Preview R9: Changes vs. Richmond

[Carn The Texan]

I read all 39 pages of last week’s changes threads including your contributions, Froggy. It was a contender for a top ten in selection melts.

The key issues were
1) Only a clown would retain Toby Murray
2) Selecting Borlase over N Murray was ridiculous
3) Dropping Edwards was an indication that Nick’s has lost the plot.
4) Dowling must be picked before our underperforming midfielders like Berry.

Four days later and which posters are suggesting that we drop Turray and Borlase? Very little love for Edward’s and Dowling?

Is it possible that the Bigfooty Experts were wrong last week?

It's possible to be bad at selection and still win a game.

Especially when you beat one of the worst teams in the league by a solitary point. With ten seconds to go.

You can enjoy the win and still think we could be better! It's free, and legal to do so.

 

[Peter Doherty]

Way to group everyone together.

Im a Borlase supporter but I don't think 2 or 3 is necessarily wrong or a melt nor would the results have changed?

How are you finding cooks games this year?
Is it possible you were wrong about him?

There were a shit load of melts last Thursday.

In particular, I liked the multiple melts about Keays being named on the ball.

 

[Huntercrow]

He went to tackle the player with the ball ?? How dare he !!!

He left his man Berry to do so. Watch the replay.
I'm not condemning him for it, just saying no one was perfect on Friday night.

 

[jackster83]

It's possible to be bad at selection and still win a game.

Especially when you beat one of the worst teams in the league by a solitary point. With ten seconds to go.

You can enjoy the win and still think we could be better! It's free, and legal to do so.

Few happy clapper types up and about today.

I'm glad they all remembered their passwords this week.

 

[Mattrox]

Few happy clapper types up and about today.

I'm glad they all remembered their passwords this week.

But the naysayers haven't reniged their calls about Turray either.

 

[adelaidecrows]

Few happy clapper types up and about today.

I'm glad they all remembered their passwords this week.

Im fine with the happy clappers celebrating, it was a good win. Enjoyable game, hard to not be happy.

Where I draw the line is people acting like this was a win of wins. Port are a dog shit team and lacked class all over the field and we over ran them. People have lost their minds with some of what i have seen. Good win but it was a good win against a shit team and my word we played like ass for most of the match. We turn up like that against Hawthorn or Sydney they will be 10 goals in front at half time.

 

[Ciao Giacomo]

How are you finding cooks games this year?
Is it possible you were wrong about him?

Are you a one trick pony/froggy?

Please bump all my posts where I have been abusive towards Cook. I have stated on numerous occasions that he has great skill but he couldn’t find enough of the ball. Like many others I could see what he was capable of and it was frustrating to see him make such slow progress over his first four years.

At the start of this season I said that I hoped he would prove me wrong and he has. I was very quick to put my hand up and say he has arrived after four long years. Unlike other posters I am not abusive towards players and/or write off Kids after a game or two in the AFL.

Firstly, my 4 points related to the collective of melters but do you deny going very hard re retaining Toby Murray?

Have you re-evaluated your opinion on Toby Murray?

“Nicks” can’t tell which brother is which

“Nicks” would drop Michael Voss and retain Brett Voss.

Do you think you were a bit harsh on Toby?

 

[TBM]

Did Dawson train today? I hope he's doing alright.

 

[Crow_68]

Did Dawson train today? I hope he's doing alright.

Yes he did.

 

[LC40]

Pedlar is an enigma to me. Does stuff sometimes that makes me think there's a real player there, but goes missing for long periods. I watched the second half replay twice but after you mentioned him I can't remember much at all that he did after 1/2 time.

In 2022 I wrote this about Pedlar

AFC 2022 SANFL Thread​

"It's his workrate, an elite midfielder runs hard both ways. He should follow Ben Keays example, not the most skilled player but works his butt off. Pedlar has a great kick but he is so lazy, sprints for a short burst and then jogs like he's disinterested. He needs a rocket up his a**e, get involved."

