Recruiters and BF

[76woodenspooners]

If you're not a paid professional in a certain field,...

Hmmm, for example, Eddie McGuire, President of the Collingwood Foodball club? (an unpaid role)

... your opinion on anything regarding that field is pretty much worthless.

 

[wednesdaywarrior]

The opinions provided on Big Footy by Knightmare and Snoop are streets ahead of the average opinion because they both have prodigiously analytical minds and both watch hours and hours of underage footy. If you read their comments it's very obvious they spend sh1tloads of time watching TAC footy and know most of these kids inside out. I've known 1 or 2 people in journalism who've written about the junior talent and would say their knowledge was no more impressive than these two.

I've only been on BF since 2010 but have followed the draft for 10 years and have always been fascinated with it. It provides us all with hope for the future, so we hang off it every year. Ever since I came on BF I've thought we were really lucky on the Pies board to have 2 guys who spend all this time taking stock of underage talent who are willing to just dish out detailed answers to our questions all the time on cue. It's brilliant. I have so much I want to know about the kids at this time of year and there is so little available in the mainstream media. I can even remember back to the pre Internet time when all you could rely on was sporadic newspaper articles on who your club was taking an interest in.

Our two draft gurus aren't infallible, they get things wrong. I think Knightmares Achilles heel is he is so logical in his analysis that he sometimes forgets the human element, sometimes suggesting players for the Pies from other clubs who've had some pretty significant off field infractions. As a school teacher I am acutely aware of how badly just one or two 'personalities' can completely f. Up the dynamic of a group and so I tend to disagree with him on those types of players as I'm pretty big on the cultural element to a team. But that's why our discussions here are pretty informed and intelligent. And we all come at it from our own angles which is great.

I don't think clubs would have much interest in any social media to get their intelligence. You'd think they would want to steer clear of it to avoid confusion but I do think these guys are easily smart enough to be working for clubs. I took a lot from what 76 said about the people who work for big organisations, sometimes we forget they're not that good. The same goes in schools. What you want are people who do the simple things well, work hard, are passionate and dedicated and intelligent. If I was an employer I'd be scoping out KM or Snoop for my business!

 

[half_back_flank]

Didn't Richmond once recruit inside the top ten based on some tape? Times must have changed. My sister was one of Brandon Ellis' teachers and said she spent at least 12hrs on the phone answering recruiters questions regarding his personality/demeanour/work ethic etc. Bulldogs and Melbourne apparently the ones that stood out as the doggies call was like a conference call police inquisition and Melbourne were asking much different questions than what mostly got thrown out.
The Collingwood site had Snoop's evaluations up once (or a few times) didn't they? Descriptions of recently drafted players a few years back. I think that shows there's at least some grounding to the opinions of the more knowledgable guys here. Not sure they're going to draft based on our polls though...

The old man is a referee for a prospective draftee. He's had 4 calls so far the longest being Port at 45 minutes. Not as highly rated as Ellis though.

 

[half_back_flank]

I'm sure a few years ago an Adelaide moderator who posted very frequently on the draft and trade board (he may have even modded there too) cancelling his BF account because he'd got a gig in a AFL teams recruiting team.

 

[Brad Goodman]

Hmmm, for example, Eddie McGuire, President of the Collingwood Foodball club? (an unpaid role)

What would his field be exactly in that role?

Nobody on here has opinions worth listening to, myself included. We're all just nameless, faceless schmucks.

 

[Old Spice]

Hmmm, for example, Eddie McGuire, President of the Collingwood Foodball club? (an unpaid role)

I think Abba Lonie may have been referring to experts in their field. Eddie knows how to be a CEO and sticks to CEO type things.

As regards draft speculation, his point remains. Experts for expert things.

 

[suspect footskills]

The old man is a referee for a prospective draftee. He's had 4 calls so far the longest being Port at 45 minutes. Not as highly rated as Ellis though.

If he's a busy man, he'd probably hate to have a top fifteen pick nearing draft time. My sister was happy to take the calls as she was taking them at school, salary, not on the clock like my job but still, if you're getting paid to be there...

 

[76woodenspooners]

What would his field be exactly in that role?

Business governance and accountability. Figurehead. Public Relations.

Nobody on here has opinions worth listening to, myself included. We're all just nameless, faceless schmucks.

On footy recruitment? You may be right.

In general? No way! We have some folks on here who could be reasonably be considered experts in one or more fields

 

[Brad Goodman]

Business governance and accountability. Figurehead. Public Relations.



On footy recruitment? You may be right.

In general? No way! We have some folks on here who could be reasonably be considered experts in on or more fields

I'm a pretty smart guy but I don't work in footy so my opinion on footy isn't valid. Same as everyone else who doesn't or hasn't worked in footy.

 

[Snoop Dog]

I'm sure a few years ago an Adelaide moderator who posted very frequently on the draft and trade board (he may have even modded there too) cancelling his BF account because he'd got a gig in a AFL teams recruiting team.

yep there was.

