Prediction Round 1 2022 Team

[Simon Crawshay]

Not a Hartigan hater, but feel he is really only a neccesity against the Hawkins, Kennedy types...

With that in mind...

B. Blake Hardwick Sam Frost James Sicily

HB. Jarman Impey Jack Scrimshaw Will Day

C. Changkuoth Jiath Tom Mitchell Lachlan Bramble

HF. Jack Gunston Jacob Koschitzke Chad Wingard

F. Tyler Brockman Mitch Lewis Luke Breust

Ned Reeves, Jaeger O'Meara, James Worpel



Inter. Dylan Moore, Conor Nash, Ben McEvoy, Denver Grainger Barras

Yep good team.

The glaring deficiency in our team is our lack of class and depth in our on ball brigade.

Our backline and forward lines actually looks half decent as per the team you have selected.

I especially like that half back line, very tasty!

 

[HedgeFund]

Not a Hartigan hater, but feel he is really only a neccesity against the Hawkins, Kennedy types...

With that in mind...

B. Blake Hardwick Sam Frost James Sicily

HB. Jarman Impey Jack Scrimshaw Will Day

C. Changkuoth Jiath Tom Mitchell Lachlan Bramble

HF. Jack Gunston Jacob Koschitzke Chad Wingard

F. Tyler Brockman Mitch Lewis Luke Breust

Ned Reeves, Jaeger O'Meara, James Worpel



Inter. Dylan Moore, Conor Nash, Ben McEvoy, Denver Grainger Barras

No genuine second key defender here.

Opposition forwards coach would simply demand a second big body to play deep next to Frost’s opponent, clear the 50 out and we’d be horribly exposed.

DGB/Sicily/Scrimshaw are all too slight/small to play on another key tall. They all like to roll off smaller opponents and take intercept marks.

That’s why we will still need Hartigan week in/out.

 

[eldorado]

No genuine second key defender here.



That’s why we will still need Hartigan week in/out.

How many teams have two genuine big-men, the second of which would be too much for Sicily or Scrimshaw to cope with?

 

[HedgeFund]

How many teams have two genuine big-men, the second of which would be too much for Sicily or Scrimshaw to cope with?

Dogs - English / Naughton / Bruce
Dees - Brown / McDonald / Jackson
Port - Dixon / Georgiadies / Ladhams (traded)
Geelong - Hawkins / Ratugolea / Stanley
Brisbane - Hipwood / Daniher / ruckman
Sydney - Franklin / McLean / Hickey
Essendon - Wright / Hooker (ret.) / Hurley
Richmond - Lynch / Riewoldt / ruckman
St Kilda - King / Ryder or Marshall / Membrey
West Coast - Kennedy / Darling / Allen
GWS - Himmelberg / Hogan / Flynn
Fremantle - Taberner / Lobb / Treacy
Carlton - McKay / Curnow / De Koenig
Hawthorn - Kozi / Lewis / McEvoy
GC - King / Day / Burgess

So probably……..Collingwood and North lack that extra big unit (which helps explain why we tend not to lose to them).

It would be a no brainer for opposition coaches.

Identify a glaring weakness - in our lack of key defenders who can body/spoil big players who lead and jump - and exploit it.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

How many teams have two genuine big-men, the second of which would be too much for Sicily or Scrimshaw to cope with?

Not many play with a traditional second key forward. The second forward seems to be more of a leading forward thesedays.

Sicily, Scrimshaw and DGB should be enough if DGB develops as we hope.

 

[HedgeFund]

Not many play with a traditional second key forward. The second forward seems to be more of a leading forward thesedays.

Sicily, Scrimshaw and DGB should be enough if DGB develops as we hope.

I don’t think either Scrimshaw or Sicily can play on genuine leading key forwards. They simply are too small to be able to close the space down and get a fist in. In fact neither of them are particularly interested in spoiling.

Hartigan takes the deep forward, Frost takes the leading forward. Sicily or Scrimshaw take the third tall whom they can roll off when they’re not getting used.

We played 19 games with Frost/Hartigan last season. Hartigan only missed due to suspension. We beat Sydney without Hartigan. Frost played on Franklin. O’Brien played CHB. We just let him walk as a Free Agent.

 

[TylerDurden]

I can see DGB playing CHB this year, should his body hold up.

 

[HedgeFund]

I can see DGB playing CHB this year, should his body hold up.

