Preview Round 10, 2019: St.Kilda v Carlton - Marvel Stadium, Sunday 26th May, 3:20PM AEST

Who Wins?

  • Saints

    Votes: 75 91.5%
  • Blues

    Votes: 7 8.5%

  • Total voters
    82
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VDS66

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And for those thinking sides would be sh1Ting themselves because we have parker ,long , young ect , thats just a myth made on here that has grown legs , there would not be one player in the AFL that could give a crap about any of them , As Stedier said maybe they should start getting it a bit more then side will be worried about them , ps young was ok on the weekend
Typical Richo letting our forwards rot away in the forward line...
 

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BrutThough

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In nine games, we've only managed to kick more than 10 goals twice, so the forward line needs a re-think.

In : Webster, White, Coffield, Clark

Out : Bruce, Brown, Kent, Phillips

B Savage Marsh McKenzie
HB Coffield Wilkie White
C Webster Steele Billings
HF Gresham Membrey Acres
F Young Battle Parker

Fol Marshall Ross Dunstan

int Sinclair Clark Newnes Paton
How do those changes help our forward line?
 

MrFoster

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Just had a look at the positions where we misssed shots. most of them are from the boundary line around 50.. so the likelihood will be low to start with.. we only had 2-3 misses are from 30 metres. this is because our forward line was crowded, the only good positions we can get was from far out/boundary line. Compare to Collingwood’s scoring positions, most of them are from 20-40 metres out, and in the central areas.. chalk and cheese..

Unless we can fix this transition/midfield disposals.. we’re unlikely to trouble the top teams.. it’s easy to say “we just need to be more accurate” based on number of behinds, but if you look deeper, just like quality of inside 50s, it’s the quality of scoring positions/slow ball movements resulting in crowded forward line that are the root of the problem..

I hope the coaches understand this and not expect players can kick miracle goals from boundary line/outside 50 regularly.
 
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Just had a look at the positions where we misssed shots. most of them are from the boundary line around 50.. so the likelihood will be low to start with.. we only had 2-3 misses are from 30 metres. this is because our forward line was crowded, the only good positions we can get was from far out/boundary line. Compare to Collingwood’s scoring positions, most of them are from 20-40 metres out, and in the central areas.. chalk and cheese..

Unless we can fix this transition/midfield disposals.. we’re unlikely to trouble the top teams.. it’s easy to say “we just need to be more accurate” based on number of behinds, but if you look deeper, just like quality of inside 50s, it’s the quality of scoring positions/slow ball movements resulting in crowded forward line that are the root of the problem..

I hope the coaches understand this and not expect players can kick miracle goals from boundary line/outside 50 regularly.
Agree to a point Collingwood's midfield were very good in clogging up our space which was also pushing us out wide, they appeared to have space in forward 50 compared to us, also Grundy pushed down into defense were as Marshal played a kick behind or a kick out of our defense to be the link up instead of pushing deep into Collingwood's forward.
 
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Our forwards should get a lot more space this week, i don't think Carlton's midfield push back like Collingwood or GWS i'd ecpect a lot more 1 on 1 contests which means Bruce & Membery could kick 3 or 4 each if not that will create more crumbs for our small forwards.

Apart from Cripps we should have the edge in the middle our older bodies should be able to get on top of there younger guy's in Dowl,SPS & Walsh.

Crucial Roma breaks even with Kreuzer as he is a barometer for them.
 
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Our forwards should get a lot more space this week, i don't think Carlton's midfield push back like Collingwood or GWS i'd ecpect a lot more 1 on 1 contests which means Bruce & Membery could kick 3 or 4 each if not that will create more crumbs for our small forwards.

Apart from Cripps we should have the edge in the middle our older bodies should be able to get on top of there younger guy's in Dowl,SPS & Walsh.

Crucial Roma breaks even with Kreuzer as he is a barometer for them.

Can Cripps(-onite ) beat the man of Steele ?
 

