Review Round 1 loss to North

[Peninsula Boy]

When Butters who got a hard tag mind you was the only player in your team who got above more than 4 clearances(he got 9) you are bound to get your pants pulled down.

Butters held up for the first quarter and then he was tagged like white on rice and their midfield started to get up and about in the second and eventually started winning the corridor and a few centre bounces. Game close to over.

 

[Duckimus Prime]

Looked like a team that hadn't had a competitive hit out vs one that had.

North had an actual bash in and go trial game against Collingwood. We got out final hit out against witches hats wearing West Coast guernseys.

Just way off the pace.

The non-competitive effort from St Kilda last year leading into a Collingwood side coming off Opening Round showed just how bad it can be.

 

[Rash]

The lineup when fit seems to be Butters, Horne-Francis, Bergman, Wines, Drew with Rozee floating in there.

Any head coach will just put a fast player on Drew and he will burn him on the outside.

With hinkley this was the case, but Carr has shown us that he doesnt like to force players to play a position that does not suit them (e.g Drew wing) like hinkley would.

Realistically drew cannot play a wing or forward position, wines too. Carr hints that with no injuries and jhf full fitness Rozee's position is half back.
Meaning the cba's order would look something like this

1. Butters
2. Drew/wines
3. Drew/wines
4. JHF (rotating forward)
5. Rozee

I have left bergman out because i think carr will soon realise he is a liability in the middle. JHF due to his potency and forward ability will likely be the next mid behind butters and drew/wines. Rozee playing majoirty off of half back.

 

[Peninsula Boy]

Not on Wines?

Wines is great on the inside, average to poor on the outside. The game in the midfield demands more. He is still fourth banana, possibly third if Bergman goes back to third tall.

 

[Peninsula Boy]

With hinkley this was the case, but Carr has shown us that he doesnt like to force players to play a position that does not suit them (e.g Drew wing) like hinkley would.

Realistically drew cannot play a wing or forward position, wines too. Carr hints that with no injuries and jhf full fitness Rozee's position is half back.
Meaning the cba's order would look something like this

1. Butters
2. Drew/wines
3. Drew/wines
4. JHF (rotating forward)
5. Rozee

I have left bergman out because i think carr will soon realise he is a liability in the middle. JHF due to his potency and forward ability will likely be the next mid behind butters and drew/wines. Rozee playing majoirty off of half back.

We're no chance with that.
Butters will get tagged every week and the rest of our group will be outclassed.
Fremantle - Serong, Brayshaw, Hayden, Luke Jackson, Murphy Reid - had to bring him up
Sydney - Heeney, Gulden, Warner, Rowbottom, Sheldrick, McInerney
Gold Coast - Rowell, Anderson, Petracca, Powell, Miller, Humphries

For mine, it's not just about Top 5 but also the few after that at stoppages.
Our engine room is going to struggle to compete until the Hornet comes in and if Bergman can excel.

 

[Power Plus]

Truck picking up broken down Carr.

 

[Rash]

We're no chance with that.
Butters will get tagged every week and the rest of our group will be outclassed.
Fremantle - Serong, Brayshaw, Hayden, Luke Jackson, Murphy Reid - had to bring him up
Sydney - Heeney, Gulden, Warner, Rowbottom, Sheldrick, McInerney
Gold Coast - Rowell, Anderson, Petracca, Powell, Miller, Humphries

For mine, it's not just about Top 5 but also the few after that at stoppages.
Our engine room is going to struggle to compete until the Hornet comes in and if Bergman can excel.

What would you suggest we do than? Very slim picking. If we pick drew/wines they would have to play very very low time on ground to not feature in the top 3 of cba's, probs like 60%.

What is your prefered CBA order?

 

[Powerade 08]

Any head coach will just put a fast player on Drew and he will burn him on the outside.

That sounds reasonable. Carr should use the same tactic and line up Rozee, JHF and Butters on the slowest opposition players. I guess there would just need to be some collaboration between the teams to make it happen

 

[Peninsula Boy]

I'll also say a fair whack of the goals that the Kangaroos got where through simple errors that hopefully are deprogrammed out of the players. I would say we gave them 6 to 7 goals in that nightmare of a game.

