List Mgmt. Ross the Boss

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It could be me but I think the 6-6-6 rule could be the best think to happen to freo in a long time. More players in front of the ball has been the major change in game style. Also its easier to not bomb in long when you have quick leading players. Hogan has the fastest maximum speed (on the gps) in the afl this year. This change could yet bring out the best in Ross.

Couretesy of Deverauxin with a post in the Welcome Hogan Thread
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/attachments/screenshot_20190422-192340_afl-jpg.659917/

Having quick leading players in McCarthy and Hogan definitely helps to allow players to lower their eyes so they bomb long less.
 

theGav56

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It could be me but I think the 6-6-6 rule could be the best think to happen to freo in a long time. More players in front of the ball has been the major change in game style. Also its easier to not bomb in long when you have quick leading players. Hogan has the fastest maximum speed (on the gps) in the afl this year. This change could yet bring out the best in Ross.

Couretesy of Deverauxin with a post in the Welcome Hogan Thread
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/attachments/screenshot_20190422-192340_afl-jpg.659917/

Having quick leading players in McCarthy and Hogan definitely helps to allow players to lower their eyes so they bomb long less.
I agree, and the club is working it well atm.

BUT, I also thought the chopping the arms rule would be a massive blessing for Sandilands. Apparently his arms weren't included in that rule.
 

fnerd

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I agree, and the club is working it well atm.

BUT, I also thought the chopping the arms rule would be a massive blessing for Sandilands. Apparently his arms weren't included in that rule.
Yeah but then the ‘too tall ,give others a chance rule’ (similar to u/12s ) got enacted and would overide it
 
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I agree, and the club is working it well atm.

BUT, I also thought the chopping the arms rule would be a massive blessing for Sandilands. Apparently his arms weren't included in that rule.
This.. so much this.. how this rule didn't apply to sandi is a blight on the league.
 
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Has anyone watched ANY other Gold Coast and St Kilda games. There is a reason we struggled to score those games and the games were a cluster**** (we also didnt turn up against GC but thats against the point).

These teams are playing the way we have always been criticised of playing, they clog it up and force a shit fight more than any other teams this year. Now you could make an argument the guys should have been able to stick to the game plan we saw in the other three weeks but unfortunately, other teams try to stop you playing the way you like, and kudos to them, they did on those days through a mixture of positioning and relentless pressure (Saints pressure is undoubtedly number 1 this year).

We played exactly how we wanted too against North, WC and GWS. North are shit with almost zero pressure so the skills were high. West Coast are an extremely experienced, skilled and cohesive unit and our finishing was off so we didnt get it all our way and kicked ourselves out of the game. We played our best game of the season to date against GWS with a high skill level in the face of a very good team.

There should be zero doubts the gameplan has changed, its now about making sure its good enough to take us the distance and can be drilled into the guys well enough that they do it on instinct
 
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This year, we throw in Hogan and a fit Taberner. All of a sudden McCarthy gets a nuffy defender & the n1 goes to Hogan. Taberner runs his man off the chain & we move Mundy & Walters out of i50 back into the midfield to deliver the ball & Matera plays deep forward again which is his perfect position. With Mundy Hill & Walters kicking i50 we have a lot more opportunity to score. Last year all 3 of them weren’t in the mid (hill injured).
Tabs got the #1 defender in the GWS match (Davis), broke his nose too. Can't remember the matchups in the other games, but I thought Tabs has had the bulk of the attention so far.
 

Fat Nyfe

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It’s never as good or as bad as it seems.

So the season is young. The benchmark remains 10 wins.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
He really needs to win about half our games at least for a pass mark imo.
Pass mark should be finals. That doesn’t mean the sky is falling in or Ross gets the sack if it’s not a pass, but Ross and the club should be openly disappointed if we miss finals, not patting each other on the back for hitting some arbitrary win mark. Not accepting mediocrity and all that.
 

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I don't overly care about the pass mark for this year. Progress with the players, the structures, the game plan should be the focus, and while that may be reflected in win/loss, it can also be derailed by injuries. Plus, I would prefer the club to sacrifice win/loss for development, especially in the first 2/3s of the season. If we are looking like finals prospects, then go hard for the wins. I think the pass mark is all about 2020, which is also what the club has previously talked about.
 

