Opinion Richmond youth silver lining to otherwise underwhelming 2016

[Sassafras]

Love how the Yanks say it: "Iony."
Iron pronounced Ion. (Except by my old teacher who said "Eye-ron ... and Sutherun ... and Northerun etc)
Ergo:
Irony=Iony.
And they don' t even do it.
Things that are not ironic are often described as such.

Indeed.

 

[This Is Anfield]

 

[Sassafras]

View attachment 270831

Hot pic.

 

[mopsy]

When was the last rebuild?? Have not seen one yet even though we were not supposed to take short cuts the club not help blowing its a load!!

Agree. I would phrase it differently We have never taken a rebuild through to its logical conclusion.

Anyway i dont believe in rebuilds as such. All clubs are in a constant state of building their lists. At given times some are turning over more than others is the only real difference.

 

[Mr Unbelievable]

When was the last rebuild?? Have not seen one yet even though we were not supposed to take short cuts the club not help blowing its a load!!

Mr magic, we have at least tried to rebuild !
This has been the most successful, the fact that it didn't produce a finals win is indicative of our very poor performance for the last 30 years.
Yes , we need to do better!

 

[Mr Magic]

Mr magic, we have at least tried to rebuild !
This has been the most successful, the fact that it didn't produce a finals win is indicative of our very poor performance for the last 30 years.
Yes , we need to do better!

We have not tried to rebuild seriously!! Wouldn't worry about previous years where KB had no support and others very little where bad selections ruled.

At least we had hope because KB's strategy made sense.

The recycled argument only made sense to a crazy man. Crazy Vossy comes to mind!

 

[TigerImposter]

None of our kids made the under 22 best 22 and I believe none made the short list of 40.

http://oneeyed-richmond.com/forum/index.php?topic=25285.0

We need to start a serious rebuild by collecting as many picks as possible as we won't get close with the likes of Grigg Houli Moore Hampson etc. they to some maybe serviceable role players, but they won't cut the mustard.
With the young talent in the Saints Dogs GWS Suns Dees and Swans the CFC managed to get three kids into the final 22.
It's scary to think that they started their rebuild seven years after DH entered pro and he is still undecided whether to commence it.
Balmey better have that cattle prod ready.

 

[NaturalDisaster]

None of our kids made the under 22 best 22 and I believe none made the short list of 40.

http://oneeyed-richmond.com/forum/index.php?topic=25285.0

We need to start a serious rebuild by collecting as many picks as possible as we won't get close with the likes of Grigg Houli Moore Hampson etc. they to some maybe serviceable role players, but they won't cut the mustard.
With the young talent in the Saints Dogs GWS Suns Dees and Swans the CFC managed to get three kids into the final 22.
It's scary to think that they started their rebuild seven years after DH entered pro and he is still undecided whether to commence it.
Baloney better have that cattle prod ready.

like hte bloke at the bottom mentioned, wheres the kid who came second in the rising star?

also, did you know Adelaide had no nominations in the rising star this year, yet theres two crows players there. Where are the Hawthorn players??

all it means is who performed better in that particular year. Much like the AA.

 

[NaturalDisaster]

anyway I don't think our development has been that good anyway, I don't think its that our kids don't have a lot of potential.

 

[TigerImposter]

like hte bloke at the bottom mentioned, wheres the kid who came second in the rising star?

also, did you know Adelaide had no nominations in the rising star this year, yet theres two crows players there. Where are the Hawthorn players??

all it means is who performed better in that particular year. Much like the AA.

What does this have to do with the best 40 kids selected by the afl ? So one kid is our rebuil? As for the Crows go and have a look at their list of kids.
Please add to the topic with solid arguments not girly little snippets of nothing.

 

[NaturalDisaster]

What does this have to do with the best 40 kids selected by the afl ? So one kid is our rebuil? As for the Crows go and have a look at their list of kids.
Please add to the topic with solid arguments not girly little snippets of nothing.

Ok TI

I just had a look at all our players under 22 and compared them to the best under 22 team, comparing the amount of games they played during the season.

