Query Ross Faulkner footies in the AFL?

[Les Malone]

killer

Sorry, missed the last bit of your post, yes i think the AF ball would have been smaller, and their was no difference between the RL and RU ball till i believe the 1950's when the Steeden came into being.

Not 100% sure though on the last bit- i stand corrected.

 

[Les Malone]

The Same Game, A Different Ball | Boyles Football Photos

www.boylesfootballphotos.net.au

At one stage a rugby size 2 ball ( smaller ball) was used by the VFA in the 1870's but a distinct AF football was not until the Sherrin the 1890's smaller again than a rugby ball.

 

[killer]

Herald March 1935



SG June 1939

 

[Les Malone]

View attachment 872728
Herald March 1935

View attachment 872730

SG June 1939

i haven't see one for awhile, but i am no longer involved in a senior football club, so maybe they are still around but i do remember white Sherrins in the 1980's

 

[Mr Courageous]

I noticed the game on fox footy tonight, bulldogs vs Fitzroy from 1993, the match ball was a Faulkner.
I am wondering when the last time a Faulkner was used in the AFL?

 

[BringBackTorps]

I fund this article in my researches

4 October 1930 Sporting Globe

http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article182998518

It relates the story of one Charlie Palmer, a Geelong player pre VFL.

He talks about the football played with in the "good old days" (ie 1880's-90's) and says it was bigger than a 1930's soccer ball and was round (& was difficult to kick a long distance- all my emphases).

I am doing research on footballs (any type) used in Victoria (for AF only), between 1858 to 1892
(After 1892, the TW Sherrin-designed ball was often used- which had rounder ends & was smaller & lighter, cf the post 1877, "pointier" VFA-prescribed Rugby No. 2 ball).

If anyone comes across, from Trove sources etc., any pre-1959 description of:-

. the shape &/or weight/size of 1858-1892 balls

. how often they might become damaged, or out of shape

. how often they became waterlogged; problems being waterlogged/heavily affected by rain

. how often the bladder burst, or became slightly deflated

. difficulties kicking them accurately, or a long distance (including heavy boots or heavy pants hindering kicking)

. jumping high to mark the ball (whether ball caught above the head, or a chest mark)

. predictible (or not) trajectory of pre-1892 balls after they were kicked

. fear of being hurt in a marking contest (either hurting the hands from the heavy balls, or hurt by another player); or actually being hurt trying to mark

. players jumping high, in an attempt to mark a ball

I would greatly appreciate it, if I could be alerted to these references. Perhaps a PM to me would be best, to relay the details/respond better to my questions.

Thank you

 

[blueycarlton]

i haven't see one for awhile, but i am no longer involved in a senior football club, so maybe they are still around but i do remember white Sherrins in the 1980's

I remember white footballs in the 1960's at high school, Lyrebird? brand. I think the makers of Kookaburra cricket balls may have made them.

 

[blueycarlton]

I am doing research on footballs (any type) used in Victoria (for AF only), between 1858 to 1892
(After 1892, the TW Sherrin-designed ball was often used- which had rounder ends, cf the post 1877, "pointier" VFA-prescribed Rugby No. 2 ball).

If anyone comes across, from Trove sources etc., any pre-1959 description of:-

. the shape &/or weight/size of pre-1892 balls

. how often they might become damaged, or out of shape

. how often they became waterlogged; problems being waterlogged/heavily affected by rain

. how often the bladder burst, or became slightly deflated

. difficulties kicking them accurately, or a long distance (including heavy boots or heavy pants hindering kicking)

. jumping high to mark the ball

. predictible (or not?) trajectory of pre-1892 balls after they were kicked

. fear of being hurt in a marking contest (either hurting the hands from the heavy balls, or hurt by another player); or actually being hurt trying to mark

. players jumping high, in an attempt to mark a ball; or actually taking a mark, with a high jump

I would greatly appreciate it, if I could be alerted to these references. Perhaps a PM to me would be best, to relay the details/respond better to my questions.

Thank you

I have done a lot of delving into pre VFL era newspapers for blueseum and I can't say I have found any description of the ball, apart from being a No2 size rugby ball. If I had found one I would have put it on the site. I did find a description about the stops/studs used by Carlton (nailed in) verus the Essendon ones which had a screw holding them on. But nothing about all of those points you mention. Maybe the ball being replaced because it went flat, rings a bell.
As a kid in the 50's and 60's the footy if left out in the rain and soaked a few times used to go nearly round. When I played as a teenager on mud heaps and the ball became waterlogged it was like kicking a lump of lead. Only one ball used in those days, I don't think Kade Simpson would have got back on his feet the other week, if the ball had been waterlogged.

