Autopsy Rd 3 Insipid Loss to Carlton (Be Civil)

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theGav56

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That was Lyons pass mark {actually premiership this year wasn‘t it?) not Longmuirs. It is illogical and unfair to shackle him to a previous coaches time line.
We don't know how many so called errors he has made because we don't actually know what he is trying to achieve. It would be nice if he was just given a bit of space to experiment and work out what is the best way to go forward. There are a few different roads he could take.
Ross not being avaiable is irrelevant to us. If some players and supporters can't control their obsession with the man, they have the option to go and play for /support the next team he coaches
It should be a quick fix because he probably won't be coaching a developing side.
It is my passmark for Longmuir, and would have been for any coach. Lyon did set his own, and that’s for him to wear, but any coach reaching top 4 has done well and is my passmark for a coach with a mature list.

I’m not obsessed with Lyon and rarely mention him unless in response to a post. I am discussing Longmuir. You brought up Lyon. My opinions are not the same as Wigarus, although I enjoy some aspects of his posting. I have confidence in Longmuir. Realistically any half decent coach should expect 5-7 years.
 
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apuchar

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It is my passmark for Longmuir, and would have been for any coach. Lyon did set his own, and that’s for him to wear, but any coach reaching top 4 has done well and is my passmark for a coach with a mature list.

I’m not obsessed with Lyon and rarely mention him unless in response to a post. I am discussing Longmuir. You brought up Lyon. My opinions are not the same as Wigarus, although I enjoy some aspects of his posting. I have confidence in Longmuir.
We don·t have a mature list. They are all sitting in rehab. You are free to have your own pass mark but it is your subjective view on things. Doesn't make it right or wrong just an opinion. I hope he stays to his own {more reasonable IMO) timeline and does`t try to do a quick patch up job to quieten the overreaction on social media. If it turns out he is wrong we will have to wear it, but at least the next coach will be inheriting a pretty good list in a good age demographic with players who are more suited to the direction modern footy is presumably going.
 

theGav56

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We don·t have a mature list. They are all sitting in rehab. You are free to have your own pass mark but it is your subjective view on things. Doesn't make it right or wrong just an opinion. I hope he stays to his own {more reasonable IMO) timeline and does`t try to do a quick patch up job to quieten the overreaction on social media. If it turns out he is wrong we will have to wear it, but at least the next coach will be inheriting a pretty good list in s good age demographic with players who are more suited to the direction modern footy is presumably going.
I am fully aware that my opinion is my opinion.

I know we don’t have a mature list, and top 4 isn’t my benchmark, but in 2 years time it would be.

An extensive rehab list has been a constant for years. Getting it remedied is part of my benchmark for Bell.

The club has asserted that finals is what they are aiming for haven’t they? They certainly haven’t come out and said we are rebuilding.
 

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apuchar

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I am fully aware that my opinion is my opinion.

I know we don’t have a mature list, and top 4 isn’t my benchmark, but in 2 years time it would be.

The club has asserted that finals is what they are aiming for haven’t they? They certainly haven’t come out and said we are rebuilding.
Fair enough. Comfortably in the top eight in two years would be my expectation. Why would we get there before all the other teams striving for the same thing especially considering many of them have advantages that we do not. It's hard work getting there. I mean how long have people been saying this is the year Geelong will drop. Still waiting....
 

bushchook

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We had fewer games and shorter quarters.


I mean, it's pretty simple, if your coach loses the players you sack him.
So why are you still mad about sacking Ross?

He lost the players a good couple of years before we sacked him. The 2nd best player at our club walked out. Too little too late, should have sacked the loser at the end of 2016 when it was obvious our run was over and he'd left us at the beginning of a 5 year rebuild.
 

salim malik

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Fair enough. So this really has nothing to do with JLo? Nobody is going to change your mind on giving JLo a chance if you are still yearning for Rossco.

RL was our best coach to date - I defended him plenty when he was our coach. Moving on from him was 100% the right decision though. I cringe just thinking about what Freo would look like now had we persisted for another 12 months.
Unfortunately nothing has changed, injuries, lots of them. Finals , not in the foreseeable future.
Lyon , Longmuir who cares ,the club is still where it's always been.
At the minute Lyon has been our highest achieving coach by a long way.
I can't understand the hate for him.
The most enjoyable season I have experienced in a lot of years following football was 2013.
I thank Lyon for that , I wish him well in his next endeavour which will probably will be a premiership for GWS.
 

apuchar

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Unfortunately nothing has changed, injuries, lots of them. Finals , not in the foreseeable future.
Lyon , Longmuir who cares ,the club is still where it's always been.
At the minute Lyon has been our highest achieving coach by a long way.
I can't understand the hate for him.
The most enjoyable season I have experienced in a lot of years following football was 2013.
I thank Lyon for that , I wish him well in his next endeavour which will probably will be a premiership for GWS.
I don't think it is hate from most people, but he wore on most of us and we just want to move on. He did what he was paid very well to do. I don't see why we have to be endless grateful to the guy. Connolly got us into the prelim with a much more enjoyable game-style imo and was less grating as an individual.
 

