Autopsy Round 1 - Freo defeated by Geelong

[Tazmania]

We used to have an excellent defensive structure across the ground and the whole team would effectively move as one to move that structure with lots of communication as the opposition moved the ball. It allowed us to quickly apply pressure and force the turnover.

I was watching for it yesterday and there are massive holes in the structure same as there was for most of last year. I suspect that aspect of our game was been dropped last year as it was a too defensive game...but if we were meant to be getting back to that this year then it hasn't happened.

I heard RTB and the assistant coaches handed out bars of soap to all the players this morning at the de-briefing session in an effort to ensure clean hands for next week. Boom-tish

 

[beetz]

Speaking of which... the Lyon press conference headline is, "i didn't prepare the team well."

WTF.... a seasoned experienced coach doesn't know how to prepare a team for round 1?

To make matters worse...he doesn't seem to realise, or won't admit, he was completely out coached by Chris Scott and the glaring holes in his game plan can even be seen by the dunderhead media commentators.

Player selection/recruitment are incredibly suspect but now the coach's own weasel words show just how much he and the club are in denial.

Wouldn't read too much in to what he tells the parasites, I mean media. Of course he would have prepared for Geelong, I reckon that statement is more about protecting the players a bit who the media were clearing going after. So that is somewhat credible by him.

 

[dart]

Speaking of which... the Lyon press conference headline is, "i didn't prepare the team well."

WTF.... a seasoned experienced coach doesn't know how to prepare a team for round 1?

the worst aspect is that they have been preparing for this game since round 10 of last year or thereabouts, when it was clear 2016 was toast so all eyes went to the future.

I can't even put my finger on what was wrong yesterday, freo got a lot of the ball but linking up with teammates fell down a lot, seemed like players weren't quite sure where they were meant to go to with the ball.

It's not all doom & gloom, Geelong aren't the worst team by far and if Freo can make use of Sandilands' dominance they should be able to turn things around quickly, hope so.

 

[Scham]

Cam Sutcliffe had 23 possessions at 90% efficiency. If you blokes are going to sink the boots in, at least have some kind of evidence to support it. Sutcliffe played probably the best I've seen him play for over 12 months.

And won his position. Couldn't say that about too many of our players.

 

[Mudd]

Wouldn't read too much in to what he tells the parasites, I mean media. Of course he would have prepared for Geelong, I reckon that statement is more about protecting the players a bit who the media were clearing going after. So that is somewhat credible by him.

He's actually meant to be talking to us the supporters at the press conferences. Trotting out the usual 1 liners without saying anything of substance is a very old school way of handling these pressers.

 

[Scham]

the dreaded Half Forward position, where Ross puts players to die a la Michael Barlow......

Blakely better watch out.

Eade's doing it to Barlow now. Mick apparently played most of the game at HF on the weekend.

 

[rgauci]

Cam Sutcliffe had 23 possessions at 90% efficiency. If you blokes are going to sink the boots in, at least have some kind of evidence to support it. Sutcliffe played probably the best I've seen him play for over 12 months.

Absolutely agree with this. He's finally added some size to his frame and was rarely out muscled. He had one Howler when he took too long to switch and our get out option was swamped.

 

[beetz]

Eade's doing it to Barlow now. Mick apparently played most of the game at HF on the weekend.

i did have a chuckle when I saw him lined up there. Any idea how he went? I didn't catch the game.

 

[meima]

i did have a chuckle when I saw him lined up there. Any idea how he went? I didn't catch the game.

Did not catch the game 24 touches and a goal is not that bad for playing first time for GC.

 

[wayToGo_]

i did have a chuckle when I saw him lined up there. Any idea how he went? I didn't catch the game.

He wasn't the sole reason but when they shifted him to the middle he started winning centre clearances for them and they started to turn the game around.

 

[beetz]

Did not catch the game 24 touches and a goal is not that bad for playing first time for GC.

He wasn't the sole reason but when they shifted him to the middle he started winning centre clearances for them and they started to turn the game around.

Vintage Barlow.

 

[Gussman]

Not when they only add up to 10 goals.

Perhaps RTB can only count up to 10? Should be 11 at least.

Take your shoes and socks off RTB Gussman , you can get to 21.

Careful you're starting to sound like RTB..."A lot (of turnovers) happened early and they're not ideal, but that wasn't the issue."

Hang on, you're not RTB are you? I mean has anyone ever seen you and RTB in the same room at the same time?

Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

 

[Gussman]

Also the game seemed a lot more even to me then the scoreline would suggest.

A lot of 50-50 balls just didn't go our way and I think the ball hit the post 2 or 3 times.