 

[BringBackTorps]

I have done a lot of delving into pre VFL era newspapers for blueseum

Congratulations on the blueseum site, the best history site for any AFL club- & thank you for your reply.

1. Did you research newspapers etc. only to 1864 (official creation date of Carlton FC)?
Or did you go back to 1861 (when Carlton Cricket Club announced in 2 newspaper ads it was holding public meetings to form a football club); or did you go back to 1858, when some newspaper reports (decades later) suggested a football Club was formed in Carlton in 1858- 1860 period (not necessarily by the Ben James group, or connected to the Carlton Cricket Club)?

2. In your research & searches on Trove, have you checked all the main Melbourne-based major papers? Back to 1858?
And have you checked all the inner suburban local newspapers also? Back to what dates?

I assume your Trove searches included, obviously, "football". Did you check also the word "foot-ball"?

I can't say I have found any description of the ball, apart from being a No2 size rugby ball

3. How many mentions (from your recollection) pre-1877 were there, approx., of "Rugby No. 2 ball", related to football matches in Victoria (not including ads for footballs)? Or Rugby No. "other"balls?

Re the Rugby No. 2 ball after 1877 (VFA prescription), were there comments or descriptions (from your recollection) of how/why it was superior to other pre-1877 balls?
If so, what was said?

How many mentions (from your recollection), approx., was the term "Rugby No. 2 ball" (re football matches, not ads), used from 1877-1895?
Or Rugby No. "other" balls?

I did find a description about the stops/studs used by Carlton (nailed in) verus the Essendon ones which had a screw holding them on.

4. Early players wore high boots without stops.
When do you think stops (of any type) were first being used? And when they became fairly common (50%+)?


5. Have you seen descriptions (prior to 1900) of players losing balance, or slipping over (in dry conditions) when running for the ball; & when striding to attempt to mark the ball?

(Old photos usually don't show the bottom of boots; or if they do, are often poor resolution, so it is not possible to judge if stops were on the boots.
In a 1885 lithographic of team captains, two players sitting on the ground had their soles exposed & clearly painted by the artist- showed both had stops).

As a kid in the 50's and 60's the footy if left out in the rain and soaked a few times used to go nearly round.

6. Can you provide corroboration (from a written source, &/or persons currently alive) that leather footballs prior to 1970 (& pre- modern, superior waterproofing technologies) "if left out in the rain & soaked a few times used to go nearly round".
By a "few times", what no. are you referring to?


Your replies are greatly appreciated, thank you.
(As from anyone else who has done detailed research in these areas).

 

[blueycarlton]

Congratulations on the blueseum site, the best history site for any AFL club- & thank you for your reply.

1. Did you research newspapers etc. only to 1864 (official creation date of Carlton FC)?
Or did you go back to 1861 (when Carlton Cricket Club announced in 2 newspaper ads it was holding public meetings to form a football club); or did you go back to 1858, when some newspaper reports (decades later) suggested a football Club was formed in Carlton in 1858- 1860 period (not necessarily by the Ben James group, or connected to the Carlton Cricket Club_?

2. In your research & searches on Trove, have you checked all the main Melbourne-based major papers?
And have you checked all the inner suburban local newspapers also?

Did you check also the word "foot-ball" in your trove searches?




3. How many mentions pre-1877 were there, approx., of "Rugby No. 2 ball", related to football matches in Victoria (not including ads for footballs)?

In mentions of the Rugby No.2 ball (after 1877 VFA prescription), were there comments or descriptions it was superior to the pre-1877 balls?
If so, what was said?

How many times, approx., was the term "Rugby No. 2", used from 1877-1895?




4. When do you think stops (of any type) were first being used? And when they became fairly common?


5. Have you seen descriptions of players slipping over (in dry conditions) when running for the ball; & when striding to attempt to mark the ball?

(Old photos usually don't show the bottom of boots; or if they do, are often poor quality, so it is not possible to judge if stops were on the boots.
In a 1885 lithographic of team captains, two players sitting on the ground had their soles clearly painted- showed both had stops).



