List Mgmt. Ross Lyon - Sacked

Is Ross still the man for the job?


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Bring back Drum

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Jul 8, 2019
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Where was I saying training skills is a waste of time.

Just questioning the belief held by some on here that Ross doesn't care about skill development.

He probably hopes that most players have the fundamental skills when they get to the AFL.
Unfortunately with the appalling junior coaching in grassroots football most draftees need much more work in this area.
I think calling junior coaches ‘appalling’ is not really understanding the role of a junior coach. Junior coaches are taught/encouraged to ensure the game is an enjoyable experience. A successful junior coach is marked on how many kids come to training & come back the next year.
Yes of course skills are taught & I hope the basics of good systems in defence, offence & contested ball.
The talent pathway coaches in today’s era are responsible for fine tuning those basic skills. Kids are identified at the age of 10 & 11, mainly because of their skill level & in a lot of cases size.
A lot of pathway coaches will disregard those who have poor skills at a young age in any case because at that age there are 100’s of kids who can win the ball, but those development coaches don’t want to particularly work on basic skills, mainly because they don’t have the timeframe to do so.

When RTB talks about skills, he’s talking about it in it basic form, being able to hit a target 20m away without pressure, no one works on that at any senior level, it’s expected.
Today’s training is all about match simulation practice, where hitting those targets 20-30m away is done constantly under match style conditions. Training is a different beast because there is no consequence of error, where gameday there is between 30000-100000 people watching along with a tv audience & then more watching the replay later & of course the result.
That pressure cannot be simulated, so young teams will make errors in games that they don’t at training & so do the experienced from time to time. The more games, along with training, then less errors. With this comes better decision making under pressure, which is just as important.
I don’t go to Freos training, but I’d be very surprised if they are not doing a lot of match simulation training.
 

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kingswood71

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If you can't see this as a constant failing of Ross coached teams nothing I say is going to change your mind.
It's been a pattern for a while.
Well...for an example, use McGovern. Second for total intercepts with 171 from 19 games. I am almost sure that we havent played WC 19 times this year, so he must have some ability to see where the ball is going and then run to that spot while he is playing against other sides too....
The way people go on about how Fremantle "Kick it to McGovern" all the time you would swear that he is an inanimate object and we pick him out, when the actual truth is the opposite!
Of course its related to entries but "Ross coached teams" are not orphans in that regard.
If you cant see that, then nothing I say is going to change your mind.
 

Joao

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That's not what I said at all, don't put words in my mouth. If you're not able to grasp the difference between what I said, and your misrepresentation, then that's unfortunate for you. And lay off the strawmen.



Again, it appears you're not able to grasp the issue at hand. Where are you coming up with this nonsense about not playing without training? In fact, where are you coming from with any of this drivvel? Players are still players and can play if they don't train?! What are you even talking about?



I'm not telling you anything, you're going off on some absurdly nonsensical tangent which bears no resemblance whatsoever to anything I have said, and dragging me with you.
The reason you think I am going off on tangents is because you aren't making sense.
 

raffrox

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Well...for an example, use McGovern. Second for total intercepts with 171 from 19 games. I am almost sure that we havent played WC 19 times this year, so he must have some ability to see where the ball is going and then run to that spot while he is playing against other sides too....
The way people go on about how Fremantle "Kick it to McGovern" all the time you would swear that he is an inanimate object and we pick him out, when the actual truth is the opposite!
Of course its related to entries but "Ross coached teams" are not orphans in that regard.
If you cant see that, then nothing I say is going to change your mind.
Nah, you're right. Our forward line is super efficient.

I don't know what I was thinking.
 

raffrox

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Lyon will coach Fremantle next season skills training or not.
Get used to that fact and watching football will become so much more enjoyable. :)
Watching Freo in recent years has been many things but you'd be hard pressed to even find a majority of Freo supporters that would say that it's largely been enjoyable.
 
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theGav56

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In short yes, I do think the way panic sets in is a coaching fault and was even apparently admitted by Lyon in the post match press conference.
The cure for "panic" is experience, and I don't mean training experience, I mean experience in games. Duman learns a lesson from that game from his error, and a coach gets measured on how that is handled. Pretty happy with how he is progressing personally.
 

BlueE

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I think calling junior coaches ‘appalling’ is not really understanding the role of a junior coach. Junior coaches are taught/encouraged to ensure the game is an enjoyable experience. A successful junior coach is marked on how many kids come to training & come back the next year.
Yes of course skills are taught & I hope the basics of good systems in defence, offence & contested ball.
The talent pathway coaches in today’s era are responsible for fine tuning those basic skills. Kids are identified at the age of 10 & 11, mainly because of their skill level & in a lot of cases size.
A lot of pathway coaches will disregard those who have poor skills at a young age in any case because at that age there are 100’s of kids who can win the ball, but those development coaches don’t want to particularly work on basic skills, mainly because they don’t have the timeframe to do so.

