rant thread

[dont bowl there]

I really don't understand how Roberton is playing AFL. I can't see a single redeeming feture to his game. He is so slow, can't run 20m without looking stuffed and has deplorable skills. MRP can do us a favour and get rid of him.

 

[Lach72]

Tell me you're only guessing. Surely we can't have another.

Just what I read here.

 

[electricfeel]

Johnson could play a game on E and still get picked each week...

 

[apuchar]

What about Morabito and Hayden??? I know they are forgotten, but nonetheless they are still important to our team and best 18 when fit. To just flippantly exclude them because they haven't been around this year is just plain wrong. If they were playing this season, then we wouldn't be in the strife we are in. I would include Griffin in that list but that would be more of a Sandilands based inclusion so i'll let it slide......this time

They always say it's the botom 6 players that cost you games, well if these 6 players return, means that 6 spuds leave. You do the math.

Hayden probably won't be there next year. Moribito will be in his knee return year, so really speaking we are only a few short. Better teams can absorb injuries a lot better than us at the moment which suggests we are a bit down on quality. I don't think our list is rebuilt yet and by the time it is we will be in the last years of Pav and Macca

 

[believe_it]

Something that seems to be becoming really common is Freo players running into each other and spoiling each other in contests. Its happening every week now.

Ibbotson is consistently too casual in his disposal and lacks urgency. Too often his handballs and kicks are cut off because of this

 

[Jimmy_the_Gent]

Tell me you're only guessing. Surely we can't have another.

It was an ankle.

I'm surprised there hasn't been more talk about this. He went to room on crutches and he looked heaps distraught. I suspect he wont play again this season, which sucks.

 

[maybethisyear]

All i want from my coach is to pick the team on its merits.
Based on my criteria Damien Drum was the best coach we ever had.

Neesham didn't want to know you unless you came from Claremont.
Connolys downfall was his steadfastly refusal to base selections on form but selected on their potential.

Harvey is no better
We had the Johnson debarcle earlier in the year, Mcphee for some reason is one of the first picked, Duffield hasnt won a one on one contest all year and is getting worse (we could go on).
We continually bring players back eaerly from injury as if they are superstars (Ibbotson, Suban) only to be reminded they are just average.

In fact I will

Our top goal scorer can't get a game because we have better ruckmen. (go Figure)
Our full forward can't get a goal (or a kick for that matter) but he tackles well.
Our small defenders are so pathetic that we have to pull a key defender onto Cyril Rioli (great job Groves but the job belonged to someone else)
Our kickins are a disgrace, kicking with a hurricane we could barely go beyond 50 meters)

Was about to stop but had another glass of Red.

The only time we look like being direct is when they put the little league goals up at half time, because that is the direction we normally kick.

If anyone doubted Palmers passion for the club look at his reaction to the injury. He does not want to leave and just wants to prove himself, despite being coached into obscurity.

 

[electricfeel]

God, I feel for Palmer. He actually cried.

I really, really want him to do well but I feel like he's not getting a proper chance. He gets one game in the midfield, does relatively well, then the week he gets pushed to the forward line where he does eff all, following week he gets dropped. Rinse and repeat. ****ing hell.

 

[yakka man]

Ibbo could definetly be doing more but I have actually been impressed by him this year. He plays as an accountable defender and still picks up a decent amount of possessions. Look at Duffield who this year has been told to be more of a defender than his usual free wheeling half back flanker and his possession numbers drop significantly. This year Ibbo has had one of the highest disposal efficiency in the team. With his speed, size and long penetrating kick I can't understand how they have not given him even a ten minute stint in the midfield.

When the whole team plays shit you can't really single out one player.

We have become tooooooooooo predictable this year. We are the easiest team to read and defeat.

 

[apuchar]

All i want from my coach is to pick the team on its merits.
Based on my criteria Damien Drum was the best coach we ever had.

Neesham didn't want to know you unless you came from Claremont.
Connolys downfall was his steadfastly refusal to base selections on form but selected on their potential.

Harvey is no better
We had the Johnson debarcle earlier in the year, Mcphee for some reason is one of the first picked, Duffield hasnt won a one on one contest all year and is getting worse (we could go on).
We continually bring players back eaerly from injury as if they are superstars (Ibbotson, Suban) only to be reminded they are just average.