McCarthy won't miss 5/6 each week, he's too good for that, just some first game jitters.

Stephen Hill looked incredible bursting though packs after beautiful taps from Sandi and I wouldn't be surprised if he is Freo's best player this year.

Walters may end up being the primary target in our forward line, even though he isn't a KPF. He has the leap and marking ability to go with next to anyone and can crumb his own ball if needed.

Would like to see Blakely played in the midfield more, allowing Fyfe to go forward and be another target in our forward 50.

Our forwardline would be the most dangerous when:
Fyfe - McCarthy - Bennell
Walters - Sandi - Ballas/Langdon

and with Neale, Mundy and the Hill brothers still in the midfield it'll be a scary forward lineup for any team in the comp to deal with.

So IMO I only see 3 flaws in our current gamestyle:

1) Teams are transitioning between our forwardline to theirs way too easily. Not enough pressure from our forwards and midfielders, to cause a turnover.

2) The ball gets overturned way too easily once it has entered our forward 50 (we had more inside 50s then Geelong, but not as many scoring shots). Some form of a wall needs to be put at about 60-70 meters out from goal, so that if the ball does get kicked out it goes straight to one of our defenders. More pressure from our forwards and midfielders would help here as it'll stop the kick out of 50 being accurate.

3) We don't have the defenders to take on anyone. Freo's defenders are a shadow of what they used to be and I would only consider some of them good. I think Ross has recognized this and has hence drafted Logue and Ryan. Hopefully this "4 year rebuild" will see Logue, Ryan, A.Pearce, Weller, Croz and Carter (academy) transition into our next generation of defenders as Ross rotates this one out (when he does).

Rant over. Please continue with your lives.

 

[youmewe]

Also the game seemed a lot more even to me then the scoreline would suggest.

A lot of 50-50 balls just didn't go our way and I think the ball hit the post 2 or 3 times.

McCarthy won't miss 5/6 each week, he's too good for that, just some first game jitters.

Stephen Hill looked incredible bursting though packs after beautiful taps from Sandi and I wouldn't be surprised if he is Freo's best player this year.

Walters may end up being the primary target in our forward line, even though he isn't a KPF. He has the leap and marking ability to go with next to anyone and can crumb his own ball if needed.

Would like to see Blakely played in the midfield more, allowing Fyfe to go forward and be another target in our forward 50.

Our forwardline would be the most dangerous when:
Fyfe - McCarthy - Bennell
Walters - Sandi - Ballas/Langdon

and with Neale, Mundy and the Hill brothers still in the midfield it'll be a scary forward lineup for any team in the comp to deal with.

So IMO I only see 3 flaws in our current gamestyle:

1) Teams are transitioning between our forwardline to theirs way too easily. Not enough pressure from our forwards and midfielders, to cause a turnover.

2) The ball gets overturned way too easily once it has entered our forward 50 (we had more inside 50s then Geelong, but not as many scoring shots). Some form of a wall needs to be put at about 60-70 meters out from goal, so that if the ball does get kicked out it goes straight to one of our defenders. More pressure from our forwards and midfielders would help here as it'll stop the kick out of 50 being accurate.

3) We don't have the defenders to take on anyone. Freo's defenders are a shadow of what they used to be and I would only consider some of them good. I think Ross has recognized this and has hence drafted Logue and Ryan. Hopefully this "4 year rebuild" will see Logue, Ryan, A.Pearce, Weller, Croz and Carter (academy) transition into our next generation of defenders as Ross rotates this one out (when he does).

Rant over. Please continue with your lives.

Ok Ross.

 

[enoenoeno]

We need to recruit / draft some offensive weapons ...

 

[DudleyDocker]

Also the game seemed a lot more even to me then the scoreline would suggest.

A lot of 50-50 balls just didn't go our way and I think the ball hit the post 2 or 3 times.

McCarthy won't miss 5/6 each week, he's too good for that, just some first game jitters.

Stephen Hill looked incredible bursting though packs after beautiful taps from Sandi and I wouldn't be surprised if he is Freo's best player this year.

Walters may end up being the primary target in our forward line, even though he isn't a KPF. He has the leap and marking ability to go with next to anyone and can crumb his own ball if needed.

Would like to see Blakely played in the midfield more, allowing Fyfe to go forward and be another target in our forward 50.

Our forwardline would be the most dangerous when:
Fyfe - McCarthy - Bennell
Walters - Sandi - Ballas/Langdon

and with Neale, Mundy and the Hill brothers still in the midfield it'll be a scary forward lineup for any team in the comp to deal with.

