Autopsy Rd 21 Blues luck dries up in the wet

Who played well for the Blues in Round 21 against the Tigers?


  • Total voters
    116
  • Poll closed .

Blue Chip Pass

Team Captain
Apr 20, 2017
426
1,331
Warrandyte
AFL Club
Carlton
I’m only half way through the replay, and it’s apparent that Richmond plays with a sense of entitlement that seems to influence umpiring. Sorry, but that’s what I’m seeing.

Take Vlaustin’s response to a physical tackle by Levi late in 1st Q for instance; he proceeded to shove his clenched fist into Levi’s neck region after pinning him to the ground in retaliation for the tackle, yet the umpire ignored it. It’s like, how dare Vlaustin be subject to tackling; it can’t have been the force of the tackle that he found so offensive, because a similar force tackle by Levi on another Tigers player early in the 2nd wasn’t penalised.

Then there’s Lynch, who puts both arms out demanding a free for interference during a marking contest in the 1st Q, paid of course; while similar interference during a marking contest up the other end in the same Q, involving a silent H, was ignored.

He who insists seems to receive.
Opine, Maybe there is a bit of biased perception. But that's exactly how I see it. Richmond are masters at pleading their case to the umpires.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Blue Chip Pass

Team Captain
Apr 20, 2017
426
1,331
Warrandyte
AFL Club
Carlton
I know we were long shots at winning the game. Especially being a wet day, totally suited Richmond.
But I just wish we could take our opportunities when they present. Seize the moment, FFS.
We missed a lot of easy goals, that would have created scoreboard pressure. Missed too many targets with either bombing or bad kicking. And we should not have left Richmond with a spare defender for that long. Blind Freddie could see it was not working. De Luca marking the ball on the right goal post and being a left footer, needed to own the moment and just kick what would have been an easy goal. Bad kicking is bad footy and it totally effects the morale and momentum of the players in a game. Whilst all that was frustrating, especially having a mouthful of stitches after surgery and I couldn't scream at the Tele. But upon reflection, there is alot to like.
I admire Teague that he can still keep his cool on the outside. He must have been livid on the inside.
Lang is out for me, papers stamped. Not good enough.
Harry, Fisher & Cripps carrying injuries.
Big thumbs up for Jones, Weiters, Plow, Simpson, Daisy, Cripps, Murphy, kruezer, SPS, Ed
McGov will be great next year when his body gets right.
We will be a much better side with Charlie & Docherty in the mix.
Throw in a GENUINE small forward and another classy midfielder and we would have beaten the Tigers.
We must beat the Saints!! Please..
 

Blue and Blue

Norm Smith Medallist
Jul 29, 2018
6,587
17,282
On the glory road
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Everton
Opine, Maybe there is a bit of biased perception. But that's exactly how I see it. Richmond are masters at pleading their case to the umpires.
A bunch of crybabys is what they are. Soft players and a soft style. They do all they can to avoid contact except when its crashing in late.
They dont attack the footy they attack the man that just went and attacked the footy while they hang back. Gutless football. Won't be long till they fall off the perch.
 

tugga

Moderator
May 9, 2006
30,336
45,154
Yid army
AFL Club
Richmond
Other Teams
Tottenham,Red Sox,San Antonio Spurs
I come in peace as I did after round 1.
Lots to like about your club going forward.
Kudos to Weitering for destroying the most in form big forward in the comp.
SPP good.
Silvagni playing with confidence is good to see.
McGovern was dangerous and looks fit.
Reckon you can make finals next year.
 

Burgers45

Witnessed 8 flags
Apr 1, 2011
1,625
2,363
Mornington Peninsula, Vic
AFL Club
Carlton
I come in peace as I did after round 1.
Lots to like about your club going forward.
Kudos to Weitering for destroying the most in form big forward in the comp.
SPP good.
Silvagni playing with confidence is good to see.
McGovern was dangerous and looks fit.
Reckon you can make finals next year.
Thanks for the compliments. If you maintain your current form you'll go close. Cheers.
 

Burgers45

Witnessed 8 flags
Apr 1, 2011
1,625
2,363
Mornington Peninsula, Vic
AFL Club
Carlton
That siren went well before he marked that.

