List Mgmt. Ross Lyon - Sacked

Is Ross still the man for the job?


  • Total voters
    328

Freomaniac

Brownlow Medallist
May 3, 2007
18,161
8,572
Parts Unknown
AFL Club
Fremantle
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Man City, Valencia, Lazio, Panthers
It goes further than this:

In 2015 we finished first. St Kilda 14th, Brisbane 17th, Carlton 18th.

2014 we were eliminated in the semis. St Kilda 18th, Brisbane 15th, Carlton 13th.

2013 was the last time any of those three teams had double figure win seasons (Carlton 11, Brisbane 10. The Saints finished 16th).
Fremantle actually started their rebuild the same year St Kilda finished theirs (they were 12 and 10 in 2016) and a year after Brisbane and Carlton started what was their third and second consecutive rebuilds. Really it only the latter two we can compare ourselves to; St Kilda didn't do a bad job of rebuilding, they just didn't do a particularly good one.

There is still a fair bit of water to go under the bridge but I think there is some lessons in Fremantles approach:
1) Don't sack your coach after you have started since it will inevitably result in player turnover setting you back (Brisbane)
2) Don't rebuild around senior players that will be end of career by the time you finish (Saints).
3) Never rebuild from scratch since the external pressure from the inevitable losses of playing too many younger players across multiple seasons make it difficult to stick to the program. (Brisbane and Carlton)
Again, I dont mind the constructive criticism.

As stated, if you are doing a 4-5 year rebuild and you think your team will spend 4-5 years out of finals, You hope you draft a bunch of good 18-20 year old players in the 1st year. That means after 4 seasons, you have a bunch of 22-24 year old players with 40-80 games under the belt. Which isn't a bad base to build from.

You look at Port in 2006, they got guys like Travis Boak, Robbie Gray and Justin Westoff. All but stewart played in the 2007 GF. All 4 blokes were in that prime 24-26 year range in 2013-14 after port spent 2008-12 period out of finals.

Brisbane Looked ok at the end of 2014 until they sacked Voss in my opinion. Then they sacked Leppitch which he netted like 14 wins in 3 years from 2015-17.

Saints rebuild wasn't too bad in theory but they had injuries to certain key young players. As I said, saints got McCartin as pick 1 in 2014, which in theory made sense as Riewoldt was a the near end of his career. So from 2005-17, McCartin was FF, Riewoldt was CHF. Riewoldt retired in 2017, that meant McCartin in 2018 in his 4th year was expected to be the spear head of the forward line. That didnt turn out as the saints hoped as McCartin is injury prone.

Blues Rebuild was interesting too. They had those 3 number 1 picks from 2005-7 in Murphy, Gibbs and Kreuzer. Gibbs is gone, the other 2 are in the near end of their careers. I personally think the Blues culled the list too deep in the last 4-6 years assuming that just recruiting a massive amount of kids was instantly going to work. It didnt. Their isnt an age balance in their 22. It reminded me of the saints of 2012-13 of having a list of players aged 30 or over and a bunch of kids aged 21 or under and a handful of players in their prime 24-27 years that are duds too.
 

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Alfonz

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 23, 2005
5,981
5,082
AFL Club
Fremantle
Ross knows the simple equation - make finals before the end of 2020 to get a contract extension.

The club's public position appears to be the same since he was given the mandate to see out the rebuild, so I highly doubt they would blink first and offer him an extension unless finals was guaranteed this year.

Possession is 9/10 of the law. Yes, Ross' recent comments about loving the club and Perth could be perceived as slightly disingenuous, but he's built this team from the ground up and it looks like it's just about to start bearing some fruit. He wont be going anywhere unless the club forces him out.

Perhaps that's the real question everybody should be asking and thinking about? Will the club hold firm on the plan that was publicly laid out at the end of 2016, or will it blink prematurely?
I hope they don't blink. If he wants to leverage a huge offer from Carlton without returning us to a genuine top 4 level side, then we should stand our ground and let him walk if that's what he decides.

And just making finals by end of 2020 should barely be enough to extend his contract. For Lyon to stay, I personally think he has to make finals this year, and then continue that progression with winning at least one final next year.
 

theGav56

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 11, 2004
20,635
15,860
Bali
AFL Club
Fremantle
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Clearly Fyfe so that he can grow his brand under a big Victorian club. :D

Im sure the AFL has already decided that you'll be happy with Carlton's second round draft pick (cause their first goes to Adelaide).
What a load of rubbish. Carlton hold Adelaide's first. Pick 10 for Fyfe or the club should walk away. Could probably expect a 2020 third rounder as well.
 

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Belnakor

Brownlow Medallist
Apr 10, 2005
18,977
10,158
Perth
AFL Club
Fremantle
I hope they don't blink. If he wants to leverage a huge offer from Carlton without returning us to a genuine top 4 level side, then we should stand our ground and let him walk if that's what he decides.

And just making finals by end of 2020 should barely be enough to extend his contract. For Lyon to stay, I personally think he has to make finals this year, and then continue that progression with winning at least one final next year.

this is the kind of approach teams like Carlton, Saint Kilda and Richmond (up until Hardwick) took. it never worked out. Sacking your coach when he is mid way through a rebuild never works out for anyone.

Our current list profile is going to peak in about 2022. We don't want a newbee coach when our list is just peaking unless you want to spend another 5 years in the wilderness.
 

Yeti

Club Legend
Feb 17, 2012
2,141
5,415
Newcastle
AFL Club
Fremantle
If the reported 4.5 million over 5 years by Carlton is on the table for RTB he would have to give it consideration over the uncertainty with Freo's offer/non offer at the end of next year
$$$$$ usually win
lol

"Reported"

It was just Slobbo dribbling lines. He said Carlton should make an offer in the vicinity of $4.5 million over 5 years.
 

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