Review Round 10, 2025 - Brisbane Lions vs. Narrm

[borrat]

Which of the contenders have hit top form this season so far?
Us - no
Hawks - no
Pies - no (scary)
Cats - don’t think so
GWS - definitely not
Suns - yes - but are they contenders?


Having said that we have a couple of structural issues which is concerning. Can’t believe I’m saying this but we really need Day back

terrifying beyond belief

 

[Tricky Dicky]

The team that I think at their best this season is playing the best football is the Bulldogs and we know what we did to them.

Suns and Cats also playing some bloody good footy.

We know our best is good enough, however we are very patchy and our percentage is the tell, the difference between our best and worst footy this year is a gaping chasm.

Perhaps apart from Collingwood, every team has been up and down.

The Bulldogs game (with the exception of the 2nd quarter) was the Lions in full flight. We destroyed them in the second half - 14 goals to 4.
We beat Geelong and kept them scoreless in the third quarter.
We crushed the Suns and the Saints. Both got a few junk time goals at the end so the final score flattered them.

So they can score heavily and they can defend. As many keep saying, our best is right up there.

We had so many games last year when the effort was piss poor and mistakes were being made like C-grade country footy.
Many of us were despairing that we could be so bad and that we would not make the 8, let alone win a final.

It's just not possible to play at or near your best every week in such a long season.
Love the quote posted earlier by GOTHELIONS16 from Fages : ‘A win is never as good as it seems and a loss is never as bad as it seems.’ Yes we were poor, but Melbourne still have a lot of very good players who know how to win.

 

[rcbrions]

Which of our mids actually work hard back to support defensively besides dunkley at times not many... needs to be more accountability.

 

[KissKiss]

I must admit Hipwood was better than I expected at centre bounces today. He was unpredictable to his opponent and then I liked his follow up at ground level.

Your argument about taking him out of the forward line and perhaps over-working him as a result is a different issue and perhaps well-founded.

Definitely took even Daniher awhile to figure out how to balance the ruck duties and forward duties. How much to spend energy in either role and whether to go up or stay and compete on the ground in the ruck? I dont blame Hipwood at all in slowing down a fair bit in his first real game doing this.

Similarly no fault on Fort struggling against the best ruck man going around.

Definitely on reflection this morning so much of our issues really came down to defensive pressure or hunger. And maybe a little bit of balance wrong in a few spots. Too many guys wanting to be the hero and not enough doing the hard work

Last year we did so well when Ah Chee and Charlie put the pressure on. Then when Joe fired up chasing it just flowed down the ground. We didnt have that last night happening. And you could see it flow onto guys like Morris giving half chases and not working hard to not let Gawn have his way down the line.

Similarly without Berry we had too many offensively minded mids and not enough chase from the inside.

None of this is dire and we can turn it around. But a few guys need a harsh review to shape up. Its hard to drop the stars but maybe some lessons need to be learned again

 

[lionsrules]

a good night sleep and a coffee and some perspective now. Yes we are down on form. The start of the season generally speaking on a whole has not been great.
There have been positives. Our job on Gold Coast, the second half against the cats (lets not underestimate that performance). Sydney round 1. The bulldogs at Gather round.

I don't agree Daniher missing is the problem. Yesterday at the game that was a midfield ruck issue.
we lost hitouts 17/53 (hitouts hit and miss on importance) but when its Gawn to trac and Oliver ....its an issue.
lost clearances, more clanger, less tackles, less shots on goal, less inside 50's, poorer efficiency when inside 50, less marks, less contested and we gave away 13 free kicks.

Yes the percentage doesn't lie. We based on that are not top 4 team. But we have quality players that need a rethink between the ears. This happened against the loss after the hawks heading into our bye. something clicked in this group. Very disappointing to collect 2 points from a possible 8 against lowly teams. But we are second and we have banked wins. This isnt the team currently to take us to glory. There is going to be a few changes.

Starce, oscar, Doedee, robertson, More of McKenna, Day again? Henry Smith?
We have got players we can insert soon when they're back from injury then we can refine this team and have a crack.

