Review R7 - Port ate all the Pies

Janus

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Sep 9, 2007
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Q4

Back to s**t Byrne-Jones as a defender. Sorry, but while I love him up the ground, I can't abide him in defence. A defender who can't defend inside 50 with 6-6-6 is useless.

I hate defenders who zone off when there is heaps of space inside 50. Four Port Adelaide players and none of them could track Mihochek's run and move to drop into his space? Ridiculous.

LOL who was Wines handballing to? It's like he assumed that any player who was positioned with their front toward Port Adelaide's goal was going to be a Port Adelaide player. ******* stupid.

Byrne-Jones - ******* hack kick not from a stoppage, but from outside the stoppage = don't bother playing next week.

Wines is playing like a player who is passing to where he thinks players were instead of where they are going. Some games you'd just rather forget, where you try too ******* hard and don't let the game flow. This was Ollie.

If Bonner can't even get the ball deep inside 50 charging through the middle, exactly why is he in this team?

Byrne-Jones. Yep, you've just undid a great second quarter with such a lazy ******* punch across the face of the opposition goal. I mean, WHAT.THE.fu**.

And as if to say 'anything you can do...' Bonner takes a bounce inside defensive 50, purely so he can rack up a stat, and then kicks the ball out on the full.

Then Wines does his crap kick around the corner out of a stoppage that he's famous for that ends up in a Collingwood player's hands.

Disgustingly errant possessions by Westhoff.



Summary

A performance where one team was up for a game that established their top four credentials and the other rocked up thinking that it would be 'just another game'. By the time Port realised that there are certain games during the season where you need your A game, which was after quarter time, it was way too late. And it wasn't really skill level execution that was the issue, but the thirst for the contest and the desire to run and get the ball. I know these guys complain about the hardness of the surface at Docklands, and West Coast has complained about the hardness of the surface at Optus Stadium...but that's no ******* excuse. You have to play where you are told.

Replace Bonner with Jonas and Byrne-Jones with Garner and we'd be 100 times better. Oh, and bring Frampton in - the reason why Moore had such a great game was because he had no one he needed to feel responsible for. Absolute s**t coaching by Ken.
 

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P4Life

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Mar 25, 2019
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Q4

Back to **** Byrne-Jones as a defender. Sorry, but while I love him up the ground, I can't abide him in defence. A defender who can't defend inside 50 with 6-6-6 is useless.

I hate defenders who zone off when there is heaps of space inside 50. Four Port Adelaide players and none of them could track Mihochek's run and move to drop into his space? Ridiculous.

LOL who was Wines handballing to? It's like he assumed that any player who was positioned with their front toward Port Adelaide's goal was going to be a Port Adelaide player. ******* stupid.

Byrne-Jones - ******* hack kick not from a stoppage, but from outside the stoppage = don't bother playing next week.

Wines is playing like a player who is passing to where he thinks players were instead of where they are going. Some games you'd just rather forget, where you try too ******* hard and don't let the game flow. This was Ollie.

If Bonner can't even get the ball deep inside 50 charging through the middle, exactly why is he in this team?

Byrne-Jones. Yep, you've just undid a great second quarter with such a lazy ******* punch across the face of the opposition goal. I mean, WHAT.THE.****.

And as if to say 'anything you can do...' Bonner takes a bounce inside defensive 50, purely so he can rack up a stat, and then kicks the ball out on the full.

Then Wines does his crap kick around the corner out of a stoppage that he's famous for that ends up in a Collingwood player's hands.

Disgustingly errant possessions by Westhoff.



Summary

A performance where one team was up for a game that established their top four credentials and the other rocked up thinking that it would be 'just another game'. By the time Port realised that there are certain games during the season where you need your A game, which was after quarter time, it was way too late. And it wasn't really skill level execution that was the issue, but the thirst for the contest and the desire to run and get the ball. I know these guys complain about the hardness of the surface at Docklands, and West Coast has complained about the hardness of the surface at Optus Stadium...but that's no ******* excuse. You have to play where you are told.

