Discussion Random Discussion

[StFly]

He doesn’t have to answer Kennett but he has to answer to us. It was a simple statement and instead of calling it bullshit he said I don’t respond to that person. Surely he just says it’s untrue and has figures to prove it. But no like any politician just deflects just as you have done by your response. And who knows if they are dying quicker with COVID. No one is giving us figures to say that. They could simply be dying with COVID. As for you not understanding well I don’t understand why doctors have completely different points of view on this virus but they do. It’s pretty easy to fix. Give us figures to show how many more are dying because of COVID. It wouldn’t be hard to find nursing home deaths over the last few years and compare them to now. I have no doubt scare tactics are part of the plan. The problem is more and more people care less and less about the virus. You can only scare people for so long. If stage 3 isn’t lifted before the grand final all that will happen is thousands if not hundred of thousands will break the law.

my dad is 83 and he will die if he gets COVID. That is 100% certain but he would rather people come visit him than never see those people again.

by the way I still say the virus is very dangerous for some but doing all this lockdown stuff is also very dangerous for some. Maybe suicides haven’t increased yet but they certainly may

It's a moving target you nong, and if effects everyone, not just some. The inherent risk of death is different, but once you get it, you got it and someone like me with pre-exsiting issues don't want to know you exist.

You also have current outbreaks in institutions designed to house the at risk, that was previously gutted with support instances and you are sitting there demanding hard facts? Are you all there? Do you need help?

I mean, I am 35 with pre-exsiting conditions, likely I'll also die if I get covid, which is why your comments on it s**t me to tears, dunno what age has to do with it TBH, but I'd rather people stay away to reduce risk, my old man is much the same and he entertains away from me and they arrive in masks and such as they are acutely aware he's also still recovering from surgery. Says more about us and upbringing than what needs to be done.

But then I was also lucky beign born into farmers, so you know, knowing the value of work, how drive, how to tend the land how to do things before I was 10, even with health things means when I grew up to be an adult, well, I cherish it more than you seem to do so.

Kind of unrelated but if you live more than 5k from someone but are their nominated visitor, can you still go?

Yes, you are, provided you are not crossing state boundaries, this falls under caregiving.

 

[plugger66]

It's a moving target you nong, and if effects everyone, not just some. The inherent risk of death is different, but once you get it, you got it and someone like me with pre-exsiting issues don't want to know you exist.

You also have current outbreaks in institutions designed to house the at risk, that was previously gutted with support instances and you are sitting there demanding hard facts? Are you all there? Do you need help?

I mean, I am 35 with pre-exsiting conditions, likely I'll also die if I get covid, which is why your comments on it sh*t me to tears, dunno what age has to do with it TBH, but I'd rather people stay away to reduce risk, my old man is much the same and he entertains away from me and they arrive in masks and such as they are acutely aware he's also still recovering from surgery. Says more about us and upbringing than what needs to be done.

But then I was also lucky beign born into farmers, so you know, knowing the value of work, how drive, how to tend the land how to do things before I was 10, even with health things means when I grew up to be an adult, well, I cherish it more than you seem to do so.



Yes, you are, provided you are not crossing state boundaries, this falls under caregiving.

the point is if you pre existing conditions you are always a chance of getting it unless there is a vaccine so unfortunately for people like that you won’t be going to the pub even if we allowed. Or the footy or shopping centres This isn’t going to be eliminated. Look at New Zealand. They thought it was.

so what is your answer? And I’m all there. And no I don’t need help. Why can’t they provide facts. I really don’t even get your point. Dont you want real information. Do want to use guess work all the time? I have no clue about you but you seem to know things about me. Unfortunately your guesses are terrible. I’m glad you grew up on a farm. I grew up in east Bentleigh. Both irrelevant to the topic.

 

[NarklesHelmet]

Living in a country (Sweden) that hasn’t locked down, here’s my perspective.

Not locking down has done very little for the economy positively. Compared to our neighbors who have locked down, differences aren’t great at all.

Deaths and community transmission are much higher than our neighbors though.