So IMO I only see 3 flaws in our current gamestyle:

1) Teams are transitioning between our forwardline to theirs way too easily. Not enough pressure from our forwards and midfielders, to cause a turnover.

2) The ball gets overturned way too easily once it has entered our forward 50 (we had more inside 50s then Geelong, but not as many scoring shots). Some form of a wall needs to be put at about 60-70 meters out from goal, so that if the ball does get kicked out it goes straight to one of our defenders. More pressure from our forwards and midfielders would help here as it'll stop the kick out of 50 being accurate.

3) We don't have the defenders to take on anyone. Freo's defenders are a shadow of what they used to be and I would only consider some of them good. I think Ross has recognized this and has hence drafted Logue and Ryan. Hopefully this "4 year rebuild" will see Logue, Ryan, A.Pearce, Weller, Croz and Carter (academy) transition into our next generation of defenders as Ross rotates this one out (when he does).

Rant over. Please continue with your lives.

Not even sure it's as much a personnel issue as it is a structural issue. For years now we have been seeing this dichotomy where there is either nobody in the forward line or virtually the whole team is there. And when all 36 players are in our forward half it's virtually impossible to score - it just becomes a little league style seagull flock fighting over the ball.

All it then takes is for one or two good chains of passing to break out of this "zone" (I use that term very loosely) and the opposition is out in their forward line with either equal numbers or as was often the case last night an outnumber. That is why all the teams we play seem to be more accurate than us - they are taking shots from better, less crowded positions.

I will go out on a limb and say 80% of our perceived skills shortcomings are primarily about structure and understanding where to be on the field at any given time. It was not that long ago we used to laugh at the deplorable skill at the Eagles, but as soon as Simpson came in with an open, free flowing game style suddenly they are all highly skilled again. You only have to look at how their skills drop off when they are subjected to intense pressure (e.g. finals) to understand why ours are so bad on a week to week basis. It's almost like Ross wants to bring finals style pressure and congestion to every game. This is a horrible game style to watch and is very taxing on the players. I'm sure our guys would run the season out much better, and with less injuries if they were playing an open, free-running style when allowed to by the opposition - in other words thump the Brisbanes of the league by 100 points and have fun doing it rather than grind out a boring 26 point win. If we could have a "Plan B" as well for those teams who do make it tough and also for the finals, we will start to become a dangerous opposition again.

 

[Lach72]

We need to recruit / draft some offensive weapons ...

Brad Hill and Bennell

 

[Unique Name]

Not even sure it's as much a personnel issue as it is a structural issue. For years now we have been seeing this dichotomy where there is either nobody in the forward line or virtually the whole team is there. And when all 36 players are in our forward half it's virtually impossible to score - it just becomes a little league style seagull flock fighting over the ball.

All it then takes is for one or two good chains of passing to break out of this "zone" (I use that term very loosely) and the opposition is out in their forward line with either equal numbers or as was often the case last night an outnumber. That is why all the teams we play seem to be more accurate than us - they are taking shots from better, less crowded positions.

I will go out on a limb and say 80% of our perceived skills shortcomings are primarily about structure and understanding where to be on the field at any given time. It was not that long ago we used to laugh at the deplorable skill at the Eagles, but as soon as Simpson came in with an open, free flowing game style suddenly they are all highly skilled again. You only have to look at how their skills drop off when they are subjected to intense pressure (e.g. finals) to understand why ours are so bad on a week to week basis. It's almost like Ross wants to bring finals style pressure and congestion to every game. This is a horrible game style to watch and is very taxing on the players. I'm sure our guys would run the season out much better, and with less injuries if they were playing an open, free-running style when allowed to by the opposition - in other words thump the Brisbanes of the league by 100 points and have fun doing it rather than grind out a boring 26 point win. If we could have a "Plan B" as well for those teams who do make it tough and also for the finals, we will start to become a dangerous opposition again.

Do you think Ross is capable of changing us to a more open gameplan?

 

[Hammersoup]

What is the idea of playing Conner as a HFF? He is a an out and out midfielder.

 

[DudleyDocker]

Do you think Ross is capable of changing us to a more open gameplan?

The optometrist in me says he will take advice from guys like Hale, Guerra and Rock who have come out of those game plans. Also, it seems like we are training for a fast, open game style so we can hope this is the case.

The pessimist in me says Ross is talking as if he still thinks the old game plan is workable, but maybe that is for the media.

Who knows, but I'm prepared to wait until later in the year.

 

[meima]

I put it out there, nothing wrong with Ross defensive game plan .