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luca77

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No Bruce would be a start?
Bruce Bruce Bruce.
He's like that little girl that had the little curl.
One minute he's crucial to our forward setup, next minute him not being there is a good start to getting things right.
If King comes good, Bruce's best position might be on the trade table. Frustrating though, I really like him and love watching him play when he's on top of his game.
 
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Maybe I’m biased.. but comparing Billings to Sidebottom is like comparing apples to oranges..
Sidebottom had 11 scoring involvements, 1 assist (billings has 5 and 2).. but Sidebottom’s impact was huge, his disposals were clean and setting up numerous scoring chains, was responsible for them taking the ball easily from centre bounces and going forward with precision, even scored 2 goals himself..

Billing was stuck on his wing most of the time.. getting half of his possesions in the back half.. getting/doing short 15 metre side way or backward kicks under no pressure. when he was going forward, kicked directly to opposition under no pressure at least 2 times.. he is not the only one.. but comparing him with Sidebottom based on his possession number is misleading..
Sidebottom had Pendles, Trelor, Adams, Beams feeding him

Billings had no one basically
 

luca77

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Maybe I’m biased.. but comparing Billings to Sidebottom is like comparing apples to oranges..
Sidebottom had 11 scoring involvements, 1 assist (billings has 5 and 2).. but Sidebottom’s impact was huge, his disposals were clean and setting up numerous scoring chains, was responsible for them taking the ball easily from centre bounces and going forward with precision, even scored 2 goals himself..

Billing was stuck on his wing most of the time.. getting half of his possesions in the back half.. getting/doing short 15 metre side way or backward kicks under no pressure. when he was going forward, kicked directly to opposition under no pressure at least 2 times.. he is not the only one.. but comparing him with Sidebottom based on his possession number is misleading..
I'm with you. I've seen Sidebottom play great games, good games and quiet games in the past, but he was really on last weekend. Every time he got the ball, I was cursing knowing that they'd not only keep possession but the next possession would be in a dangerous position. I cursed quite a bit that game. Brilliant footy mind and skills to go with it. JB was OK, but no comparison for mine. Like I said a few days ago (and I think BrutThough did rightly point out it's not every week) but if there was a level above AFL, Sidebottom would still be too good when he's on.
Anyway I sometimes get caned for glowing about opposition players (might be safe since I haven't seen Joffa around here lately, hope he's OK though) but he's a beauty.
 

Gosaints12

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Bruce Bruce Bruce.
He's like that little girl that had the little curl.
One minute he's crucial to our forward setup, next minute him not being there is a good start to getting things right.
If King comes good, Bruce's best position might be on the trade table. Frustrating though, I really like him and love watching him play when he's on top of his game.
He’s 27 would the teams that missed out on Lynch, Hawthorn and Collingwood be interested and what’s he worth.

Collingwood:
Bruce for Moore

Hawthorn:
Bruce for their first
 

luca77

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He’s 27 would the teams that missed out on Lynch, Hawthorn and Collingwood be interested and what’s he worth.

Collingwood:
Bruce for Moore

Hawthorn:
Bruce for their first
That's not my field of expertise...I usually leave those things for others on here to put up and just hit the like button on ones that sound good.
But, I think that might be a little optimistic. And I think if he keeps playing with this inconsistency for the rest of the year we might not be asking for all that much. Maybe a 2nd rounder or roleplayer (not the D&D kind).
But given we have a pretty weak hand next draft, even a 2nd rounder might help. Could potentially turn that into a late first with a player or pick.
 

Enclosed_Animal

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Who had a more experienced side on the weekend..

Us or Carlton?
Things will move around slightly this week with ins and outs, but going off last week its pretty close overall.

Both teams had 17 players under 100 games, and both teams only had only 6 players aged 25 or over.

We were less experienced as we had 8 players with less than 20 games, they had 5.

But they were a younger with 11 players 21 or under, to our 4.

Overall its pretty close though, and neither team will really be able to claim too much of a difference.

Also as an FYI, missing from a current clear best 22 last week (can probably argue a few more young players around the edges, but just noting the obvious):
Saints: Steven, Hanners, Roberton, Carlisle, Geary, JWebb
Blues: Simpson, Jones, Docherty, Plowman

Given three of theirs (Simpson, Jones and Plowman) probably come in, and only Murphy goes out, we will have substantially more quality on the sidelines.

