R4 v West Coast Eagles.

[Suns of Anarchy]

It's time to give the young blokes a crack and get games into them. Rischitelli and Rosa should see out their time mentoring the young blokes in the NEAFL.
I'd rather see Scrimshaw, Scheer, Brodie, Ballard playing and I don't subscribe to the 'we must protect them' theory.
There's plenty of experience on all lines to help them out. It's a rebuild and might as well get games into the young blokes having a dip. An 80 point loss with zero effort is unacceptable and it's the same old offenders every week that let us down.

 

[Peel67skin]

Had a great night sleep, walked the dog and had a delicious breakfast at the surf club.
I’m still angry at the little petals.

Reached his 100 games , time to go to NEAFL.

 

[Ben Drever]

It all starts with pressure and effort.


Tackle numbers past 2 weeks under 50
=2 losses

Tackle numbers rounds 1-2 above 90
= 2 wins

 

[eppo67]

Reached his 100 games , time to go to NEAFL.

View attachment 483369

Watched him very closely last night Not only are some of his defensive efforts absolutely disgraceful he regularly burns his team mates in far better positions.
Might be time to stick the cue in the rack and part ways as Melbourne did with Watts.

 

[Peel67skin]

Watched him very closely last night Not only are some of his defensive efforts absolutely disgraceful he regularly burns his team mates in far better positions.
Might be time to stick the cue in the rack and part ways as Melbourne did with Watts.

Agree , i don't even think about draft pick at the moment.

 

[Scotty_222]

I was out last night.. did I miss much? I was gonna watch the replay, should I?

 

[Stroppy]

Tbh, we are right about where I thought we would be.
Good enough to beat teams in the bottom 4 (if only we could play ourselves for the 4 points), not good enough to beat the rest unless we play really really well. Capable of a 1/4 of so of quality play, more if we can slow the other team down, but very susceptible to a running team that gets several goals up and then keeps attacking.

Got to be realistic. Our youngsters are still, well, young and our 3 players who are 30+ are average AFL players at best.
We simply don't have enough players in the prime 25-29 age group to be good. A lot of the guys we do have are good players, but we don't have enough of them. Worst of all, we only have 3 mids in that group (Swallow, Lyons and Hall).

Was also worried at the start of the season about our quality in the 21-24 year old bracket. Need a few of these to push up a level or two if we are going to be a much better team in 2018 and 2019. But I just don't see enough there.

Sexton (24)
Lemmens, Lonergan, Martin (23)
Leslie, Holman, Willis, KK, Miller, Weller (22)
2MP, Wigg (21).
Throw in Young, who is 25.

Of those 13 players, Jack is already really good. 2MP could be really good, and jury still out on Weller.
The rest currently look back end of best 22 players/role players, at best.

They have some work to do if they are going to jump a level (including 2MP and Weller), and consequently see the team improve sooner rather than later. It can be done and might be done, but I argue that we won't be much good unless they do.

Suspect we will be trying to hold on as a club until some of our 18-20 year olds come on. If some of them don't become guns? Hey, we will always have the draft to look forward to. I mean, the most press we get all year is draft related.

 

[OB11]

How much better are Dews press conferences.
No BS or meaningless rhetoric. States exactly what he was unhappy with and what went wrong also placing players on notice So refreshing.

Hasn't really thrown specific players under the bus to cover his ass which is a refreshing change

 

[OB11]

I was out last night.. did I miss much? I was gonna watch the replay, should I?

If you only watched the Suns when they win you wouldn't watch many games

 

[OB11]

Tbh, we are right about where I thought we would be.
Good enough to beat teams in the bottom 4 (if only we could play ourselves for the 4 points), not good enough to beat the rest unless we play really really well. Capable of a 1/4 of so of quality play, more if we can slow the other team down, but very susceptible to a running team that gets several goals up and then keeps attacking.

Got to be realistic. Our youngsters are still, well, young and our 3 players who are 30+ are average AFL players at best.
We simply don't have enough players in the prime 25-29 age group to be good. A lot of the guys we do have are good players, but we don't have enough of them. Worst of all, we only have 3 mids in that group (Swallow, Lyons and Hall).