And here’s the thing. I’ve had COVID. My brother-in-law and sister-in-law have as well as well as many friends. And out of them, 70% of us have had ongoing symptoms months later. Fatigue, reduced lung capacity, increased blood pressure, night sweats. The thing just won’t go away.

People focus on deaths but what they don’t focus on is how we know little about this virus and the long-term effects of it. The long-term effects on the economy if a lot of people get it in your country will be devastating. The only thing saving us here at the moment is many of us with long-term effects who are working from home are able to rest when fatigued etc. I could honestly say if I had to work at the office now, I and many others would be on long term sick leave (this coming from someone who was very healthy and active pre-COVID).

On the mental health aspect, most people who have office jobs are actually doing well not having to commute so it balances out with those struggling not being able to visit relatives etc.

My advice to family and friends in Australia is, as frustrating as it is with lockdown, thank god you are not opening up and letting it run wild through your society. The long-term effects of this thing are going to be catastrophic for those societies that have let it run wild.. and for negligible economic benefit and a great loss of life.

 

[plugger66]

Living in a country (Sweden) that hasn’t locked down, here’s my perspective.

Not locking down has done very little for the economy positively. Compared to our neighbors who have locked down, differences aren’t great at all.

Deaths and community transmission. are a much higher than our neighbors though.

And here’s the thing. I’ve had COVID. My brother-in-law and sister-in-law have as well as well as many friends. And out of them, 70% of us have had ongoing symptoms months later. Fatigue, reduced lung capacity, increased blood pressure, night sweats. The thing just won’t go away.

People focus on deaths but what they don’t focus on is how we know little about this virus and the long-term effects of it. The long-term effects on the economy if a lot of people get it in your country will be devastating. The only thing saving us here at the moment is many of us with long-term effects who are working from home are able to rest when fatigued etc. I could honestly say if I had to work at the office now, I and many others would be in long term sick leave (this coming from someone who was very healthy and active pre-COVID).

On the mental health aspect, most people who have office jobs are actually doing well not having to commute so it balances out with those struggling not being able to visit relatives etc.

My advice to family and friends in Australia is, as frustrating as it is with lockdown, thanks god you are not opening up and letting it run wild through your society. The long-term effects of this thing are going to be catastrophic for those societies that have let it run wild.. and for negligible economic benefit and a great loss of life.

No one wants to completely open up. Well I’m sure a few do but that would be crazy. That doesn’t mean basically complete lockdown works either. It’s about balance. What happens if they can’t get a vaccine? We can’t go on forever with limited work or limited sport or limited crowds and we also can’t go on with border closures. And you say most with office jobs are doing well not commuting but in my last job face to face conversations was an important part of the job and mental health. As I say it’s balance and it’s not going away soon.

 

[gringo2011]

It's so silly to you because you think people actually think nobody has died from COVID.

So you don't want to even question why we are in the situation we're in? You will just trust whatever government tells you? It's a good thing this kind of thinking is dying away. If we let government dictate to us what we can and can't do we are truly stuffed. Like blindly downloading an intrusive app because the government said it will stop the spread of the virus. Or how they leaked private medical records of thousands of people. Or how they want to remove independent news from social media. Or how they are land clearing for their own financial gain at the expense of endangered wildlife. Or how they plunged this nation into the most debt it has ever been in pre COVID. They've done enough over a long enough period of time for people to stop and think/question it.


Who said anyone doubted people were dying from it. I said 6% of the deaths in America have been solely from COVID. The other 94% had COVID but died from other causes.

It's a sample size of 330 million people so it's probably safe to assume the percentages are similar in our country, if not even lower than that given we locked down quicker and harder than they did.

You say questioning what is going on is tinfoil ridiculousness but the same can be said of those who just blindly believe whatever their government tells them. That is ridiculous too. I think at this point people are well within their right to question the severity of the virus and why entire states and countries need to be closed down for an entire year because two sections of our society are falling ill.


Hear absolutely nothing from them about the all conquering app anymore. Wonder why. Out of sight out of mind.