In fact I will

Our top goal scorer can't get a game because we have better ruckmen. (go Figure)
Our full forward can't get a goal (or a kick for that matter) but he tackles well.
Our small defenders are so pathetic that we have to pull a key defender onto Cyril Rioli (great job Groves but the job belonged to someone else)
Our kickins are a disgrace, kicking with a hurricane we could barely go beyond 50 meters)

Was about to stop but had another glass of Red.

The only time we look like being direct is when they put the little league goals up at half time, because that is the direction we normally kick.

If anyone doubted Palmers passion for the club look at his reaction to the injury. He does not want to leave and just wants to prove himself, despite being coached into obscurity.

I agree with that and yet some people maintain that the only reason we are not performing is because we have injuries.

 

[Clay Davis]

I agree with that and yet some people maintain that the only reason we are not performing is because we have injuries.

Basically it makes the whole thing easier to stomach.

I would love to pretend that injuries are the sole reason for a lot of this year's form (especially in the poorer games) and that without them we'd be storming into top four, but the reality is that we've been figured out. A number of players aren't being allowed to have the same impact as last year (Duffield, Hill, Mayne, among others) and injuries are not the reason for this, opposition coaches now know how they play and have strategies to counter them.

 

[dont bowl there]

Why are 90% of our kickouts long to the boundary, I can sort of understand it when Sandi there because you know he will at least win the hitout from the throw in but with Clarke? Even 40 points down we never kicked it long down the middle. Gutless football.

 

[Rob]

I am generally not one to let players off the hook after a game like that. And in another thread i'll probably unleash on a few of them. But I think it's absurd how most people are letting the coach off the hook given he was, by the length of the Flemington straight, the main reason for the result.

I didn't think we were smashed in first possession, or were too soft at the ball. We lost because we played the most absurdly dumb football i've ever seen. When it's slippery as hell, the game becomes all about territory. Don't piss around with the ball, just get it forward at all costs. It's common sense, and Hawthorn picked up on that very early on. We refused to. We'd get possession at a stoppage, try and handball the ****ing thing, lose it and Hawthorn would slam it forward. Or we'd get the ball and go for a short pass. And all our players were doing it, it wasn't just the dumb ones like Johnson and Ibbo. Silvagni was our best player, but after he got that 50m penalty and proceeded to try a little chip kick to Hill I couldnt believe it. Not long after - during the torrential downpour - one of our players was at half back and decided to go the short pass to someone else. The rain was so bad I couldn't see who either was. Unfortunately, the idiot with the ball thought the conditions were good enough to go for a 20m short pass. Nothing wrong with the kick itself, it hit the chest of the recipient. But in rain like that, predictably, the ball was fumbled and we lost it.
Ordinarily i'd blame the players for such painfully obvious brain melts. But every one of our players was doing it. Fyfe, Barlow, Pavlich - all going for dinky little handpasses where they just had to slam it forward. It was so obviously part of the team's strategy. We probably got beaten in the clearances, but not because we weren't getting our hands on the ball. We were obsessed with ****ing around with it when our opposition did the opposite. Who knows, we might have lost anyway, but our utterly moronic game strategy resulted in one of the darkest days for the club that I can remember.

Einstein once said that the definition of insanity was doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Well Harves, if that's true then you belong in a straitjacket locked in a Graylands padded room. Not once did our strategy change during the match, other than a few positional changes in the last quarter. So how the hell did you expect we were going to get back into it?

 

[apuchar]

Basically it makes the whole thing easier to stomach.

I would love to pretend that injuries are the sole reason for a lot of this year's form (especially in the poorer games) and that without them we'd be storming into top four, but the reality is that we've been figured out. A number of players aren't being allowed to have the same impact as last year (Duffield, Hill, Mayne, among others) and injuries are not the reason for this, opposition coaches now know how they play and have strategies to counter them.

Yes, they reckon if you stay still you are going backwards. All the other teams have got forward pressure now, but they have more. We don't.

 

[apuchar]

I am generally not one to let players off the hook after a game like that. And in another thread i'll probably unleash on a few of them. But I think it's absurd how most people are letting the coach off the hook given he was, by the length of the Flemington straight, the main reason for the result.