salim malik

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I don't think it is hate from most people, but he wore on most of us and we just want to move on. He did what he was paid very well to do. I don't see why we have to be endless grateful to the guy. Connolly got us into the prelim with a much more enjoyable game-style imo and was less grating as an individual.
It's the same old Lyon bashers on here with the same old criticism.
I,'ve noticed the posters who can't let Lyon go are the Lyon bashers.
Longmuir at the minute is not setting the world on fire.
Let's get back onto today's problems which to my observations are as bad as ever.
 

MadEyeEmmy

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So you can throw out the insults but can't take the heat when you are called out on it.
Bet you where having the time of your life watching what Fremantle achieved in 2013.
That was down to man you so easily maligned.
Hypocrisy is rife on here.
Yeah you really called me out. Well done. I was giving my opinion on Ross Lyon based on well known facts that have been widely reported by pretty much every major news outlet. Look I’m sure you felt special because Lyon said hello to you at training once, but that doesn’t mean you need to be deliberately obtuse regarding the faults of the man and attack anyone who dares to speak out about it.

Yes I sure did enjoy our success in 2013, does that mean I have to continue to pine for Ross Lyon for the rest of my life?

Get a grip. He ain’t coming back.
 

Wigarus

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So why are you still mad about sacking Ross?

He lost the players a good couple of years before we sacked him. The 2nd best player at our club walked out. Too little too late, should have sacked the loser at the end of 2016 when it was obvious our run was over and he'd left us at the beginning of a 5 year rebuild.
Oh, look, another person that doesn't know the difference between a coach and a list manager.

For the benefit of anyone reading (because you are obviously never gonna get it) as has been rehashed many times, Bell is the one that signed off on the Lachie Neale trade right before he used the picks from it to get Hogan.
 

Piggy Smalls

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It’s taken me a while to gather my thoughts since the game. What an absolute sh*t show.

Really disappointed in team selection and on-field leadership more than anything else. Sean Darcy is not a CHF, he’s barely a ruckman half the time. Why was Treacy not brought in for Fyfe? We need a big MOBILE marking target to straighten us up. It is a fundamental of modern football.

Im not sure who was ‘acting’ as captain but the level of on-field leadership was woeful. Senior players need to identify when we are being physically bullied and stamp it out there and then. Speaking of our ‘leaders’, Michael Walters elects to bump, narrowly misses oppo player’s head and cost us a goal at a time we were barely hanging on. Piss weak. I’m not sure if I’m imagining things but Sonny’s attitude ain’t quite right and hasn’t been since Longmuir told him he’s a forward first and foremost.

Cox and Ryan had no chance with the way our mids played. Completely reverted back to 2017 where everyone went the ball and left free men on the outside every single time. We did not win a single 50/50 yet this was not addressed as an issue. Our backs got hung out to dry big time.

J Lo needs to respond this week. Get Sturt in FFS. Get Treacy in FFS and get a big bodied mid in to intimidate the Hawks or we will be 1-3.
 

Wigarus

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Yeah you really called me out. Well done. I was giving my opinion on Ross Lyon based on well known facts that have been widely reported by pretty much every major news outlet. Look I’m sure you felt special because Lyon said hello to you at training once, but that doesn’t mean you need to be deliberately obtuse regarding the faults of the man and attack anyone who dares to speak out about it.

Yes I sure did enjoy our success in 2013, does that mean I have to continue to pine for Ross Lyon for the rest of my life?

Get a grip. He ain’t coming back.

If they were well known facts you wouldn't be getting called out on it. You are making assumptions based on news reports that have no substance.

Everybody knows he ain't coming back. But this is a Freo forum and he's going to be a yardstick for every coach until they surpass him on win/loss. You wanting people to not talk about him is ridiculous.
 

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MadMundy

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Oh, look, another person that doesn't know the difference between a coach and a list manager.

For the benefit of anyone reading (because you are obviously never gonna get it) as has been rehashed many times, Bell is the one that signed off on the Lachie Neale trade right before he used the picks from it to get Hogan.
Of course the coach and the list manager are two very different roles, but every senior coach will have a big say in who comes to the club or not, so clearly Ross would have signed off on bringing in Hogan, just as Bell did too.
 

Wigarus

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Of course the coach and the list manager are two very different roles, but every senior coach will have a big say in who comes to the club or not, so clearly Ross would have signed off on bringing in Hogan, just as Bell did too.
How big is a big say? Is it as big as the final say? Because that's what the list manager has.
The reality is, losing the Lloyds and not replacing them with the best was the start.
 