Replace Bonner with Jonas and Byrne-Jones with Garner and we'd be 100 times better. Oh, and bring Frampton in - the reason why Moore had such a great game was because he had no one he needed to feel responsible for. Absolute **** coaching by Ken.
You are all over Bonner and DBJ's games, and while agree with you that Bonner had a stinker not so sure that DBJ was that bad. I thought he and Duursma were the only 2 players during that second quarter who looked like they weren't going to cop the crap going on and made a conscious effort to put their bodies an the line and change the flow.
I wouldn't be surprised to see Bonner lose his spot to Jonas, not sure both will go, as it will make us horribly slow down back. DBJ's Defender stats are actually quite good in terms of pressure acts (first for PA and equal 3rd in the league) and tackles (first for PA and 4th in the league, 1 behind the leader)
As I have said before I to would enjoy seeing Garner play but my understanding his pace and defensive skills are not his strong bow but his disposal and composure are first class so therefore for team balance DBJ will stay.
What did you think of Todd Marshalls game? I cannot recall that you have mentioned him. You are critical of Westhoff but by having 29 possessions you are opening yourself up to making mistakes Todd just seemed nowhere.
I like many others believe our midfield in the first quarter was the root of our problems Collingwood players walking out of the front of the contest with no pressure made it impossible to defend and hence the bake from Ken towards Lycett and Ollie.
As they say though, it is never as good as it looks and never as bad as it seems.
Onwards to Saturday.
 

simba_

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did anyone get a clip of Hoff giving a free kick away for winning a bumping contest in the first quarter? i know there were bigger problems but that's all i need
 

Janus

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You are all over Bonner and DBJ's games, and while agree with you that Bonner had a stinker not so sure that DBJ was that bad. I thought he and Duursma were the only 2 players during that second quarter who looked like they weren't going to cop the crap going on and made a conscious effort to put their bodies an the line and change the flow.
I wouldn't be surprised to see Bonner lose his spot to Jonas, not sure both will go, as it will make us horribly slow down back. DBJ's Defender stats are actually quite good in terms of pressure acts (first for PA and equal 3rd in the league) and tackles (first for PA and 4th in the league, 1 behind the leader)
As I have said before I to would enjoy seeing Garner play but my understanding his pace and defensive skills are not his strong bow but his disposal and composure are first class so therefore for team balance DBJ will stay.
What did you think of Todd Marshalls game? I cannot recall that you have mentioned him. You are critical of Westhoff but by having 29 possessions you are opening yourself up to making mistakes Todd just seemed nowhere.
I like many others believe our midfield in the first quarter was the root of our problems Collingwood players walking out of the front of the contest with no pressure made it impossible to defend and hence the bake from Ken towards Lycett and Ollie.
As they say though, it is never as good as it looks and never as bad as it seems.
Onwards to Saturday.
I liked Byrne-Jones’ second quarter, but the game is longer than a quarter and he’s just poor at defending inside defensive 50. Pace and agility are useless if you aren’t winning the ball first.

Marshall did perfectly fine when the ball was moving quickly. He didn’t make glaring mistakes. Westhoff has played 250 games and isn’t cut the same slack.

Collingwood were able to exit out of the front of the contest because Bonner was either getting sucked up towards it or wasn’t putting on any sort of pressure at all. Ken’s bake at quarter time to Lycett and Wines was more about the ease with which Collingwood were clearing the ball in general...we weren’t making it hard for them at all with any sort of pressure.
 

Spadge

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I liked Byrne-Jones’ second quarter, but the game is longer than a quarter and he’s just poor at defending inside defensive 50. Pace and agility are useless if you aren’t winning the ball first.
and this is why Eddie Betts ******* kills us every showdown and i hate to think what it will be like with the 6-6-6 if DBJ is on Betts again
 

RussellEbertHandball

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23 frees in the game 12 v 11 Coll. 20 in the crows v freo game yesterday, 10 each. Can't tell me there were only 23 frees on Friday nights especially given the throws and dropped balls in the packs when tackles were laid. It didn't affect the game but there were a hell of a lot of frees missed.

Before this Rd the average frees per game was 38.7. 2091 frees for 54 games.