Was also worried at the start of the season about our quality in the 21-24 year old bracket. Need a few of these to push up a level or two if we are going to be a much better team in 2018 and 2019. But I just don't see enough there.

Sexton (24)
Lemmens, Lonergan, Martin (23)
Leslie, Holman, Willis, KK, Miller, Weller (22)
2MP, Wigg (21).
Throw in Young, who is 25.

Of those 13 players, Jack is already really good. 2MP could be really good, and jury still out on Weller.
The rest currently look back end of best 22 players/role players, at best.

They have some work to do if they are going to jump a level (including 2MP and Weller), and consequently see the team improve sooner rather than later. It can be done and might be done, but I argue that we won't be much good unless they do.

Suspect we will be trying to hold on as a club until some of our 18-20 year olds come on. If some of them don't become guns? Hey, we will always have the draft to look forward to. I mean, the most press we get all year is draft related.

The most press we get down in Melbourne is which unsigned player is going to join which Melbourne club

 

[Mini GF]

I was out last night.. did I miss much? I was gonna watch the replay, should I?

Take the bad with the good and endure it all...plus it be good to hear your reflections too

 

[Peel67skin]

I don't agree protect young players , i rather they play their way in (Good form )than coming in because of injuries and let those who are off form fight their way bad through NEAFL .

 

[17er]

Agree , i don't even think about draft pick at the moment.

Hall was the barometer of the team last night, all ebbs and flows. He kept playing until the end, but it was Hall-ball style and not much substance. If he gets dropped it won't be a surprise - I would stick him in a forward pocket and make him scrag for possessions in the NEAFL until he works out that forward defensive efforts are his only path back into the seniors.

BTW, Hall came to the club through the Rookie Draft. If he gets traded in October, the club will have gotten over 100 games out of him and a high Draft pick. It is a shame he is even in the trade conversation because he could be a superstar with proper coaching.

Tbh, we are right about where I thought we would be.
Good enough to beat teams in the bottom 4 (if only we could play ourselves for the 4 points), not good enough to beat the rest unless we play really really well. Capable of a 1/4 of so of quality play, more if we can slow the other team down, but very susceptible to a running team that gets several goals up and then keeps attacking.

Got to be realistic. Our youngsters are still, well, young and our 3 players who are 30+ are average AFL players at best.
We simply don't have enough players in the prime 25-29 age group to be good. A lot of the guys we do have are good players, but we don't have enough of them. Worst of all, we only have 3 mids in that group (Swallow, Lyons and Hall).

Was also worried at the start of the season about our quality in the 21-24 year old bracket. Need a few of these to push up a level or two if we are going to be a much better team in 2018 and 2019. But I just don't see enough there.

Sexton (24)
Lemmens, Lonergan, Martin (23)
Leslie, Holman, Willis, KK, Miller, Weller (22)
2MP, Wigg (21).
Throw in Young, who is 25.

Of those 13 players, Jack is already really good. 2MP could be really good, and jury still out on Weller.
The rest currently look back end of best 22 players/role players, at best.

They have some work to do if they are going to jump a level (including 2MP and Weller), and consequently see the team improve sooner rather than later. It can be done and might be done, but I argue that we won't be much good unless they do.

Suspect we will be trying to hold on as a club until some of our 18-20 year olds come on. If some of them don't become guns? Hey, we will always have the draft to look forward to. I mean, the most press we get all year is draft related.

We are rebuilding from our initial List that had top talent who wanted to leave, veterans who retired and foundation players who would never have played AFL for another club. To rebuild we've gone to the Draft with the loot from trading away our best players, which is a really bad way of getting better quickly but quite an ingenious method of making the best of a poor situation. To assist the process, we brought in Rosa, Lyons, Witts, Barlow, Hanley, Young and renewed contracts for Harbrow and Rischitelli.