Nothing has changed he's a one way player. Puts effort into his forward running but his defensive efforts are really poor. Just doesn't run hard both ways, he picks and chooses when to sprint in defensive efforts. The other tendency I've noticed is his defensive setup. Rarely marks an opponent tightly as a defensive option but chooses to guard a zone. Often found pointing to others to pick up a loose player while he's guarding fresh air.
Some of the more analytical here will say it's the role he's been allocated in a team zone but others don't sag off their opponent to the extent he does to create an impact. If that is his responsibility in a zone defense then the set up is flawed.

Pedlar has a superb kick but isn't involved enough. Right now his impact on the field is not significant enough to excuse his periods of absence.
The coaching stuff need to be blunt...He needs a rocket up his a**e, get involved.

 

[Ciao Giacomo]

Im fine with the happy clappers celebrating, it was a good win. Enjoyable game, hard to not be happy.

Where I draw the line is people acting like this was a win of wins. Port are a dog shit team and lacked class all over the field and we over ran them. People have lost their minds with some of what i have seen. Good win but it was a good win against a shit team and my word we played like ass for most of the match. We turn up like that against Hawthorn or Sydney they will be 10 goals in front at half time.

I can’t think of a single happy clapper who proclaimed it was a great win (certainly not me). We have struggled over the first 8 games and we are lucky to be 4-4.

I said before the game that I would be happy with a one point win…..and I was. The Pear aren’t a great team but they are not a bottom four team. Their good players are very good and they are all playing well (Butters, JHF, Georgiades, Aliir) but they lack depth.
They are missing two influential players (Rozee and SPP), the other missing players are fringe or SANFL level.

We were missing Dawson, Keane, Ah Chee, Fogarty, Hinge and Walker. We played one short for more than 3 quarters and 2 short from late in the third quarter. We had to fly back from Brisbane on a 5 day break and then a lot of key umpiring decisions went against us.

I am just happy to take the win.

 

[FR0GGY]

Are you a one trick pony/froggy?

Please bump all my posts where I have been abusive towards Cook. I have stated on numerous occasions that he has great skill but he couldn’t find enough of the ball. Like many others I could see what he was capable of and it was frustrating to see him make such slow progress over his first four years.

At the start of this season I said that I hoped he would prove me wrong and he has. I was very quick to put my hand up and say he has arrived after four long years. Unlike other posters I am not abusive towards players and/or write off Kids after a game or two in the AFL.

Firstly, my 4 points related to the collective of melters but do you deny going very hard re retaining Toby Murray?

Have you re-evaluated your opinion on Toby Murray?

“Nicks” can’t tell which brother is which

“Nicks” would drop Michael Voss and retain Brett Voss.

Do you think you were a bit harsh on Toby?

I haven’t ever said you’ve abused him, I’ve said you’ve canned him “ball magnet” or been disrespectful (did you not repeatedly spell his name intentionally wrong or have I got that wrong?)

I think it was a strange decision for sure.
If you surveyed 100 people crows and non crows how many would have said Nick would get dropped before Toby.
You say you read my posts yet haven’t worked out majority of my posts are sarcasm?
I’m not sure I actually said we should drop Toby or even had an opinion on Toby?
Unless you’ve attributed posts that I didn’t make to me?

 

[WeeBlake]

But the naysayers haven't reniged their calls about Turray either.

There was widespread praise for his game v port from many people who thought his selection was a mistake. What more do you want?

 

[CrowBloke]

OK ...I get the positive emotion towards players from a win

But this is the same midfield most of this board has been declaring is the worst in the AFL .....can you please make up your mind

Opinions in here wax and wane with the fickleness of injuries and results mate. It's human nature to respond brightly after Friday night --- it set up my weekend, mood-wise --- but deeper issues like:
---Nicks' Selections/inflexibility/lack of flair/dour defensiveness
--- VB's lack of success with our Mids
--- Thilthorpe's form (is he injured, or not?), Pedlar, Taylor, Cumming, Bond.
--- Run-and-carry from defence
all remain.

