Ross Lyon and his inability to give youth a go

[Freomaniac]

The thread started 15 months ago and people have been saying this about Lyon for much longer than that. Jury out really, hes only just started.

Speaking of Darcy, dont you think Freo are overdue to try another ruckman? Sandilands now 34 and another injury prone year? Perhaps should have gone the youth path a bit earlier?

I have Quoted you before. Still... Jono Griffin was delisted aged 31. Zac Clarke was 27 and retired. Sean Darcy Cam in at the right time. I expect Lloyd meek and Scott Jones to get a game this year

 

[The Joker]

Ross Lyon gave us two absolutely red hot goes at a premiership (and I thank him for that!), but he didn't give Armo and Stevens a chance when he was coach. They came good AFTER he left us.

It's true, but at the time were they better than the players he had running around in the big league. Steven won a RS nomination when Ross was there. But really, they were 21 and 23 when he left, it's no shocking surprise they got better.

I'm not arguing here, just trying to see if it's as bad as it's made out to be!

 

[Freomaniac]

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_match_statistics?mid=9528

Average Attributes
Fremantle Attribute Essendon
186.8cm Height 187.6cm
87.0kg Weight 87.8kg
25yr 1mth Age 24yr 11mth
92.0 Games 86.4

Total Players By Games
Fremantle Games Essendon
10 Less than 50 9
2 50 to 99 6
5 100 to 149 4
5 150 or more 3


Freo played 10 guys with 50 games or less.

4 of those guys are Brayshaw, Banfield, Cerra and Crowden. 2 of those blokes got a debut game vs Essendon.The other 2 got a debut game in round 1 vs Port

 

[Freomaniac]

Keep changing the goal posts to suit the narrative

The motivations are relevant, fact of the matter is if he had it on his terms he would still be playing his set group of players which was proven in rounds 1-2 this year.

Trying to spin this into he's suddenly this master youth development coach is quite frankly baffling and shows just how easy some Freo fans are duped.

Freo played 10 players with 50 games or less vs Essendon.

4 of those blokes are brayshaw, Banfield, Cerra and Crowden. 2 blokes played their 1st game, the other 2 played their 2nd game.

Yep Ross Lyon plays No youth.

 

[mightymouse75]

In all fairness it's taken him 10 years

 

[Freomaniac]

I heard this topic being discussed on SEN radio while driving home from work last night, and it was quite interesting.

The topic of discussion was that Ross Lyon while a very good coach, doesnt seem to invest to much into youth. The hosts stated he has hit set 25 or so players and very rarely plays any other players, forcing them to languish away in the WAFL. They stated that players such as Apeness, Crozier, Hannath, etc are being deprived from senior football or when they are called up play 1 or 2 games before being dropped and unable to get that continuity at the top level.

They stated that he did this also at St Kilda, and when he left the Saints were in a terrible position development wise and are only now getting out of the Rut he caused when he left.

They said that with Freos ageing list, it was a mistake to sign Ross till 2020 due to the above, and that Ross will have to change his coaching philosophy if he is to see out his contract as he will have to start going down the youth and development path soon.

From what i can see from a Football watcher is that i kind of agree with this. Hawthorn, Sydney, Geelong continue to cycle in new players all the time and giving them a chance to prove themselves, however i dont really see this with Freo.

Anyways Im not going to say this is whats happening, i just thought it was a interesting discussion.

Freo played 10 players with 50 games or less vs Essendon.

4 of those blokes are brayshaw, Banfield, Cerra and Crowden. 2 blokes played their 1st game, the other 2 played their 2nd game.

 

[Freomaniac]

In all fairness it's taken him 10 years

ijust love making every anti ross lyon person on here look stupid

 

[Peel67skin]

ijust love making every anti ross lyon person on here look stupid

He is a good coach , but he debut youth and then give up on them or let them go .

The problem is all the debut last year did not play compare to other team not rebuilding like Port (SPP, Marshall). Sean Darcy, Cox , Nyhuis , Logue (injuries) , deluca ( delisted ) , Balic ( trade out) . One thing to debut youth another thing is to persist with them .

 

[Freomaniac]

He is a good coach , but he debut youth and then give up on them or let them go .

The problem is all the debut last year did not play compare to other team not rebuilding like Port (SPP, Marshall). Sean Darcy, Cox , Nyhuis , Logue (injuries) , deluca ( delisted ) , Balic ( trade out) . One thing to debut youth another thing is to persist with them .

Depends on how you see it. Freo have depth in some areas

 

[ydraw]

He's doing it now, he wasn't doing it when this thread was created. We were playing guys like Suban and Mayne over young players.

 

[freo_leo29]

Honestly the thread has run its course and should be locked, It is obvious Ross plays youth.

 

[Freomaniac]

Glad this is back. I was worried given all 3 of the Freo/Ross/Tanking/Yoof threads had fallen off the front of the main board.

post away mate

 

[Freomaniac]

Couldnt care less bout lyon leaving, but to answer your question list spots were taken up by rejects from other clubs to suite his rigged 20 man defence game plan, had zero interest in bringing kids to the club. Id also say armitage and steven are fine examples of young players pushing on post lyon. Tom lynch couldnt get out of the place any quicker. Not much more but thats lyon for you, always scrapping the bottom of the barrel when it comes to youth. Theres a whole lot more you'd have absolutely no idea about so please stay on topic and add something constructive or step aside

Ross Lyon doesn't play youth? Freo beat Essendon 16.10 to 14.6.90 playing 4 1st year players in Brayshaw, Banfield, cerra and Crowden

 

[Yeti]

Give it a rest.....

