Discussion Random Discussion

[jwikked]

And what does NASA know about the Aussie bushfires?
Do they get in under the eucalyptus trees and study excessive fuel loads and hazard reduction techniques?
Have they spoken with Aboriginal elders and firefighters on the ground?
Are they planning on sending astronauts to fight the bushfires? (I thought they were more interested in going to Mars).

That link or whatever you're trying to convey has no relevance to the post of mine you quoted or what I have been discussing.

Global warming and climate change has a hell of a lot to do with bushfires. But it’s irrelevant really, why does it need to be bushfire related? You’ve been clear you think climate change isn’t being influenced by mankind. You seem to enjoy hearing from experts, so I have you a link to the culmination of hundreds (even thousands perhaps) of experts who explain how the climate is changing and our role in that.

 

[Johnnyrayflamingo]

Global warming and climate change has a hell of a lot to do with bushfires. But it’s irrelevant really, why does it need to be bushfire related? You’ve been clear you think climate change isn’t being influenced by mankind. You seem to enjoy hearing from experts, so I have you a link to the culmination of hundreds (even thousands perhaps) of experts who explain how the climate is changing and our role in that.

I have never said any of that so don't put words in my mouth and no, climate change has very little or had no effect on the savageness of the bushfires this season as detailed by the bushfire experts I have listed.

NASA doesn't study Australian bushfires in the South East of our country. Your link is irrelevant.

 

[bergholt]

I have never said any of that so don't put words in my mouth and no, climate change has very little or no effect on the savageness of the bushfires this season as prescribed by the bushfire experts I have listed.

I reckon that's probably true. And yet climate change will have an effect next time, or the time after. So this bushfire season is a good example of what we should be trying to avoid by taking action on climate change.

 

[jwikked]

I have never said any of that so don't put words in my mouth and no, climate change has very little or had no effect on the savageness of the bushfires this season as detailed by the bushfire experts I have listed.

NASA doesn't study Australian bushfires in the South East of our country. Your link is irrelevant.

Of course climate change has had an impact.
Days hotter than 40 degrees are far more dangerous than a day that’s 30 degrees.
More days over 40 degrees means more fire danger.
2019 was the second hottest year on record. That absolutely has an impact on our bushfires.

 

[Johnnyrayflamingo]

I reckon that's probably true. And yet climate change will have an effect next time, or the time after. So this bushfire season is a good example of what we should be trying to avoid by taking action on climate change.

Australia can and will never effect the global climate at 1% total of emissions. Its reality smack bang in your face. We are down there with the likes of Algeria, Iraq and Uzbekistan.

The big 5 at 65% I believe it is could though but it won't ever happen for a very long time. Keep dreaming. China is in the process of building/financing 300 coal fired plants for developing countries around the world right now. Lots more co2 to come.

 

[Johnnyrayflamingo]

Of course climate change has had an impact.
Days hotter than 40 degrees are far more dangerous than a day that’s 30 degrees.
More days over 40 degrees means more fire danger.
2019 was the second hottest year on record. That absolutely has an impact on our bushfires.

Not according to the bushfire experts like Packham, Underwood and Jurskis. Its all to do with the built up fuel loads mainly that have stockpiled for many different reasons listed by them. Its the main cause behind the ferocity of the current bushfires.

 

[Crusty Undies]

Not according to the bushfire experts like Packham, Underwood and Jurskis. Its all to do with the built up fuel loads mainly that have stockpiled for many different reasons listed by them. Its the main cause behind the ferocity of the current bushfires.

Right so that's what, 3 experts you have as evidence. Now compare that to the literal hundreds of experts saying that climate change is the cause and that hazard reduction burns are practically impossible due to increased temperatures and reduced rainfall. Not to mention that hazard reduction burns play only a small role in overall hazard reduction. So please do explain again how we're delusional for believing the group with a factor of about 300 more experts supporting?

 

[gringo2011]

This is pointless. You blokes are so biased it's not funny. You contradict yourselves at every corner not listening to these blokes and firies on the ground plus bushfire experts in Jurksis, Underwood and Packham.

I think some of you fellas have been sucked into this over hyped catastrophic doomer mindset big time. But there are always ulterior motives for some as they are so desperate to push this man made climate change agenda and link it to the 19/20 bushfires. Sad really. These devious people are the worst and if you think they are all there just to save and green the planet then you are f'ing dreaming or on the shard.