Last November, when everyone was losing their minds about the West Coast and Fremantle trades, the new management had put the skids on Drafting piles of young talent and went for a bold consolidation plan. Bringing in 4 Academy players was unprecedented, but based on the success of the previous academy draftees it was a justified gambit. Snagging Powell and Ballard will be seen as master strokes when they mature into AFL sized players (Powell was our compo for Ablett and Ballard came with Weller for #2) while Jaska has been quietly impressing in the NEAFL. There will be more Academy players nominated this year and thanks to the trades of last November the club has 2 draft picks in each round.

There will be a reload this year with more casualties than some fans will like, but the average age of the rest of the list is pushing up into the zone where players begin to reach their full potential. It wouldn't surprise me if the Suns draft 20 or more Academy players over the next few years and even if many of them wash out, it is still going to fertilise the QAFL and NEAFL. The Academy has produced Weller, Joyce and Spencer, who were all named for last night's game - Weller was named in the Suns' best players, BTW - and you get the feeling that more Academy players are going to feature with Spencer, Heron and Crossley making it onto the Emergency lists for the WA games, Scheer pushing for a return to the seniors while Dawson was named Captain of the NEAFL team last week.

All of the players you named have either played their share of NEAFL (or SANFL/WAFL) or they've been exposed to AFL before they were really ready. Sexton, Lemmens and Lonergan have emerged from the latter experience as incomplete players, while Martin and KK are brilliant yet ineffective in the positions they've played in. Holman, Wigg and Young couldn't get regular games at their own clubs and are playing for future contracts, while 2MP and Leslie are AFL standard players who can't get a game because of niggling injuries and the cattle in front of them.

Weller, in many ways, represents our future. He's the right age to be part of this group's development into seasoned players, he comes from the club's Academy and identifies as a local, and he's been identified as captaincy material from an early age. He also has the longest contract. I often confuse him for Harbrow and their playing styles are similar - we know their decision making needs to be better, but how good is it to see them burst off halfback and launch the ball inside 50?

 

[Peel67skin]

I really hope Dew play Weller as HF , young and Holman good at stop gap but if their performance drop they should play NeAFL and get their place back, give the kids a chance and forget about protection , if Young and Holman injured ,the kids will come in anywhere ,, why not reward them a place if they perform in NEAFL rather than through injuries .

 

[Suns of Anarchy]

To rebuild we've gone to the Draft with the loot from trading away our best players, which is a really bad way of getting better quickly but quite an ingenious method of making the best of a poor situation.

As Pauline Hanson would say "Please explain?"

 

[17er]

I really hope Dew play Weller as HF , young and Holman good at stop gap but if their performance drop they should play NeAFL and get their place back, give the kids a chance and forget about protection , if Young and Holman injured ,the kids will come in anywhere ,, why not reward them a place if they perform in NEAFL rather than through injuries .

Dew has said places are now at risk. I'm thinking he won't want to see the backline get swamped for size again, so Leslie or Spencer come in for Rischa and maybe KK gets bumped for a livewire like Dawson (upgraded for Hanley). Holman needs a rest and Lonergan or Brodie can take his role, while Young can make way for 2MP's immediate return. Hall needs a break and Barlow can take his job, while I reckon Ainsworth could do with a break as well to make way for Scheer's return.

It is the side we should have taken West and form since has justified the need to make changes.

 

[SandyToes]

As Pauline Hanson would say "Please explain?"

Big Melbourne clubs can go to Free Agency to improve their lists immediately
It's not difficult for them but nigh on impossible for us
So we have to go to the draft to look for success- which obviously can't come overnight

 

[17er]

As Pauline Hanson would say "Please explain?"

Look at all the players who have requested trades and what we got in return = the 2016 Draft and Trade period.

Basically, in 2016 the collection of 1st Round Draft Picks as well as the trading for Lyons, Witts and Hanley was the culmination of trading away some of our best talent. You usually don't get your draft pick value back in the form of increased draft pick value after you pick a player, but that's what Clayton did, on balance, with all those trades. He picked the players, they played, then he traded them and got draft value far greater or equal to their original value. The Dixon trade alone was a bonanza because he cost the club nothing at the draft and collected plenty. Prestia and O'Meara came and went for 1st round picks and change that helped buy the players to replace them immediately, Hanley and Lyons, plus the players that will be stars in future, Brodie and Bowes.

