it.

It’s not like after their burst we didn’t have ample opportunities to get right back into the game. We got it to 19 points, but definitely missed some golden opportunities through potentially a bit of finals inexperience, but it certainly wasn’t a breakdown of the game style which has served us well all season. Pedlar had a shot early in the 4th, Thilthorpe had that moment, we certainly weren’t struggling for scoring chances and had clamped right down on Collingwood’s scoring again.

Rachele will obviously be a little underdone, but he is a spark player that could kick 1 or 2 quickly and actually convert I50 dominance when we have momentum. MM has a game under his belt and will be far better for that. Dawson never puts in 2 average games in a row, he will lift.

Hawthorn aren’t the defensive team that Collingwood or the Crows are, they will give you a lot more opportunities and can be scored on quickly (as we showed a few weeks ago and the Giants did yesterday). We’ve earned this 2nd chance and I believe we are more than good enough to take it.

 

[pjcrows]

I understand the emotion people have after a finals loss, it sucks losing big games. However, after having more time to think about the game a few days on, did we really play that poorly?

Collingwood had their 5 goal, 10 minute burst at the start of the 3rd, not ideal obviously. However, they kicked 5 goals outside of that in 110 minutes (excluding the goal with 15sec left when game is dead). The game didn’t play out that differently to the previous win against them, it was a defensive struggle because both teams are so elite at it.

It’s not like after their burst we didn’t have ample opportunities to get right back into the game. We got it to 19 points, but definitely missed some golden opportunities through potentially a bit of finals inexperience, but it certainly wasn’t a breakdown of the game style which has served us well all season. Pedlar had a shot early in the 4th, Thilthorpe had that moment, we certainly weren’t struggling for scoring chances and had clamped right down on Collingwood’s scoring again.

Rachele will obviously be a little underdone, but he is a spark player that could kick 1 or 2 quickly and actually convert I50 dominance when we have momentum. MM has a game under his belt and will be far better for that. Dawson never puts in 2 average games in a row, he will lift.

Hawthorn aren’t the defensive team that Collingwood or the Crows are, they will give you a lot more opportunities and can be scored on quickly (as we showed a few weeks ago and the Giants did yesterday). We’ve earned this 2nd chance and I believe we are more than good enough to take it.

We were systematically destroyed by a far better midfield and our structure was dismantled. Collingwood should have actually won by more.

 

[Scorpus]

Yep we seem to have become more stagnant with our ball movement over the season. Less release handballs from marks/free kicks, hack kicking from stoppages rather than releasing outside. Plus going down the line from any stop ball situation. Feels like fewer switches

Our inability to change lanes compresses the ground and in finals that invites pressure

 

[pjcrows]

Our inability to change lanes compresses the ground and in finals that invites pressure

I posted in the pre-game:

Collingwood will stifle the corridor. That will be their Plan A and they're good at it. They'd be hoping we don't take risks or play on, and turn it into a dogfight.

We will need to take risks at the right time to win - but that's how we've won games this year.

We were either scared to take the risks through the corridor, or we were instructed to minimise the risk through the corridor.

Either way, it was a big failure. We played into their Plan A. We played like we were reactive, timid, and as if it was Collingwood's home ground. Nicks bought into it too, with his weird mind games and straying from what has worked.

 

[BucketsNj]

I look forward to seeing the same passion from you on the Collingwood board when your supporters boo Rankine next time we play you guys.

A bit different. Rankine will be booed because he used a homophobic slur.
Quaynor will be booed because he was called one

 

[Thrillthorpe7]

We were systematically destroyed by a far better midfield and our structure was dismantled. Collingwood should have actually won by more.

Yet they scored 5 goals in 110 minutes outside of their burst in the 3rd. ‘Should have won by more’ can be countered with ‘Adelaide should have taken more opportunities inside 50’, both are meaningless as neither actually eventuated.

‘Systematically destroyed’, geez you love to roll out doomer pr0n.

 

[Interloperer]

Yet they scored 5 goals in 110 minutes outside of their burst in the 3rd. ‘Should have won by more’ can be countered with ‘Adelaide should have taken more opportunities inside 50’, both are meaningless as neither actually eventuated.

‘Systematically destroyed’, geez you love to roll out doomer pr0n.

Collingwood basically stopped trying to score at 3/4 time, because they had such supreme confidence in their defence that they were happy to bolster it and withstand an all-out Adelaide attack. And they were correct to do so.

 

[CrowBloke]

That's your problem buddy. Not mine.

Not sure what you're referring to here.
In general, we're in agreement, see below.

I've put up with abuse most of my life because of my light frame, but like you I am an old West Adelaide supporter and bought up with old addage that sticks and stone may break my bones but word will never hurt me. What goes on the field stays on the field in regards to what is said not actions.

I was 19, tall/skinny, and took a hanger on a chunky older bloke who was in the right poz to get jumped on.
After I kicked he came up to me all mad anger, shook his fist in my face, called me a "****ing pxxxxa" (dunno why; I'm straight) and said he would kill me if I did it again. Yep, a death threat. We played on.
He bought me a beer after the game.

I'm with you; what's said on the field stays on the field.

I copped more knees in the back and sides, sprig-tracks on my legs, and elbows to the head and jaw that hurt much more than being threatened/verballed.