Stewart66 it should read "We are all Melburnians if it's good for a vote"

Victorians don't vote Liberal. They don't like victorians.

 

[George]

Victorians don't vote Liberal. They don't like victorians.

Sad that it's really that simple haha

 

[gringo2011]

No one wants to completely open up. Well I’m sure a few do but that would be crazy. That doesn’t mean basically complete lockdown works either. It’s about balance. What happens if they can’t get a vaccine? We can’t go on forever with limited work or limited sport or limited crowds and we also can’t go on with border closures. And you say most with office jobs are doing well not commuting but in my last job face to face conversations was an important part of the job and mental health. As I say it’s balance and it’s not going away soon.

That's why you try to knock it out rather than pull up short. The problem is no-one really knows. what long term effects getting it can give. Research still doesn't understand it properly even. It could go on for year but the less cases now the better long term hopefully. Other states will have break outs too and the country will be in and out of lockdowns. The less out there the less lock downs. The article below illustrates how little is understood.

A Supercomputer Analyzed Covid-19 — and an Interesting New Theory Has Emerged

A closer look at the Bradykinin hypothesis

elemental.medium.com

 

[plugger66]

That's why you try to knock it out rather than pull up short. The problem is no-one really knows. what long term effects getting it can give. Research still doesn't understand it properly even. It could go on for year but the less cases now the better long term hopefully. Other states will have break outs too and the country will be in and out of lockdowns. The less out there the less lock downs. The article below illustrates how little is understood.

A Supercomputer Analyzed Covid-19 — and an Interesting New Theory Has Emerged

A closer look at the Bradykinin hypothesis

elemental.medium.com

So what do we do? The same as now? That’s no way to live. Less cases now is great but what happens if we don’t get to this magical 5 for 14 days in a row by the end of October. Just keep it going. My real point is less and less people are obeying full lockdown. What happens in stage 3. It will be party time. This is what lockdown fatigue is coming to.

 

[StFly]

So what do we do? The same as now? That’s no way to live. Less cases now is great but what happens if we don’t get to this magical 5 for 14 days in a row by the end of October. Just keep it going. My real point is less and less people are obeying full lockdown. What happens in stage 3. It will be party time. This is what lockdown fatigue is coming to.

Martial law is a thing.

There's your end game in "party time" if we're still in state of emergency.

 

[plugger66]

Martial law is a thing.

There's your end game in "party time" if we're still in state of emergency.

Riddles. There is more out and about now than stage 3 last time. Just get on the roads during the day to see. They can’t fine or arrest everyone

 

[StCicatriz]

Completely spot on, have to be in denial these days to think otherwise. Haven't seen a single person dispute any of what you've said either, just the honest truth. They have ruined this country.


Nope people have every right to question, illegal to put wrong cause of death but also illegal to disallow protest until government makes a new rule to take care of that. Point being they will do whatever they want to do, naive to think these people are doing the best by us in year 2020. Or at the very least to take them on their word all the time.


Haha why still defend it, said it from the start that it would be a disaster, got roasted on here because apparently I wasn't serious about helping save lives. Spin. Now look. Just add it to the very long list of Liberal stuff ups. Not like I'm a genius either, it was obvious it wouldn't work.


I was like you then I thought why does a country of 25 million people that has 2000 active cases still think keeping us locked in our homes and destroying small business is a good idea? Want to be very clear here too. I am not saying it definitely IS for different motives all I am saying is that it is time to question it. There's a very large discrepency IMO from the number of cases we have to the governments response. You'd think we'd be recording tens of thousands of cases a day. 65% of cases are coming from two sections of society yet the entire state has to remain in lockdown. QLD, WA, SA, NSW with almost no cases between them yet still refuse to open borders. It is counter intuitive. It cannot be because they have our best interests at heart because if they did they would've taken into account mental health and suicide which people are dying from far more than COVID.

I also wonder why this country is trying to ban independent news from social media. Makes me wonder why they are against what is essentially free speech. You could say it's to control the narrative of what we are fed from a media that are in bed with the current government. Murdoch runs this country as much as Morrison. I wonder why the government does these things.