Nothing wrong with hawthorn game plan
Nothing wrong with cats handball game plan

If you can play all three types of style depend on situation you win the flag ( bulldog)

In training players need to build endurance improve their kicking and handball , and doing extra without the coach around.

 

[stax on the mull]

I just think it could be something as simple as Geelong came to Perth with strategies in selection and gameplan to stop our strengths and score regularly and we didn't come up with anything during the game to counter.

Sometimes you get outcoached, your planning is all wrong and you can't change it during a match once the damage is done early. They do have a coach at Geelong who spent 6 years at Fremantle as a development and an assistant coach and would know most of their strengths and weakness.

 

[Proud SJW]

Well, I did myself a favour (?!) and went and watched it again this arvo.
I also watched Lyon's presser.

I had a go at the umps on the gameday thread in the heat of the moment, and I'll stand by what I said then - a couple of early calls in Geelong's forward half which did influence the game, and I'm seeing the same pattern far too often for it to be mere coincidence.
But, as Ross is fond of saying, that wasn't the issue.

Anyone still claiming we don't miss Ballantyne in that forward line has rocks in their head, as far as I'm concerned, and you can leave your prejudices at the door. The ease with which Geelong crumbed and waltzed out on a rebound was absolutely demoralising.
But it wasn't that either.

Most of us know that Footy is played in the head almost as much as it being a game of skill and tactics... even if we tend to ignore that in our analyses at times.

In the warm light of the next day replays, we really didn't start off badly. A couple of moments could be explained away by first-round jitters, but overall it was quite reasonable. If anything, you could watch that first quarter again and say that, for the first 15 mins or so, we were actually outplaying Geelong.
Johnson, however, probably single-handedly stopped us cold on more than one occasion. Along with Kersten.
Kersten I can forgive, a little - first Freo game, has never been a shining light as a player anyway. Send him back to Peel (sorry Meima) and give Tabs a run, problem addressed... for now.
But Johnson? There's been a lot of talk about how he's slowing down and wotnot, but that hasn't prevented him from being valuable to Freo in the past - you could more often than not rely on his decision making and skills even if he was a bit slower than he used to be. He was a cool head, a general, and a leader. Even in 2016 (when he played), he was cool and collected with his disposals, at least as much as you'd expect a senior player to be.
What we saw yesterday was not that Johnson - poor decision making, poor skills, and slow. He was a liability. We can have new players making mistakes (well, up to a point), but we simply can't afford our senior players ******* up that badly. Johnson was inexcusable.

We can make a lot of Freo's poor skills over the whole game, as many others have already pointed out - but as stated, footy is played in the head as much as anywhere, and that early poor performance by Johnson and the umps questionable decisions pretty much kept Geelong in the game and stole whatever momentum we had after the first 15 minutes.
So, for me, that's where it started.

But again, that wasn't the issue.

The issue for me was when I was watching on gameday, and Fremantle basically just - gave up. I don't think I've ever seen a poorer start in round one for this club, to be honest... not even last year. The lack of structure, confusion, and bookend ineptness was the worst I can remember seeing. We played with almost zero confidence, and the skills were lamentable.
Ok, so everyone else in this thread has already said much the same thing.

But when the coach comes on to live TV and says skills weren't the issue, alarm bells start ringing. I mean, I can understand what he was getting at - confidence is the key to skills, and the team lacked confidence, which is why Lyon stated it was his fault, as well as not preparing Fremantle for Geelong's "things they did well". But when it's the bloody turnovers which led to Geelong doing the "things they did well" in the first place, then how you can possibly say skills weren't the issue was a bit beyond me.
What Geelong "did well" was score from our many, many turnovers. Which were the result of poor confidence, which was the result of skill errors. Or vice-versa, whatever.
Major skill errors, on the part of our more senior players. So it seems to me, that the best defence against "what Geelong did well" was to not turn the ball over every 10 seconds.

So... yeah. I'm beginning to slightly lean toward some of the more skeptical amongst us who are saying there's "something wrong" with this team. Whether it be coach, leadership on field, or whatever... there's some leading to poor confidence.
The Freo of 2013-2015 wasn't an overly skilled team either, but you could be sure that when we were playing badly and causing turnovers, we'd bloody well get in there and lock that ball up to prevent anyone capitalising on them. We had heart.

Others have it quite correct, we can't any longer say it's because we're missing our best players. Some are still out, true enough - but the keys are back. As far as I'm concerned, Lyon has some 'splainin to do. I used to enjoy his pressers, but they're beginning to sound more like obfuscation than analysis.

It's only round one, so perhaps its a bit early to be getting so down.

 

[meima]

Well, I did myself a favour (?!) and went and watched it again this arvo.
I also watched Lyon's presser.