Yesterdays game was painful to watch, especially the last quarter. I am glad we are getting exposed now. We have got time to fix this. I am of the opinion we need to finish top 4. We can't do last year again. We don't have that in us.
Andrews .... two weeks in a row letting frustrations out and it reeks of cockiness. Voss did it after a few flags but you're not Voss.... When I see those outbursts .... just makes me think its all a mental thing. There's a lack of effort and a side of cockiness that's showing. That can be fixed.
Daniher missing is not the answer.
You can win flags without a big forward if the talent is there and we have that. See 2021, 2023 as recent examples.

 

[Grasshopper17]

It’s heeere

View attachment 2318280

I'd be interested in knowing, if you're able to think back 23 years ago, whether you felt the same way after this game.

 

[braddsey]

Oscar seems very fragile at the moment .
Losing Joe also meant losing his back up ruckman .

We basically lost two players when Joe retired , he is so hard to replace .

Hopefully things get sorted out eventually .not sure how though .

We now know how blessed we were to have a 200cm goal kicking marvel who could also ruck.

Which of the contenders have hit top form this season so far?
Us - no
Hawks - no
Pies - no (scary)
Cats - don’t think so
GWS - definitely not
Suns - yes - but are they contenders?


Having said that we have a couple of structural issues which is concerning. Can’t believe I’m saying this but we really need Day back

Dogs.

 

[twhowler]

We now know how blessed we were to have a 200cm goal kicking marvel who could also ryck

Dogs.

We played dogs off a five day break after the played the late perth game in real heat and without Bont. That win was awesome to watch but hardly a mark of where the 2 sides are at.

 

[M Malice]

Which of our mids actually work hard back to support defensively besides dunkley at times not many... needs to be more accountability.

Our wingers Jarrod Berry and Jaspa Fletcher definitely, Zac Bailey and Hugh McCluggage spasmodically.

Someone who really works their arse off to get back is Dev Robertson but his weaknesses outweigh those defensive positives so unlikely to get another crack at it.

 

[Kernel Kurtz]

I think we've been getting away with an ordinary structural setup and lack of effort at times ,particularly from the mids, with enough bursts of brilliance to keep our noses in front and some experienced grit at times , particularly in the first game and the Geelong game . But Collingwood exposed these deficiencies , the dam wall was breaking against North and it completely broke in the last quarter yesterday.

The good thing is that we know what the issues are , overall have the cattle to fix it and are still second on the ladder.

Just at present there are too many players out of form not showing what we know they're capable of. I guess we'll see if the desire is still there over the next few weeks. As soon as you put Berry and Starcevich back in the side it straightens us up quite a bit.

Thanks Marty,
Thought the same , might be a structuaral problem .
We mark there and all of a sudden the centering kick in from Levi looks like a million dollars. I'll also add he did well to get the kick away to a very attacking part of our forward area.
As I said I missed most of the second half , thought we had their messure the first half although as in this example , we burned a few opportunities.
The second half must of been frustrating to watch.

 

[Berrygood]

I thought we played some spectacular football in the first n second qtrs. Effort was good, mids were finding the ball, intensity was good, kicking was good, overlap run was good. We were handling Gawn well.

Second half it looked like we just stopped. Lost the hunger and hunt. Thought we had it in the bag.

A lot of players out of form at the moment. Same was said last year at this stage, Fages stuck with them and was rewarded. I reckon he'll do the same this year.

I didn't mind Gardiner's game last night. I think he could do more in the ruck. The ruck work got Hippy into the game early but took a lot out of him. Not really his go is it? Happy to see him have a wrestle in the ruck deeper in the fwd 50, like Hawkins.

Good to see Kiddy get a run.

Disappointing loss, they could all use a cup of cement, hope they find it soon. We've got the players that can do the job with all the hard work, they just have to do it longer.