MadEyeEmmy

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If they were well known facts you wouldn't be getting called out on it. You are making assumptions based on news reports that have no substance.

Everybody knows he ain't coming back. But this is a Freo forum and he's going to be a yardstick for every coach until they surpass him on win/loss. You wanting people to not talk about him is ridiculous.
Correction, I wouldn’t be getting “called out” if people on this forum actually had the guts to acknowledge that Lyon wasn’t the messiah and a perfect human being. Are you seriously trying to pretend that everything that was reported in the media was false? LOL

He got us to a grand final nearly 8 years ago. It was great. We all loved it. Well done Ross. Doesn’t change the fact that we then tumbled down the ladder and he sexually harassed a woman at work. Sorry if I’m not misty eyed remembering those times.
 

bushchook

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Oh, look, another person that doesn't know the difference between a coach and a list manager.

For the benefit of anyone reading (because you are obviously never gonna get it) as has been rehashed many times, Bell is the one that signed off on the Lachie Neale trade right before he used the picks from it to get Hogan.
Which he had to do because Lyon drove Neale away from the club.
 

apuchar

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It's the same old Lyon bashers on here with the same old criticism.
I,'ve noticed the posters who can't let Lyon go are the Lyon bashers.
Longmuir at the minute is not setting the world on fire.
Let's get back onto today's problems which to my observations are as bad as ever.
I think both sides bring him up equally. As soon as things go badly for JL the Rossy lovers "i told you so's" come out thick and fast and visa versa.
We don't know if there are problems "as bad as ever" if we don't actually know what our coaching group is trying to achieve. For some who think we should be playing finals this year it looks bad but for those who want to see continued development of our new gameplan with our new young players, it's just not that bleak , yet.
 

gungho

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Correction, I wouldn’t be getting “called out” if people on this forum actually had the guts to acknowledge that Lyon wasn’t the messiah and a perfect human being. Are you seriously trying to pretend that everything that was reported in the media was false? LOL

He got us to a grand final nearly 8 years ago. It was great. We all loved it. Well done Ross. Doesn’t change the fact that we then tumbled down the ladder and he sexually harassed a woman at work. Sorry if I’m not misty eyed remembering those times.
Yeah, dunno. The allegation if true (still unsubstantiated) is that Lyon commented on a girls breasts size to a group of men (one of whom disliked the comment and reported it to someone higher up).
Would a group of women comment about a man's arms, bum or any other body feature to each other in a social setting (every day of the week and twice on Sundays).
I don't like Rosco that much to be honest, either as a coach or person, but the sexual abuse allegation has all the hallmarks of a typical west australian media beatup.
 

MadEyeEmmy

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Yeah, dunno. The allegation if true (still unsubstantiated) is that Lyon commented on a girls breasts size to a group of men (one of whom disliked the comment and reported it to someone higher up).
Would a group of women comment about a man's arms, bum or any other body feature to each other in a social setting (every day of the week and twice on Sundays).
I don't like Rosco that much to be honest, either as a coach or person, but the sexual abuse allegation has all the hallmarks of a typical west australian media beatup.
I don’t deny that members of the WA media hated Ross and would take opportunities to stick the knife in (it’s one of the reasons I can’t stand Tim Gossage) but I think what you’ve written here is downplaying what was alleged.

Multiple sources including the Herald Sun, The ABC, The West Australian, The Age and Fox Sports all reported on this. The allegation was that Ross made the comment directly to the female employee (plus others) and then proceeded to continually harass her during a work party. Subsequently, she was paid a 6 figure sum to keep her mouth shut about it.

He was one of the heads of our club. For him to behave this way towards a subordinate is not the same as a group of women commenting on a mans arms or bum. We should expect better. I don’t like it and I’m glad that he is no longer leading Fremantle. It’s fine if you don’t think that it’s a big deal but I do.

*shrug*
 

theGav56

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Fair enough. Comfortably in the top eight in two years would be my expectation. Why would we get there before all the other teams striving for the same thing especially considering many of them have advantages that we do not. It's hard work getting there. I mean how long have people been saying this is the year Geelong will drop. Still waiting....
Benchmarks should be aspirational. Failing to achieve them and understanding why is a big part of how you develop.
 

Purple Madness

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Yeah, dunno. The allegation if true (still unsubstantiated) is that Lyon commented on a girls breasts size to a group of men (one of whom disliked the comment and reported it to someone higher up).
Would a group of women comment about a man's arms, bum or any other body feature to each other in a social setting (every day of the week and twice on Sundays).
I don't like Rosco that much to be honest, either as a coach or person, but the sexual abuse allegation has all the hallmarks of a typical west australian media beatup.
Was Rosich the dibby dobber?
 

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