Australia and the globe will keep spinning folks.

I have told you numerous time, the VFFA is not real. It is literally an organisation designed to misinform while pretending to be something they are not. I'll try to make this simple for you, it's like a Bulldogs cheer squad member started the Saints Supporters Club of Australia. He starts off saying that we are broke then a few months later starts pushing it harder and demands that we move to Tasmania saying he's seen the "real" figures. He says he's backed by the huge membership of his SSCA and that real fans want to move before it's too late. Dumb journalist report it and idiot fans get behind him and start demanding the club moves. The club and AFL deny there is an issue but an ignorant fringe won't listen no matter what they say.

 

[gringo2011]

Ferocity of bushfires in Australia will experience ‘exponential effect’ without intervention

Without adequate management and fire reduction burn offs, the ferocity of Australia's fires will continue to incur an "exponential effect" to the point where "no firefighting force known to man" can stop it, says bushfire specialist Roger Underwood. Mr Underwood said he is "very worried" that...

www.skynews.com.au

Packham and Underwood together. Decades of expert bushfire expierence between them. What would they know...

And don't use Sky News and Peda Credlin to discredit them. Its not relevant.

Packham and Underwood have been saying the same things for years on end. Decades even.

Its great millions of Aussies are listening to and hearing guys like this at the moment. I have passed this onto all my friends, family and work colleagues.

Moral decay used a car mechanic analogy but to make it even simpler, if you had a guy from the fire brigade come and put out a fire at your house. Would you believe that he knew how the fire started or the conditions that lead to it or would you believe the forensic fire investigation team who is actually trained in the forensic techniques to assess the cause?

 

[gringo2011]

Right so that's what, 3 experts you have as evidence. Now compare that to the literal hundreds of experts saying that climate change is the cause and that hazard reduction burns are practically impossible due to increased temperatures and reduced rainfall. Not to mention that hazard reduction burns play only a small role in overall hazard reduction. So please do explain again how we're delusional for believing the group with a factor of about 300 more experts supporting?

They are all from the VFFA they are frauds.

 

[jwikked]

Not according to the bushfire experts like Packham, Underwood and Jurskis. Its all to do with the built up fuel loads mainly that have stockpiled for many different reasons listed by them. Its the main cause behind the ferocity of the current bushfires.

If those experts don’t believe a 40 degree day means a higher chance of fire danger, then they are simply wrong.
I have no doubt even the cherry picked few would have no problems linking hot days with higher risk of bushfires.

 

[bergholt]

Australia can and will never effect the global climate at 1% total of emissions. Its reality smack bang in your face. We are down there with the likes of Algeria, Iraq and Uzbekistan.

Nah, that's not how international negotiations work. Read up on the Montreal Protocol, which got rid of CFCs in the 80s so our ozone hole isn't getting worse. (Without it our skin cancer rates would be 10x worse.) It worked because many countries, big and small, all took action at the same time. There weren't too many countries sitting out saying "not our problem".

Anyway, it's an opportunity for Australia. If we could be bothered we'd be developing the next generation of sustainable agriculture and making a whole new export industry, but we're a lazy country full of shitty big companies who don't bother to innovate, so we're just sitting around arguing the toss.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Not according to the bushfire experts like Packham, Underwood and Jurskis. Its all to do with the built up fuel loads mainly that have stockpiled for many different reasons listed by them. Its the main cause behind the ferocity of the current bushfires.

Hey Johnnyray - I don't know why I'm bothering since you have a complete inability to engage in critical thinking at even the most basic level but for the sake of an "argument" let say your "experts" are right and its all about fuel loads.

Now this is one of the many simple (yet unanswered questions) I've put to you before. Have you ever tried to light a campfire with green fire wood before?

If you have then you'd know that the bloody thing just wouldn't burn no matter how much green wood you pile on top. Bloody thing just smoulders and smokes and doesn't even get hot enough to cook your sausages.

So Johnnyray - and here's another simple question for you to fail to answer - Why does that happen if its only about fuel loads?

Here's a website for you - I think you desperately need it.

Critical Thinking | SkillsYouNeed

Develop your critical thinking skills. Boost your ability to solve problems and make the right decisions at work, home and in study.

www.skillsyouneed.com

"Critical thinking requires you to use your ability to reason. It is about being an active learner rather than a passive recipient of information."