So who needs to be replaced in the midfield: Dawson, Rachele, Rankine, Soligo, Curtin

--- I'd let Dawson be a roaming Free Agent.
His game sense is very good and he's super-versatile.
If he thinks he should play HB, or forward, or have a run in the midfield (last option not optimal for mine; he's match-fit underdone and still grieving I would think), he can get a message to a runner/Nicks to initiate where he thinks he's needed.
Also, do we have to play Curtin as a mid? ... I'd love to see him roam up and back on a wing, with Cook on the other wing. They both get back to defend, are very skillful and can kick a goal.
That would leave Rachele/Rankine/Soiigo/Berry/Edwards as options for mid rotations, even get Thilthorpe and some Pedlar-mongrel in there now and then.

That would create some flexibility which in general Nicks avoids but I am hoping he'll see the value of letting go of some of his default principles. Of course, we have no influence in the matter, but we can hope!

....please tell me if you believe Berry is a better option than any of these blokes .....and if he is, why are we chasing Zac Bailey

See above. Also, we're chasing Bailey because he'd be a best-23 player and probably replace one of Berry/Edwards/Pedlar/Taylor except in case of injury.
Those 4 players then have all of this year to stamp their mark on the team and make themselves undroppable.

Also ...why was Berry on a games trigger to get a contract for 2027

Because he was not as good when that was added as he is now ...?
It's up to Berry to make himself indispensable to our best-23.
If he doesn't he'd be good trade value, as you suggest below.

My POV ...which we all have, is I'd prefer the weapons Edwards brings to the table .....height, speed, elite kick, and composure under pressure.

I agree.
I saw enough in the Saints game to think he has a big future as a mid with us.
Nicks has got to treat him better by picking him consistently whenever possible, not scapegoat him, and back him in like he did Milera and Cook.

I'd be trading Berry this year .....what do they say, "Buy Low, Sell Hi"
These are the sort of moves that make a difference to Clubs ... I think we can all agree, Bailey is an upgrade on Berry ....and Edwards needs a spot in that midfield rotation.

Agreed --- which has not been our track record --- does this mean we're making a kind of peace??
(I still want Nicks sacked ).

Btw, has Bailey made any noises/hints about wanting to come here? How likely is it?

 

[Ciao Giacomo]

I haven’t ever said you’ve abused him, I’ve said you’ve canned him “ball magnet” or been disrespectful (did you not repeatedly spell his name intentionally wrong or have I got that wrong?)

I think it was a strange decision for sure.
If you surveyed 100 people crows and non crows how many would have said Nick would get dropped before Toby.
You say you read my posts yet haven’t worked out majority of my posts are sarcasm?
I’m not sure I actually said we should drop Toby or even had an opinion on Toby?
Unless you’ve attributed posts that I didn’t make to me?

You compared him to Brett Voss, check out your posts.

 

[adelaidecrows]

I can’t think of a single happy clapper who proclaimed it was a great win (certainly not me). We have struggled over the first 8 games and we are lucky to be 4-4.

I said before the game that I would be happy with a one point win…..and I was. The Pear aren’t a great team but they are not a bottom four team. Their good players are very good and they are all playing well (Butters, JHF, Georgiades, Aliir) but they lack depth.
They are missing two influential players (Rozee and SPP), the other missing players are fringe or SANFL level.

We were missing Dawson, Keane, Ah Chee, Fogarty, Hinge and Walker. We played one short for more than 3 quarters and 2 short from late in the third quarter. We had to fly back from Brisbane on a 5 day break and then a lot of key umpiring decisions went against us.

I am just happy to take the win.

Im not calling people who are celebrating the wins happy clappers. Im happy we won. Im happy when we win every game like everyone else. It was a good win. All I am saying is some people have used this as a narrative winner for their pro nicks views. So go your hardest, celebrate the win.

 

[Mattrox]

There was widespread praise for his game v port from many people who thought his selection was a mistake. What more do you want?