Can you provide corroboration (from a written source, &/or persons currently alive) that leather footballs prior to 1970 (& modern waterproofing technologies) "if left out in the rain & soaked a few times used to go nearly round".
By a "few times", what no. are you referring to?


Your replies are greatly appreciated, thank you.
(As from anyone else who has done detailed research in these areas).

Congratulations on the blueseum site, the best history site for any AFL club- & thank you for your reply.

1. Did you research newspapers etc. only to 1864 (official creation date of Carlton FC)?
Or did you go back to 1861 (when Carlton Cricket Club announced in 2 newspaper ads it was holding public meetings to form a football club); or did you go back to 1858, when some newspaper reports (decades later) suggested a football Club was formed in Carlton in 1858- 1860 period (not necessarily by the Ben James group, or connected to the Carlton Cricket Club_?

2. In your research & searches on Trove, have you checked all the main Melbourne-based major papers?
And have you checked all the inner suburban local newspapers also?

Did you check also the word "foot-ball" in your trove searches?




3. How many mentions pre-1877 were there, approx., of "Rugby No. 2 ball", related to football matches in Victoria (not including ads for footballs)?

In mentions of the Rugby No.2 ball (after 1877 VFA prescription), were there comments or descriptions it was superior to the pre-1877 balls?
If so, what was said?

How many times, approx., was the term "Rugby No. 2", used from 1877-1895?




4. When do you think stops (of any type) were first being used? And when they became fairly common?


5. Have you seen descriptions of players slipping over (in dry conditions) when running for the ball; & when striding to attempt to mark the ball?

(Old photos usually don't show the bottom of boots; or if they do, are often poor quality, so it is not possible to judge if stops were on the boots.
In a 1885 lithographic of team captains, two players sitting on the ground had their soles clearly painted- showed both had stops).



Can you provide corroboration (from a written source, &/or persons currently alive) that leather footballs prior to 1970 (& modern waterproofing technologies) "if left out in the rain & soaked a few times used to go nearly round".
By a "few times", what no. are you referring to?


Your replies are greatly appreciated, thank you.
(As from anyone else who has done detailed research in these areas).

Well I am alive, I think, at 70. I don't need a written source because I know that they went out of shape.
Footballs were a very expensive item and in the early days would have been dried out, boot polished and repaired, and used many times over.
I remember my father making me a paper football similar to what the kids used in the 1920's and 30's 'cause footies were expensive.
I have seen ads and reports of rubber footballs experimented with.

As for 1861 I found that and put that into Blueseum. I have been back to the 1850's looking for references to the Myall Ground and found an ad for the Myall Hotel. First recorded Carlton game was on the Myall Ground now the Alfred Hospital site.
There is heaps of info on Trove if you take the time to look.
Anyway I will get back to you when I have the time.

 

[Burtonsgottago]

Loved kicking the Faulkner as a kid. Had such a nice feel. Always found the Sherrin a little overrated as even the expensive ones get bloated and resemble kicking a rock over time.

 

[blueycarlton]

Congratulations on the blueseum site, the best history site for any AFL club- & thank you for your reply.

1. Did you research newspapers etc. only to 1864 (official creation date of Carlton FC)?
Or did you go back to 1861 (when Carlton Cricket Club announced in 2 newspaper ads it was holding public meetings to form a football club); or did you go back to 1858, when some newspaper reports (decades later) suggested a football Club was formed in Carlton in 1858- 1860 period (not necessarily by the Ben James group, or connected to the Carlton Cricket Club)?

2. In your research & searches on Trove, have you checked all the main Melbourne-based major papers? Back to 1858?
And have you checked all the inner suburban local newspapers also? Back to what dates?

I assume your Trove searches included, obviously, "football". Did you check also the word "foot-ball"?



3. How many mentions (from your recollection) pre-1877 were there, approx., of "Rugby No. 2 ball", related to football matches in Victoria (not including ads for footballs)? Or Rugby No. "other"balls?

Re the Rugby No. 2 ball after 1877 (VFA prescription), were there comments or descriptions (from your recollection) of how/why it was superior to other pre-1877 balls?
If so, what was said?

How many mentions (from your recollection), approx., was the term "Rugby No. 2 ball" (re football matches, not ads), used from 1877-1895?
Or Rugby No. "other" balls?