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Are you serious? We've played more youngsters than anyone in recent years and turned over 80% of the list in a short period of time. Picking youngsters when they're not ready hurts a players development, it doesnt help. Simply playing players at afl level doesnt magically make them better. In fact someone like Giro is better off working at things at wafl level until he develops a bit more consistently by foot. The reason why Carlton and Gold Coast have been down for so long isnt because they didnt play youngsters. Its because they played too many youngsters before they were ready. Danyle Pearce played because there wasnt another youngster close to ready by Round 1 2018. Cerra had only just started training and Crowden (probably the closest to being ready youngster not selected) had hardly set the world on fire that preseason. Tucker benefited from playing a few games at WAFL last year. The idea that you have to play every young player to be rebuilding is absurd.
Danyle played for the same reason Zac D played 2017. For the reasons Lyon has always said - his dual narrative of restump not rebuild and starting each season trying to win as many games as he can with his tried and true players and methods to take the heat off himself. I accept it and understand it even if I don't agree with it. Why are people now trying to pretend it was different from what it was is my only point. You really do fly off the handle mate, try and calm down.
 

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That's a pretty convenient argument, so essentially all future successes can be attributed else where, whereas all failure attributed directly to Lyon so your precognitions can remain safely unchallenged regardless of outcome. It seemed pretty obvious to me at the time that carrying a hampered Darcy who was not playing his best in what was already a fairly tall and immobile team allowed GC to outrun us at the end. I think we've learned from that and dropped Cox for McCarthey for sake of balance. With so many good talls we want to play, we'll sometimes run into the danger of being tempted to play too many.

And it may even be possible that Lyon is a hack coach where the rule changes and our new forward line simply makes who the coach is inconsequential, we seem to have such a strongly positioned team where failure seems like a very hard thing to do. But it would be disingenuous to make this type of argument and then not also apply the same logic to when Lyon was in charge of a fairly uncompetitive list in 2018 still young and developing.
How do you dismiss playing 8 men in the backline ? We were 19 points up in that final quarter and the coach resorted to his default option.
I’m happy to cop that loss if it was the price for what we are now seeing.
I wrote on my disappointment of the coach’s plan of using an undermanned forward line. He has been doing it since 2016 and I am ******* sick of it. So too, has Ross’ new boss . That is my essentially my argument.
I don’t bag anyone involved with Freo including coaches, managers and especially players.
However , that does not diminish my feeling of helplessness with what I have seen from Ross since 2015.
I like Ross for the change in our professionalism. Ross has clearly had a positive impact on this club.
That does not mean his intransigence is acceptable.
That is my argument. His new boss has intervened.
Ross will now get the credit ; I am happy for that to happen.
I have been disappointed with him over the past 3 years but I have never said that on this site although I could have.
From now on I will attribute wins to Ross. I had the right to blame him for losses because of what I wrote about above; it was my prerogative and I chose to be silent.
 

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I don't overly care about the pass mark for this year. Progress with the players, the structures, the game plan should be the focus, and while that may be reflected in win/loss, it can also be derailed by injuries. Plus, I would prefer the club to sacrifice win/loss for development, especially in the first 2/3s of the season. If we are looking like finals prospects, then go hard for the wins. I think the pass mark is all about 2020, which is also what the club has previously talked about.
Id love for us to finish 7 or 8th. Have a final in Melbourne against a big club to really teach the guys about finals pressure. Maybe jag a win or two while we're there. Get these boys battle hardened.
 

theGav56

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Id love for us to finish 7 or 8th. Have a final in Melbourne against a big club to really teach the guys about finals pressure. Maybe jag a win or two while we're there. Get these boys battle hardened.
Excellent plan! Playing finals would be a terrific way to forge the team for the future.Give them self belief. Send them off into the break knowing they need to come back in top condition ready for the battle from day 1.
 

kingswood71

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Has anyone watched ANY other Gold Coast and St Kilda games. There is a reason we struggled to score those games and the games were a cluster**** (we also didnt turn up against GC but thats against the point).

These teams are playing the way we have always been criticised of playing, they clog it up and force a shit fight more than any other teams this year. Now you could make an argument the guys should have been able to stick to the game plan we saw in the other three weeks but unfortunately, other teams try to stop you playing the way you like, and kudos to them, they did on those days through a mixture of positioning and relentless pressure (Saints pressure is undoubtedly number 1 this year).

We played exactly how we wanted too against North, WC and GWS. North are shit with almost zero pressure so the skills were high. West Coast are an extremely experienced, skilled and cohesive unit and our finishing was off so we didnt get it all our way and kicked ourselves out of the game. We played our best game of the season to date against GWS with a high skill level in the face of a very good team.