I'm a huge Ross Lyon supporter but he isn't faultless. Everyone gets it, Freo are rebuilding and Ross Lyon is playing the youth in droves.

And yes, it helps getting top 10 picks instead of high teen picks.

 

[westy1]

He is a good coach , but he debut youth and then give up on them or let them go .

The problem is all the debut last year did not play compare to other team not rebuilding like Port (SPP, Marshall). Sean Darcy, Cox , Nyhuis , Logue (injuries) , deluca ( delisted ) , Balic ( trade out) . One thing to debut youth another thing is to persist with them .

What like you persisted with your team meima?
Pathetic

 

[TheMcManusNose]

post away mate

lol righto

 

[Plugger_87]

Ross Lyon doesn't play youth? Freo beat Essendon 16.10 to 14.6.90 playing 4 1st year players in Brayshaw, Banfield, cerra and Crowden

you sad sad sad individual, i pitty you man

 

[Freomaniac]

While i agree with most of what you're saying, i think Ross Lyon has been at the club long enough that he certainly should be taking a fair bit of the blame for the lack of KPP's. It's been pretty obvious for a long time that Freo hasn't been good at drafting KPP's, but Lyon's now been there for 5 drafts, and nothing has changed. When he arrived at the club, he should have recognised this hole in the list (as should many people at Freo), but he hasn't, or has chosen to ignore it. If Freo had focused on KPP's in the 2011/12 drafts, there would likely be a few starting to hit their straps and actively pushing out Pav and Dawson, etc.

Freo seems to be falling into a trap of going for best available, when they don't have the list makeup that allows them to do that. Weller is a great prospect, and perhaps he will be the best player that was available at that pick, but what's the point of having him and Fyfe and other stars in the midfield when you have very little in terms of KPP's. It's far easier to find a Weller-level midfielder/small (especially with later picks in the draft) than it is to find a Lever-level KPP.

Otherwise i agree completely with what you say, especially that last paragraph. There's always good reasons to draft whatever player you draft, and reasons to overlook the players you don't draft, but it gets to the point where there's a hole on your list and you need to fill it, which Freo haven't done.

Agreed with most of your post... During that 2011-15 drafts, We always went for best available for the 1st and 2nd round. Freo should of got best available with their 1st pick then punt on a key forward or key forward/ruck with a 2nd pick. But Freo did use 1st and 2nd round picks on KPPs.

Tanner Smith was a 2nd rounder in the 2012 draft. Looked ok for the 1st 2 years in development. Saved his career off a Port game in 2015. Looked good in some games in 2016, then got one long term injury then that was the end of him.

Then Comes the 2013 draft. We originally hoped Cam McCarthy was going to slide to us at pick 17. GWS shocked a few people and got him at pick 12. Surprised a few people at the time as they already had Jonothan Patton and Jeremy Cameron. We used that pick on Michael Apeness who is a key forward ruck. Looked ok in a handful of games but had 2 knee recos. We also go Matt Tarberner in the rookie draft and he is slowly improving

Alex Pearce was our 2nd round pick Played his 1st season in the reserves, played 12 games in 2015. He then played 10 games in 2016 then injured his leg, he also missed out on 2017 as well. He is now an important cog in freos backline.

 

[Freomaniac]

you sad sad sad individual, i pitty you man

Well I am going to ram down Ross Lyons youf policy down the saints throats whether you like it or not.

 

[Plugger_87]

Well I am going to ram down Ross Lyons youf policy down the saints throats whether you like it or not.

we dont care bro we have our own issues

 

[Freomaniac]

we dont care bro we have our own issues

well this this bro is about Ross Lyon playing youf. How is your teams youf policy going?

 

[sonnywalters]

Sandilands, M Johnson, D Pearce, Mundy, Spurr, Sutcliff, Kersten & Ballantyne should all be retired at year's end.

Also Freo have 5 rucks on their list.

 

[sonnywalters]

well this this bro is about Ross Lyon playing youf. How is your teams youf policy going?

Cerra, Brayshaw, Cox, Darcy, Logue, Banfield, Tucker, Nyhuis, Crowden
v
Gresham, Long, Clark, Coffield, White, Lonie, Battle, McKenzie, McCartin, Goddard

I prefer Freo's yoof to be honest.

 

[The Joker]

Sandilands, M Johnson, D Pearce, Mundy, Spurr, Sutcliff, Kersten & Ballantyne should all be retired at year's end.

Also Freo have 5 rucks on their list.

Who do they pay all the money to though, I mean, dont you need to reach a certain % of the cap?

Anyway, no way will they pay Kersten out, no matter how bad he is!

 

[TedDougChris]

In all fairness it's taken him 10 years

Makes you wonder if sometimes he regrets not doing it sooner, or if he thinks he just didn't have the young quality cattle ???