I'd really love to know something more about you because if you have any sort of intelligence our education system has clearly failed you and we should feel sympathy for you.

 

[Crusty Undies]

They are all from the VFFA they are frauds.

I was trying to grant a few inches to win a few metres but it seems like that didn't work on old mate either...

 

[Johnnyrayflamingo]

I have told you numerous time, the VFFA is not real. It is literally an organisation designed to misinform while pretending to be something they are not. I'll try to make this simple for you, it's like a Bulldogs cheer squad member started the Saints Supporters Club of Australia. He starts off saying that we are broke then a few months later starts pushing it harder and demands that we move to Tasmania saying he's seen the "real" figures. He says he's backed by the huge membership of his SSCA and that real fans want to move before it's too late. Dumb journalist report it and idiot fans get behind him and start demanding the club moves. The club and AFL deny there is an issue but an ignorant fringe won't listen no matter what they say.

Seriously, what are you on about?

I couldn't give a **** about the VFFA. Stop being devious.

 

[Johnnyrayflamingo]

Right so that's what, 3 experts you have as evidence. Now compare that to the literal hundreds of experts saying that climate change is the cause and that hazard reduction burns are practically impossible due to increased temperatures and reduced rainfall. Not to mention that hazard reduction burns play only a small role in overall hazard reduction. So please do explain again how we're delusional for believing the group with a factor of about 300 more experts supporting?

Read up on the subject a bit more and listen to the bushfire experts.

You're pullimg numbers out of your arse but greenie lefties are very good at mob rules.

 

[Johnnyrayflamingo]

Hey Johnnyray - I don't know why I'm bothering since you have a complete inability to engage in critical thinking at even the most basic level but for the sake of an "argument" let say your "experts" are right and its all about fuel loads.

Now this is one of the many simple (yet unanswered questions) I've put to you before. Have you ever tried to light a campfire with green fire wood before?

If you have then you'd know that the bloody thing just wouldn't burn no matter how much green wood you pile on top. Bloody thing just smoulders and smokes and doesn't even get hot enough to cook your sausages.

So Johnnyray - and here's another simple question for you to fail to answer - Why does that happen if its only about fuel loads?

Here's a website for you - I think you desperately need it.

Critical Thinking | SkillsYouNeed

Develop your critical thinking skills. Boost your ability to solve problems and make the right decisions at work, home and in study.

www.skillsyouneed.com

"Critical thinking requires you to use your ability to reason. It is about being an active learner rather than a passive recipient of information."

I'd really love to know something more about you because if you have any sort of intelligence our education system has clearly failed you and we should feel sympathy for you.

I have a masters and earn 6 figures.

Like your mates, your arrogance and hubris is astounding. Get a grip on reality. Safe space time for you son.

 

[Johnnyrayflamingo]

Nah, that's not how international negotiations work. Read up on the Montreal Protocol, which got rid of CFCs in the 80s so our ozone hole isn't getting worse. (Without it our skin cancer rates would be 10x worse.) It worked because many countries, big and small, all took action at the same time. There weren't too many countries sitting out saying "not our problem".

Anyway, it's an opportunity for Australia. If we could be bothered we'd be developing the next generation of sustainable agriculture and making a whole new export industry, but we're a lazy country full of shitty big companies who don't bother to innovate, so we're just sitting around arguing the toss.

Disagree mate.

 

[George]

Cerrone is stiff as a board.

Hanging to see McGregor v Masvidal if it happens. My two favourite fighters.

Conor looks great at 170. Good division for him to have a crack at. Masvidal, Diaz, Ferguson, Khabib. Plenty of good opponents for him at 155 or 170. He looks heavier at 170 but looks alot more powerful. Don't want to see him at 145 again.

All in all hope he becomes an active fighter again. Always a good show when McGregor is on the card.

 

[Moral Decay]

I have a masters and earn 6 figures.

Like your mates, your arrogance and hubris is astounding. Get a grip on reality. Safe space time for you son.

Wow
Reality? You're hiding behind a computer, desperately posting crap that is out of date, contested and faulty; what you don't have is any experience, nor do you know anyone with any experience, nor are you willing to even challenge yourself to even try and get any experience and the funniest bit of all, which you would know if you were really engaged in what is happening, if you were part of it, or knew anyone that is part of it; is that nothing has worked.
The modelling that the fire controllers use to determine how far, how hard and when a fire will run has been wrong. Decades of work by professionals and scientists has proved to be worthless, fires that were meant to run didn't and fires that should have been "safe" weren't.