 

[rwan566]

What frustrates me is in the presser fagan said there was no pattern to our form except in the last two weeks and challenged the media as to whether they saw one

I think as fans we all can clearly see a pattern not sure if fagan is being realistic as if he is then I worry

 

[beatnik]

'They annihilated us': Fagan doesn't mince words after Demons shock

Chris Fagan has a few concerns after two disappointing performances in as many weeks

www.afl.com.au

You may want to ring Fagan too mate. Looks like the dumb coach is also having a crisis, said we got annihilated and we're not around the mark.

Re-read my post, I’m not saying there’s no problems…we’re playing terribly and we need to turn it around, I’m just saying there’s context and we’re still in a great position so let’s not completely **** the bed

 

[Section 5]

Lions need to lift, and we have the players to do that. The next 4 weeks will give us a better indication.
Hopefully it is a much rosier outlook than the last 2 weeks.

Our entries I50 under little or no pressure were way off and intercepted quite easily by Melbourne.
Our 2nd game in a row we should have been well in front at three quarter time.
Because of no scoreboard pressure at that time, we gave the lowly opposition some hope of getting back into the game and both times they did.

Fagan mentioned certain stats are lack effort stats and also mentioned hunger.
Thats pretty much what the last two weeks were. A wasted 6 premiership points v near bottom sides.
Now we have to put it all together to possibly get a win against the Hawks who we have not beaten for years.

Unfortunately, a wasted fortnight premiership points wise. No time machine to fix it we just have to move onto next week.

On paper we only have 1 weakness being ruck relief and depth in that area even allowing for VFL injured players.
Now Oscars mystery issues Fagan clearly does not want to enlighten the fans on.

Hippy going into the ruck at CBA's is a mistake. It nearly ended badly at his first CBA. See images below.
I was on the other side of the ground and Hippy clearly landed flat on his back.
We easily could have been down one player 6 minutes into the game but were lucky.

The midfield is so Jekyll and Hyde at the moment
It probably won't happen yet but maybe Fletcher to the midfield and Will more wing/forward will be a better balance.

Our small forwards being Ah-Chee and Lohmann were nonexistent against bottom teams that they should have excelled against. Charlie has had some opportunities but pretty much wasted all of them bar 1 the last 2 weeks.

Harris must have taken some angry pills the last two weeks. So, unlike him.
Trying to knock Melksham drink bottle away a couple of times after he goaled is just not on.
Fagan then sent him to the forwards to calm dawn. Moving our game high goal kicker back to defense.

Losing to North and Melbourne should tell us there are no easy games in the remaining 13 rounds.

So many players need to lift.
Yes, Gawn killed us, but he has done that all year, yet the Demons had only won against Dockers, Tigers & Eagles until yesterday. They even lost to North in round 2 when North were crap.

On a positive note, Kiddy got through the game and was solid. Zorko solid again.
However, as posters mentioned earlier in the year can we afford 2 attacking halfbacks

 

[Mr Ripper]

I'd be interested in knowing, if you're able to think back 23 years ago, whether you felt the same way after this game.

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Was actually going to post about this last night, but cbf.

It was the culmination of a few weeks where we’d been winning, but getting sloppier and sloppier at defending.

It sparked a renewed focus on tackling and pressure and a general tightening up of the backline and we only dropped one more game for the year (Port by a goal at Footy Park in the last round).

 

[braddsey]

What frustrates me is in the presser fagan said there was no pattern to our form except in the last two weeks and challenged the media as to whether they saw one

I think as fans we all can clearly see a pattern not sure if fagan is being realistic as if he is then I worry

We all know Chris Fagan always only speaks 100% truth to the media, and has never been known to tell little white lies to the media to protect his team or individual players…
We can be confident that what he says in his presser is absolutely not aligned with what he says to the players behind closed doors.

 

[StevoJenkins]

I don't actually think our game was as bad as some here think. Transition was actually really good, until we didn't do one more handball and/or players played for themselves rather than the team. We had a pretty good number of inside 50's, but no contested marks to grab them/pretty shit placement and constant bombing of the ball.

Outside of the non-controllables (our entire reserves forward line being on the injury list), Melbourne were there to win the game, and we didn't make the best of our opportunities.