SO the players that we have that are 22 and under are:

Nick Vlastuin - 19 games (Was nominated in the 40)
Kamdyn Mcintosh - 6 games
Liam Mcbean - 3 games
Nathan Drummond - 4 games
Ben Lennon - 3 games
Jayden Short (R) - 16 games
Reece Mckenzie - 0 games
Ivan Soldo (R) - 0 games
Oleg Markov - 8 games
Dan Butler - 0 games
Jason Castanga (R) - 5 games
Callum Moore (R) - 2 games
Connor Menadue - 14 games
Corey Ellis - 11 games
Mabior Chol (R) - 1 game
Dan Rioli - 18 games (rising star nom)


Now to look at the team (not including finals)

Rory Laird - 17 games
Jacob Weitering - 20 games
Sam Docherty - 22 games
Callum Mills - 20 games
Jake Lever - 22 games
Zac Williams - 20 games
Zac Merrett - 22 games
Patrick Cripps - 21 games
Stephan Cogniglio - 22 games
Isaac Heeny - 20 games
Jesse Hogan - 21 games
Christian Petracca - 17 games
Jake Stringer - 19 games
Joe Daniher - 22 games
Darcy Moore - 17 games
Brody Grundy - 21 games
Marcus Bontempelli - 22 games
Jack Viney - 21 games
Jack Martin - 21 games
Tim Membry - 17 games
Ollie Wines - 22 games
Lachie Hunter - 23 games

Now, lets have a look the average number of games played by our boys under 22. Ive never been good at maths TI but i can work out something as basic as averages.

The average is 6.88 games...

What about the 22 under 22 gameers

The average is.... 20.41 games

So if you have a list, which kids only played an average of 6.8 games, and yet the average of the 22 list is 20, how the hell do you expect any of our kids to be selected???

Another thing to consider.

The lowest number of games played by players in the final 22 gamers is 17... Rory Laird, Christain Petracca, Tim Membry and Darcy Moore

Only two of our players played more games than that.. Nick Vlastuin, who was nominated and Daniel Rioli who is only in his first year so obviously isn't as experience or going to be as consistent. and yes Petrracca also made his debut, but remember he was 2nd in the draft, so he is going to be better as a general rule.

Next closest player was Jayden Short with 16 games, again a first year player and rookie listed.

Next is Connor Menadue with 14 games, showed a lot of promise but went in and out of the team and was rather inconsistent.

Next was Corey Ellis who only played 11 because of injury.

The rest played under 10 games. Short, Castanga, Chol, Moore, are rookies so had to be elevated before they played. Mcintosh got a season ending injury whilst training, Mcbean was always going to be rubbish and got delisted, Ben Lennon spent most of the year sick or injured, Nathan Drummond was still rehabilitating (for most the year) from injuring himself during his debut game last year, Oleg Markov took a while to get on the park cos he never set the world on fire during the VFL but showed a lot of promise when he did AND should have got a rising star nom, Reece Mckenzie retired and never debuted, Dan Butler hasn't played a game for us.

So I ask you now TI, is it really because our kids are just so terrible like you believe? Are we really as doomed as you believe with this group? How can you tell with the obvious small number of games played between them?

 

[TigerImposter]

Ok TI

I just had a look at all our players under 22 and compared them to the best under 22 team, comparing the amount of games they played during the season.

SO the players that we have that are 22 and under are:

Nick Vlastuin - 19 games (Was nominated in the 40)
Kamdyn Mcintosh - 6 games
Liam Mcbean - 3 games
Nathan Drummond - 4 games
Ben Lennon - 3 games
Jayden Short (R) - 16 games
Reece Mckenzie - 0 games
Ivan Soldo (R) - 0 games
Oleg Markov - 8 games
Dan Butler - 0 games
Jason Castanga (R) - 5 games
Callum Moore (R) - 2 games
Connor Menadue - 14 games
Corey Ellis - 11 games
Mabior Chol (R) - 1 game
Dan Rioli - 18 games (rising star nom)


