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Ref Watch

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elhadjihenry said:
Handball has to be deliberate. It wasn't deliberate. Therefore it wasn't handball. Get over it.
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o_O

1. I'm saying I thought it was deliberate. You're saying you didn't think it was deliberate. ..Cool. Deliberate is a subjective term, which is the entire issue being discussed here. If you don't like it don't join the discussion.
2. Every ref who has seen the incident (bar a retired flog) has said it was handball and shouldn't have been given.
3. Suck shit for losing to Bayern, that's karma for you.
 
elhadjihenry said:
Laws of the game say that handball has to be deliberate. Not sure whether the referee's have been instructed to interpret grey areas or not.
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Referees interpretation of anything is what worries me.
 
moomba said:
Referees interpretation of anything is what worries me.
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Exactly. If they've been instructed to interpret things in a particular way - as seems to be the case - it should be made clear in the LotG.
 
SM said:
o_O

1. I'm saying I thought it was deliberate. You're saying you didn't think it was deliberate. ..Cool. Deliberate is a subjective term, which is the entire issue being discussed here. If you don't like it don't join the discussion.
2. Every ref who has seen the incident (bar a retired flog) has said it was handball and shouldn't have been given.
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You may think it was deliberate but you are wrong. It may be subjective but in this case there is not one iota of evidence that suggests it was deliberate.

The laws of the game say deliberate, the part of the law that is interpretive is:
  • the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)
  • the distance between the opponent and the ball (unexpected ball)
  • the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an infringement
The hand did not move it was the ball that moved towards the hand.

There was no chance to move his hand it happened so quickly.

The position of his hand above his head means nothing.

The law is on my side, you are wrong. As someone who referees themself I thought you might be familiar with it.
SM said:
3. Suck shit for losing to Bayern, that's karma for you.
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Just couldn't resist throwing in a snide comment could you? Hope you get relegated, you deserve it.
 

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elhadjihenry said:
You may think it was deliberate but you are wrong. It may be subjective but in this case there is not one iota of evidence that suggests it was deliberate.

The laws of the game say deliberate, the part of the law that is interpretive is:
  • the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)
  • the distance between the opponent and the ball (unexpected ball)
  • the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an infringement
The hand did not move it was the ball that moved towards the hand.

There was no chance to move his hand it happened so quickly.

The position of his hand above his head means nothing.

The law is on my side, you are wrong. As someone who referees themself I thought you might be familiar with it.

Just couldn't resist throwing in a snide comment could you? Hope you get relegated, you deserve it.
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It was deliberate. You're wrong. Get over it.

By the way the last point was meant to be ironic since you had thrown in some immature comments (hint: the first sentence in this post is mimicking your response as well). We don't deserve to be relegated but if you genuinely believe that then it underlines how utterly clueless you are.

I suppose you think Gibbs getting a yellow was a fair outcome, and Walcott shouldn't have seen red.
 
SM said:
It was deliberate. You're wrong. Get over it.

By the way the last point was meant to be ironic since you had thrown in some immature comments (hint: the first sentence in this post is mimicking your response as well). We don't deserve to be relegated but if you genuinely believe that then it underlines how utterly clueless you are.

I suppose you think Gibbs getting a yellow was a fair outcome, and Walcott shouldn't have seen red.
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How is that immature? You are wrong and you continue to throw little jibes in multiple threads about this, it's time to get over it and move on like every other fan who loses a game. You obviously have some kind of anti-Arsenal complex which is causing you to be incredibly salty about it.

You are in the bottom 3, if you end up there at the end of the season you deserve to be relegated. That is not clueless that is a fact. If you manage to get out of the bottom 3 by the end of the season then good for you, but at this point you absolutely deserve to be there. The table doesn't lie.

You clearly have no understanding of the concept of "deliberate" if you think that was deliberate, so I'm not going to bother trying to argue with you anymore. You can disagree all you like but it won't change anything. So reply with one of your little passive-aggressive "ok" posts and we can be done with this.
 
elhadjihenry said:
How is that immature? You are wrong and you continue to throw little jibes in multiple threads about this, it's time to get over it and move on like every other fan who loses a game. You obviously have some kind of anti-Arsenal complex which is causing you to be incredibly salty about it.

You are in the bottom 3, if you end up there at the end of the season you deserve to be relegated. That is not clueless that is a fact. If you manage to get out of the bottom 3 by the end of the season then good for you, but at this point you absolutely deserve to be there. The table doesn't lie.

