List Mgmt. Ross Lyon - Sacked

[Bender571]

I may be wrong, but I understood it was a $1m outlay, offset by the revenue earned, and that it was a small deficit.

People complain about the club not being innovative, I thought this was a strong move.

That was my understanding as well.

"“We’re anticipating not to make any money from this event,” Rosich said.

“That’s not the purpose of this additional game. The purpose of the additional game was to bring an extra game to WA and an extra game for our Fremantle supporters to watch at home.

“We’re not anticipating making a profit at all from the venture. It’s likely to be a small loss on the event, but it wasn’t a money-making opportunity.”"

"Almost 19,000 tickets had been sold for the game yesterday and Fremantle chief executive Steve Rosich anticipated a crowd of about 30,000."
Official crowd was 33,388 so the loss might've been even smaller than anticipated
https://thewest.com.au/sport/freman...-from-taking-on-gold-coast-game-ng-b88792404z

 

[E Shed]

I think there is a lot to like about the team this year and going forward but I keep coming back to the fact Hawthorn and other teams being coached in a similar style (Brisbane) just take us to pieces with ease. Its not even close and we just aren't even in it.
Its hard to see how we can win a flag when there appears to be such a glaring achilles heel in Lyons gameplan.

 

[Spirit Level]

I cant fathom how some people cant see the improvement in the youngsters.
Are you pissed off because Ross pulled of the win with a team of youngsters and missing 8 best 22 . You were so hoping for a loss werent you.

You realise that young players will naturally improve with experience right? Especially the likes of a Cerra or Brayshaw who have footy running right through their blood.

You also realise that it took us until after half time to get a few goals ahead of the last team on the ladder on our home deck, right?

You are so blinded by your love of the guy that you can't see we're going nowhere with him.

 

[Frigate]

Do you actually watch us play? Do you?

There is no system and we make the same mistakes every ****ing week without ever fixing them.

The plan is stale and the need for change is evident to nearly everyone.

I seriously can't fathom how some people think he is the one to take us forward

This is the typical hysteria from someone that probably yells out "kick the bloody thing", then watches the turnover and rebound and then complains about game plan.

Guess what - if you do not have key position players taking marks around the ground, it is bloody hard to get any system going. Do you notice the minute Tabs comes back in suddenly McCarthy plays better - and Cox?

Same mistakes every week without fixing them? I think you are over-rating our list and not identifying the symptoms of the failed "game plan". The mistakes are s**t kicks, missing simple handballs, missing easy shots on goal. The mistakes come from having to kick to Ballas or Walters or Matera as key players in the forward line, because we were missing most of our talls all year.

Apparently Dew is an awesome footy brain, and went to Gold Coast - has that magically turned their list into a competitive machine? What about the Bulldogs and the Saints - apparently they had these new innovative game plans - they are going great guns!

Lastly, the quote that "the need for change (coach) is evident to nearly everyone" is simply not true. Maybe within your group of friends, maybe influenced by some very opinionated people???

Relax, we have had a crap year, but considering everything that has gone wrong, we have signed everyone we want going forward apart from Cerra. We should be pushing for the 8 next year, if we can halve the amount of injuries : THese players have all missed a substantial amount : If we could get 21 games out of all these we are completely different team :
These have missed :
Fyfe (8), Blakely (10), Sandi (13), Taberner (14), Bennell (season), Hamling (6), Logue (season), S Hill (8), Apeness (15), Cox (7), B Hill (13), Darcy (16), Walters (6)

 

[Stilgar]

What is innovative about buying games?

I gave you a like for that one Clay because I like the fact you are so predictable.

I think you see yourself as some modern day Che Guevara, but your not really revolutionary. Just sad and bitter.

Never mind, we'll lose again soon and that will cheer you up no doubt.

 

[theGav56]

I gave you a like for that one Clay because I like the fact you are so predictable.

I think you see yourself as some modern day Che Guevara, but your not really revolutionary. Just sad and bitter.

Never mind, we'll lose again soon and that will cheer you up no doubt.

Che Guevara? Clay sees himself as BF Trump.

 

[Dirty_banchez]

You must be crying tears of blood that Ross will be coaching until at least 020.

When Banker returns we will have the numbers to overthrow you.

 

[jedi mind tricks]

What is innovative about buying games?

Lol

The loss of revenue was minimal

It wasn't 1 mil as that obviously was the outlay.

You are just creating an argument while not presenting facts.

 

[Lach72]

Ballas got another year


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[yakka man]

I may be wrong, but I understood it was a $1m outlay, offset by the revenue earned, and that it was a small deficit.

