Random Discussion II

[Aphrodite]

Continued from here :-

Random Discussion - NO POLITICS, NO RELIGION

Continued here: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/random-discussion-ii-no-politics-no-religion.1301936/

www.bigfooty.com

 

[HARKER]

Can't disagree with either of you

Wish they would just report the facts, rather than the constant racial tones

You're clearly one of the wiser ones, but this isn't going to be appreciated by the agenda-driven looking for opportunities to drive their bias home and good luck searching for facts over the opportunity to display outrage and moral positioning.

Here's an actual study looking into these matters, headed by Roland G Fryer (who happens to be an African American) - The whole document is in this link -

An Empirical Analysis of Racial Differences in Police Use of Force

Roland G. Fryer J. An Empirical Analysis of Racial Differences in Police Use of Force. Journal of Political Economy. Forthcoming.

scholar.harvard.edu

This is a summary -

This paper explores racial differences in police use of force. On non-lethal uses of force, blacks and Hispanics are more than fifty percent more likely to experience some form of force in interactions with police. Adding controls that account for important context and civilian behavior reduces, but cannot fully explain, these disparities. On the most extreme use of force –officer-involved shootings – we find no racial differences in either the raw data or when contextual factors are taken into account. We argue that the patterns in the data are consistent with a model in which police officers are utility maximizers, a fraction of which have a preference for discrimination, who incur relatively high expected costs of officer-involved shootings.

No one is going to argue for police brutality and no one should applaud racism, but somewhere along the way facts should also come into account.
The paper does state that Hispanics and blacks are treated have a higher rate of force used against them in interactions. This of course shuld be looked at and acted upon evidence and not emotion.

Justice should be just that, not favouring one side (and god, don't we have so many sides) or another.
I trust that policeman gets his just desserts and I 'hope' other non-involved policemen and women (black and white, gay and straight, theist and non-theist) don't have to pay a price. This would be....unjust.

 

[Elmer_Judd]

You're clearly one of the wiser ones, but this isn't going to be appreciated by the agenda-driven looking for opportunities to drive their bias home and good luck searching for facts over the opportunity to display outrage and moral positioning.

Here's an actual study looking into these matters, headed by Roland G Fryer (who happens to be an African American) - The whole document is in this link -

An Empirical Analysis of Racial Differences in Police Use of Force

Roland G. Fryer J. An Empirical Analysis of Racial Differences in Police Use of Force. Journal of Political Economy. Forthcoming.

scholar.harvard.edu

This is a summary -
This paper explores racial differences in police use of force. On non-lethal uses of force, blacks and Hispanics are more than fifty percent more likely to experience some form of force in interactions with police. Adding controls that account for important context and civilian behavior reduces, but cannot fully explain, these disparities. On the most extreme use of force –officer-involved shootings – we find no racial differences in either the raw data or when contextual factors are taken into account. We argue that the patterns in the data are consistent with a model in which police officers are utility maximizers, a fraction of which have a preference for discrimination, who incur relatively high expected costs of officer-involved shootings.

No one is going to argue for police brutality and no one should applaud racism, but somewhere along the way facts should also come into account.
The paper does state that Hispanics and blacks are treated have a higher rate of force used against them in interactions. This of course shuld be looked at and acted upon evidence and not emotion.

Justice should be just that, not favouring one side (and god, don't we have so many sides) or another.
I trust that policeman gets his just desserts and I 'hope' other non-involved policemen and women (black and white, gay and straight, theist and non-theist) don't have to pay a price. This would be....unjust.

Agree with most of what you say Harks, but President Trump is the worst sort of buffoon when it comes to dealing with a crisis like this.

Things are only going to get worse when he starts labelling the Protestors (or at least a segment of them) as terrorists and threatening to bring in the military and have unarmed protesting civilians shot in the streets.

Now I am not defending the selfish rabble that are trashing and looting stores and starting fires etc but I am getting the impression that Trump is almost encouraging another civil war between White and Black America.

 

[Arr0w]

Isn’t that the point though, which has so many African Americans angry/upset, that this wouldn’t have happened to a white man.