 

[Peninsula Boy]

That sounds reasonable. Carr should use the same tactic and line up Rozee, JHF and Butters on the slowest opposition players. I guess there would just need to be some collaboration between the teams to make it happen

Unless all of their midfield is fast and young.

 

[Nelso]

Right on cue by Fireman Kane. So predictable.

"Careful for what you wish for" to the Port Supporters.

Go to 14 mins when they start discussing the Port game

 

[Peninsula Boy]

What would you suggest we do than? Very slim picking. If we pick drew/wines they would have to play very very low time on ground to not feature in the top 3 of cba's, probs like 60%.

What is your prefered CBA order?

Yes Rash. Slim pickings. You want impact players in the midfield. It is the engine room where the rest of the team depends on.

My preferred CBA order is Butters, Horne-Francis, Bergman, Wines, Drew with Rozee floating in there.
And if it gets bad, I might try Rozee at number 2 again.

If Butters goes, we are officially in rebuild mode.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Their selected side was older and more experienced than ours, only slightly but still.

Port
25 years
77.6 games

North
25.4
101.2

We named the 3rd most inexperienced side this round, North 10th.

We also named the 4th youngest side, North 6th.

Whoever thinks we aren't in a rebuild/reset year are kidding themselves

Age and experience and home ground advantage counts for a lot.

So does skill and having the right structure, especially KPFs and KPDs, and in these first 3 or 4 rounds, the bloody opening bullshit round and the byes affect, also counts.

I kept the age and experience stats for about 15 rounds last year. Freo were tipped to do big things, but their age profile said they weren't ready to make it to top 4, but they should have beaten GC at home elimination final although they were on average 1 year and 0 months younger than the GC and 11 games less experienced. They are tipped for top 4 again, but they lack experience, so I can see them missing top 4 again this year, but making finals.

However compare them to Port who had a similar age and experience profile in Rd 1 and you see that its their skills and structure that made a difference in the result. Ok Freo lost, but hardly anyone wins at Kardinia Park and it was a huge improvement on last year's 11 goal drubbing at Kardinia Park and had the chance to win it after they kicked 8 goals in the first quarter.

Swap in Wines for a MacKinley and Port's age average goes up 2 months and the games average goes up by 10 or 11 games.

Highlighted in light blue are the teams that played in Bullshit Round. Only 2 games were with teams who played last week and 6 other games were unbalanced. The North v Port game was the only one where both teams didn't play last week.

The oldest and most experienced teams won 7 of 9 games. 7 of 9 home teams won and you can argue the MCG is Hawthorn's home not Essendon's, given how many times both teams play there each year.

Stats from footywire's individual game day stats pages.

 

[JHF1870]

When we were 13 points up in the first quarter I knew something was wrong. We weren't playing well but got lucky. They missed shots.

There doesn't seem to be much connection between players and Coach.

The supporters got what they wanted but it's uncomfortable.

I suggest watching The Rick and Morty Dragon episode, The Story Train episodes and The Vat of Acid episodes. Might make sense.

 

[FishingRick04]

Right on cue by Fireman Kane. So predictable.

"Careful for what you wish for" to the Port Supporters.

Go to 14 mins when they start discussing the Port game

King shpuld be calling Kane out.after he was critical of Kenny

 

[Ford Fairlane]

 

[JHF1870]

Age and experience and home ground advantage counts for a lot.

So does skill and having the right structure, especially KPFs and KPDs, and in these first 3 or 4 rounds, the bloody opening bullshit round and the byes affect, also counts.

I kept the age and experience stats for about 15 rounds last year. Freo were tipped to do big things, but their age profile said they weren't ready to make it to top 4, but they should have beaten GC at home elimination final although they were on average 1 year and 0 months younger than the GC and 11 games less experienced. They are tipped for top 4 again, but they lack experience, so I can see them missing top 4 again this year, but making finals.

However compare them to Port who had a similar age and experience profile in Rd 1 and you see that its their skills and structure that made a difference in the result. Ok Freo lost, but hardly anyone wins at Kardinia Park and it was a huge improvement on last year's 11 goal drubbing at Kardinia Park and had the chance to win it after they kicked 8 goals in the first quarter.

Swap in Wines for a MacKinley and Port's age average goes up 2 months and the games average goes up by 10 or 11 games.