Now to look at the team (not including finals)

Rory Laird - 17 games
Jacob Weitering - 20 games
Sam Docherty - 22 games
Callum Mills - 20 games
Jake Lever - 22 games
Zac Williams - 20 games
Zac Merrett - 22 games
Patrick Cripps - 21 games
Stephan Cogniglio - 22 games
Isaac Heeny - 20 games
Jesse Hogan - 21 games
Christian Petracca - 17 games
Jake Stringer - 19 games
Joe Daniher - 22 games
Darcy Moore - 17 games
Brody Grundy - 21 games
Marcus Bontempelli - 22 games
Jack Viney - 21 games
Jack Martin - 21 games
Tim Membry - 17 games
Ollie Wines - 22 games
Lachie Hunter - 23 games

Now, lets have a look the average number of games played by our boys under 22. Ive never been good at maths TI but i can work out something as basic as averages.

The average is 6.88 games...

What about the 22 under 22 gameers

The average is.... 20.41 games

So if you have a list, which kids only played an average of 6.8 games, and yet the average of the 22 list is 20, how the hell do you expect any of our kids to be selected???

Another thing to consider.

The lowest number of games played by players in the final 22 gamers is 17... Rory Laird, Christain Petracca, Tim Membry and Darcy Moore

Only two of our players played more games than that.. Nick Vlastuin, who was nominated and Daniel Rioli who is only in his first year so obviously isn't as experience or going to be as consistent. and yes Petrracca also made his debut, but remember he was 2nd in the draft, so he is going to be better as a general rule.

Next closest player was Jayden Short with 16 games, again a first year player and rookie listed.

Next is Connor Menadue with 14 games, showed a lot of promise but went in and out of the team and was rather inconsistent.

Next was Corey Ellis who only played 11 because of injury.

The rest played under 10 games. Short, Castanga, Chol, Moore, are rookies so had to be elevated before they played. Mcintosh got a season ending injury whilst training, Mcbean was always going to be rubbish and got delisted, Ben Lennon spent most of the year sick or injured, Nathan Drummond was still rehabilitating (for most the year) from injuring himself during his debut game last year, Oleg Markov took a while to get on the park cos he never set the world on fire during the VFL but showed a lot of promise when he did AND should have got a rising star nom, Reece Mckenzie retired and never debuted, Dan Butler hasn't played a game for us.

So I ask you now TI, is it really because our kids are just so terrible like you believe? Are we really as doomed as you believe with this group? How can you tell with the obvious small number of games played between them?

For starters you have to stop putting words in my mouth as I did not say our kids are terrible . We did not get any kid into the top 40 is what I stated. Your stats actually make my case stronger that we still need to do a rebuild bc it's the Grigg Houli Moore types that are ruining opportunities for our kids. This is where the social worker has destroyed a lot of players development by playing hacks. Example:Moore over Lennon in the last round. With DH there for two more years and based on his seven years of nothing I'm getting a tank of oxygen in order to survive his destructive work.

 

[mopsy]

I think what people fail to look at is where in the scale players are likely to finish up.
I only see 4 juniors who have potential top end talent and none are anywhere near top end atm.
If it is a rebuild then that wont get us anywhere near close to a premiership.

 

[Sassafras]

Unpopular opinion, but I think Tom Boyd will be a very, very good player. He's only 20 years old.

I also think that he will be.
Also had a bit to go.

Agree with this but his value is not a million a year, it may reach those hights but he is not even close to that yet imo

Yep, maybe not worth it yet, but today he took a big step.

 

[Livonski]

Which is why they are renegotiating Boyd's contract as we speak!
It was made with a purpose ... and I doubt Boyd was supposed to step in and kick 50 goals this year. It was made with three, four and five years in mond, which starts next year.

Bump.

Some gold in that thread.
I said at the time and repeat now. It would have been a disgrace to try and renegotiate Boyds contract.

I wonder what they're thinking tonight?

Payday?