I had a go at the umps on the gameday thread in the heat of the moment, and I'll stand by what I said then - a couple of early calls in Geelong's forward half which did influence the game, and I'm seeing the same pattern far too often for it to be mere coincidence.
But, as Ross is fond of saying, that wasn't the issue.

Anyone still claiming we don't miss Ballantyne in that forward line has rocks in their head, as far as I'm concerned, and you can leave your prejudices at the door. The ease with which Geelong crumbed and waltzed out on a rebound was absolutely demoralising.
But it wasn't that either.

Most of us know that Footy is played in the head almost as much as it being a game of skill and tactics... even if we tend to ignore that in our analyses at times.

In the warm light of the next day replays, we really didn't start off badly. A couple of moments could be explained away by first-round jitters, but overall it was quite reasonable. If anything, you could watch that first quarter again and say that, for the first 15 mins or so, we were actually outplaying Geelong.
Johnson, however, probably single-handedly stopped us cold on more than one occasion. Along with Kersten.
Kersten I can forgive, a little - first Freo game, has never been a shining light as a player anyway. Send him back to Peel (sorry Meima) and give Tabs a run, problem addressed... for now.
But Johnson? There's been a lot of talk about how he's slowing down and wotnot, but that hasn't prevented him from being valuable to Freo in the past - you could more often than not rely on his decision making and skills even if he was a bit slower than he used to be. He was a cool head, a general, and a leader. Even in 2016 (when he played), he was cool and collected with his disposals, at least as much as you'd expect a senior player to be.
What we saw yesterday was not that Johnson - poor decision making, poor skills, and slow. He was a liability. We can have new players making mistakes (well, up to a point), but we simply can't afford our senior players ******* up that badly. Johnson was inexcusable.

We can make a lot of Freo's poor skills over the whole game, as many others have already pointed out - but as stated, footy is played in the head as much as anywhere, and that early poor performance by Johnson and the umps questionable decisions pretty much kept Geelong in the game and stole whatever momentum we had after the first 15 minutes.
So, for me, that's where it started.

But again, that wasn't the issue.

The issue for me was when I was watching on gameday, and Fremantle basically just - gave up. I don't think I've ever seen a poorer start in round one for this club, to be honest... not even last year. The lack of structure, confusion, and bookend ineptness was the worst I can remember seeing. We played with almost zero confidence, and the skills were lamentable.
Ok, so everyone else in this thread has already said much the same thing.

But when the coach comes on to live TV and says skills weren't the issue, alarm bells start ringing. I mean, I can understand what he was getting at - confidence is the key to skills, and the team lacked confidence, which is why Lyon stated it was his fault, as well as not preparing Fremantle for Geelong's "things they did well". But when it's the bloody turnovers which led to Geelong doing the "things they did well" in the first place, then how you can possibly say skills weren't the issue was a bit beyond me.
What Geelong "did well" was score from our many, many turnovers. Which were the result of poor confidence, which was the result of skill errors. Or vice-versa, whatever.
Major skill errors, on the part of our more senior players. So it seems to me, that the best defence against "what Geelong did well" was to not turn the ball over every 10 seconds.

So... yeah. I'm beginning to slightly lean toward some of the more skeptical amongst us who are saying there's "something wrong" with this team. Whether it be coach, leadership on field, or whatever... there's some leading to poor confidence.
The Freo of 2013-2015 wasn't an overly skilled team either, but you could be sure that when we were playing badly and causing turnovers, we'd bloody well get in there and lock that ball up to prevent anyone capitalising on them. We had heart.

Others have it quite correct, we can't any longer say it's because we're missing our best players. Some are still out, true enough - but the keys are back. As far as I'm concerned, Lyon has some 'splainin to do. I used to enjoy his pressers, but they're beginning to sound more like obfuscation than analysis.

It's only round one, so perhaps its a bit early to be getting so down.

Well done , I think you forget to point out that other team like Melbourne improve their culture and game plan also. Is not like the old game plan is bullet proof , it is good but many team had break the Sandi, fyfe combo . hawthorn ,Richmond , now Geelong allow Sandi to win the ruck but not the midfield battle.

 

[Proud SJW]

Do you think Ross is capable of changing us to a more open gameplan?

Whatever the new game plan is, it isn't the pressure and stoppage game plan of 2013-12015. That much is obvious.

I honestly think that, given the deficiencies in players we still have, it might a case of "be careful what you wish for".
I suppose the real question is if anyone thinks Bevo, Clarkson or whoever could do any better with what we have.

Geez. I need a go have a drink or something, I'm getting depressed.