4. Early players wore high boots without stops.
When do you think stops (of any type) were first being used? And when they became fairly common (50%+)?


5. Have you seen descriptions (prior to 1900) of players losing balance, or slipping over (in dry conditions) when running for the ball; & when striding to attempt to mark the ball?

(Old photos usually don't show the bottom of boots; or if they do, are often poor resolution, so it is not possible to judge if stops were on the boots.
In a 1885 lithographic of team captains, two players sitting on the ground had their soles exposed & clearly painted by the artist- showed both had stops).



6. Can you provide corroboration (from a written source, &/or persons currently alive) that leather footballs prior to 1970 (& pre- modern, superior waterproofing technologies) "if left out in the rain & soaked a few times used to go nearly round".
By a "few times", what no. are you referring to?


Your replies are greatly appreciated, thank you.
(As from anyone else who has done detailed research in these areas).

 

[blueycarlton]

Q1. I checked as far back as I could, I may have missed something, probably, who knows?
There were lots of clubs in the Carlton area by the late 1860's. I didn't look to see when they were formed. Although The Footballer has formation dates on lots of these clubs.

Q2. No, I haven't checked every local suburban newspaper in Melbourne.
If you would like to spend hours in the State Library trawling through reels and reels of micro-fische for me, please do so.
Yes I did check Foot-ball

Q3. No2. Rubgy ball was mentioned. How many times? I can't recall. Should I have made a note of it?

Q4. There is an article on the different type of stops used by Carlton and Essendon. It's in Blueseum in one of the VFA years.

Q5. Well the "grounds" had no drainage system back then and after heavy rain were a quagmire, of course players were falling over.
In dry weather? Well, players today fall over on billiard table top surfaces with the roof closed, don't they?

Q6. As I have said, I have left my footballs out in the rain and they would become deformed. A bit like me.
I played footy in my teens in the 60's when only one football was used in a game and it became so waterlogged that it was like kicking a lump of lead in the final quarter.

I am just an ordinary supporter with no professional research or writing qualifications.
Now retired I decided to devote a lot of my time to the earlier formative years of the club, just because it hadn't been recorded in any detail by anyone on the site.
I also contribute to the great Blueseum web site in general.
We are quite happy for anyone else to contribute to the Pre VFL section or to any other part of Blueseum.
If you want to help out, just let Blueseum know.
However, do not alter some one elses writing without permission.

 

[north_lad]

Rocking the Faulk in this game

 

[Munners]

I just got this footy off eBay because I love the retro logos, can anyone help identify where and when it's from? My guess is mid 90s, maybe 95-97.

 

[jle101]

I just got this footy off eBay because I love the retro logos, can anyone help identify where and when it's from? My guess is mid 90s, maybe 95-97.
View attachment 1186473View attachment 1186474

Possibly even before then. Could be anywhere from 1990 - 1997.

 

[farnsy1964]

I just got this footy off eBay because I love the retro logos, can anyone help identify where and when it's from? My guess is mid 90s, maybe 95-97.
View attachment 1186473View attachment 1186474

Magnificent find, I just bought this Maccas Ross Faulkner tonight with Geelong signatures on it, have dated it between 2000-2004

 

[Tandy]

We used to use the Faulkner's in Auskick and vickick. Preferred them as kid footys

 

[Randall Stevens]

I just got this footy off eBay because I love the retro logos, can anyone help identify where and when it's from? My guess is mid 90s, maybe 95-97.
View attachment 1186473View attachment 1186474

Today Tonight first aired in 1995, so I reckon your time window is accurate.

Also, Triple M first broadcast footy in ‘97. Possible - but unlikely imo - that they would be advertising on the ball if not covering the sport. You could say same about Today Tonight, but at least Channel 7 was the footy broadcaster.

 

[Carn The Berries]

I just got this footy off eBay because I love the retro logos, can anyone help identify where and when it's from? My guess is mid 90s, maybe 95-97.
View attachment 1186473View attachment 1186474

Ross Faulkners were used in the SESFL/SFL during the mid/late 90s. I remember being behind the goals as a kid kicking them back during senior games... Once they got waterlogged they were far heavier than a Sherrin, I was glad they were never used in the EFL where I was playing!

They always seemed to need a lot more kicking in than Sherrins to get to a nice shape, they stayed "pointier" for longer.