Perhaps they aren't all that they seem, Joffa.


100% spot on my friend. It is a complete shambles.

Its actually been quite effective...

 

[George]

 

[gringo2011]

So what do we do? The same as now? That’s no way to live. Less cases now is great but what happens if we don’t get to this magical 5 for 14 days in a row by the end of October. Just keep it going. My real point is less and less people are obeying full lockdown. What happens in stage 3. It will be party time. This is what lockdown fatigue is coming to.

I think we will have a stage 3 set up if it hasn't gone down enough. I think they are wary of promising too much too early. When ever they let up Victorians have just dropped their guard. Until people stop doing the wrong thing we will have a big stick approach. I still see people saying it's not real. It's very easily spread and no-one thinks they'll get it. If you do you can have life long damage done to your health.

The weather is improving and UV has probably saved some of the northern states from as much spread as we have had. Hopefully it helps start bringing numbers right back in. It will be a lot further spread here and interstate and the right conditions will flare it back up. The more we do now to eradicate it the better.

 

[Stewart66]

Living in a country (Sweden) that hasn’t locked down, here’s my perspective.

Not locking down has done very little for the economy positively. Compared to our neighbors who have locked down, differences aren’t great at all.

Deaths and community transmission are much higher than our neighbors though.

And here’s the thing. I’ve had COVID. My brother-in-law and sister-in-law have as well as well as many friends. And out of them, 70% of us have had ongoing symptoms months later. Fatigue, reduced lung capacity, increased blood pressure, night sweats. The thing just won’t go away.

People focus on deaths but what they don’t focus on is how we know little about this virus and the long-term effects of it. The long-term effects on the economy if a lot of people get it in your country will be devastating. The only thing saving us here at the moment is many of us with long-term effects who are working from home are able to rest when fatigued etc. I could honestly say if I had to work at the office now, I and many others would be on long term sick leave (this coming from someone who was very healthy and active pre-COVID).

On the mental health aspect, most people who have office jobs are actually doing well not having to commute so it balances out with those struggling not being able to visit relatives etc.

My advice to family and friends in Australia is, as frustrating as it is with lockdown, thank god you are not opening up and letting it run wild through your society. The long-term effects of this thing are going to be catastrophic for those societies that have let it run wild.. and for negligible economic benefit and a great loss of life.

Yeah mate appears the virus attacks & damages organs , arteries they are now just realising the after
effects several months after Covid ..fatigue is common.

 

[Stewart66]

Really good idea to enter trade war with China , wonder where all our business will be going.

Fresh water resources in Russia

Россия в условиях изменения климата. Все об изменении климата, уязвимости и стратегий адаптации для всех европейских стран.

www.climatechangepost.com

Huawei Just Launched 5G In Russia With Putin's Support: 'Hello Splinternet'

Huaewi's new 5G deployment in Moscow is wrapped in real political significance.

www.forbes.com

Russia Cuts Off Wheat, Other Grain Exports

The Russian Agriculture Ministry announced on April 26 that it was suspending its export of most grains until July 1, seemingly shrugging off warnings from international organizations who are asking countries not to disrupt global food supply chains during the current COVID-19 pandemic.

www.rferl.org

Guinea set to supply iron ore from 2026 | Hellenic Shipping News Worldwide

Development of the Simandou blocks in Guinea will not only increase the country’s iron ore exports but will also prompt Chinese importers to shift some iron ore imports away from Australia to Guinea, which will add to dry bulk shipping demand. Guinea has already become the world’s largest...

www.hellenicshippingnews.com

 

[pebblesofsand]

Really good idea to enter trade war with China , wonder where all our business will be going.