An "I was wrong". An admission that a footy opinion on the internetz does mean a pile of shit.

People are happy to post "I was right" or "I called it" but there is serious lack of "I was wrong".

And this is one of those times.

 

[CrowBloke]

In 2022 I wrote this about Pedlar

AFC 2022 SANFL Thread​

"It's his workrate, an elite midfielder runs hard both ways. He should follow Ben Keays example, not the most skilled player but works his butt off. Pedlar has a great kick but he is so lazy, sprints for a short burst and then jogs like he's disinterested. He needs a rocket up his a**e, get involved."

Nothing has changed he's a one way player. Puts effort into his forward running but his defensive efforts are really poor. Just doesn't run hard both ways, he picks and chooses when to sprint in defensive efforts. The other tendency I've noticed is his defensive setup. Rarely marks an opponent tightly as a defensive option but chooses to guard a zone. Often found pointing to others to pick up a loose player while he's guarding fresh air.
Some of the more analytical here will say it's the role he's been allocated in a team zone but others don't sag off their opponent to the extent he does to create an impact. If that is his responsibility in a zone defense then the set up is flawed.

Pedlar has a superb kick but isn't involved enough. Right now his impact on the field is not significant enough to excuse his periods of absence.
The coaching stuff need to be blunt...He needs a rocket up his a**e, get involved.

Really good, detailed response and analysis, thanks .
This is especially damning:
"Often found pointing to others to pick up a loose player while he's guarding fresh air", which suggests to me that he thinks he's better than he actually is. Like Fogary when he was fresh, I can see that Pedlar would have been a big fish in the Juniors pond, but in the AFL he's a boy amongst an army of tough men.
Pedlar needs to be taken aside by Dawson or Tex or Nicks, someone, and be given some cold, hard facts and be challenged to be better. In fact, I'd like you to explain to him what you said above!

 

[CrowBloke]

Out - Toby Murray, Berry

 

[Daniel6]

The changes this week will depend on who is available and who is injured/needs to be managed.


There are a couple of changes that have to be made, regardless of injuries.

Out - Toby Murray, Berry

In - Edwards, Dowling

Straight from the Phil Davis play book.

 

[FR0GGY]

You compared him to Brett Voss, check out your posts.

Oh come on, I pretty sure you’re smarter than that, unless you think Nick is comparable to Michael?

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

I hear tell BRIS are a pretty good side ..... yet they handball less than us ....and likewise, a lot of their drive comes off Half Back, holding their defensive structure and kicking thru zones

Quite effective if you ask me ....

View attachment 2601768

An elite intercepting team with elite kickers in the back half, that style sure suits them

We're at the other end of the spectrum, hence being the 18th ranked team for D50 to F50 transition.

Add in that Sydney had as many metres gained by handball on Saturday as we've had for the season and you wonder what we're actually doing. Even our wins are absolute grinds.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

An elite intercepting team with elite kickers in the back half, that style sure suits them

We're at the other end of the spectrum, hence being the 18th ranked team for D50 to F50 transition.

Add in that Sydney had as many metres gained by handball on Saturday as we've had for the season and you wonder what we're actually doing. Even our wins are absolute grinds.

I don't understand why people are surprised at this

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I agree.
I saw enough in the Saints game to think he has a big future as a mid with us.
Nicks has got to treat him better by picking him consistently whenever possible, not scapegoat him, and back him in like he did Milera and Cook.

You just posted the opposite on Edwards .....that he was a likely chance to make way for Bailey

There are finer aspects of player's games that go beyond stats .... Berry is essentially a one position player, a player that critically fumbles in pressure moments ....like Finals

You've essentially sat on the fence, not saying he's a lock as a Mid .....oscillating based on each games performance ....that's simply barracking

People, and you included were ready to give up on Cook ..... the art of player development is projection ....not an exact science, but there are mental & physical aspects, that supporters rarely look for

I've always said since both were drafted .... that Berry was a poor man's Pedlar ...I'm happy with that comparison

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Berry