People complain about the club not being innovative, I thought this was a strong move.

IIRC West Coast came up with the idea first. Am I right in saying that? We came in second and the AFL gave us the rights to the game.

 

[Yeti]

Ballas got another year


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I'm a big advocate for keeping senior blokes around to nurture and protect the next generation.

But this is horseshit.

He is cooked.

 

[Lach72]

If we cut hard elsewhere I'm not as against it as everyone else...if he's the 4th picked small behind Walters Matera and Switta


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[westy1]

If we cut hard elsewhere I'm not as against it as everyone else...if he's the 4th picked small behind Walters Matera and Switta


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id have ballas over tommy sheridan, cam sutcliffe and brandon matera any day of the week
had a good game yesterday and genuinely gives a *

although johnno was made to look 5 years younger yesterday due to the standard of the opposition



'

 

[Scham]

If we cut hard elsewhere I'm not as against it as everyone else...if he's the 4th picked small behind Walters Matera and Switta


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And Giro and Crowden and any small that we draft or trade in this year.

 

[Freo Shark]

Ballas got another year


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I'm a big advocate for keeping senior blokes around to nurture and protect the next generation.

But this is horseshit.

He is cooked.

This, hes cooked hurry up and stick a fork in it!

 

[Scham]

This, hes cooked hurry up and stick a fork in it!

It could be worse. The Saints signed Gilbert on for this season and they're 4 years in to their rebuild!

 

[jedi mind tricks]

This is the typical hysteria from someone that probably yells out "kick the bloody thing", then watches the turnover and rebound and then complains about game plan.

Guess what - if you do not have key position players taking marks around the ground, it is bloody hard to get any system going. Do you notice the minute Tabs comes back in suddenly McCarthy plays better - and Cox?

Same mistakes every week without fixing them? I think you are over-rating our list and not identifying the symptoms of the failed "game plan". The mistakes are s**t kicks, missing simple handballs, missing easy shots on goal. The mistakes come from having to kick to Ballas or Walters or Matera as key players in the forward line, because we were missing most of our talls all year.

Apparently Dew is an awesome footy brain, and went to Gold Coast - has that magically turned their list into a competitive machine? What about the Bulldogs and the Saints - apparently they had these new innovative game plans - they are going great guns!

Lastly, the quote that "the need for change (coach) is evident to nearly everyone" is simply not true. Maybe within your group of friends, maybe influenced by some very opinionated people???

Relax, we have had a crap year, but considering everything that has gone wrong, we have signed everyone we want going forward apart from Cerra. We should be pushing for the 8 next year, if we can halve the amount of injuries : THese players have all missed a substantial amount : If we could get 21 games out of all these we are completely different team :
These have missed :
Fyfe (8), Blakely (10), Sandi (13), Taberner (14), Bennell (season), Hamling (6), Logue (season), S Hill (8), Apeness (15), Cox (7), B Hill (13), Darcy (16), Walters (6)

Logical reasoning instead of irrational hatred

 

[Unique Name]

although johnno was made to look 5 years younger yesterday due to the standard of the opposition
'

With ball in hand maybe... but defensively his lack of ability to break out past a jog made him look like a 50yr old. His lack of run was a massive liability and Carlton looked to move the ball through whoever was closest to Johnson because they were able to get 10m in the clear with ease. Quite a few of their early goals went through Johno.

 

[Square Peg]

I can't find one post saying Lyon is the best in the league... Then you suggested a few coaches who were better and the list was quite frankly so shite it was easy to pick apart. Fagan was better... Going by the metric you are now spruiking he is a fair way behind in a team that started rebuilding a few years before ours. We are not going to get Geelong Scott or Clarkson here and Geelong Scott is presiding over a long slow slide in his teams performance and going on your metric is going backward year on year. Personally, I think the Hawks will have a big fall in the next three years and won't have a premiership to show for it.

Worsfold was also mentioned in that list IIRC - which is a false equivalent as they are at least three years further in their rebuild. On top of that by the only measurement that counts we beat them when both teams had full lists.

I was on here in 2015 saying we needed to wholesale change the list and was told to piss off by many as I was lessening the fun of the season. I find most on here who want Lyon gone don't have a good reason past 'I don't like him' when we dig beyond the surface.

What area have we not improved in this season? There is one and that is 'wins' and we have two games to go (neither of which we are favored to win). Apart from that name one area.