[Rankine] served his penalty for past indistrection and I didn't condone it, but for me he was let down by the club who should have said to Dobbingwood prove it what he said. They didn't have to self report but this is this bloody goody two shoes policy they have.

Racism and homophobia have become the two big no-nos, whether we think it's "goody two shoes" or not.
They make the rules, not old timers like us.
I said in a previous post that if Rankine had called him "a dog cxxt" and said he'd slept with his mother the previous night, no action would've been taken.
So some verbal abuse is ok, regardless of how foul it is, but not anything that is racist or homophobic.

Odd double-standard if you ask me .

We should still have Stengel, look at him now. Again that should have been handled differently.

Separate issue but, yeah, I agree. Scott/Geelong/different system and living with Eddie in Melbourne have definitely brought out the best in Stengle. Goodonim.

Let me ask you, what would have the likes of Neil Kerly or any of the old blokes of yester year think of this world where you get more weeks for uttering one word instead of some one who king hits some one?

My guess is Knuckles is spinning in his grave; if he was around he'd be scornful is my guess.

Lynch copped 5 games for his round-arm hit on Butts, ditto Houston for his much worse flattening of Rankine last year; Rankine got 4 for the word 'fxxxxt'.
I dunno, seriously .
The players are educated, told clearly what they can do and what they can't but there are a lot of odd decisions around suspensions to confuse them, and us eg Cotchin before that GF, Butters a few times and plenty others (McAdam got three for his bump on Wehr who got up and played on!!).
It's the hypocritical outrage that gets me, tbh --- especially from Mugpie fans who (with PA) have some of the most abusive supporters in the Comp.

 

[pjcrows]

Yet they scored 5 goals in 110 minutes outside of their burst in the 3rd. ‘Should have won by more’ can be countered with ‘Adelaide should have taken more opportunities inside 50’, both are meaningless as neither actually eventuated.

‘Systematically destroyed’, geez you love to roll out doomer pr0n.

Yes. Systematically destroyed.

A good coping effort. Keep living in your fantasy world

 

[Hodgy]

A bit different. Rankine will be booed because he used a homophobic slur.
Quaynor will be booed because he was called one

Quaynor was booed because he informed on someone. Whether you agree or not, societies have always despised informers. And rightly so in my opinion.

The pattern has been the same for ever. Those in control try to limit free speech and the expression of any alternate views, and a small percentage try to further themselves by pointing out transgressors in the name of moral outrage. Think of the inquisition or the FBI’s persecution of “communists” in the 60’s and there is countless other examples through history.

The great thing is that these horrible periods in history never last forever, and I’m confident that the pendulum will bounce back this time as well.

 

[CrowBloke]

Rankine's merely ran into Starcevich, he only went down because he's got such a soft head, It was nothing like Houston's hit. Your talking absolute shit.
Rankine's a dummy that's cost his team big time, but don't compare the Houston hit to the Starcevich thing, Rankine was was actually stiff to get the weeks he did.

Nope, what I said is accurate:
"Rankine did a nearly-identical blindside hit on Starcevich just under 6 weeks earlier (July 7th., concussed, taken off + Rankine got 4 games for that)".
Before I posted I had a look at the Rankine hip'n'shoulder, just to be sure, here:

Major concerns for big guns as Rankine bump fells Lion

Brandon Starcevich is subbed out after being bumped off the ball by Izak Rankine

www.afl.com.au

Starcevich was blindsided. Soft or not, he was concussed (you can't fake concussion and Starcevich missed a game).
The key description is "near-identical".

Where we agree is on this: "Rankine's a dummy that's cost his team big time". Given the emphasis on punishments for homophobic slurs and the education players receive, yes, he is.

 

[Smart Fella]

A bit different. Rankine will be booed because he used a homophobic slur.
Quaynor will be booed because he was called one

Quaynor is getting booed indirectly for that. Supporters are going off some pretty fishy information to how and why it was brought to the attention to people outside of IQ and Rankine.

 

[CrowBloke]

They would know all too well. I think our biggest issue wasn't so much not knowing what to do, it was panicking under pressure. Every good plan goes out the window.

Under pressure, they revert to 2020-2024 Crows, ie panicked hack-kicks and high bombs to forwards or unmarked opponents.
Davis needs to undo 5 years of conditioning and get Nicks to change tactics. Good luck with that

It was pointed out to me last time I posted one of his videos that he's Jeff White, former #1 pick and Melbourne ruckman. He knows what he's talking about. Ironically the first video I saw of his was an analysis of our centre bounce dominance against Carlton.

I didn't recognise him as Jeff White.
I saw that video of how RoB dominated in that game; brilliant analysis.

 

[GreyCrow]

Oh and one more Bad

I bought the Tex T and pulled a $50 out ( forgetting the card only ) and when I went to get my card out I must have left the note on the bench as I tried on the shirt

Thats on me

 

[Bogsey]

Personally find sniping blokes and putting them in hospital worse. Yet you cheer on Houston every week like a hero.

You obviously dont watch much Pies games. We can't stand Houston.
But doesn't excuse booing IQ.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

A bit different. Rankine will be booed because he used a homophobic slur.
Quaynor will be booed because he was called one

Quaynor got booed because broke the code of the schoolyard

Sure, it doesn't exist anymore but the booing fans haven't picked up on that nuance, let alone that booing makes our club look homophobic

 

[Bogsey]

Adam Goodes board.

Find my next comment re this