Autopsy Rd 16 Blues last quarter comeback ends in heartbreak

[norway blue]

It was a ******* s**t show from both team in the first two quarters. Benny Hill / some mother’s do have em. Can’t believe we were even in the game at the end. I liked it though.


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[Soapy V]

Ok maybe last 4 weeks? He has played an insane amount of footy over his first 2 years. No need to rush him to 300 games.

I was thinking more long term as well. Thought it might be good for him to go back and play a bit of midfield. So important he is fit and ready for the pre season

 

[windows1]

Attending and training at top intensity are 2 different things. Most players are at most training sessions, what they do varies greatly.

The fact you think having basic logic pointed out is screaming at you is as hillarious as the fact you think the outcome ("he doesn't chase") is what is being discussed here.

Check your exclamation marks then when you message me next time. Otherwise I will interpret as yelling. Let’s agree to disagree. You think you’re being logical. I think you’re bereft of it. You think the same of me. Jog off.

 

[HBF]

Nope. Not at all. Just a statement of fact that you and Thy can’t get your head around. The umpiring hurt us in the first three quarters. So did our s**t skills. One fact doesn’t invalidate the other. Both contributed to our 3/4 time deficit. Certainly our skills contributed more. As did Jones inexplicable decision making. But the umpiring hurt us. Period. Moving on from that now. It’s a no win topic with a few here.

Of course we were on the end of some interesting calls. But the main reason we lost is because of our poor kicking and decision making.

As I have said a number of times in this thread already, every single game of AFL there are going to be interesting calls for both sides. If we were good enough we would have won that game after our fightback in the final qtr. The umpires had nothing to do with Simpson turning over the footy which resulted in the final goal of the game

 

[Gethelred]

And the reason for all of that is FITNESS!!

You mention SPS he is not only a year older but has had much better pre-seasons the past 2 years. Dow had the traditional limited first pre-season and then injury ruined most of this one.

Everything he has shown demonstrates he is working extremely hard on his game (going with Cripps to see Diesel, the noticeable improvement in his kicking) the idea he simply doesn't want to defend but still gets picked every week while Jack, Kennedy, O'brien & Setterfield go back to the 2's is laughable.

It's as though people do not remember how limited SPS was last season, or the season before. SPS could only go once in a single play before he was done, and that's with him being the most instinctive player on our list.

Dow looks like someone going through a heavy block of training. He's tired. It's pretty ******* clear. I'd not be against dropping him - our attitude towards Northern and our development team is a bit on the nose; it didn't hurt Jack any to build up fitness and to develop him as a mid in the VFL, nor did it hurt Weitering to thoroughly dominate and lead us in the game he played after his injury last year - but you're absolutely right.

 

[Gethelred]

Pretty hard to get anything done offesively when 4 of our 6 defenders are all bad kicks and turning it over consistently. weiters is a good kick and simmo is ok but not elite. they others would be considered poor
how many turnovers did newmand and plowman have in the first qtr?
Plowman is pathetic by foot. Having good skills isnt just about the physical execution of the skill but also the mental ability to make the correct decision.. maybe he has a role as a lock down defender but we need to get some class around him (doc, willo, stocker & SPS) and have designated kickers

I actively hate the idea of SPS becoming a backman. He's too much a natural mid for it for one, and his skills at extricating the ball from a contested situation to clear advantage are waaaay too valuable to throw him behind the ball. Around the stoppage is the perfect place for him.

Having said that, you're not wrong that we certainly need some more quality in the back half, some silk by foot. Part of our problem is that Plow's role is as much organiser as stopper; he's the mature player down there, and when Weitering went off he became the bloke that runs the back six. He's essentially third in line, behind Doc and Jacob; of course he's going to bite off more than he can chew. On one hand, we don't live in an ideal world, we're rarely going to have our full best back six available together; on the other, Plow cops it because he's effectively a bandaid for us, a jack of all trades that is expected to cover for a positional or leadership hole. He looks s**t when we're under siege or when a game is this close, because he's playing the hardest role across the back six; you cannot simply be all things. He cannot be the small defender and the intercept marker and the third man up and the playmaker at the same time; imagine how long your apprenticeship would be to collect all the skills needed to be that bloke. How long'd it take Dylan Grimes to be able to do most of that? And that's with Richmond supporters calling for his head for the better part of 10 years; and people on the Carlton board reckon we do whipping boys!

Plowman is average by foot, but he is required to be exceptional sometimes and gets found out. I'd sooner be blaming Weitering's injury, Simpson's decline, Newman's scattergun and Jones' chaotic influence than Plow's disposal by foot.