Fresh water resources in Russia

Россия в условиях изменения климата. Все об изменении климата, уязвимости и стратегий адаптации для всех европейских стран.

www.climatechangepost.com

Huawei Just Launched 5G In Russia With Putin's Support: 'Hello Splinternet'

Huaewi's new 5G deployment in Moscow is wrapped in real political significance.

www.forbes.com

Russia Cuts Off Wheat, Other Grain Exports

The Russian Agriculture Ministry announced on April 26 that it was suspending its export of most grains until July 1, seemingly shrugging off warnings from international organizations who are asking countries not to disrupt global food supply chains during the current COVID-19 pandemic.

www.rferl.org

Guinea set to supply iron ore from 2026 | Hellenic Shipping News Worldwide

Development of the Simandou blocks in Guinea will not only increase the country’s iron ore exports but will also prompt Chinese importers to shift some iron ore imports away from Australia to Guinea, which will add to dry bulk shipping demand. Guinea has already become the world’s largest...

www.hellenicshippingnews.com

Yeah - All the way with USA is working a treat after we supported them in the ill advised push against China.

Great to see to USA stepping up to fill the barley shortfall in China caused by the tariffs imposed on Australian Barley.

Bet Californian wine growers will be lining up so happy to "help" their aussie mates as well.

Blind Freddy could see what would happen but that didn't stop the Muppets in Canberra.

 

[gringo2011]

Yeah - All the way with USA is working a treat after we supported them in the ill advised push against China.

Great to see to USA stepping up to fill the barley shortfall in China caused by the tariffs imposed on Australian Barley.

Bet Californian wine growers will be lining up so happy to "help" their aussie mates as well.

Blind Freddy could see what would happen but that didn't stop the Muppets in Canberra.

And we gave the fracking and gas industries a blank cheque to go and waste as much as they want to rebuild our economy. Fracking costs more than you can sell the gas for and gas exporters make us pay more than retail overseas to wholesale our gas back to us that we own. You couldn't have given it to a better bunch of criminals. Lucky they are great economic managers or we'd be ****ed.

 

[Stewart66]

Yeah - All the way with USA is working a treat after we supported them in the ill advised push against China.

Great to see to USA stepping up to fill the barley shortfall in China caused by the tariffs imposed on Australian Barley.

Bet Californian wine growers will be lining up so happy to "help" their aussie mates as well.

Blind Freddy could see what would happen but that didn't stop the Muppets in Canberra.

Sorry mate it’s all Russia now going forward except Iron Ore , in serious trouble .

'Just shut up': Export giants slam handling of China relationship

Exporters to China fear they could be next in the firing line as politics gets in the way of business with Australia's largest trading partner.

www.afr.com

Meanwhile for the climate change deniers .

Live updates: Wildfires in California, Oregon and Washington

About 40 large fires are burning across Oregon, California and Washington. Follow here for the latest.

edition.cnn.com

We have destroyed 3 times the size of Canberra ( trees ) in Queensland alone in 6 years.

Have a look at what NSW Nationals doing today won’t be a Koala in the state in 20years.

Think about it.


Anyway said enough .

 

[StFly]

Sorry mate it’s all Russia now going forward except Iron Ore , in serious trouble .

'Just shut up': Export giants slam handling of China relationship

Exporters to China fear they could be next in the firing line as politics gets in the way of business with Australia's largest trading partner.

www.afr.com

Meanwhile for the climate change deniers .

Live updates: Wildfires in California, Oregon and Washington

About 40 large fires are burning across Oregon, California and Washington. Follow here for the latest.

edition.cnn.com

We have destroyed 3 times the size of Canberra ( trees ) in Queensland alone in 6 years.

Have a look at what NSW Nationals doing today won’t be a Koala in the state in 20years.

Think about it.


Anyway said enough .

We have wetlands, metro Melbourne wanna demo it and put houses in, subdivide it all and piss off nature, each meeting we tell them where to shove it and the avenues to GTFO.

 

[plugger66]

Yeah - All the way with USA is working a treat after we supported them in the ill advised push against China.

Great to see to USA stepping up to fill the barley shortfall in China caused by the tariffs imposed on Australian Barley.

Bet Californian wine growers will be lining up so happy to "help" their aussie mates as well.

Blind Freddy could see what would happen but that didn't stop the Muppets in Canberra.