The best examples of these opportunities (that I saw) were Charlie, Zorko and Lachie.

I don't know if Zorko was threatened by Coleman being back in the team or something, but his ball-use all game, especially his inside 50's, were bog awful. Against a team that loves forcing the bomb in, Zorko kept bombing it in blindly, without a target, and kept stuffing up the transition kick. With a performance like that, I'd prefer him moved to the forward line and have Fletcher moved back to defence.

Charlie (and also Kai, but less expectation on Kai) seems to have all the confidence when kicking for goal/general play, but to the point where he doesn't play a team game. He's burning teammates in better positions, tries to make up for it in general play, gets gassed, then becomes a liability in said general play. I do have some sympathy for Charlie, as he is playing McCarthy's role and probably isn't suited for it, but the burning of players in better positions and the general lack of form needs to bump him back to the twos for a couple of weeks.

For Lachie, he was good in the middle, but he was no better than the others with the bombing. He'd grab the ball in the middle, then slam it on the boot. Good if there's someone who can clunk those marks, but we've got an inexperienced Morris, a gassed Hipwood who was second ruck the whole game, and defender turned band-aid forward Gardiner. None of these three are considered good, contested marks in the conditions at that point in the game against a team who forces bombs into defence. Those kicks into the 50 from Neale were never going to work.

I also don't get why we waited for the game to be over to put McKenna in. Kai barely touched the ball the whole game, and the coaches decided to wait until halfway through the final quarter to take him off for McKenna. When McKenna did get into the game, he did what all the smalls were not able to do and kicked a goal. He was the only small that I recall kicking a goal (I don't count Ah Chee, see him as more of a medium).

I'll leave my line-up changes to the changes thread, but if we can clean up the entries to the forward line, and somehow get our smalls into form, I think we should be fine until the bye. Hopefully, by then we should have some forwards/rucks available to play (Smith, Day, Ryan, etc.).

 

[Gadzorks]

We all know Chris Fagan always only speaks 100% truth to the media, and has never been known to tell little white lies to the media to protect his team or individual players…
We can be confident that what he says in his presser is absolutely not aligned with what he says to the players behind closed doors.

I don't listen to any fagan interviews, including the post game. He is not going to give insights, so why waste my time.

Great coach and team builder, loyalty is to his employees which is fair enough.

 

[Gadzorks]

I don't actually think our game was as bad as some here think. Transition was actually really good, until we didn't do one more handball and/or players played for themselves rather than the team. We had a pretty good number of inside 50's, but no contested marks to grab them/pretty shit placement and constant bombing of the ball.

Outside of the non-controllables (our entire reserves forward line being on the injury list), Melbourne were there to win the game, and we didn't make the best of our opportunities.

The best examples of these opportunities (that I saw) were Charlie, Zorko and Lachie.

I don't know if Zorko was threatened by Coleman being back in the team or something, but his ball-use all game, especially his inside 50's, were bog awful. Against a team that loves forcing the bomb in, Zorko kept bombing it in blindly, without a target, and kept stuffing up the transition kick. With a performance like that, I'd prefer him moved to the forward line and have Fletcher moved back to defence.

Charlie (and also Kai, but less expectation on Kai) seems to have all the confidence when kicking for goal/general play, but to the point where he doesn't play a team game. He's burning teammates in better positions, tries to make up for it in general play, gets gassed, then becomes a liability in said general play. I do have some sympathy for Charlie, as he is playing McCarthy's role and probably isn't suited for it, but the burning of players in better positions and the general lack of form needs to bump him back to the twos for a couple of weeks.

For Lachie, he was good in the middle, but he was no better than the others with the bombing. He'd grab the ball in the middle, then slam it on the boot. Good if there's someone who can clunk those marks, but we've got an inexperienced Morris, a gassed Hipwood who was second ruck the whole game, and defender turned band-aid forward Gardiner. None of these three are considered good, contested marks in the conditions at that point in the game against a team who forces bombs into defence. Those kicks into the 50 from Neale were never going to work.