We missed our chances early in the last qtr. Could have put a few on early but couldn't convert.
I know it won't make any difference to the outcome of the game, but a number of supporters have brought it to the attention of Whately's program on SEN this morning. Impact it has had on betting, etc.and also impact if happens in finals. He was skeptical that it occurred, but is going to look into it this afternoon. I'll be watching 360 tonight for any result.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Large Hawaiian

Debutant
Sep 21, 2017
55
219
AFL Club
Carlton
Or you, know, the other option? Lang just isn't good enough.
I watched him closely yesterday, on several occasions he wanted to engage with his opponent with the ball in the air rather than just attack the ball which is what his man did. He was outclassed and looked devoid of confidence. I was happy when we got him from the Cats but I don't see a spot for him now. I'd be delighted to be proven wrong.
 

Duigan Alley34

Team Captain
Sep 4, 2011
484
1,768
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Cleveland Cavaliers
It wasn't him that set the Tiggies up like he does so often though. De Luca reduced his impact on the game. His previous month of games was so much better than what he provided today. Prestia was the one who killed us today with his 11 clearances, including a game high 5 clearances from centre bounces.

When it's all said & done, Houli was probably not in the best half a dozen defenders on the ground & this is a credit to De Luca given Houli's form across the season (today was his 3rd lowest disposal game this season).
Fair enough, not the way I saw it, but that's ok.
Prestia did kill us. It was Houli's 3rd lowest disposal count but he was exquisite with nearly every possession and that hurts in these conditions. Ultimately, it was the tigers ability to string clean chains of possession that allowed them to score more heavily than us and Houli was a big part of that imo.
 

Jimmyonesix

Rookie
Jun 7, 2019
46
89
AFL Club
Carlton
I think the wet weather impacted O’Brien’s game. He will be better for it. Still very young and raw, i wouldn’t drop him next week
Do you think the fact we didn’t want to use our wings and flanks out of congestion (Richmond does very well)to run the ball instead we persisted bombing forward attributed to his Setterfield gibbons output and bought there spare in to play this may be the main reason we couldn’t get deep entries and no chance for forwards to set up .. maybe it more to do with our work around clearances that needs to be looked at — you want runners receiving ball no going in and getting there own — just my opinion
 

Duigan Alley34

Team Captain
Sep 4, 2011
484
1,768
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Cleveland Cavaliers
Point missed.......

Let’s just see if 360 blows up about Reiwoldt’s “chicken wing” on Liam the same way the media did on Judd?

Then we’ll both know the answer.
I was ******* furious at this pathetic weak dog act by Reiwoldt. Great way to do some serious damage. One thing to hold a blokes arm in that position but then to put extra force into it...

Deliberate endangerment of Jones. This should get multiple weeks in my opinion, but won't, probably won't even get looked at by that grub.
 

Duigan Alley34

Team Captain
Sep 4, 2011
484
1,768
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Cleveland Cavaliers
I think the wet weather impacted O’Brien’s game. He will be better for it. Still very young and raw, i wouldn’t drop him next week
Yep, took some time for him to adapt and find a way to influence the game which wasn't suited to his natural style. Good learning experience for the lad.
 

Opine

Premium Gold
Aug 30, 2018
3,084
5,771
AFL Club
Carlton
100% completely agree.
...
PS - I’ve posted seperately that Tiggers were constantly appealing for frees and sooking to the umps when they didn’t get them. Jack is a “leader”!!!!
This is my point, it's driven by their leaders starting with their coach; he snaps at post match media for daring to pursue a line of questioning; retaliates against crowd for daring to question his team's ability away from MCG; snaps at media for daring to question his teams prospects.
 

BrisbaneCFC

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 1, 2016
5,320
6,823
AFL Club
Carlton
I only really have three things to say.

Can we please put a moratorium on the phrase or variations thereof, "I don't usually bag out umpires...'? You want to criticise the umpiring, go right ahead; I'm not Thy, this thread is as much for venting as it is for coherence. But the only time that particular phrase or its variants is used is prior to criticism, whether valid or otherwise. Whether you do it normally or you've never done it before in your life, you're doing it now; has approximately the same value as 'I'm not a racist but'.

The second - concerning the game itself - is that if Teague is to get the job, he will need to have some means of addressing what is and has long been an issue at Carlton on this side of 2000, the simply inadequate means of exiting a stoppage. At no point have we had a good or better clearance coach who was capable of winning the ball and ensuring the string of possession is continued afterwards whilst moving the ball quickly. We've had the former, but never the latter, and with the quality we have across the 22 now we lack any excuses outside of poor coaching and development within our senior players; formerly Gibbs and Mitch Robinson, but also Kruez, Murphy and Simpson. It might just be a Barker thing; Walsh cites Barker as having a huge influence over him, and Walsh is starting to bomb the ball when within a clearance context.