 

[Livonski]

Based on what Ive seen of him live over two years in the VFL I suggest no .
Pea Heart with no killer instinct and plods around looking lost running around to the wrong spots
Over rated and average IMO. A Vickery with two legs.

TigerImposter gold right there.

What a fine judge of talent.

 

[Tiger71]

Yep, maybe not worth it yet, but today he took a big step.

Haha i am pissed drunk and at a dinner atm. I stand by what I said, he still is not worth a million a year. Like I said, he may reach those heights so i do rate the boy but as of now, he is not a million a year forward. He could get there though.

Have no idea why you quote bumped me ?

 

[TigerImposter]

TigerImposter gold right there.

What a fine judge of talent.

Amazing what a good coach can do if he's prepared to drop the bloke. TV is the perfect example.
Yep a of of people got it wrong with Tommy. It's all about development.
I'm still a few hundred posts behind you when it comes to BS.

 

[Livonski]

What do you mean .. disgrace? Hawthorn and Geelong players have been taking pay cuts for a decade to keep their teammates. Guess who wins the premierships.

Sorry about the bump...but I guess the Dogs win the premiership. And the disgrace that Darcy and Mooney suggested in "renegotiating" his salary would've changed the course of history.

 

[Tiger71]

Amazing what a good coach can do if he's prepared to drop the bloke. TV is the perfect example.
Yep a of of people got it wrong with Tommy. It's all about development.
I'm still a few hundred posts behind you when it comes to BS.

Actually, Livonski has less posts then you.

In my estimating, you are streaks a head of him when it comes to BS posts.

Also, its good to see how quick you jump off a opinion and switch to another. Show some spine man, show some spirit!

Anyway, off to drink and eat more. I'll have a white wine for you with some fish TI

 

[TigerImposter]

Yep, maybe not worth it yet, but today he took a big step.

Yep good talent identification. I over ruled him based on two games at Coburg and a dozen other afl/ VFL games. Should have used the cliche
Talls Take Longer.

 

[Sassafras]

Haha i am pissed drunk and at a dinner atm. I stand by what I said, he still is not worth a million a year. Like I said, he may reach those heights so i do rate the boy but as of now, he is not a million a year forward. He could get there though.

Have no idea why you quote bumped me ?

Because I was agreeing with your post that was responding to mine....

 

[Sassafras]

Yep good talent t game. I over ruled him based on two games at Coburg and a dozen other afl/ VFL games. Should have used the cliche
Talls Take Longer.

Who knows how he will play the next 10 plus years of his career. But I have always been astounded by people putting him down consistently at that age when he has all the weapons. He dominated at junior level and was always going to take time to adjust. I predicted a Hawkins (but better) scenario would take place after a break out game and he would go on to be elite, admittedly not this early on and as I said who knows about his future. But he certainly has the right team and coach around him to succeed.

 

[TigerImposter]

Actually, Livonski has less posts then you.

In my estimating, you are streaks a head of him when it comes to BS posts.

Also, its good to see how quick you jump off a opinion and switch to another. Show some spine man, show some spirit!

Anyway, off to drink and eat more. I'll have a white wine for you with some fish TI

Good drink all the white wine as its for pussies IMO and be careful not to choke on a fish bone.
Sticking up for Livo FMD the DH apologists are out in force.
Must be embarrassed that Bever who did his apprenticeship under Clarkson ( like DH) actually learned something while on the job.
Enjoy you're evening while drinking in sloth ,self pity and shame.

 

[Tiger71]

Good drink all the white wine as its for pussies IMO and be careful not to choke on a fish bone.
Sticking up for Livo FMD the DH apologists are out in force.
Must be embarrassed that Bever who did his apprenticeship under Clarkson ( like DH) actually learned something while on the job.
Enjoy you're evening while drinking in sloth ,self pity and shame.

Never change TI. lol

I will drink white wine as I know its your favorite.

Also I will never feel shame being a tiger man but you would never understand that.

Anyway, good night my old crusty imposter. May you embrace the club you support as I know Norf need more members. C'mon lass, put your money where your mouth is. Have you recovered from Boomer getting the ass yet ?