Yep China will look after us. They always do. It’s proven. Some live in fantasyland.

 

[plugger66]

Lockdown working in east Bentleigh. Only half of east Bentleigh out and about today. 2 weeks should see the other 50% out. But no lockdown fatigue. All good.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

the point is if you pre existing conditions you are always a chance of getting it unless there is a vaccine so unfortunately for people like that you won’t be going to the pub even if we allowed. Or the footy or shopping centres This isn’t going to be eliminated. Look at New Zealand. They thought it was.

so what is your answer? And I’m all there. And no I don’t need help. Why can’t they provide facts. I really don’t even get your point. Dont you want real information. Do want to use guess work all the time? I have no clue about you but you seem to know things about me. Unfortunately your guesses are terrible. I’m glad you grew up on a farm. I grew up in east Bentleigh. Both irrelevant to the topic.

If he went to the footy in a full MCG and all the others were from Weribee or Altona, there would be 70 people somewhere in the crowd that might give him the virus.
If all the others were from Dandenong, there would be 30 spreaders somewhere in the crowd.
If all the others were from Frankston , there would be 10 spreaders somewhere in the crowd. If it was a Pub in Frankston, there's a very slim chance someone there has it.
If all the others were from Wodonga there is probably no-one in the crowd with it. Also the Wodonga pub is probably a pretty safe bet.

So if Victoria can get to a level like Queensland or W.A. or New Zealand, the risk of him getting it in a pub is getting pretty low.
Remember If someone went to a pub and had Covid19 not everyone would get it. But some people would get it and spread it, and others would have dire consequences if they caught it.
The whole thing is about improving the odds. I don't know how risk adverse McFly is, but i'd think he can get into a pub again.

NZ did eliminate it. They let it back in. Apparently their border security people "didn't like" having to be tested for Covid. Maybe we can send them some security guards to make sure their Border Security do it right.

 

[plugger66]

If he went to the footy in a full MCG and all the others were from Weribee or Altona, there would be 70 people somewhere in the crowd that might give him the virus.
If all the others were from Dandenong, there would be 30 spreaders somewhere in the crowd.
If all the others were from Frankston , there would be 10 spreaders somewhere in the crowd. If it was a Pub in Frankston, there's a very slim chance someone there has it.
If all the others were from Wodonga there is probably no-one in the crowd with it. Also the Wodonga pub is probably a pretty safe bet.

So if Victoria can get to a level like Queensland or W.A. or New Zealand, the risk of him getting it in a pub is getting pretty low.
Remember If someone went to a pub and had Covid19 not everyone would get it. But some people would get it and spread it, and others would have dire consequences if they caught it.
The whole thing is about improving the odds. I don't know how risk adverse McFly is, but i'd think he can get into a pub again.

NZ did eliminate it. They let it back in. Apparently their border security people "didn't like" having to be tested for Covid. Maybe we can send them some security guards to make sure their Border Security do it right.

There are 5 known cases in east Bentleigh at the moment so technically no one can get it is east Bentleigh as those 5 should be isolating. The problem is the unknowns. And then there are people who luckily don’t get it and person next to them does. Anyway I’m sick of it and by the crowds in east Bentleigh today so is half of the suburb and I doubt my suburb is different to others. Lockdown fatigue causes this.

 

[George]

We have destroyed 3 times the size of Canberra ( trees ) in Queensland alone in 6 years.

Have a look at what NSW Nationals doing today won’t be a Koala in the state in 20years.

Think about it.


Anyway said enough .

It's a disgrace

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Lockdown working in east Bentleigh. Only half of east Bentleigh out and about today. 2 weeks should see the other 50% out. But no lockdown fatigue. All good.

I saw 2 lots of lawn contractors doing the sides of the roads this morning. I think of you every time i see one.
They must be using the "government work " loophole.
Everything the government ( including local ) does is vital.

Of course you can't wait two months to install new curbing on a road that's probably been there since before there were cars and never had Curbing.
This is only the stuff I see, I wonder what other trivia is deemed essential simply due to being "government work".