I didn't think we were smashed in first possession, or were too soft at the ball. We lost because we played the most absurdly dumb football i've ever seen. When it's slippery as hell, the game becomes all about territory. Don't piss around with the ball, just get it forward at all costs. It's common sense, and Hawthorn picked up on that very early on. We refused to. We'd get possession at a stoppage, try and handball the ****ing thing, lose it and Hawthorn would slam it forward. Or we'd get the ball and go for a short pass. And all our players were doing it, it wasn't just the dumb ones like Johnson and Ibbo. Silvagni was our best player, but after he got that 50m penalty and proceeded to try a little chip kick to Hill I couldnt believe it. Not long after - during the torrential downpour - one of our players was at half back and decided to go the short pass to someone else. The rain was so bad I couldn't see who either was. Unfortunately, the idiot with the ball thought the conditions were good enough to go for a 20m short pass. Nothing wrong with the kick itself, it hit the chest of the recipient. But in rain like that, predictably, the ball was fumbled and we lost it.
Ordinarily i'd blame the players for such painfully obvious brain melts. But every one of our players was doing it. Fyfe, Barlow, Pavlich - all going for dinky little handpasses where they just had to slam it forward. It was so obviously part of the team's strategy. We probably got beaten in the clearances, but not because we weren't getting our hands on the ball. We were obsessed with ****ing around with it when our opposition did the opposite. Who knows, we might have lost anyway, but our utterly moronic game strategy resulted in one of the darkest days for the club that I can remember.

Einstein once said that the definition of insanity was doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Well Harves, if that's true then you belong in a straitjacket locked in a Graylands padded room. Not once did our strategy change during the match, other than a few positional changes in the last quarter. So how the hell did you expect we were going to get back into it?

Trouble is, other than drop the whole team because of complete stupidity what is the coach supposed to do. These guys have been playing footy for probably more than 20 years. surely they don't have to be told the basics. I think the problem is partly the coaching and partly because we still have some of the dumbest footballers in the competition

 

[electricfeel]

Here's another thing I don't understand. Whenever the ball is kicked to a contest why do ALL the Freo players in that contest have to jump up and attempt to mark the ball? It leaves nobody at ground level where so many times the ball will spill out the back to opposition players. If Fyfe is jumping up for the mark, let him ****ing mark it. Or at least have a few players at ground level to gather the ball.

 

[yakka man]

Einstein once said that the definition of insanity was doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Well Harves, if that's true then you belong in a straitjacket locked in a Graylands padded room. Not once did our strategy change during the match, other than a few positional changes in the last quarter. So how the hell did you expect we were going to get back into it?

Classic quote and exactly true. At least in the quarter Harve's tried to mix it up a bit. Mayne in the backline didn't look completely out of place. Ibbo in the forward line looked stupid but why didn't they try him in the middle.

We need to do everything different next year starting with a hard, intense and uninjured pre-season.

 

[maybethisyear]

Trouble is, other than drop the whole team because of complete stupidity what is the coach supposed to do. These guys have been playing footy for probably more than 20 years. surely they don't have to be told the basics. I think the problem is partly the coaching and partly because we still have some of the dumbest footballers in the competition

I think you are missing the point.

If one player is stupid its the players fault.
If the whole team is stupid its the coaches fault.

 

[Rob]

Trouble is, other than drop the whole team because of complete stupidity what is the coach supposed to do. These guys have been playing footy for probably more than 20 years. surely they don't have to be told the basics. I think the problem is partly the coaching and partly because we still have some of the dumbest footballers in the competition

If a few players are doing it, then i'll blame the players. If all the players are doing it, it's because they've been told to by the coach.

 

[Clay Davis]

Rob, you are basically describing the fundamental flaw in our game plan.

We can't do the quick kick from congestion because our forwards don't play in front, and those that do are generally mismatched by better and bigger players (Mayne on Gibson).

So what we have to do is work through clearances and contests with hands, trying to create space forward of the ball for our break players to run clear into.

The massive flaw is that on the slightest whiff of possession we set up to run forward. If it doesn't come off because of pressure (Saints + first Derby) or the conditions (tonight), we are hurt hard on the turnover.

So it looks like our players are dumb and dicking around with the football, but that's the game plan.

 

[creamygoodness]

Totally agree with Clay for once. All we freaking did all night was bomb it long to contest after contest, no attempt to switch it up and move the zone, no trying to take on the man on the mark and carry the ball. It's not the freaking 70's, football is different Harves, get it through your ****ing head.

Hawthorn absolutely cut us up in the first quarter, showed how much of a joke our structures are.

 

[Rob]

Rob, you are basically describing the fundamental flaw in our game plan.

We can't do the quick kick from congestion because our forwards don't play in front, and those that do are generally mismatched by better and bigger players (Mayne on Gibson).