The umpires were spoken to no matter what the say as most of the games were under 30 frees in total. Rest of this round Meb 18 v 21 Haw, GWS 22 v 26 StK, Bris 27 v 17 Syd, WB 17 v 11 Rich at Docklands, WCE 15 v 12 GCS, Calt 14 v 15 NM at Docklands, Gee 13 v 13 Ess

At the 12 games at Docklands before Friday night it was
Rd 1 44, 47 - Rd 2 45, 42 - Rd 3 36, 39 - Rd 4 43, 35, Rd 5 44, 32, 34 and Rd 6 35.

Anyway here is the Champion Data tables - a bit late.

Ryder in particular and Lycett got more hits out to advantage 13, than Grundy 8 and that's why we might have won the clearances 40 to 36 and won Centre clearances 14 to 11, but outside those stoppage contests their mids killed our mids in the first quarter and ended up in front over all 4 quarters. Plenty of green for the Pies.

1557122474814.png



Not much green for Port and a bit more red

Its a bit fuzzy but Xscore for collingwood was 117 and they kicked 108 due to missing some easy shots by Stephenson and Reid. Our X Score was 81 and actual was 69.

They had 35 shots from 58 inside 50's whereas we had 22 from 45 shots. Lucky we were a bit more accurate than them.

1557123530610.png
 

Power Girl

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I guess now that Wingard has gone we all know who Janus’ latest scapegoat is. Come on down Riley.

Hey Janus Why can’t you direct some of that vitriol towards the conductor of this god awful orchestra? Just for a change. Go on try it you might like it.
 

Pappagallo

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I guess now that Wingard has gone we all know who Janus’ latest scapegoat is. Come on down Riley.

Hey Janus Why can’t you direct some of that vitriol towards the conductor of this god awful orchestra? Just for a change. Go on try it you might like it.
Well Binner has been largely poor this year so I think it’s justified. Also he did end on “Absolute s**t coaching by Ken.”
 

PatientMental

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I guess now that Wingard has gone we all know who Janus’ latest scapegoat is. Come on down Riley.

Hey Janus Why can’t you direct some of that vitriol towards the conductor of this god awful orchestra? Just for a change. Go on try it you might like it.
I'd agree.

But Bonner has been unacceptably s**t this year. His outside is almost non existent anymore - added to his lack of contested work he's pretty much forcing us to play -1 in defence for the entire game.
 

Power Girl

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I’m not disagreeing about Bonner being dreadful but others have been pulled up for saying a s**tload less scathing and vitriolic about Wines. I am pointing out the targeting of one player time and time again.

Also if you take your own disgust about Bonner’s game out of it and reread it then it really is OTT and singling him out as the worst player of all time when he wasn’t even the worst player that night.

But if you cannot see that Janus systematically blames one or two scapegoats then you must be reading something different to me.

It is always someone else’s fault other than Ken. It is always one poor bloke without a soul or deliberately handballing to someone’s feet. But how do young men enter Port with talent and dash but after a season or two are a broken shell of a player.

But no please do carry on pointing out how a 22 year old is more responsible than an ancient Hoff or a captain both barely get a mention in his anti Bonner rant why?
 

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Kiss from a Rozee

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Bonner is the weakest link defensively in our back 6 so gets super exposed when our midfield doesn’t apply pressure.

The question is does he provide enough run, is his offensive side worth it?
 

Power Girl

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I think Janus is teeing off a little harder because houston was 20 last year and bonner is already 22. Probably needs to play sanfl tbf.
Very possibly Bonner needs some sanfl time.
My point is the unhinged constant references to Bonner as though he is the Antichrist.

This is not the first time and Bonner won’t be the last. But when will people question why he has got it in for certain individuals but never the senior coach or his favourites.

Next season it will be one of our current newbies who are deliberately sabotaging our chances.
 

Janus

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The way Janus posts about Bonner now reminds me of the way he posted about Houston this time last year.
Now?

1557138408858.png


I'm pretty consistent in saying he's timid and soft as butter in the contest and needs to harden up if he wants to make it. Been saying it for 12 months or so. He's not getting better, whereas Houston took about six months to transform from someone who was unsure of himself, registering a 0 in the B&F against Geelong, into a guy who stormed home in the count in the back half of the year.