 

[HARKER]

I actively hate the idea of SPS becoming a backman. He's too much a natural mid for it for one, and his skills at extricating the ball from a contested situation to clear advantage are waaaay too valuable to throw him behind the ball. Around the stoppage is the perfect place for him.

Having said that, you're not wrong that we certainly need some more quality in the back half, some silk by foot. Part of our problem is that Plow's role is as much organiser as stopper; he's the mature player down there, and when Weitering went off he became the bloke that runs the back six. He's essentially third in line, behind Doc and Jacob; of course he's going to bite off more than he can chew. On one hand, we don't live in an ideal world, we're rarely going to have our full best back six available together; on the other, Plow cops it because he's effectively a bandaid for us, a jack of all trades that is expected to cover for a positional or leadership hole. He looks s**t when we're under siege or when a game is this close, because he's playing the hardest role across the back six; you cannot simply be all things. He cannot be the small defender and the intercept marker and the third man up and the playmaker at the same time; imagine how long your apprenticeship would be to collect all the skills needed to be that bloke. How long'd it take Dylan Grimes to be able to do most of that? And that's with Richmond supporters calling for his head for the better part of 10 years; and people on the Carlton board reckon we do whipping boys!

Plowman is average by foot, but he is required to be exceptional sometimes and gets found out. I'd sooner be blaming Weitering's injury, Simpson's decline, Newman's scattergun and Jones' chaotic influence than Plow's disposal by foot.

That's a bit strong isn't it? I fully agree.

 

[Blue and Blue]

They will have a hard time keeping SPS away from following the ball. Would need a 30 metre chain round his leg.....tied to the behind post.....

 

[Gethelred]

They will have a hard time keeping SPS away from following the ball. Would need a 30 metre chain round his leg.....tied to the behind post.....

He'd tear out the behind post.

 

[BlueGum]

FIIK why we were so off the mark in the first half.

It seems to me that the zone thing anchors players to the guarding space role. I appreciate it at he ground when you can see how it works - really slows down the opposition, and forces them to kick back or sideways or to contests. Can be really effective at creating turnovers.

We ain't good though at switching into attacking play - there doesn't seem to be a system about it. Systems would help players do what was expected of them, and be predictable to the player with the ball? Instead we seemed to panic and our disposal went to ****. Created turnovers back the other way. Frustrating. Other teams gt the overlap run up and going.

Jack was great. Levi, Kreuz, Murphy, Walsh the Wonderboy also had good ones. Setters and Kennedy got better in the forward roles. Weiters is getting to be mr reliable (until his nose is broken).

Looooooking forward to the day we beat Melbourne. I really dislike them.

 

[Blue and Blue]

FIIK why we were so off the mark in the first half.

It seems to me that the zone thing anchors players to the guarding space role. I appreciate it at he ground when you can see how it works - really slows down the opposition, and forces them to kick back or sideways or to contests. Can be really effective at creating turnovers.

We ain't good though at switching into attacking play - there doesn't seem to be a system about it. Systems would help players do what was expected of them, and be predictable to the player with the ball? Instead we seemed to panic and our disposal went to ****. Created turnovers back the other way. Frustrating. Other teams gt the overlap run up and going.

Jack was great. Levi, Kreuz, Murphy, Walsh the Wonderboy also had good ones. Setters and Kennedy got better in the forward roles. Weiters is getting to be mr reliable (until his nose is broken).

Looooooking forward to the day we beat Melbourne. I really dislike them.

Lot of sense here Bluegum....
This zoning I feel depends greatly on knowing when to switch and that is very much an experience thing. Staying safe in coralling mode a few seconds too long is all it takes for it to go pear shaped.

 

[agro]

Pretty hard to get anything done offesively when 4 of our 6 defenders are all bad kicks and turning it over consistently. weiters is a good kick and simmo is ok but not elite. they others would be considered poor
how many turnovers did newmand and plowman have in the first qtr?
Plowman is pathetic by foot. Having good skills isnt just about the physical execution of the skill but also the mental ability to make the correct decision.. maybe he has a role as a lock down defender but we need to get some class around him (doc, willo, stocker & SPS) and have designated kickers

Simpson, Newman and Plowman- who is the fourth?

 

[Gethelred]

FIIK why we were so off the mark in the first half.

It seems to me that the zone thing anchors players to the guarding space role. I appreciate it at he ground when you can see how it works - really slows down the opposition, and forces them to kick back or sideways or to contests. Can be really effective at creating turnovers.

We ain't good though at switching into attacking play - there doesn't seem to be a system about it. Systems would help players do what was expected of them, and be predictable to the player with the ball? Instead we seemed to panic and our disposal went to ****. Created turnovers back the other way. Frustrating. Other teams gt the overlap run up and going.