There should be zero doubts the gameplan has changed, its now about making sure its good enough to take us the distance and can be drilled into the guys well enough that they do it on instinct
excellent analysis snuffy :)
Yes, we could easily have been 5 and 0 if we had kicked straighter....
 

malpaso

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How do you dismiss playing 8 men in the backline ? We were 19 points up in that final quarter and the coach resorted to his default option.
I’m happy to cop that loss if it was the price for what we are now seeing.
I wrote on my disappointment of the coach’s plan of using an undermanned forward line. He has been doing it since 2016 and I am ******* sick of it. So too, has Ross’ new boss . That is my essentially my argument.
I don’t bag anyone involved with Freo including coaches, managers and especially players.
However , that does not diminish my feeling of helplessness with what I have seen from Ross since 2015.
I like Ross for the change in our professionalism. Ross has clearly had a positive impact on this club.
That does not mean his intransigence is acceptable.
That is my argument. His new boss has intervened.
Ross will now get the credit ; I am happy for that to happen.
I have been disappointed with him over the past 3 years but I have never said that on this site although I could have.
From now on I will attribute wins to Ross. I had the right to blame him for losses because of what I wrote about above; it was my prerogative and I chose to be silent.
Crap post, we were changing the game plan before his 'new' boss was in place as evidenced by our recruiting. We had very little KPF stocks since 2015 thru lack of recruitment, age/retirement and injury.
 
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I wrote on my disappointment of the coach’s plan of using an undermanned forward line. He has been doing it since 2016 and I am ******* sick of it. So too, has Ross’ new boss . That is my essentially my argument.
You're welcome to think that but it isn't actually an argument because it's not a falsifiable statement. An argument line where the conclusion cannot be disproved doesn't make for great discourse. You've shared your views and I've shared mine. Since 2016 we've had objectively the worst forward line in the league, regardless of what the coach did or didn't do.
 
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I could see Ross’s game plan evolving the last year and a half, we just didn’t have the tall timber or mid skills to execute it. Now that’s not to say are skills are all the way there, I think we need a lot more work in fact, but having the tall targets has made us so much better.

Last year as soon as Taberner went down, we struggled to score so Ross went defensive again, he had to to stop the beltings. Didn’t always work obv.

This year, we throw in Hogan and a fit Taberner. All of a sudden McCarthy gets a nuffy defender & the n1 goes to Hogan. Taberner runs his man off the chain & we move Mundy & Walters out of i50 back into the midfield to deliver the ball & Matera plays deep forward again which is his perfect position. With Mundy Hill & Walters kicking i50 we have a lot more opportunity to score. Last year all 3 of them weren’t in the mid (hill injured).

I look forward to Blakely slotting back in & hopefully Darcy gets back in as well. Stephen Hill probably fit 2nd half. Would like us to try the super tall forward line again.

Brayshaw & Cerra’s skills have been down this year, but they’ll come on strong before the end of the year.
Seems to me to be a confidence thing with Brayshaw. As said previously, it does effect your confidence getting injured on field by thuggish behaviour. I had my front teeth knocked out playing rugby by an errant kick (put them back in myself like a champ) and it definitely effected my play for a bit.

Anyway, it's almost natural for players to have the second year blues as they struggle to find their feet in the team. It's rare when you get a player who has a great first season and continues the ascent consistently. These guys aren't the new boys anymore and aren't getting the same focus that the first year players get, the expectations are slightly heavier and psychologically they desire to back up their first year form which can be a difficult thing to deal with. Third year is when these two will be settled and aware of what they provide.
 

Joao

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You're welcome to think that but it isn't actually an argument because it's not a falsifiable statement. An argument line where the conclusion cannot be disproved doesn't make for great discourse. You've shared your views and I've shared mine. Since 2016 we've had objectively the worst forward line in the league, regardless of what the coach did or didn't do.
This post made me wonder, what if there was a logic expert moderating big footy who would analyse every post and could disqualify arguments based on logic. 99/100 posts would be disqualified for being a non-sequitur, strawman, non-falsifiable etc.

Would be hilarious, especially in the melt thread.
 

Fred Ziffel

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You're welcome to think that but it isn't actually an argument because it's not a falsifiable statement. An argument line where the conclusion cannot be disproved doesn't make for great discourse. You've shared your views and I've shared mine. Since 2016 we've had objectively the worst forward line in the league, regardless of what the coach did or didn't do.
I agree , we have had arguably the worst forward line in the league for a few years and yet Ross persisted with 5 or less forwards.
My view is basically; no matter the calibre of the players, not playing with fewer players than your opponent is better than being outnumbered continually. 6 is better than 5.
Anyway it may well be moot now. I hope so.
 

theGav56

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I agree , we have had arguably the worst forward line in the league for a few years and yet Ross persisted with 5 or less forwards.
My view is basically; no matter the calibre of the players, not playing with fewer players than your opponent is better than being outnumbered continually. 6 is better than 5.
Anyway it may well be moot now. I hope so.
It just seems totally transparent that there was a plan to put the new defence in place, develop the midfield, then build the forward line. There is a logic to it, and it does seem to have worked (early days).
 
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