When a player isn't improving but still gets games in spite of not hitting the contest like everyone else has to, it's going to have an effect on the psyche of the team. I don't expect him to be some juggernaut, but I do expect him to actually put something more than inferred pressure on opponents and execute the skills that he is in the team for effectively.

I was and still am prepared to give him a shot at it because I like the idea of Bonner in the team running off of half-back with Burton - but there comes a point when you have to cut bait. 12 months with absolutely no improvement in toughness in the contest, in a contract year when he should be making every post a winner, is that time.
 

Power Girl

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Janus is not wrong about Bonner, nothing he has said is wrong
In the showdown preview thread he said ‘we replace Bonner with anyone and we win’
Now are you telling me that you agree that Bonner is the sole source of our problems?
Because this replace Bonner and we are winners seems a little delusional to me
 

Janus

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In the showdown preview thread he said ‘we replace Bonner with anyone and we win’
Now are you telling me that you agree that Bonner is the sole source of our problems?
Because this replace Bonner and we are winners seems a little delusional to me
Nope. It's cause and effect.

An article was written about Port Adelaide's young defence and how good it was last week. But the facts are, it's only as good as the effort the midfield puts in, and when the midfield sees a player who isn't putting in the required effort and putting his head in the hole getting selected every week, it's going to have a massive effect on the statements that the coach says about being hard at the contest.

Hinkley says that there were behavioural and performance standards that needed to be addressed at the end of last year, and I don't see those standards being upheld by Bonner. By replacing him with a player who is willing to uphold those standards, it says to the playing group that we aren't messing around about the standard required to play AFL football. And the entire performance of the team will improve. Ken backed the playing group in against West Coast and for a brief moment, Bonner played the right way (as did everyone else). But then Jonas got injured and it became more about the defenders having to cover for his loss, which exposed his lack of contested ball winning ability.

It's not Bonner the player that is the sole source of our problems, but what he represents. He represents 'near enough is good enough'. He represents the Port Adelaide that is happy to finish 5th-10th every year.

You can be happy about that sort of level of performance if you like. Not me.
 

elpirate

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Ultimately, it's Ken's job to motivate, inspire and discipline the players.

It's Ken's job to give them a plan and the tools to execute.

Ken always finds a way to fail in all of these areas.
 

afl2004

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In the showdown preview thread he said ‘we replace Bonner with anyone and we win’
Now are you telling me that you agree that Bonner is the sole source of our problems?
Because this replace Bonner and we are winners seems a little delusional to me
Well yes he was being phasecious, but any 23 to 28 player on our list would do far better. He doesn't tackle and if he does there weak
 

P4Life

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Very possibly Bonner needs some sanfl time.
My point is the unhinged constant references to Bonner as though he is the Antichrist.

This is not the first time and Bonner won’t be the last. But when will people question why he has got it in for certain individuals but never the senior coach or his favourites.

Next season it will be one of our current newbies who are deliberately sabotaging our chances.
No need to wait until next year it’s DBJ next week.
Just a fact about DBJ he is currently rated the number 1 defender in the AFL for score launches
So yes he has faults but let’s occasionally look at the positives.
 

Janus

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Why do our running half backs turn into flakes, is the better question.

O'Shea, Pittard, DBJ, Bonner. All of them showed glimpses of greatness at one time or another and all end up devoid of confidence. What's the common factor here?
I don't consider Byrne-Jones to be a flake. When he's up the ground he's awesome. He's just a poor one on one defender. He really is a 7/10 player.

Ken wants running half-backs who can defend hard but also get up the ground. He wants players who were like him - the guy who said to a teammate "Look after my man, I'm off to win 3 Browlow votes."
 

Butters Made Me Do It

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I dislike Bonner for different reasons to Janus, primarily that he completely lacks awareness and is as much a bombscare as Adam Kingsley ever was.

I don't think he backs out of contest for being soft, but because he gets lost in decision making, and thats why he looks OK on the outside when its simpler and putrid when the game is hot.

He'd continue looking ok in a side with overloaded defence, or with a convincing structure to minimise the stress on his decision making.
 
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