You clearly have no understanding of the concept of "deliberate" if you think that was deliberate, so I'm not going to bother trying to argue with you anymore. You can disagree all you like but it won't change anything. So reply with one of your little passive-aggressive "ok" posts and we can be done with this.
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I'm not wrong, that's what you seemingly fail to comprehend.

Oh so if we end up in the bottom 3 at the end of the season we deserve to go down. No shit. Very different from saying we currently deserve to go down.

I have a very clear concept, you seem to struggle with it though.

Off you go champ. :thumbsu:
 
SM said:
I'm not wrong, that's what you seemingly fail to comprehend.

Oh so if we end up in the bottom 3 at the end of the season we deserve to go down. No shit. Very different from saying we currently deserve to go down.

I have a very clear concept, you seem to struggle with it though.

Off you go champ. :thumbsu:
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ok
 
elhadjihenry said:
ok
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480
 
elhadjihenry said:
You may think it was deliberate but you are wrong. It may be subjective but in this case there is not one iota of evidence that suggests it was deliberate.

The laws of the game say deliberate, the part of the law that is interpretive is:
  • the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)
  • the distance between the opponent and the ball (unexpected ball)
  • the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an infringement
The hand did not move it was the ball that moved towards the hand.

There was no chance to move his hand it happened so quickly.

The position of his hand above his head means nothing.

The law is on my side, you are wrong. As someone who referees themself I thought you might be familiar with it.

Just couldn't resist throwing in a snide comment could you? Hope you get relegated, you deserve it.
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Lol? It means everything, considering the ball went across the goal line off it.
Whilst not a Maradona-deliberate handball, he gained an unfair advantage by scoring with a part of the body you aren't allowed to score from.
It's a handball anywhere on the pitch, it just wasn't seen so that is why the goal was given - not that it was given because it wasn't deliberate.
 

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Jatz said:
Oh SM. The Sanchez 'handball' definitely wasn't deliberate. The goal should still have been disallowed.

And I hope Hull don't get relegated.
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Awesome, I'll go running around in my Sunday League with my hand above my head and cite the Sanchez decision if I ever get called up for handball then.

Also **** off Clattenburg, clearly too ashamed to show his face in England anymore.
 
SM said:
Awesome, I'll go running around in my Sunday League with my hand above my head and cite the Sanchez decision if I ever get called up for handball then.

Also **** off Clattenburg, clearly too ashamed to show his face in England anymore.
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If it's ball to hand then excellent :)

Hahaha this decision has sent you off the deep end mate :p
 
Jatz said:
If it's ball to hand then excellent :)

Hahaha this decision has sent you off the deep end mate :p
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You can keep citing ball to hand and you'll continue to be wrong. That's one factor considered, it isn't the be all and end all.

Honestly how many handballs do you see given that are genuinely hand to ball?
 
SM said:
You can keep citing ball to hand and you'll continue to be wrong. That's one factor considered, it isn't the be all and end all.
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I'm not but no one will convince you otherwise so I won't bother to continue with it. You're way too close to this one.
 

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Jatz said:
I'm not but no one will convince you otherwise so I won't bother to continue with it. You're way too close to this one.
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Must be why the ref's association agrees with me, they're all hull fans. :drunk:
 
SM said:
Must be why the ref's association agrees with me, they're all hull fans. :drunk:
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SM said:
o_O

1. I'm saying I thought it was deliberate. You're saying you didn't think it was deliberate. ..Cool. Deliberate is a subjective term, which is the entire issue being discussed here. If you don't like it don't join the discussion.
2. Every ref who has seen the incident (bar a retired flog) has said it was handball and shouldn't have been given.
3. Suck shit for losing to Bayern, that's karma for you.
Click to expand...

So uhhh...
 
In my referee training I have never heard of a different rule regarding goals scored from an unintentional handball. Was told the most important factors are arms being in a natural / unnatural position and whether the player who handled unintentionally was able to avoid ball to hand. I reffed a match once where a keeper attempted a clearance and it rebounded off the striker's arm from a distance of about 1 metre who was closing the keeper down. The striker's arms were in a natural position and there was no way he could have avoided the ball striking his arm so I awarded a goal.


Perhaps it would be a good idea for FIFA to bring in a specific rule which says goals scored from any handball, whether intentional or not do not stand.
 
Jatz said:
So uhhh...
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So uh what? I'm not quite sure what the bolded has to do with me saying it was deliberate and the Refereeing body agreeing.
 

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