Get Caracella. Get McCarthy. Get Voss. Get Ratten. I don't care who you get to be the midfield/stoppages coach, as long as they can create a system which allows us to win the ball free to a situation in which we can move from a clearance through the flanks cleanly, with space.

The final part is that we have some difficult decisions to make, list wise. We have TDK, Charlie, Harry, Kerr as KPF, with strong medium forwards in Gov, Kennedy and Jack. We have Cripps who can rest forward, who is KPF height. We have Jones, Weitering, Plow, Marchbank, Goddard, Macreadie, Ben Silvagni as KPD, with Williamson being barely cm below KPD height and Finbar who could be either eventually and Levi who is anything already. We have seen it already. We simply possess too many talls to use them all adequately. We do not play as well when they're all available, and we cannot match a smaller faster opponent when we play all of them when they are fit. We are going to have to trade some of these players over the next 2-3 years, and we are going to have to make decisions that we will regret in the short to long term, but as of right now our list is unbalanced. It's funny, if we had Harry and Kennedy in 2011 we'd have been a genuine top 4 chance; hell, if we had Kerr and Kennedy in 2011, we'd have been a top 4 chance. It's good to have such a glut of talent in talls, but the downside is that you cannot always expect to play at Docklands under a closed roof, and you cannot risk being overrun against smaller opposition in a grand final purely because you didn't want to lose a talented player.
Whatever you do, don't propose trading a tall. You will get ripped to shreds. ;)
 

dangerousdane

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 16, 2015
5,232
6,015
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Arsenal
A bunch of crybabys is what they are. Soft players and a soft style. They do all they can to avoid contact except when its crashing in late.
They dont attack the footy they attack the man that just went and attacked the footy while they hang back. Gutless football. Won't be long till they fall off the perch.
Soft players playing a soft style don’t win grand finals, I’m sorry but this is just pure fantasy, we got a lesson on Sunday on how to win in the wet.
 

Gethelred

Norm Smith Medallist
May 1, 2016
7,569
14,509
AFL Club
Carlton
Whatever you do, don't propose trading a tall. You will get ripped to shreds. ;)
It comes down to this for me; we cannot play all three of Gov, Harry and Charlie ahead of the ball in the ones, not as they currently are. Brisbane in 2001-04 were able to play all three of Lynch, Bradshaw and Brown because their midfield was in contention for being the best assembled in the AFL era, and their defence was rebounding via Leppistch like a modern defense, and because when you've got a matchwinner like Akermanis who can play like Eddie Betts as a midfielder, you have that luxury. I'd love to think we can assemble a list of that caliber, but it's not realistic.

We either a) create a gameplan of kick/mark, using set plays to create space for talls to lead into, eschewing smallball completely and maintaining our setup behind the footy to ensure we are not punished for turnovers - which was what we were trying to do under Bolton - or b) we trade out one of those three, keeping Kerr as a backup (and, let's face it, it'd be one of H or Charlie that gets traded, not Gov) and moving to a conventional setup, with more smalls to create more pressure to feed our intercept defense behind the ball. We have more than enough marking options ahead of the ball now, via Kennedy, JSOS, Gov, Harry, Charlie, Cripps (to say nothing of the players in the twos who could develop in that direction) to go ahead with a 2 talls setup. Gov plays too tall to count as a medium.

I'd be cool going for something innovative (it's what made me want Bolton to hang around, we just started to see the edges of what we could be capable of this year with the kick/mark gameplan) but Teague is not playing that way, not anymore. We've been better under him with a smaller squad - as with most innovations in the AFL, it came off the back of injuries instead of thinking ahead - than we have with a tall one, and he has more time for strong marking medium talls than Bolton did.

I'm concerned that our desire to hold onto the talent we've got will interfere with our ability to continue to build our midfield into the behemoth we need it to be.

If anyone is asking me what I would do, I would trade whoever was open to it of Harry or Charlie (consistent performer versus x-factor CHF/FF/mid; whoever you think is more likely to be productive over the long run) for as much as I could, which at this point would be at the very least 2 early draft picks, with which I would use to draft unique midfield talent whilst getting in Coniglio. We need to continue to get in quality at the bottom end, so that they can build with developed players ahead of them.

We're not done yet, not by a significant margin.
 

Top Bottom