So what we have to do is work through clearances and contests with hands, trying to create space forward of the ball for our break players to run clear into.

The massive flaw is that on the slightest whiff of possession we set up to run forward. If it doesn't come off because of pressure (Saints + first Derby) or the conditions (tonight), we are hurt hard on the turnover.

So it looks like our players are dumb and dicking around with the football, but that's the game plan.

That's my point - tonight the game plan sucked dry dead donkey balls because the conditions warranted something completely different. Hawthorn adapted instantly. We didn't.

Really, is it that hard to go 1 on 1 and order players to get the ball forward at all costs? Wet weather football should be piss easy for a coach, you put your hardest players in the clinches and hope everyone is tough enough to win more of the ball. I just had a look at the stats, we won enough of the ball (actually had more possessions), but pissed around with it. Hawthorn's kick-handball ratio was 1.8, ours was 1.15. Also won the clearances 51-42, and the contested possessions. Yet the inside 50s was 34-61. What does that tell you? How do you have more possession, more clearances yet get utterly flogged in the inside 50s (and the scoreboard)? I'd love to see a stat on ground kicks as well. I reckon it's 3 or 4 to 1 in favour of Hawthorn.

 

[Freo4life]

Johnson could play a game on Cocaine and still get picked each week...

Would probably play better anyway. I don't know why people are bothering to call for him to be dropped, it aint gonna happen under Harvey. Seriously starting to lose a little faith in Harvs with his non existent gameplan, stupid positioning and tactics (Rob's post is spot on). Just shot ourselves in the foot with our footskills all night as a result of too many sub standard AFL "players" and passengers.

Ibbo-never been a fan, deadset ******ed at times
Johnson-less said the better
Duffield-gone backwards big time
Crowley-would probably be best for all concerned if he hung up the boots
Roberton-geez i hate people writing off young players but i am very tempted to join in
Mayne-love his pressure, intensity but if he cant have a presence on the scoreboard what good is he?
Tendai-pulls of some good kicks but really does butcher it at times
McPhee-not too sure if i would offer him another contract..

Edit: just rememberd, how ****** stupid are our players at times for 2-3 of them to go for the mark almost every time? Seriously let the better marks go for the ball and wait for the crumbs

 

[Clay Davis]

That's my point - tonight the game plan sucked dry dead donkey balls because the conditions warranted something completely different. Hawthorn adapted instantly. We didn't.

Really, is it that hard to go 1 on 1 and order players to get the ball forward at all costs? Wet weather football should be piss easy for a coach, you put your hardest players in the clinches and hope everyone is tough enough to win more of the ball. I just had a look at the stats, we won enough of the ball (actually had more possessions), but pissed around with it. Hawthorn's kick-handball ratio was 1.8, ours was 1.15. Also won the clearances 51-42, and the contested possessions. Yet the inside 50s was 34-61. What does that tell you? How do you have more possession, more clearances yet get utterly flogged in the inside 50s (and the scoreboard)? I'd love to see a stat on ground kicks as well. I reckon it's 3 or 4 to 1 in favour of Hawthorn.

Well, that seems to be more signs Harvey has little belief that the players can get the job done.

Basically, we have a game plan, we have a best 22. That's it. Any deviation from that and we're up shit creek.

 

[PapaJ]

That's my point - tonight the game plan sucked dry dead donkey balls because the conditions warranted something completely different. Hawthorn adapted instantly. We didn't.

Really, is it that hard to go 1 on 1 and order players to get the ball forward at all costs? Wet weather football should be piss easy for a coach, you put your hardest players in the clinches and hope everyone is tough enough to win more of the ball. I just had a look at the stats, we won enough of the ball (actually had more possessions), but pissed around with it. Hawthorn's kick-handball ratio was 1.8, ours was 1.15. Also won the clearances 51-42, and the contested possessions. Yet the inside 50s was 34-61. What does that tell you? How do you have more possession, more clearances yet get utterly flogged in the inside 50s (and the scoreboard)? I'd love to see a stat on ground kicks as well. I reckon it's 3 or 4 to 1 in favour of Hawthorn.

You got it Rob. I said at half time to my neighbour that the effort from our boys is there, but we're playing too much dry footy in s**t faced conditions. We weren't organised or working smart enough, in contrast the Hawks were. By the time we got a handle on how to play the conditions, it was all over. It wasn't bad footy so much as dumb footy.