So that gives so called protesters the right to flood in from other cities and loot/destroy property?

 

[Arr0w]

You're clearly one of the wiser ones, but this isn't going to be appreciated by the agenda-driven looking for opportunities to drive their bias home and good luck searching for facts over the opportunity to display outrage and moral positioning.

Here's an actual study looking into these matters, headed by Roland G Fryer (who happens to be an African American) - The whole document is in this link -

An Empirical Analysis of Racial Differences in Police Use of Force

Roland G. Fryer J. An Empirical Analysis of Racial Differences in Police Use of Force. Journal of Political Economy. Forthcoming.

scholar.harvard.edu

This is a summary -
This paper explores racial differences in police use of force. On non-lethal uses of force, blacks and Hispanics are more than fifty percent more likely to experience some form of force in interactions with police. Adding controls that account for important context and civilian behavior reduces, but cannot fully explain, these disparities. On the most extreme use of force –officer-involved shootings – we find no racial differences in either the raw data or when contextual factors are taken into account. We argue that the patterns in the data are consistent with a model in which police officers are utility maximizers, a fraction of which have a preference for discrimination, who incur relatively high expected costs of officer-involved shootings.

No one is going to argue for police brutality and no one should applaud racism, but somewhere along the way facts should also come into account.
The paper does state that Hispanics and blacks are treated have a higher rate of force used against them in interactions. This of course shuld be looked at and acted upon evidence and not emotion.

Justice should be just that, not favouring one side (and god, don't we have so many sides) or another.
I trust that policeman gets his just desserts and I 'hope' other non-involved policemen and women (black and white, gay and straight, theist and non-theist) don't have to pay a price. This would be....unjust.

What is never reported, with any gender/race is the level of resistance they show authorities

Make no mistake, what happened to Floyd was appalling and justice is warranted

 

[HARKER]

Agree with most of what you say Harks, but President Trump is the worst sort of buffoon when it comes to dealing with a crisis like this.

Things are only going to get worse when he starts labelling the Protestors (or at least a segment of them) as terrorists and threatening to bring in the military and have unarmed protesting civilians shot in the streets.

Now I am not defending the selfish rabble that are trashing and looting stores and starting fires etc but I am getting the impression that Trump is almost encouraging another civil war between White and Black America.

People like Trump. I can't stand him as much as I couldn't stand Kennett, when he was in office, but somehow things seem to get done.
He'll probably find his way into office again and not so much for what he's doing right but for what the others are doing wrong.
Did you see Bidens reaction to this farce? Anything for some sort of political advantage. It's all so insincere.

 

[HARKER]

What is never reported, with any gender/race is the level of resistance they show authorities

Make no mistake, what happened to Floyd was appalling and justice is warranted

It was sickening and I couldn't watch the whole lot...and I don't care what came about for the officer to impart such disregard for anothers' life.
A life should not have been taken....not a white life, a black life, gender a,b,c +++ , etc etc
Apparently they had history. Is this true?

Anyway, I'll leave it at that. Back to football on this forum.

 

[Aphrodite]

Belongs here :-

SRP

Society, Religion and Politics

A board for grown-ups.

www.bigfooty.com

 

[thylacine60]

Slow news day. I see...
If it makes you feel any better, Quatermain's brother in law is gay.

and?

 

[thylacine60]

No one is going to argue for police brutality and no one should applaud racism, but somewhere along the way facts should also come into account.

when someone isn't satisfied with the protests of the repressed.......somewhere along the way we must find excuses for repressive white authorities........

 

[DangerousD]

So that gives so called protesters the right to flood in from other cities and loot/destroy property?

Is that a serious question?

 

[Robbo's my hero]

Is that a serious question?

Knowing Arr0w I’d say yes.

 

[HARKER]

when someone isn't satisfied with the protests of the repressed.......somewhere along the way we must find excuses for repressive white authorities........

Protest all you want. This is every individuals right and there is a right to protest here.
You do though have to take into account the scope of the protest and how is violence and looting a means to an end?
Some may well applaud this conduct but no one would be applauding it should it be happening to them. Not a black individual, not a white.....no one.