From 2023 and beyond for sure. Still too light at the moment IMO

 

[eldorado]

Dogs - English / Naughton / Bruce
Dees - Brown / McDonald / Jackson
Port - Dixon / Georgiadies / Ladhams (traded)
Geelong - Hawkins / Ratugolea / Stanley
Brisbane - Hipwood / Daniher / ruckman
Sydney - Franklin / McLean / Hickey
Essendon - Wright / Hooker (ret.) / Hurley
Richmond - Lynch / Riewoldt / ruckman
St Kilda - King / Ryder or Marshall / Membrey
West Coast - Kennedy / Darling / Allen
GWS - Himmelberg / Hogan / Flynn
Fremantle - Taberner / Lobb / Treacy
Carlton - McKay / Curnow / De Koenig
Hawthorn - Kozi / Lewis / McEvoy
GC - King / Day / Burgess

So probably……..Collingwood and North lack that extra big unit (which helps explain why we tend not to lose to them).

It would be a no brainer for opposition coaches.

Identify a glaring weakness - in our lack of key defenders who can body/spoil big players who lead and jump - and exploit it.

I respectfully disagree that only Hartigan is capable of matching up on those groups, with the exception of West Coast and Geelong...pure size, as a factor, is diminishing in importance compared to pace and team defensive structure.

 

[HedgeFund]

I respectfully disagree that only Hartigan is capable of matching up on those groups, with the exception of West Coast and Geelong...pure size, as a factor, is diminishing in importance compared to pace and team defensive structure.

Good luck then.

There’s a very good reason we ran with Frost and Hartigan as our two key defenders every single week in 2021 (save for the 3 weeks Hartigan was suspended).

We even threw O’Brien down back to help out more often than not.

We all agree McEvoy in defence is ancient history so there’s a pretty bare cupboard at Hawthorn for KPDs who weigh more than 90kgs.

 

[WWSD]

We desperately need another young key defender. That would setup the back six nicely for the next decade.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

I don’t think either Scrimshaw or Sicily can play on genuine leading key forwards. They simply are too small to be able to close the space down and get a fist in. In fact neither of them are particularly interested in spoiling.

Hartigan takes the deep forward, Frost takes the leading forward. Sicily or Scrimshaw take the third tall whom they can roll off when they’re not getting used.

We played 19 games with Frost/Hartigan last season. Hartigan only missed due to suspension. We beat Sydney without Hartigan. Frost played on Franklin. O’Brien played CHB. We just let him walk as a Free Agent.

Scrimshaw and Sicily are already better players than TOB, with the latter proving to be a better CHB despite giving up several cms to TOB and his opponents.

DGB will prove to be better as well with some experience, he will be our CHB moving into this new era.

DGB - 195cm
Hartigan - 194cm
Frost - 194cm
Scrimshaw - 193cm

There is a negligible difference between the four in terms of height.

During his time here Sicily has played more as a KPD than Frost has.

 

[threesixpio]

About as good as I've seen yet from Ash Browne:

Best 22 for '22: Ash Browne

With the trade period done, the Hawks Insiders team take an early stab at picking a round one team for next year.

hawksinsiders.substack.com

View attachment 1267905

That’s almost exactly mine.

 

[H00t]

Scrimshaw and Sicily are already better players than TOB, with the latter proving to be a better CHB despite giving up several cms to TOB and his opponents.

DGB will prove to be better as well with some experience, he will be our CHB moving into this new era.

DGB - 195cm
Hartigan - 194cm
Frost - 194cm
Scrimshaw - 193cm

There is a negligible difference between the four in terms of height.

During his time here Sicily has played more as a KPD than Frost has.

Scrimshaw has the height but struggles with his lockdown defending. DGB will be a player but until he puts on some more size he will get pushed aside easily.

Sicily reads the ball well and we want him being able to zone off. Against the more physical stronger forwards his lack of size will hold him back. We can’t use Sicily as the last man in defense.

 

[Slysh]

This thread is such a pissing contest when we don't really know anything yet.

Still have the Draft to go, than a full pre season followed by pre season games.

Currently our team would probably be pretty close to the round 23 team and just swapping in the players that were injured.

Was Big Boy a better player than both Reeves and Lynch this year? Absolutely

Will he definitely be next year? Nope, wait and see over the pre season.

Who would have expected Moore or CJ to have that good of a season coming in to 2021?

Saunders, Mitchell (fast one), Callow are real wild cards. Wouldn't be surprised to see any in round 1, also wouldn't be surprised if they didn't play a game in 2022.

Players will get bigger, faster, stronger, better over the off season.

Some of the older guys may slow down.

 

[tommyk72]

Scrimshaw has the height but struggles with his lockdown defending. DGB will be a player but until he puts on some more size he will get pushed aside easily.

Sicily reads the ball well and we want him being able to zone off. Against the more physical stronger forwards his lack of size will hold him back. We can’t use Sicily as the last man in defense.