Jack was great. Levi, Kreuz, Murphy, Walsh the Wonderboy also had good ones. Setters and Kennedy got better in the forward roles. Weiters is getting to be mr reliable (until his nose is broken).

Looooooking forward to the day we beat Melbourne. I really dislike them.

I remember how, the year before last, when they thought they'd be the next big thing, their supporters ran all over the main board and on the team boards, commenting and liking melts on postmatch threads like crazy.

They are not the most likeable bunch, are they? I do hope we're not that insufferable in a few years.

 

[koutamarto]

Simpson, Newman and Plowman- who is the fourth?

Plowman Jones Marchank
Simpson Weitering Newman

Shouldnt be too hard to work out!

 

[Percy2257]

FIIK why we were so off the mark in the first half.

It seems to me that the zone thing anchors players to the guarding space role. I appreciate it at he ground when you can see how it works - really slows down the opposition, and forces them to kick back or sideways or to contests. Can be really effective at creating turnovers.

We ain't good though at switching into attacking play - there doesn't seem to be a system about it. Systems would help players do what was expected of them, and be predictable to the player with the ball? Instead we seemed to panic and our disposal went to ****. Created turnovers back the other way. Frustrating. Other teams gt the overlap run up and going.

Jack was great. Levi, Kreuz, Murphy, Walsh the Wonderboy also had good ones. Setters and Kennedy got better in the forward roles. Weiters is getting to be mr reliable (until his nose is broken).

Looooooking forward to the day we beat Melbourne. I really dislike them.

Me too!

 

[VeinGlorious]

I’d just love to see him flat out chase his guts out. Btw his kicking action has improved out of sight.

Thanks Diesel

 

[norway blue]

Simpson, Newman and Plowman- who is the fourth?

That’s an iffy backline .


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[Robbo's my hero]

I think we’re confusing the ability to kick with the capability of making a smart decision when under pressure.

 

[David Sylvian]

If you are referring to the one in the last qtr, that was after his opponent for the day had kicked 6 and was off the ground injured, The damage had been done. I love his athleticism and attack on the ball, but it needs to be better tempered and considered.

I was, he had, it hadn't we were still in it up to our eyeballs and you are right.

 

[Ken Navies]

gotta get nominated...........

Mmmmm, clique bait...

 

[Ken Navies]

Little Stevie Wright....killing it with Evie, on the Opera House steps in ‘76.

Glorious.

Bon Scott’s blueprint,Stevie.
Indeed, a glorious bastard.

 

[The Coach]

Commitments yesterday so have only seen the replay today
Setterfield could have kicked 8gls !

 

[gbatman]

???? SPS had 13 contested out of his 17? Hardly cruising around. 4th in pressure acts. I think he had a real go.

Stats don't show the full picture, you can jog after someone and it's a pressure act or have someone near you when you get the ball and it's a contested effort. There's a difference between registering stats like that and and how you go about it. You have a guy like Walsh who plays hard and has a high level of effort and puts his head over the ball and takes hard contact and you have guys who don't but still register similar contested ball.

I've watched the games this year, I don't just look at stats, I look at actions, I see a lot of people going half at it and a lot who go wholey at the contest and they do register similar pressure acts and hard ball gets and whatever.

There is a reason SPS, Fisher and Dow have been moved out from on the ball and Murphy and Walsh have come in from the wing to play more in the center. Because the latter have been playing harder and with more intensity. They haven't been moved out because they were going well in other positions, they got moved out because they weren't going well and weren't playing the hard footy that Curnow, Cripps, Walsh and even Murphy are playing.

Watch the games, going at a contested ball carefully, slowly and baulking at the contest, not going hard straight lines at the contest. I'm seeing that. That's part of why some guys who started this season in an inside role are now in outside roles.

 

[windows1]

I hear ya Robin. Although I think those guys are out more because they flat out can’t run.

 

[mediumsizered]

I agree that no balls should not be difficult to adjudicate, but at park level you're not getting people running in and bowling at 130+ every ball for 5 hours, either (unless the spinners are on). Could be that it's rather a good deal harder to look at the no ball line and watch the ball at that level of pace.

One of the contributing factors to missed no-ball calls is the distance umpires are now standing back from the stumps. This creates a distorted view of where the front foot is landing, complicated by scuffing of the popping crease & indentations which develop from bowlers' feet landing on or near the popping crease over & over again. It wasn't that long ago that umpires would stand no further back than the cut area of the pitch, but now they are standing up to a further metre back from there.