There are many fronts to this story and they should all be confronted but not at the expense of others' lives and livelihoods. That's not.....just.

 

[HARKER]

Is that a serious question?

Is this somehow a controversial view?

I'll tell you what: The day I see someone destroy and set fire to their own shop for a cause, I'll take notice.

 

[Arr0w]

Is that a serious question?

Somewhat retorical, but there are ways with dealing with situations, looting, destruction does not achieve a thing

 

[Jabba73]

Protest all you want. This is every individuals right and there is a right to protest here.
You do though have to take into account the scope of the protest and how is violence and looting a means to an end?
Some may well applaud this conduct but no one would be applauding it should it be happening to them. Not a black individual, not a white.....no one.

There are many fronts to this story and they should all be confronted but not at the expense of others' lives and livelihoods. That's not.....just.

Who is looting and perpetuating violence? Seems the protests have been hijacked for other purposes, some only need an opportunity or excuse, they don’t need a connection to the cause.

 

[Aphrodite]

Take it to SRP thanks.


Where it belongs!

 

[footyfan1978]

and?

42

 

[thylacine60]

fair call.......

 

[Elmer_Judd]

Did I mention the horrible and traumatic nightmare i had last night where I dreamt I was a Hawthorn supporter and been driven out to Waverley Park (A stadium i do greatly miss tbh) wearing a Hawks Jumper and Scarf ?

Aside from their recent loaded premiership success, I have no idea why my subconscious dreamy up the hideous notion of being in Poo and Wee (from a HFC aesthetics point of view)

Also their song is downright terrible, easily the worst out of all the Victorian Clubs (Yankee Doodle Dandy or as a kid growing up, the Roger Ramjet cartoon theme song)

If I had a few dollars for every weird dream/nightmare I had, i could buy out Elon Musk (probably)

 

[HARKER]

Who is looting and perpetuating violence? Seems the protests have been hijacked for other purposes, some only need an opportunity or excuse, they don’t need a connection to the cause.

I don't know every individual involved and neither do you, so we don't really know what the ratio may be and then there's the aggression forced upon innocent individuals.
I agree that people hijack genuine causes for self-serving interests, but the real 'cause' should distance themselves from these types.

Good to hear the family ask for peace. That's a huge call and one in the right direction.

 

[Robbo's my hero]

Did I mention the horrible and traumatic nightmare i had last night where I dreamt I was a Hawthorn supporter and been driven out to Waverley Park (A stadium i do greatly miss tbh) wearing a Hawks Jumper and Scarf ?

Aside from their recent loaded premiership success, I have no idea why my subconscious dreamy up the hideous notion of being in Poo and Wee (from a HFC aesthetics point of view)

Also their song is downright terrible, easily the worst out of all the Victorian Clubs (Yankee Doodle Dandy or as a kid growing up, the Roger Ramjet cartoon theme song)

If I had a few dollars for every weird dream/nightmare I had, i could buy out Elon Musk (probably)

I can top that. I had a dream recently where I was at a game between Carlton and GWS and the light towers collapsed while the game was on. Explain that one.

 

[DangerousD]

Somewhat retorical, but there are ways with dealing with situations, looting, destruction does not achieve a thing

Of course, I’m wondering why you were asking me, I have never suggested that rioting is acceptable behaviour.

 

[DangerousD]

Is this somehow a controversial view?

I'll tell you what: The day I see someone destroy and set fire to their own shop for a cause, I'll take notice.

was only controversial because, I never said or implied that looting or violence was acceptable.

 

[thylacine60]

Protest all you want. This is every individuals right and there is a right to protest here.
You do though have to take into account the scope of the protest and how is violence and looting a means to an end?
Some may well applaud this conduct but no one would be applauding it should it be happening to them. Not a black individual, not a white.....no one.

There are many fronts to this story and they should all be confronted but not at the expense of others' lives and livelihoods. That's not.....just.

ever protested or walked in unison with someone worse off than you?