People here blamed Ross for the first half but the second was all Carlton's fault... bloody hilarious.
Some have made the fallacious claim they would prefer to lose 105-100 than win with a lower score. Read any book on investing and loss aversion throughout history and you will discover that although people may think they believe this, historical stats prove it a fallacy. Read: The Undoing Project by Michael Lewis. Great writer, entertaining and hugely informative as a starting point. There are many other docs, journal articles and books I can suggest once you have looked into this, all fascinating, helpful for business, investing and leading teams. Bigfooty book club here we go! It is false to say the very least that people would be happy with high scoring losses.

So again - please tell me an area we haven't improved in this year. Or admit it is your bias against Lyon and that you simply want the process to happen faster.

When you are finished with the hysteria, exaggerations and straw man arguments it might be worth responding in detail. I stress might.
For now I think I'll just repeat the following, again for your benefit

The metric of wins and losses per season is the metric comparing team performance from year to year that matters. Everything else is peripheral bullshit, soon to be forgotten by history. The only caveat to that is the uneven fixture might mean you have it worse one year than another but in the end, as Lyon himself says, it's an outcomes industry. People can crap on about whatever process measures they want, it means nothing in comparison.

Unless you believe team performance is 100% due to the coach, that is not a metric to judge a coach by. And I never said it was. So bullshit on about it with your fallacious arguments all you want but Joao was the only one trying to make that connection and I shot it down in flames.

The rest of your post is about as useful and relevant to me as **** on a bull, so I have no idea why you are addressing it to me.

 

[Square Peg]

Logical reasoning instead of irrational hatred

More garbage from you. You should reconsider your position as a mod. Are you a player of stupid games that everyone criticising Lyon suffers from irrational hatred, or are you going to try and make sense and at least pretend to be even handed?
And please, do again run off to your fellow mods for me having a crack at you.

 

[Stilgar]

IIRC West Coast came up with the idea first. Am I right in saying that? We came in second and the AFL gave us the rights to the game.

I think you're right.

 

[jedi mind tricks]

More garbage from you. You should reconsider your position as a mod. Are you a player of stupid games that everyone criticising Lyon suffers from irrational hatred, or are you going to try and make sense and at least pretend to be even handed?
And please, do again run off to your fellow mods for me having a crack at you.

Firstly I have never discussed you to the other mods. I did however read your post saying that I know nothing about football.

I never deleted that post.

Secondly you may want to re read my posts re Ross and Freo's skills coaches and strength and conditioning. I haven't been so complementary about them.

I don't however go on a Ross bashing crusade unlike some. It doesn't make for an enjoyable time on BF. Plus I find some of it isn't very leveled to the point of irrational.

 

[Stilgar]

More garbage from you. You should reconsider your position as a mod. Are you a player of stupid games that everyone criticising Lyon suffers from irrational hatred, or are you going to try and make sense and at least pretend to be even handed?
And please, do again run off to your fellow mods for me having a crack at you.

Have a snickers buddy, Jedi has been known to have the odd pot at Ross himself.

I think he's just trying to cool the temperature a bit.

Edit: What Jedi said

 

[poshman]

Do you actually watch us play? Do you?

There is no system and we make the same mistakes every ****ing week without ever fixing them.

The plan is stale and the need for change is evident to nearly everyone.

I seriously can't fathom how some people think he is the one to take us forward

That is simply not true. But the use of the double question for emphasis.. bravo!

 

[poshman]

Do you think the club would have made that outlay with the belief we would end up with the same wins as last year? Or did they see that extra home game as a way of improving chances of making finals? Or potentially keeping our season live for longer, thereby increasing crowds sizes later in the year? Neither of the latter happened.

With the extra home game in hand, does finishing on the same number of wins mean we improved with a younger list, or stayed about the same? The pollyannas are on here talking about how this season was an improvement. Fewer thrashings, more youth blooded. But are we headed in the right direction? We've beaten one team in the top 10 (Port may still slide out of the 8), last year we beat four teams inside the top 10, two at the MCG, one of whom was the eventual premier.

I'd say we've stopped the rot. We won't get worse from here, but there is no reason to think we will get better.

No reason to think we will get better?

This is one of the most ridiculous things I have read on bigfooty. Up there with ‘it was brayshaws fault he got hit in the head’.

Do you not think we will get improvement out of any of the following?

Brayshaw
Cerra
Cox
Tabs
Fyfe (plays 18 games)
Darcy
Blakely
Ryan
Wilson
Logue
Hamling

Shall we continue. I’m laughing so hard right now. We went over this and you refused to go through the list and admit there has been improvement and some of it significant. But your ‘there is no reason to think we will get better’ surely even the panicked agenda pushers here would agree that natural improvement will come from many one the list. Add to that the consistent efforts of more senior players and we will improve.