There are a lot of ways of looking at the desertions - this one is glass half full. The tactic is terrible - just ask the Fitzroy Lions - because getting rid of your best players will only lead to disaster. However, in making the best of a rotten situation, consolidating the draft picks and staggering the rebuild to add play now veterans to guide new recruits is well thought out and the next few seasons will see the rebuild complete and conversations like this will be ironic.

 

[SandyToes]

Dew has said places are now at risk. I'm thinking he won't want to see the backline get swamped for size again, so Leslie or Spencer come in for Rischa and maybe KK gets bumped for a livewire like Dawson (upgraded for Hanley). Holman needs a rest and Lonergan or Brodie can take his role, while Young can make way for 2MP's immediate return. Hall needs a break and Barlow can take his job, while I reckon Ainsworth could do with a break as well to make way for Scheer's return.

It is the side we should have taken West and form since has justified the need to make changes.

TBH I think the Club got out of Perth about 10 goals short of a pass mark
If we'd been within 5 goals each game playing pressure football that would have been a strong B+ from me where an A+ is a lucky win

 

[17er]

TBH I think the Club got out of Perth about 10 goals short of a pass mark
If we'd been within 5 goals each game playing pressure football that would have been a strong B+ from me where an A+ is a lucky win

Tom Lynch playing on after marking dead in front was an example of that 10 goal difference. Dumb and unnecessary. No look hand passes were another feature lacking braincells.

 

[Sunraysia]

TBH I think the Club got out of Perth about 10 goals short of a pass mark
If we'd been within 5 goals each game playing pressure football that would have been a strong B+ from me where an A+ is a lucky win

Agreed. Pissed we just blew our percentage advantage last night without any effort to protect it.
I can take the loss - but no way should it have been that big.

 

[Peel67skin]

Tom Lynch playing on after marking dead in front was an example of that 10 goal difference. Dumb and unnecessary. No look hand passes were another feature lacking braincells.

I feel for Holman type of players, he try his heart out , he need to be rested or play NEAFL to avoid early injuries , as for sexton, hall,touk and even McPherson they look good when thing go their way but when thing get tough they get back to normal habit.

 

[sunsofanarchy]

I didn't watch the game, I was on nightshift but listened to ABC commentary and they didn't have alot to say about gc but they said Young could hold his head high. He kicked 2 and found a bit of the pill. He just offers something different every week, his tackling one week, his marking another, might kick a couple of snags the next but I don't see effort an issue with him, nor did I when he was at port. Hard day for a high half fwd when you're smashed in the midfield like that.

 

[Sunraysia]

I didn't watch the game, I was on nightshift but listened to ABC commentary and they didn't have alot to say about gc but they said Young could hold his head high. He kicked 2 and found a bit of the pill. He just offers something different every week, his tackling one week, his marking another, might kick a couple of snags the next but I don't see effort an issue with him, nor did I when he was at port. Hard day for a high half fwd when you're smashed in the midfield like that.

Was at game - had him in
my top 3
17 disposals @ 88 percentage . Plus 2 goals.

 

[sunsofanarchy]

Holman is in the team for defensive pressure, when that's not there he is a clogger.

As much as we want to buy into the sam day comeback story, I don't. Peter Wright when fit needs to replace Sam and maybe Lynch won't be triple teamed as much.

When we say we need a Jack Martin fwd, mid and def, we have one fwd in ah chee, he is a genuine target to kick to and very clean hands when it's in dispute. This will allow Jack to stay in the midfield longer. I don't know if it's out defence that needs patching.. probably a bit but when it comes in so easy it's hard to stop. You can make all the changes in the world but that loss wasn't because of personnel, that was effort and mot playing as a team. Barlow, Lonergan and Brodie will at least get the ball moving our way and give our defence some time to set up.

Still quite flat after yesterday. This week is gonna be huge