Highlighted in light blue are the teams that played in Bullshit Round. Only 2 games were with teams who played last week and 6 other games were unbalanced. The North v Port game was the only one where both teams didn't play last week.

The oldest and most experienced teams won 7 of 9 games. 7 of 9 home teams won and you can argue the MCG is Hawthorn's home not Essendon's, given how many times both teams play there each year.

Stats from footywire's individual game day stats pages.
View attachment 2553160

We need quality defenders. Where are they?

Bergman

Ratagulea shows promise
Marshall looked ok but seems to be the unluckiest guy ever

Aliir (shit at one on one, great in the air) Liability in contests
BZT, Serviceable
Evans

Jones, terrible defender, drops easy marks, fumbles, liability.

That's just the defence. Where's our top level defender pushing for AA? This is fundamentally the key area we need to invest in over the next two seasons with our 2nd and 3rd round picks.

Our forward line is similar although we have Georgiades.

Midfield is solid.

 

[Peninsula Boy]

Visentini drops the easy mark. Curtis runs off his direct opponent Logan Evans who stands still while Curtis goes for the crumb. Curtis goes around Marshall, Wehr, Aliir and Ratugolea in a phone box and eventually Evans tries to smother but he's too late and Curtis snaps a nice goal while Lachie Jones is not directly on him.

I know it is late in the game and it is over but you play hard to the end. Tough watch.

 

[morell]

I get the Drew and Wines comparisons as neither are quick and have below par ball skills, but they're pretty different to my eyes...

Wines is very adept at getting his hands on the ball first and distributing, but then gets burnt really badly on the outside.

Drew I feel isn't as strong on the inside but has go go gadget arms and can run so can blanket a strong opposition mid very effectively.

Wines is an offensive player - an inside one, Drew is and should only be used as a defensive midfielder who might pop up with a nice kick or goal. A strong game against West Coast children doesn't change that.

I made the analogy that our mids are all Ferraris that can't get out the car park because there's a speed bump. Drew is more of a Mazda 3.

We desperately and urgently need an inside ball winning mid back in the rotations and it's not Drew.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

Visentini drops the easy mark. Curtis runs off his direct opponent Logan Evans who stands still to crumb. Curtis goes around Marshall, Wehr, Aliir and Ratugolea in a phone box and eventually Evans tries to smother but he's too late and Curtis snaps a nice goal while Lachie Jones is not directly on him.

I know it is late in the game and it is over but you play hard to the end. Tough watch.

That was awful to watch at the time and it hasn't aged well. Bit harsh of Ralph to single out Marshall, there were many accomplices.

 

[PatientMental]

Right on cue by Fireman Kane. So predictable.

"Careful for what you wish for" to the Port Supporters.

Go to 14 mins when they start discussing the Port game

Cornes conveniently forgetting we were a rudderless cluster**** last year - all because Ken wanted a victory lap.

Yes, one more year of that please kane.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Cornes conveniently forgetting we were a rudderless cluster**** last year - all because Ken wanted a victory lap.

Yes, one more year of that please kane.

We lost 7 games by bigger margins than yesterday's 47 points.

 

[JHF1870]

We lost 7 games by bigger margin than yesterday's 47 points.

I think GC are the benchmark. Look at their list. I mean they don't have super huge players across teh board do they? It needs to be a good balance. They've got blistering speed, but their skills are elite. They scare me.


They've got Collins and Petracca.

But they've also got guys like Jeffrey and Rogers who are incredibly skilled but neither huge.

At least I've seen enough now to know where we're at. I think we could win a handful of games but it's not really in our interest to do well if we lose Butters.

 

[rogerjames]

I

The idea behind drafting Berry was to address Port’s small forward stocks. He was not my first choice to draft but he was the 2nd best rated small forward behind Kako.

Difficult to play in a position where there are no senior bodies to help out and in arguably the hardest position to play.

Understand that but what we really need is a 190cm bigger bodied mobile forward not another short, slightly built small forward who is too small to mark regularly & is not a natural goal sneak.

But my main point was it shouldn't have been our first priority. Build a reliable defense first because that gives you a chance to win finals.

 

[JHF1870]

In hindsight I think we should have taken Reid obviously but also looked at Luke Trainor