Fires here started Nov. 20. talking to the firefighters on the ground they said back then that short of ten inches of rain they would burn to the coast, because there was nothing they could do and guess what, they did.

Oh and one more thing according to all the research, this can't happen, we've had 3 mega, (a 100 year event of more than 500,000 hectares) fires in the same area in the last 20 years, some of these areas have been burned through 4 times, the experts say it can't happen but it did and until they process the information and throw out all the old models they have no idea of how to fight the next fire.

All you're doing is playing with yourself, whoever gave you a masters, give them the money back. Get out from behind the computer, get some real experience and talk to the right people because until you do your just embarrassing yourself.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Nah, that's not how international negotiations work. Read up on the Montreal Protocol, which got rid of CFCs in the 80s so our ozone hole isn't getting worse. (Without it our skin cancer rates would be 10x worse.) It worked because many countries, big and small, all took action at the same time. There weren't too many countries sitting out saying "not our problem".

Anyway, it's an opportunity for Australia. If we could be bothered we'd be developing the next generation of sustainable agriculture and making a whole new export industry, but we're a lazy country full of shitty big companies who don't bother to innovate, so we're just sitting around arguing the toss.

We are NOT full of shitty big companies.
They are Pissy little companies.
Mostly only regional ( as opposed to multi-national ).

They are limited by market segments. -- Banks, Mines/Energy, Medical.

Who is going to develop the next generation of sustainable agriculture? Coles?
Lots and lots of businesses are small subsidiaries from overseas, where their parents make it very clear their job is not to innovate.
( The now gone car companies were let a long way off the lease , but were still very limited by their owners ).

The Energy companies largely operate facilities that were originally built by the Government, based on designs from Germany or other places.
We never "designed " power stations. We don't design processes.
We just follow procedures.

When the Government put grants in place to try to promote innovation, they are too stupid to weed out those who try to get funding for no-hope projects or to enforce conditions.

( Does anyone else remember the special "women's surfboard"
Ford got a grant to develop their production line to build Focus cars, THEY TOLD THE GOVERNMENT, that they would develop a 4 cylinder Falcon instead , they kept the money )

There is not even agreement to how innovation should be achieved. Some point to schools and teachers, but if we better teach the kids, we end up with a heap of people capable of research and development, but no-one to employ them to do so.

The day's of Thomas Edison building a lightglobe in his shed , patenting it, then starting a company around it are long gone.
We have lots and lots of little contractors offering specialised services, fighting over the scraps of the fewer big companies that exist.

If our companies are Shitty, its because we ( as a Nation ) encouraged and facilitated their shitty.

Its one of the reasons we can't be a leader in global emissions reductions, we are a follower at best. We are restricted to off the shelf products ( please no more Myki fiasco's where we try to do something better...and fail ) , and we have a big country to look after, and a history of blowing out costs, especially on public projects ( looking at you Desalination plant ).

 

[Joffaboy]

"Its a radio interview with a very expierenced captain. 52 years on the job."

So why don't you listen to me then?

I have almost an equal amount of experience in hands on fire fighting (40+ years) but more importantly as part of the Level 3 Incident Management Team (the ones responsible for managing campaign fires like we have experienced this summer) I've actually have had to plan, deal with and respond to fire behaviour on an hour by hour basis whether as wildfires or as part of fuel reduction burning procedures.

So here's the simple truth Johnny - fire behaviour in 2020 is more erratic and more volatile (and therefore much more dangerous) than any other known period and this is due to factors associated with climate change.

Simple fact.

Unless you have been on 2GB, your opinion doesn't count

 

[Crusty Undies]

I have a masters and earn 6 figures.

Like your mates, your arrogance and hubris is astounding. Get a grip on reality. Safe space time for you son.

Oh yeh? Is your masters in climate science or any other even slightly relevant field? Cos if not then it doesn't really matter

 

[bergholt]

Disagree mate.

I don't get it. What do you disagree with?

 

[Johnnyrayflamingo]

I don't get it. What do you disagree with?

Everything.

Aussies are innovative world leaders in many fields. We punch above our weight in many areas.