So overall our injuries are worse, they are younger but we are less experienced. IMO the thing that really separates both teams is just that they have more sh** players than we do
 
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Stewart66

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How do those changes help our forward line?

Doubt Webster plays huge bandage on hand at training today.
Roberton looks in fantastic shape , have feeling he harbour’s the thought of playing some day.
Jake Carlisle getting closer to playing soon
Pierce , Phillips , Young all had concussion gear on today.
 

bird_man

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I'm with you. I've seen Sidebottom play great games, good games and quiet games in the past, but he was really on last weekend. Every time he got the ball, I was cursing knowing that they'd not only keep possession but the next possession would be in a dangerous position. I cursed quite a bit that game. Brilliant footy mind and skills to go with it. JB was OK, but no comparison for mine. Like I said a few days ago (and I think BrutThough did rightly point out it's not every week) but if there was a level above AFL, Sidebottom would still be too good when he's on.
Anyway I sometimes get caned for glowing about opposition players (might be safe since I haven't seen Joffa around here lately, hope he's OK though) but he's a beauty.
Sidebottom is a terrific player, I'd love him at the Saints. Billings is actually on track with him at the same age, not just with possessions but also score involvements, inside 50's and metres gained. In fact their stats are almost identical over the board. Billings is kicking more goals.

I'd be very happy if Jack continues to progress the way he is and ends up being as good as Steele at his best.
 
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Doubt Webster plays huge bandage on hand at training today.
Roberton looks in fantastic shape , have feeling he harbour’s the thought of playing some day.
Jake Carlisle getting closer to playing soon
Pierce , Phillips , Young all had concussion gear on today.

Put Webster in the ruck.

 

tomjoad

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I can see this game being a bit like round one. We should get on top of them, but we'll be cagey, and they'll be wanting to atone for last weeks demolition job. Saints by 5 to 15 points...and to play better the week after.
 
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Just had a look at the positions where we misssed shots. most of them are from the boundary line around 50.. so the likelihood will be low to start with.. we only had 2-3 misses are from 30 metres. this is because our forward line was crowded, the only good positions we can get was from far out/boundary line. Compare to Collingwood’s scoring positions, most of them are from 20-40 metres out, and in the central areas.. chalk and cheese..

Unless we can fix this transition/midfield disposals.. we’re unlikely to trouble the top teams.. it’s easy to say “we just need to be more accurate” based on number of behinds, but if you look deeper, just like quality of inside 50s, it’s the quality of scoring positions/slow ball movements resulting in crowded forward line that are the root of the problem..

I hope the coaches understand this and not expect players can kick miracle goals from boundary line/outside 50 regularly.
This is slightly left of centre and I feel like I'm crowbarring this into this thread, but I'm wondering whether there would be some advantage to the Saints to play a tweaked Pagans Paddock style forward 50 entry game (from time to time).

I probably need to give this more thought, but our real competitive advantage as far as our forward line is currently concerned (if you had to pick one) would be crafty small-mid sized forwards with pace (obviously not including Bruce and Membrey in this discussion, just for the moment).

Parker. Gresh. Young. Lonie. Long.

We could play a faster forward line and push the half forwards up to the midfield and the full forwards to the half forward mark, and keep the space open in the 50 and allow our forwards to run onto it.

Obviously sides would wise onto this pretty quickly and start playing a loose man or two behind the play in the Saints' attacking forward 50, but then you'd be left with our loose men further up the ground to take a short kick and adjust when required.

You could even play say Bruce or Membrey deeper in the forward 50 as a lone target and use him as a decoy to take the defender away and create space - and kick to the space, allowing the speedy crew to sweep up the ball.

As I said, I probably need to give this more thought and I've probably missed something - but I was just thinking of ways we could fix out forward 50 entry and accuracy woes, and this could possibly be one way (given the aim is to be kicking from 5 metres out running into an open goal).
 
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