When RTB talks about skills, he’s talking about it in it basic form, being able to hit a target 20m away without pressure, no one works on that at any senior level, it’s expected.
Today’s training is all about match simulation practice, where hitting those targets 20-30m away is done constantly under match style conditions. Training is a different beast because there is no consequence of error, where gameday there is between 30000-100000 people watching along with a tv audience & then more watching the replay later & of course the result.
That pressure cannot be simulated, so young teams will make errors in games that they don’t at training & so do the experienced from time to time. The more games, along with training, then less errors. With this comes better decision making under pressure, which is just as important.
I don’t go to Freos training, but I’d be very surprised if they are not doing a lot of match simulation training.
While I agree with what you're saying about junior coaches, from what I've seen there is little time spent on match simulation.

Also drills can be designed, as they are in other top level sports, to simulate pressure the players experience. But that doesn't happen to any great extent from what i've seen at Freo compared to WCE.
 

BlueE

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You mean like the Plan B that knocked off Geelong?
He came up with a different plan to beat Norf and then thanked Montagna in the post game pressor for his advice.

Back to the same ole same ole against Gold Coast in the next game where Montagna wasn't opposition analyst!
 

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theGav56

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He came up with a different plan to beat Norf and then thanked Montagna in the post game pressor for his advice.

Back to the same ole same ole against Gold Coast in the next game where Montagna wasn't opposition analyst!
And our recent games have also had a different game plan, using three rucks for example, and playing much smaller in defence. Who says Lyon only has one game plan?
 

salim malik

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Watching Freo in recent years has been many things but you'd be hard pressed to even find a majority of Freo supporters that would say that it's largely been enjoyable.

Lyon is coach now and will coach in 2020. End of story .
You better get used to it and who knows you might even join the majority of supporters who accept the fact and have got behind the club. ;)
 

raffrox

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Lyon is coach now and will coach in 2020. End of story .
You better get used to it and who knows you might even join the majority of supporters who accept the fact and have got behind the club. ;)
Oh I forgot. If I'm not careful you can revoke my supporter card?

What's that you say? You actually can't tell me how to support my club?

The passive aggressive ;) is a nice touch.
 

dont bowl there

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I wonder if all the other teams feel the same about Luke Ryan who is 3rd in total intercepts?
"Why do they keep bombing it to Ryan?!!!"
You do realize that players read the play and run to position right?....
You don't think there has been a pattern of kick long inside 50 that allows really good intercept defenders to have field days against us? Just because some teams do the same to us doesn't mean we shouldn't be criticised for the same mistake over and over and over.
 

PurpleEyes

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Watching Freo in recent years has been many things but you'd be hard pressed to even find a majority of Freo supporters that would say that it's largely been enjoyable.
I've enjoyed 2019.
There's only been a few games where I've really felt we were done by half time and not in the game.
Yes, there has been games where I get frustrated, but I have far too many Eagles fans who have said the same about their team in 2019.
And I thought we would only have a sneaky chance of finals football if we had an excellent lucky year with injuries. So my expectations at the start of 2019 have so far been exceeded.
 

raffrox

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I've enjoyed 2019.
There's only been a few games where I've really felt we were done by half time and not in the game.
Yes, there has been games where I get frustrated, but I have far too many Eagles fans who have said the same about their team in 2019.
And I thought we would only have a sneaky chance of finals football if we had an excellent lucky year with injuries. So my expectations at the start of 2019 have so far been exceeded.
Fair enough.
 

salim malik

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Oh I forgot. If I'm not careful you can revoke my supporter card?

What's that you say? You actually can't tell me how to support my club?

The passive aggressive ;) is a nice touch.
You can support the club how the **ck you want but 2020 is going to have Lyon coaching Freo.
If we have a good 2020 and with the improvement shown and the injured back playing it's certainly on the cards that Lyon could coach on beyond 2020.
That doesn't make the future all that bright and sunny for those who want him gone.;)
 
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WilloTree

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It's not really relevant anymore if we think Ross is a good coach or not. Freo has lost 7000 members in 12 months. The Board won't accept that for long and without a VERY fast turn around in membership numbers, Ross will be gone within 12 months.
 

salim malik

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It's not really relevant anymore if we think Ross is a good coach or not. Freo has lost 7000 members in 12 months. The Board won't accept that for long and without a VERY fast turn around in membership numbers, Ross will be gone within 12 months.
Nah win 4 or 5 first up next season and supporters will come back in droves.
 

PurpleEyes

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It's not really relevant anymore if we think Ross is a good coach or not. Freo has lost 7000 members in 12 months. The Board won't accept that for long and without a VERY fast turn around in membership numbers, Ross will be gone within 12 months.
Please show where you got that rot from?
 

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