Dustn Fletcher did pretty well against the big forwards despite not having too much weight and only being 3cms bigger. Will be interesting to see how DGB evolves.

 

[The Spirit of Cricket]

I really think this conversation re Hartigan has little to do with match ups and more to do with how Sam envisions us defending as a team

 

[theiaofseed]

We desperately need another young key defender. That would setup the back six nicely for the next decade.

We can get that through FA when the times right, between Impey, Hardwick, Bramble, CJ, Day, Scrimshaw, DBG and Sicily we have a backline that can play together for 6+ years.

If we draft another thats fine but i'm not concerned if we don't

 

[H00t]

Dustn Fletcher did pretty well against the big forwards despite not having too much weight and only being 3cms bigger. Will be interesting to see how DGB evolves.

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think DGB needs to be Hartigan size. But it’s definitely his size and therefore strength plus his fitness that’s holding him back. Add on that forwards are getting taller, fitter and stronger than when Fletcher played on them.

As a first year defender its super impressive that it’s only his strength and tank that held him back. He has amazing natural defending ability. In 2-3 years I see him being an amazing defender. But as of round 1 next year it’s definitely going to be challenging for him.

 

[tommyk72]

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think DGB needs to be Hartigan size. But it’s definitely his size and therefore strength plus his fitness that’s holding him back. Add on that forwards are getting taller, fitter and stronger than when Fletcher played on them.

As a first year defender its super impressive that it’s only his strength and tank that held him back. He has amazing natural defending ability. In 2-3 years I see him being an amazing defender. But as of round 1 next year it’s definitely going to be challenging for him.

Agree - round 1 he's not there, but not many second year draftees are. I'm hoping that we're pumping games into him now and building on that natural ability with experience. In parallel, his body will be growing, as will his connection with other defenders in the team. I think we'll be pretty impressive down back prety damn soon (if we're not already).

 

[HedgeFund]

Scrimshaw and Sicily are already better players than TOB, with the latter proving to be a better CHB despite giving up several cms to TOB and his opponents.

DGB will prove to be better as well with some experience, he will be our CHB moving into this new era.

DGB - 195cm
Hartigan - 194cm
Frost - 194cm
Scrimshaw - 193cm

There is a negligible difference between the four in terms of height.

During his time here Sicily has played more as a KPD than Frost has.

How many times have you seen Sicily or Scrimshaw comfortable playing on heavier opponents?

I can’t recall ever.

They aren’t strong. They’re good readers of the ball in flight but take their intercept marks uncontested. Both like to roll off and take marks floating across as the 3rd man up.

If they have to be made accountable for a bigger opponent they struggle, regularly.

We need the second large defender to give Sicily / Scrimshaw the smaller opponent to allow them the flexibility to roll off.

I agree O’Brien is inferior to them both, but we deployed him to a floating CHB role in Sicily’s absence, and he simply covered for Hartigan when he was suspended. Once Hartigan was available, he came straight back in.

Same will happen in 2022. No doubt. First choice 6 should be:

B: Hardwick Hartigan Scrimshaw
HB: Sicily Frost Impey/CJ

We can obviously play Day, CJ or Impey further up the ground.

 

[mustang]

It reads like a team that Clarkson would’ve put out 12 months ago.

It doesn’t look like a team that a new coach would put out with an eye on the future.

Howe, Phillips, Frost should all make way.
Sicily won’t be playing in the back pocket.
DGB will be in the side.

Agreed I would play the kids and the Wingard,Mitchell etc don’t play every game as if they play we don’t get games into Newcombe, pick 5 etc.

 

[Slainte]

Dustn Fletcher did pretty well against the big forwards despite not having too much weight and only being 3cms bigger. Will be interesting to see how DGB evolves.

Agree with the Dustin Fletcher comparison - DGB looks like a very similar type to me.

 

[burger09]

Agree with the Dustin Fletcher comparison - DGB looks like a very similar type to me.

Lucky the Rocca brothers, Carey, Ablet snr, Kernahan etc. are long gone and Buddy is on his last legs.

Fletch struggled on the biggest and the best despite what Sheeds and his bomber lemmings will tell you. Good player but not a complete full back/stopper.

 

[Slainte]

We desperately need another young key defender. That would setup the back six nicely for the next decade.

There is a reasonable chance that Gibcus will be available when we exercise our pick #5 (assuming this remains our first pick). Could do worse IMO. The weight of opinion on this site is that we should target quality mids but I would be comfortable with Gibcus, Andrew or Rachele. Hartigan has at best a couple of seasons left and Frost 3-4 so Gibcus would be a good strategic acquisition.