I also don't get why we waited for the game to be over to put McKenna in. Kai barely touched the ball the whole game, and the coaches decided to wait until halfway through the final quarter to take him off for McKenna. When McKenna did get into the game, he did what all the smalls were not able to do and kicked a goal. He was the only small that I recall kicking a goal (I don't count Ah Chee, see him as more of a medium).

I'll leave my line-up changes to the changes thread, but if we can clean up the entries to the forward line, and somehow get our smalls into form, I think we should be fine until the bye. Hopefully, by then we should have some forwards/rucks available to play (Smith, Day, Ryan, etc.).

I disagree with your Charlie comments. My take is he can't get the balance right between going himself and handing off to team mates.

He'll give off when he was in the best position then take a shot when he isn't.

Same with attack v defence. He's been on the back line defending at the cost of attack.

 

[davemc_lions]

I think if you cut out our cute little 45 angle 20m kicks then we kick long and hope for a contest.
Which does not work when that kick is to Gawm or May who mark it.

Also worry having Zorko and Coleman both attacking off HB opens us up a little defensively

 

[M Malice]

I disagree with your Charlie comments. My take is he can't get the balance right between going himself and handing off to team mates.

He'll give off when he was in the best position then take a shot when he isn't.

Same with attack v defence. He's been on the back line defending at the cost of attack.

I was dumfounded when Josh Dunkley took a mark in a really good spot around 35-40 meters out on a slight angle... AND then proceeded to pass to Logan Morris in an almost impossible angle tight up against a pocket boundary line, Logan then missed everything.

Just take the shot Josh, you passed to a man in a lot worse position.

 

[knaf]

I'd be interested in knowing, if you're able to think back 23 years ago, whether you felt the same way after this game.

View attachment 2318890

I remember this game. I thought it was inexplicable, just couldn’t understand it. We were terrible all day. It turned out that it was a one off.

Have a different reaction to last nights loss. I feel the wear and tear of two hard years is starting to tell. Completely human reaction to find it hard to be at your peak continually. It’s a tough competition. Appreciate the good times the team has given us.

Medium term (this year) I am a bit concerned. Longer term I know the list and club are in very good position. Not sure how we navigate through the medium term.

 

[mpal6]

Re-read my post, I’m not saying there’s no problems…we’re playing terribly and we need to turn it around, I’m just saying there’s context and we’re still in a great position so let’s not completely **** the bed

Re-quoted it for you as well. I don't see a "we have problems and playing terribly" in your reply anywhere. But I read it as more interested in having a condescending go than wanting to have a discussion. Either way, I'll leave that one here and move on. Each to our own.

Except for the fact that tonight was the first time we’ve lost in 5 weeks

Keep some toys in the cot, if you’re going to have a dorm crisis, you’d want to have it when 2 pts out of 1st place!

 

[M Malice]

I remember this game. I thought it was inexplicable, just couldn’t understand it. We were terrible all day. It turned out that it was a one off.

Have a different reaction to last nights loss. I feel the wear and tear of two hard years is starting to tell. Completely human reaction to find it hard to be at your peak continually. It’s a tough competition. Appreciate the good times the team has given us.

Medium term (this year) I am a bit concerned. Longer term I know the list and club are in very good position. Not sure how we navigate through the medium term.

I'd actually prefer to do a Collingwood(2024) and miss finals altogether after a flag this season than stumble into finals and go straight out.

Reset, hit 2026 on the back of a full off season and cross fingers minimal post season 2025 surgeries.

 

[mpal6]

I'd actually prefer to do a Collingwood(2024) and miss finals altogether after a flag this season than stumble into finals and go straight out.

Reset, hit 2026 on the back of a full off season and cross fingers minimal post season 2025 surgeries.

I think this squad is still capable of a prelim. Beyond that whatever happens on that day.

I'd like to maximize returns while Charlie, Neale, Zorko are still in there as we're likely to regress when they retire. This is until we find our feet again in midfield as well as in general leadership, who is the next "follow me boys" type voice that'll stand up amongst next gen etc.