 

[ppoiter]

If you're not a paid professional in a certain field, your opinion on anything regarding that field is pretty much worthless.

That just isnt true. First example that comes to mind is all the contributions to the field of astronomy that have come from amateurs who are just people who take an interest and put a lot of time in. I dont see why the same couldn't apply when it comes to drafting.

 

[Schraderbrau]

I think Abba Lonie may have been referring to experts in their field. Eddie knows how to be a CEO and sticks to CEO type things.

As regards draft speculation, his point remains. Experts for expert things.

This may have some general applicability to other much larger codes like soccer but I'm not sure about AFL. First, I remember reading a few times that the majority of recruiters or volunteers get paid very little (probably even moreso now there is a cap of football department spending). Second, I suspect getting into the industry as one of these low paid volunteers has as much to do with who you know and networking as it does to do with actual ability. Third, the majority of the talent is in the TAC cup in Vic and there are only 6 games a week of that. It wouldn't be that difficult to corner this market especially since these days everything is recorded. Interstate players would obviously be more difficult.

In short I'd assume that the lower rung recruiters are not professionals/experts and given the info that is now widely distributed (and expanding every year) there is no reason why some non-paid 'bigfooty' draft people couldn't be better than some of the recruiters.

 

[Bard]

What makes an expert? Someone who spends thousands of hours doing something because they want to, or someone who does it because that's what they get paid to do?

Is a carpenter who can't find work no longer an expert carpenter?

Isn't this entire discussion moot? In my eyes Knightmare is an AFL scout, the only difference being he's currently unemployed. Hopefully time and dedication will change that for him.

 

[Old Spice]

A draft expert is someone who a/. sees a lot of live games, b/. has proven judgment, c/. knows a segment of the competition and knows it well and d/. presumably receives payment for their services.

The idea that someone on Bigfooty is across the national talent is just ludicrous. Are they flying across the land on a full-time basis with no money to spot talent, tape it, then review it? A one man band?

You require a machine to funnel talent and payment on a contractor payment basis which is not part of the FD spend or we can't explain why some clubs have a massive network and others a small one. Do we have a bigger scout network because everyone loves Collingwood and are dying to help us?

 

[76woodenspooners]

Do we have a bigger scout network because everyone loves Collingwood and are dying to help us?

I think that's the whole point of this thread.

We're all wanting to roll up our sleeves and pitch in.

Perhaps the hint was too subtle?

 

[Old Spice]

I think that's the whole point of this thread.

We're all wanting to roll up our sleeves and pitch in.

Perhaps the hint was too subtle?

Sure, we can all pitch into engineering, medicine and string theory. It would be a massive boon. Perhaps we know something they haven't thought of yet.

 

[76woodenspooners]

Sure, we can all pitch into engineering, ...

Indeed!

It's called Crowd sourcing

 

[Old Spice]

Indeed!

It's called Crowd sourcing

I'll leave expert things to experts.

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/alleged-phony-doctor-faces-victims-court/story?id=21486777

 

[Visions]

If the hierarchy at Collingwood browsed this site, they would have known we wanted pick 5 + Aish last week and not the actual deal that they signed off on for Beams.

So no, they don't look at BF.

 

[TradeDraft]

If the hierarchy at Collingwood browsed this site, they would have known we wanted pick 5 + Aish last week and not the actual deal that they signed off on for Beams.

So no, they don't look at BF.

IF they did they probably laugh at us and say we have no idea at all what is Really happening

 

[Markfs]

I dont even understand why someone would ask this question...it blatantly obvious that the experts are actually posting on BF.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Well, he did not have to come on and take Pot Shots at other people

Dave, you aren't helping things mate

Stop bagging him if you want to read his stuff, why not go there and apologise, I'm sure he will appreciate it

 

[MagpieJoel]

We finished 11th because he didn't listen soon enough. We would easily have won the premiership if he had made all the changes necessary early in the year.

Yeah, like when we were 8 and 3.

 

[Markfs]

Sure, we can all pitch into engineering, medicine and string theory. It would be a massive boo n. Perhaps we know something they haven't thought of yet.

I cant give much input on string theory other than to keep a roll of it handy in case the muffler rusts off its mounting...

 

[Tbone McGraw]

Just on 1 of the early points in this thread re Bontempelli.

Is it possible, we were never that interested in him, but wanted 1 of Scharenberg or Aish to slide.So we made a lot of public noise about Bonts which was hot air.

It is just a theory and possibly a laughable one. Of course, only the club internally would know their rankings of the players.

I do also understand that recruiters are professionals but that doesn't mean their opinions can't change. E.g. Dogs recruiters hadn't really considered Bonts until they heard the noise about him and went for a second look through their data collected on him.

To be able to read Hine's true thoughts every draft day!!